Is a Leaf suitable

Becks610

Hi all. I am interested in getting a Leaf, not a new one but a second hand one.

My situation - 2 car household, one diesel one petrol. Petrol 05 Ford Focus- need to get rid of this as new baby has arrived and this is a 3 door. Have had it since 2010, I would keep until it dies but with 3 doors it's difficult.

Have an 11 diesel as well. I do 25 km each way to work and my husband does 7 km each way. we also use the diesel car at the weekends and my husband also does 25 km each way two evenings a week.

Main extra journeys at the weekend are 25 km each way, occasionally either one of us do over 100km so need diesel car for this.

The main use is on the diesel car but if we got a Leaf it would switch to this- also I have never sat in a Leaf - how big is the boot as we hope to have a 2nd child a few years down the line. There is no rush with the new car as I have till I go back to work which is May next year.

KCross

You sound ideally suited. The 25km each way work commute plus another 50km two evenings is do-able in a 24kWh Leaf. A 30kWh (if the budget allows) would be better again but they are harder to find.

Do you have a driveway where you can plug the car into a charge point mounted on the outside wall of your house?


Leaf boot is decent but everyone has their own idea of what a big boot is. You really need to see for yourself on that.

Becks610

Thanks for the reply. Yeah I have my own driveway so will be no issues with charging. As we tend to keep our cars a good few years I was thinking the 30kwh Leaf would be good but I have heard they are hard to find.

I know people say go to UK but not sure we would be knowledgeable enough about electric cars for that even though I do read this forum a lot.

Soarer

Hey Becks.

The 100kms you mention. Is that each way or return? It it motorway or "normal" roads.

Before even knowing that, a current Leaf from late 2013 onwards would suit you perfectly.
I suppose you'd swap the petrol car for it. But there's every chance that you'll end up using the Leaf for all the weekend running about too, thus saving you money on the fuel spend on the diesel.

As for the boot, the only thing you can do is go have a look at one to see if it suits.

Nissan will give you €5000 in scrappage for your Focus against a current 30kWh Leaf. But you'll lose that in depreciation straight away, if such things bothered you.

Becks610

Thanks Soarer. Yeah I would imagine we would end up doing all the weekend travelling in the Leaf thus saving more money. The diesel car we have isn't worth much now it has 250k kilometres on it as my husband had a different job previously thus putting up a lot of mileage- happy to keep this car as it has been regularly serviced.

I checked the distance - it is 120 km each way mainly motorway - it would only be occasionally but it is for work so I would need our other car as I couldn't be stopping to charge.

How much would the 30 kWh Leaf be so with the scrappage.

thierry14

Becks610 wrote: »

Thanks Soarer. Yeah I would imagine we would end up doing all the weekend travelling in the Leaf thus saving more money. The diesel car we have isn't worth much now it has 250k kilometres on it as my husband had a different job previously thus putting up a lot of mileage- happy to keep this car as it has been regularly serviced.

I checked the distance - it is 120 km each way mainly motorway - it would only be occasionally but it is for work so I would need our other car as I couldn't be stopping to charge.

How much would the 30 kWh Leaf be so with the scrappage.

Wait for the new Leaf in Feb 18

Buying the old one now is madness

KCross

Becks610 wrote: »

I know people say go to UK but not sure we would be knowledgeable enough about electric cars for that even though I do read this forum a lot.

If you are nervous about going to the UK there are a few companies who specialise in going to the UK for EV's on your behalf.

So you could just give them your requirements and budget and they will see if they can find one for you and bring it back.


If you buy off the main dealers here you will be paying a premium for it.

Scrappage, AFAIK, is only if you buy a new car. You said you were looking at 2nd hand so I don't know if scrappage will be applicable to you. Just sell the Focus privately.


Also budget for the purchase and install of a home charge point. Anything from €500 if you are willing to source materials yourself and get a friend to help to wire it, upto €1000 (rip off price) if you go with a one stop shop.

