Sutton to Malahide Greenway

Moflojo

Fingal County Council is holding public consultations this week on the proposed Sutton-Malahide Greenway. This project will eventually link to and extend the coast route from Clontarf-Sutton.

The first consultation was last night, Tuesday, but there'll be another one tonight and again on Thursday. Anyone who's interested should go along and get informed or just express support for the scheme.

The full schedule of public consultations is as follows:
Tuesday 17th October | 3.30-7.30pm in Portmarnock Hotel and Golf Links.
Wednesday 18th October | 3.30-7.30pm in Malahide Library.
Thursday 19th October | 4.15-7.30pm in Baldoyle Library.

More information available here: http://www.dublincycling.com/cycling/sutton-malahide-greenway-information-evenings

Rogue-Trooper

Did you go last night? Is it just a viewing of the proposed plans or is there someone there from the council to converse with?

Moflojo

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

Did you go last night? Is it just a viewing of the proposed plans or is there someone there from the council to converse with?

Haven't gone, nor will I get a chance to this week, but the description of the meetings this week is: "...to set out the scope of the project and to start the discussion with local people and visitors on the issues, challenges and opportunities in designing the Greenway."

I guess that means there will be maps showing the outline route of the Greenway and giving an overview of the type of path that's proposed.

Doctor Bob

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

Is it just a viewing of the proposed plans or is there someone there from the council to converse with?

The ad from the local press (copy here: https://twitter.com/dublincycling/status/919895726812991488) says there'll be FCC staff at the information evenings.

Rogue-Trooper

There was actually a leaflet from Labour in the door when i got home about this.

Says "Various options under consideration for the proposed scheme will be available at each venue and Fingal staff will also be present to provide further information on the project".

After much rooting around the fingal website, I found the page with the proposals here.

Will drop down tomorrow evening if I get home from work in time.

mr spuckler

it annoys me that the way this week lined itself up for me meant i couldn't go out to see this. thanks for the link above

plodder

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

There was actually a leaflet from Labour in the door when i got home about this.

Says "Various options under consideration for the proposed scheme will be available at each venue and Fingal staff will also be present to provide further information on the project".

After much rooting around the fingal website, I found the page with the proposals here.

Will drop down tomorrow evening if I get home from work in time.

Good find. You need to download the PDF files to be able to see the plans clearly, and it looks like you can make a submission there too. So, it isn't really necessary to attend the sessions in person. It would be great if as many people as possible voice their support for the plans, as doubtless there will be some who are agin' it.

The whole coastal plan and particularly the link to Donabate from Malahide (which isn't covered by this) will be a fantastic addition.

magicbastarder

am i missing it, but do the route outlines stop in baldoyle and start again in portmarnock? i'd regard the road between them as possibly the most important part.

brocbrocach

plodder wrote: »

The whole coastal plan and particularly the link to Donabate from Malahide (which isn't covered by this) will be a fantastic addition.

Will that go over the viaduct?

mr spuckler

brocbrocach wrote: »

Will that go over the viaduct?

pretty sure i read that a new bridge is to be built for it.

brocbrocach

mr spuckler wrote: »

pretty sure i read that a new bridge is to be built for it.

Brilliant! Look forward to that. I presume that'd be shared with pedestrians too?

mr spuckler

brocbrocach wrote: »

Brilliant! Look forward to that. I presume that'd be shared with pedestrians too?

yep. link here to an old story on it, i definitely read something more recently though.

cdaly_

magicbastarder wrote: »

am i missing it, but do the route outlines stop in baldoyle and start again in portmarnock? i'd regard the road between them as possibly the most important part.

According to Dublincycling.com, Councillor David Healy says:

“The Baldoyle to Portmarnock section has been taken first, separately, and is expected to go to An Bord Pleanala and formal public consultation, probably in November.”

plodder

mr spuckler wrote: »

yep. link here to an old story on it, i definitely read something more recently though.

Yeah, there's already some kind of a service road on the embankment which had to be put in when the bridge collapsed. I assume there is space for same on the other side and all that's needed is a bridge alongside the new railway bridge.

mcgratheoin

Here's the entire set of options

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B68tZJiNn0H7emRxdlAxNkNzOE0

magicbastarder

cdaly_ wrote: »

According to Dublincycling.com, Councillor David Healy says:

“The Baldoyle to Portmarnock section has been taken first, separately, and is expected to go to An Bord Pleanala and formal public consultation, probably in November.”

cheers - i'm comfortable enough on that road, but can easily see why it'd be intimidating for people not confident on a bike.

Colonel Claptrap

magicbastarder wrote: »

cheers - i'm comfortable enough on that road, but can easily see why it'd be intimidating for people not confident on a bike.