There are rumblings of a grant being provided for that but no details on that yet.

unkel

The diesel is still worth a bit as it is only 6 years old (and has low tax). I'd sell that and keep the petrol Focus as your second car. The Focus can then do the odd 240km trip (for work, so only driver needed - that is has only 3 doors then doesn't matter) and you will find you will use the Leaf for almost all other journeys

NIMAN

thierry14 wrote: »

Wait for the new Leaf in Feb 18

Buying the old one now is madness

Hi all. I am interested in getting a Leaf, not a new one but a second hand one.

Shefwedfan

If you dont need the 30kW which you sound like you dont. Nissan are selling off the top spec 24KW at a number of garages at 20k. That is leather etc included on it.

Might be worth a look. It is a lot of car for 20k and if you are keeping for a long time then no issue with depreciation.

I would suggest not limiting yourself to Leaf. Why not have a look at the Zoe. Electric Auto's in Kildare are getting them in all the time and selling really quickly. Just an option instead of Leaf.

Depends on budget, what are you thinking of spending?

I found the Leaf boot not great. I have a double buggy and it didn't really fit but then again I didn't really try that hard because the Leaf wasn't for me. I ended up with eGolf.

Shefwedfan

thierry14 wrote: »

Others are talking about scrappage

Pick me out

.......

You are very aggressive the last while. Relax man....it's a forum....

To be fair I refer to 24KW new as it would be similar cost to 30KW second hand

Soarer

thierry14 wrote: »

Others are talking about scrappage

Pick me out

Snip

Completely uncalled for.

I mentioned scrappage as it brings the price of a new 30kWh Leaf down to nearly the same price as a secondhand one, and that's without haggling.

thierry14

Shefwedfan wrote: »

You are very aggressive the last while. Relax man....it's a forum....

To be fair I refer to 24KW new as it would be similar cost to 30KW second hand

I know

I should/will

He picked me out on purpose

Hate that

Shefwedfan

thierry14 wrote: »

I know

I should/will

He picked me out on purpose

Hate that

Edit it out....before mods see or your gone for a week

thierry14

Soarer wrote: »

Completely uncalled for.

I mentioned scrappage as it brings the price of a new 30kWh Leaf down to nearly the same price as a secondhand one, and that's without haggling.

That is true

New is better, if a good deal can be got on 30kWh, it does make sense

Shefwedfan

Back to topic, what sort of budget you looking at might help options?

Becks610

Originally my budget was 15k but I am willing to go higher if it is a better option. I never buy new so I don't know about going new cos surely after a few years there will be better EVs out with more range.

Unkel- re getting rid of the diesel we will be sharing drop off/ crèche pick ups so we need two 5 door cars.

Re the Zoe - is there something with battery rental on them? Or is that only some Zoe's

Bigus

I'd say buy 12 or 13 Leaf for under €10k Now , the 30 kw isn't worth a 6k min premium at the moment , better to trade up later as ev's become more plentiful and better in 18 months or so.

Shefwedfan

Becks610 wrote: »

Originally my budget was 15k but I am willing to go higher if it is a better option. I never buy new so I don't know about going new cos surely after a few years there will be better EVs out with more range.

Unkel- re getting rid of the diesel we will be sharing drop off/ crèche pick ups so we need two 5 door cars.

Re the Zoe - is there something with battery rental on them? Or is that only some Zoe's

Only some Zoe's....this is the 40KW version but lease battery
http://www.electricautos.ie/vehicles/renault/zoe/kildare/1843873

With the lease you pay less up front for the car but you have to pay the monthly fee. Most people prefer to go battery bought.

Electric autos had a number of battery owned in the last few months. One below. I was down with him last week and he had a lovely black one but it was already sold.....
https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/renault/zoe/used-2015-152-renault-zoe-zoe-i-batte-kildare-fpa-49090274157576

Please note i am just putting up Electric Auto's as he make reference if they are battery owned or not. I have no idea on main dealers as they dont make any reference.