It's awkward enough as a motorist overtaking cyclists / joggers. The steeped banks are not ideal.

Must be tricky as a cyclist.

Moflojo

magicbastarder wrote: »

cheers - i'm comfortable enough on that road, but can easily see why it'd be intimidating for people not confident on a bike.

It's contested space. Have been on the receiving end of aggro from drivers there when out for spins. Would only cycle it with others now, don't feel safe on it solo. Baldoyle-Portmarnock Greenway can't come soon enough IMO!

Rogue-Trooper

Details of the proposed stretch between Baldoyle and Portmarnock have been submitted to An Bord Pleanala by Fingal.

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/baldoyle-and-portmarnock-pedestrian-and-cyclist-scheme

Alanstrainor won't be posting any more videos in the near miss thread if this comes to pass!

plodder

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

Details of the proposed stretch between Baldoyle and Portmarnock have been submitted to An Bord Pleanala by Fingal.

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/baldoyle-and-portmarnock-pedestrian-and-cyclist-scheme

Alanstrainor won't be posting any more videos in the near miss thread if this comes to pass!

That's good news. The land seems to be fenced off already. So, I guess that means it's ready to go as soon as ABP give approval.

Alanstrainor

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

Details of the proposed stretch between Baldoyle and Portmarnock have been submitted to An Bord Pleanala by Fingal.

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/baldoyle-and-portmarnock-pedestrian-and-cyclist-scheme

Alanstrainor won't be posting any more videos in the near miss thread if this comes to pass!

Haha, all going well!

Sounds fantastic.

magicbastarder

that looks like it's not going to meander back and forth across the coast road, which is excellent news.

mr spuckler

magicbastarder wrote: »

that looks like it's not going to meander back and forth across the coast road, which is excellent news.

I think that was what was proposed for Baldoyle itself wasn't it? largely due to space / land ownership issues iirc.

this looks like an excellent proposal and indeed potentially a template for how these should be done. the grass separation between pedestrians and cyclist is imo a really good idea.

plodder

There will be a new signal controlled crossing at Mayne Rd. though, where before you would just go straight thru on the main rd.

magicbastarder

mr spuckler wrote: »

I think that was what was proposed for Baldoyle itself wasn't it? largely due to space / land ownership issues iirc.

i misunderstood so, i just assumed it'd be swapping backwards and forwards along the coast road.

Tombo2001

magicbastarder wrote: »

am i missing it, but do the route outlines stop in baldoyle and start again in portmarnock? i'd regard the road between them as possibly the most important part.

The point is to be able to call it a greenway, have a photo op and press release.

As long as we are clear on that we can proceed.

mr spuckler

magicbastarder wrote: »

i misunderstood so, i just assumed it'd be swapping backwards and forwards along the coast road.

I think it might have been proposed that there would be a crossing from the coast side at the roundabout to join with this stretch, as well as the multiple crossings between there and Sutton.

but I'm working off something that I looked over a few months back so could equally be wrong on it!
there were definitely significant issues down around the railway crossing and tbh it looked pretty unusable for all but the more leisurely cyclists. certainly if commuting / out training etc there's no way you'd be inclined to cross the road so many times.

the one thing that annoys me (annoys might not be exactly the right word) about something like this is that it highlights the absolute dearth of proper cycling infrastructure. similarly with the coast path from Sutton to Fairview, it's incredible how relaxing the cycle path is compared to re-entering the bear-pit on East Wall Road.

Tombo2001

mr spuckler wrote: »

I think it might have been proposed that there would be a crossing from the coast side at the roundabout to join with this stretch, as well as the multiple crossings between there and Sutton.

but I'm working off something that I looked over a few months back so could equally be wrong on it!
there were definitely significant issues down around the railway crossing and tbh it looked pretty unusable for all but the more leisurely cyclists. certainly if commuting / out training etc there's no way you'd be inclined to cross the road so many times.

the one thing that annoys me (annoys might not be exactly the right word) about something like this is that it highlights the absolute dearth of proper cycling infrastructure. similarly with the coast path from Sutton to Fairview, it's incredible how relaxing the cycle path is compared to re-entering the bear-pit on East Wall Road.

Never a truer word spoken.

On the subject ....... how much was spent on that 'cycle bridge' there at Fairview over the canal. What were they thinking?

mathie

The part where it joins back to the road near the Portmarnock roundabout needs to be done correctly.
A dangerous bend there with drivers generally speeding both ways.

Also could they not extend the bridge over Moyne river to over Moyne Rd?
Or do I need to wake up?

mr spuckler

mathie wrote: »

The part where it joins back to the road near the Portmarnock roundabout needs to be done correctly.
A dangerous bend there with drivers generally speeding both ways.