You could contact him and tell him budget etc and see what he can get. I have bought 2 cars off him this year and he is a gent

This one has to be lease battery but 171 in budget
https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/renault/zoe/used-2017-171-renault-zoe-demo-model-cork-fpa-4100981981954570308

Shefwedfan

You could trade in your car and see what you get against the following: https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/volkswagen/golf/used-2015-151-volkswagen-golf-e-golf-dublin-fpa-5001655738401152932

I can highly recommend.....I get circa 120-140km per charge.....I got 2 adults, 3 kids and dog into it

Also another option
https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/bmw/i3/used-2014-141-bmw-i3-ib1-one-owner-dublin-fpa-113309077256219

Outside budget but maybe if you like Mercs
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201708017915271?sort=sponsored&make=MERCEDES-BENZ&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=de78hq&radius=1500&fuel-type=Electric&advertising-location=at_cars&page=1

The Leaf doesn't have to be the automatic choice. Look around for option.

Soarer

Becks610 wrote: »

How much would the 30 kWh Leaf be so with the scrappage.

Just saw this now.

Think it's around €20k including the €5k scrappage.

I think those long journeys would be well doable in the 30kWh with a quick charge. Well worth it for the fuel savings.

Not only does the 30 Kwh provide more range but also faster charging on the fast charger. Well worth the extra if the budget can stretch.

Soarer

Deleted User wrote: »

Not only does the 30 Kwh provide more range but also faster charging on the fast charger. Well worth the extra if the budget can stretch.

Really?

How come that?

KCross

Top spec (SVE) 30kWh with 6.6kW charger for £14k here:
https://speakev.com/threads/nissan-leaf-tekna-30kwh-6-6kw.79497/

goz83

Shefwedfan wrote: »

snip

I would suggest not limiting yourself to Leaf. Why not have a look at the Zoe. Electric Auto's in Kildare are getting them in all the time and selling really quickly. Just an option instead of Leaf.

Depends on budget, what are you thinking of spending?

I found the Leaf boot not great. I have a double buggy and it didn't really fit but then again I didn't really try that hard because the Leaf wasn't for me. I ended up with eGolf.

The Zoe is too small. The OP is looking for a decent boot, which I think the Leaf has. Now...we don't carry double buggies, we usually have collapsible strollers (of the mamas and papas variety, so not very skimpy). My SIL has a large buggy and that fits into the Leaf with extra room. It's one of those buggies that the cradle comes away from the base.

The eGolf might be a bit pricey for the OP considering you can get a 30kw Leaf new for ~20k or used for 15-16 if willing to to the UK.

However, it sounds like the 1.5 Gen (2014+) Leaf will do just fine and can be got for ~10k easily enough.

The one Kcross linked might be one to jump at.

Soarer

KCross wrote: »

Top spec (SVE) 30kWh with 6.6kW charger for £14k here:
https://speakev.com/threads/nissan-leaf-tekna-30kwh-6-6kw.79497/

Good value that.

But before I even clicked on it, I knew it was going to be white!

How can you spec a Tekna with the 30kWh battery, 6.6kW charger, and thrn not get metallic paint?!

Soarer

Soarer wrote: »

Really?

How come that?

They allow it to charge faster probably because they feel that it will have no adverse effects. The battery does warm it up faster though.

At 50% charge the 24 Kwh leaf could be charging at 30-35 Kw (not exactly fast) and the 30 Kwh leaf 45 all the way to 80%.

The key is heat, not a good idea to fast charge it close to the red.

The Ionig charged at 60 odd Kw to 80% and then about 40 odd Kw if I remember correctly to 90% , it makes a big difference.

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

The Ionig charged at 60 odd Kw to 80% and then about 40 odd Kw if I remember correctly to 90% , it makes a big difference.

Hasn't that been debunked though?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=104565306&postcount=3869

All the chargers in Ireland are supposed to be 50kW max and the Ioniq is much the same as the 30kWh Leaf in that it pulls 45kW for most of the time.

The reports of 60kW charging in Ireland aren't real.

Shefwedfan

KCross wrote: »

Hasn't that been debunked though?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=104565306&postcount=3869

All the chargers in Ireland are supposed to be 50kW max and the Ioniq is much the same as the 30kWh Leaf in that it pulls 45kW for most of the time.

The reports of 60kW charging in Ireland aren't real.

A lot of these threads seem to go off topic....not trying to back seat mod or anything but I don't think the OP really cares that much

I know I own an electric car for over 6 months now and I have no idea what charge it pulls or anythin....just plug it in and then when you go to drive its full

KCross

KCross wrote: »

Hasn't that been debunked though?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=104565306&postcount=3869

All the chargers in Ireland are supposed to be 50kW max and the Ioniq is much the same as the 30kWh Leaf in that it pulls 45kW for most of the time.

The reports of 60kW charging in Ireland aren't real.

I doubt it because it got from 22-90% in something like 25 mins flat !

The Kwh meter on the chargers shows the total energy consumed by the charger so unless it's very inefficient it's within 10% to make up for losses.

It certainly displayed a lot more on the Kwh meter on the charger than it would with a Leaf.

KCross

I don't think so. cros13 said his 30kWh Leaf was also showing 60kW on the charger.

And work out the maths on that.... 68% of 28kWh's in 25mins isn't close to 60kW rate at all. 45kW is about right.

Becks610

Thanks for all the replies.

What is the difference in range between the 24kw and the 30kw. I probably would be the type of person to get range anxiety where as my husband wouldn't.

Do people think there will be much degradation of the battery is I was to buy a 24kw Leaf in say 3 years.

Becks610

Shefwedfan wrote: »

You could trade in your car and see what you get against the following: https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/volkswagen/golf/used-2015-151-volkswagen-golf-e-golf-dublin-fpa-5001655738401152932

I can highly recommend.....I get circa 120-140km per charge.....I got 2 adults, 3 kids and dog into it

Also another option
https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/bmw/i3/used-2014-141-bmw-i3-ib1-one-owner-dublin-fpa-113309077256219

Outside budget but maybe if you like Mercs
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201708017915271?sort=sponsored&make=MERCEDES-BENZ&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&postcode=de78hq&radius=1500&fuel-type=Electric&advertising-location=at_cars&page=1

The Leaf doesn't have to be the automatic choice. Look around for option.

That golf is very nice - is there many electric golfs around?

KCross

KCross wrote: »

I don't think so. cros13 said his 30kWh Leaf was also showing 60kW on the charger.

And work out the maths on that.... 68% of 28kWh's in 25mins isn't close to 60kW rate at all. 45kW is about right.

When I had the 33 KWh I 3 Rex for a test drive I saw the charger pull 50 Kw max and mostly 47-48 Kw. I couldn’t imagine the 30 Kwh Leaf pulling more especially the I3 being liquid cooled. But I’d like to know for sure what the ioniq really sends to the battery.

Shefwedfan

Becks610 wrote: »

That golf is very nice - is there many electric golfs around?

Not many, I have one. Another person bought a new 172 and posted here on boards.

I think around 6-8 in total in Ireland, mostly because VW haven't really pushed selling them.....in last few months a good few sold compared to previous....in the rest of the World you have a 6 month waiting list, they are flying out the door.....

A good few GTE knocking around which is the Hybrid version......

I test drove the Leaf and it wasn't for me. I was lucky and I found import eGolf which was perfect......test drive the eGolf, it is more expensive but really it is a step up from the Leaf/Ioniq etc....in the US the choice is Tesla 3 or eGolf......Ireland has not caught up yet....

thierry14

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Not many, I have one. Another person bought a new 172 and posted here on boards.

I think around 6-8 in total in Ireland, mostly because VW haven't really pushed selling them.....in last few months a good few sold compared to previous....in the rest of the World you have a 6 month waiting list, they are flying out the door.....

A good few GTE knocking around which is the Hybrid version......

I test drove the Leaf and it wasn't for me. I was lucky and I found import eGolf which was perfect......test drive the eGolf, it is more expensive but really it is a step up from the Leaf/Ioniq etc....in the US the choice is Tesla 3 or eGolf......Ireland has not caught up yet....

The choice is Bolt or Model 3

eGolf isn't anywhere near those 2.

unkel

thierry14 wrote: »

The choice is Bolt or Model 3

Neither of those cars are available in this country at the moment, this year or even next year. Would you mind not posting about stuff like that again until 2019? You will be doing us all a great favour. Thank you.

thierry14

unkel wrote: »

Neither of those cars are available in this country at the moment, this year or even next year. Would you mind not posting about stuff like that again until 2019? You will be doing us all a great favour. Thank you.

Do me a favour and read!!

He said US

liamog

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When I had the 33 KWh I 3 Rex for a test drive I saw the charger pull 50 Kw max and mostly 47-48 Kw. I couldn’t imagine the 30 Kwh Leaf pulling more especially the I3 being liquid cooled. But I’d like to know for sure what the ioniq really sends to the battery.

Ask the questions on the Ioniq thread and I'll answer.
For the purpose of this thread, the fastest available chargers in Ireland are the Efacec triple heads and will provide 125A.

Your battery voltage increases depending on state of charge which is why we see charging rates peak at around 80%. After 80% most cars request a lower amperage from the charger to protect the battery.

Ioniq has been proven to work at 175A but we don't have any 175A CCS chargers available in Ireland.

Shefwedfan

thierry14 wrote: »

The choice is Bolt or Model 3

eGolf isn't anywhere near those 2.

What is your assumptions based on out of interest?

The Bolt is an economy car, like the Leaf/Zoe....you will see a lot of these types of comments in terms of the Bolt "Economy-car interior plastics" etc etc

The eGolf and Tesla 3 are not economy cars.

The positive for the Bolt is of course range but this does not seem to be of huge concern to US customers who majority are city based....300Km(220km real world) is more than enough which the eGolf will provide, also with US weather I would expect the eGolf range to be more as when it is hot in Ireland the range is extra 30-40km.

It is rather a mute point as the Bolt will not be sold here.

thierry14

Shefwedfan wrote: »

What is your assumptions based on out of interest?

The Bolt is an economy car, like the Leaf/Zoe....you will see a lot of these types of comments in terms of the Bolt "Economy-car interior plastics" etc etc

The eGolf and Tesla 3 are not economy cars.

The positive for the Bolt is of course range but this does not seem to be of huge concern to US customers who majority are city based....300Km(220km real world) is more than enough which the eGolf will provide, also with US weather I would expect the eGolf range to be more as when it is hot in Ireland the range is extra 30-40km.

It is rather a mute point as the Bolt will not be sold here.

You mentioned US, not me

Why is it a mute point?

Did I mention Ireland?

Your classes are all wrong too

Model 3 competes with BMW 3 series/Audi A4/ Mercedes

Your Golf is an econ box, its not in the same group as those cars, it competes with the Focus/Corolla/Mazda 3

You make the Golf sound like a Merc,in VW group thats Audi

Chevy Bolt is far superior to the eGolf, only you would compare the too

Way faster, way more range, a proper EV

Interior might not be as good, Golf is no Lexus or Merc itself

VW will make a proper EV soon, its called concept ID

Even they know the eGolf is a compliance car like the Focus EV

Why do you think VW are making the concept ID its main platfrom to compete with Model 3/Bolt and not the eGolf

KCross

KCross wrote: »

Top spec (SVE) 30kWh with 6.6kW charger for £14k here:
https://speakev.com/threads/nissan-leaf-tekna-30kwh-6-6kw.79497/

And... it's gone!!

Took less than 48hrs!

Shefwedfan

thierry14 wrote: »

You mentioned US, not me

Why is it a mute point?

What are you talking about?

thierry14 wrote: »

Did I mention Ireland?

What are you talking about?

thierry14 wrote: »

Your classes are all wrong too

Model 3 competes with BMW 3 series/Audi A4/ Mercedes

Your Golf is an econ box, its not in the same group as those cars, it competes with the Focus/Corolla/Mazda 3

Is the A4/3 series available in Electric? This is an electric car thread in case you got confused.

I made the reference to Merc above

thierry14 wrote: »

You make the Golf sound like a Merc,in VW group thats Audi

Chevy Bolt is far superior to the eGolf, only you would compare the too

I never said Golf was a Merc, can you please tell me where I said that?

Also as above I made reference to the Electric Merc

Audi does not have electric version of Golf so whats your point?

As I said already how do you know if Bolt is superior to eGolf?

thierry14 wrote: »

thierry14 wrote: »

Way faster, way more range, a proper EV

Thats your opinion, I thrust the opinion of people who have actually driven both cars.

thierry14 wrote: »

Interior might not be as good, Golf is no Lexus or Merc itself

Never said it was a Lexus or Merc, did I?

thierry14 wrote: »

VW will make a proper EV soon, its called concept ID

Explain why the eGolf is not a proper EV?

thierry14 wrote: »

Even they know the eGolf is a compliance car like the Focus EV

Why do you think VW are making the concept ID its main platfrom to compete with Model 3/Bolt and not the eGolf

Are you aware ID is not one car? but a number of cars? so Buzz etc is ID....

I don't actually understand what you are ranting and raving about? As per my post I said the eGolf was a step up from Ioniq/Leaf. Which it is? Can you agree that?

Seeing as the eGolf is outselling the Leaf/Ioniq in other parts of the World it is not too bad for compliance car.

goz83

Shefwedfan wrote: »

What are you talking about?



What are you talking about?



Is the A4/3 series available in Electric? This is an electric car thread in case you got confused.

I made the reference to Merc above



I never said Golf was a Merc, can you please tell me where I said that?

Also as above I made reference to the Electric Merc

Audi does not have electric version of Golf so whats your point?

As I said already how do you know if Bolt is superior to eGolf?

thierry14 wrote: »

Thats your opinion, I thrust the opinion of people who have actually driven both cars.



Never said it was a Lexus or Merc, did I?



Explain why the eGolf is not a proper EV?



Are you aware ID is not one car? but a number of cars? so Buzz etc is ID....

I don't actually understand what you are ranting and raving about? As per my post I said the eGolf was a step up from Ioniq/Leaf. Which it is? Can you agree that?

Seeing as the eGolf is outselling the Leaf/Ioniq in other parts of the World it is not too bad for compliance car.

Keep Cool

waynegalway

thierry14 wrote: »

Wait for the new Leaf in Feb 18

Buying the old one now is madness

On a related point to this and scrappage:

A Nissan dealer informed me that the €5k scrappage he was able to offer me on a new 30kWh car will not be available on the new 40kWh model that’s coming in Feb. So, if you’re banking on scrappage, you’d have to be going for a new 30kWh version.

Shefwedfan

goz83 wrote: »

Keep Cool

Just trying to clarify from other posters what he/she is talking about....

I didn't think my reply was aggressive or anything?

thierry14

Shefwedfan wrote: »

..in the US the choice is Tesla 3 or eGolf......Ireland has not caught up yet....

This is what I was quoting you on

Fanboy much?

BoatMad

thierry14 wrote: »

This is what I was quoting you on

Fanboy much?

Given the tesla model 3 isn't actually shipping in volume ,in the US , I hardly see it being a choice and it's 12-18 months away in Ireland

BoatMad

waynegalway wrote: »

On a related point to this and scrappage:

A Nissan dealer informed me that the €5k scrappage he was able to offer me on a new 30kWh car will not be available on the new 40kWh model that’s coming in Feb. So, if you’re banking on scrappage, you’d have to be going for a new 30kWh version.

If you get a good deal buying a run out model 30kwh leaf is quite a good idea, especially if the car suits your needs.

unkel

Given a new model 40kWh would be available on the road for about €27k (once the lower spec models come out), The old model 30kWh would need to be under €20k on the road for it to be a reasonably good deal and I can't see that happening.

BoatMad

unkel wrote: »

Given a new model 40kWh would be available on the road for about €27k (once the lower spec models come out), The old model 30kWh would need to be under €20k on the road for it to be a reasonably good deal and I can't see that happening.

A scrappage and a bit of discount should get it to 20k ish. Not bad at that price , it's a good solid car with enough range for many people. Just like my iPhone 6