Also could they not extend the bridge over Moyne river to over Moyne Rd?
Or do I need to wake up?

you're wide awake! the bridge is just over the river and it's a raised toucan crossing on Moyne road...

plodder

mathie wrote: »

The part where it joins back to the road near the Portmarnock roundabout needs to be done correctly.
A dangerous bend there with drivers generally speeding both ways.

Also could they not extend the bridge over Moyne river to over Moyne Rd?
Or do I need to wake up?

image upload

The purple shows the "toucan" (where do they get these names?) signalised junction. So, it will be safe definitely.

A bridge over Mayne rd. would be a massive cost, a bit ott in my opinion.

magicbastarder

plodder wrote: »

The purple shows the "toucan" (where do they get these names?)

two can cross; i.e. a pedestrian and a cyclist, side by side.

site_owner

great to see this getting going.

but, to add to the list of head scratchers, why are they pretending that the short section from the thatch cottage to red arches roundabaout doesnt need any work?

Colonel Claptrap

I spotted construction work on the strand road near the roundabout.

Is it part of this project?

cdaly_

site_owner wrote: »

great to see this getting going.

but, to add to the list of head scratchers, why are they pretending that the short section from the thatch cottage to red arches roundabaout doesnt need any work?

I think it will be part of the larger development of the greenway. This bit is just to prioritise the narrow, twisty, no-footpath stretch between the two roundabouts.

brocbrocach

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Never a truer word spoken.

On the subject ....... how much was spent on that 'cycle bridge' there at Fairview over the canal. What were they thinking?

Do you mean the humpback bridge near the the five lamps? That was definitely a big fat waste of money - unless they plan to build a cycle lane leading up to it everybody is just going to stick to the road.

buffalo

brocbrocach wrote: »

Do you mean the humpback bridge near the the five lamps? That was definitely a big fat waste of money - unless they plan to build a cycle lane leading up to it everybody is just going to stick to the road.

They do.

edit: here you go: http://www.dublincity.ie/sites/default/files/content/Planning/Documents/150522%20Phase%202_Section%201.pdf

mr spuckler

buffalo wrote: »

They do.

edit: here you go: http://www.dublincity.ie/sites/default/files/content/Planning/Documents/150522%20Phase%202_Section%201.pdf

I presume that's all part of the eventual plan for the Royal Canal greenway? I'm from Athlone so would be something else to be able to hop on there and basically stay away from the road the whole way down to Athlone.

buffalo

mr spuckler wrote: »

I presume that's all part of the eventual plan for the Royal Canal greenway? I'm from Athlone so would be something else to be able to hop on there and basically stay away from the road the whole way down to Athlone.

Yes, that's it alright.

Some links and info at http://royalcanal.ie/royal-canal-greenway/

DCC: http://www.dublincity.ie/main-menu-services-planning-planning-news/royal-canal-greenway-part-8

mathie

Great to see the "greenway" from Baldoyle to Portmarnock but we'll be going from zero points where we've to yield to two points. Waiting on pedestrian lights (if the ones from the coast road to the Baldoyle rd are anything to go by) is a major pain in this country.
For a stretch that normally take a few minutes (depending on the wind) that's not great.

I know some will say its "safer" but I don't know. I guess we'll see how its actually implemented.

Alanstrainor

mathie wrote: »

Great to see the "greenway" from Baldoyle to Portmarnock but we'll be going from zero points where we've to yield to two points. Waiting on pedestrian lights (if the ones from the coast road to the Baldoyle rd are anything to go by) is a major pain in this country.
For a stretch that normally take a few minutes (depending on the wind) that's not great.

I know some will say its "safer" but I don't know. I guess we'll see how its actually implemented.

I see the concern, but I just don't see how it would have been possible without these crossing/entry points. I would hope that whatever lights there are at Moyne Road would give priority to pedestrians and cyclists. This should mean that people of all ages can now get between Baldoyle and Portmarnock. As it stands only the hardcore will brave that stretch, even in daylight.

cdaly_

mathie wrote: »

Great to see the "greenway" from Baldoyle to Portmarnock but we'll be going from zero points where we've to yield to two points. Waiting on pedestrian lights (if the ones from the coast road to the Baldoyle rd are anything to go by) is a major pain in this country.
For a stretch that normally take a few minutes (depending on the wind) that's not great.

I know some will say its "safer" but I don't know. I guess we'll see how its actually implemented.

The Moyne Road junction map shows a 'raised table' at the junction. That will presumably mean that cars travelling north and turning left won't just sweep the turn at speed but will instead need to slow. Most of the other traffic should be easy enough. I would like to see the left turn radius be very tight to further force slowing on the turn.

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I see the concern, but I just don't see how it would have been possible without these crossing/entry points. I would hope that whatever lights there are at Moyne Road would give priority to pedestrians and cyclists.

If they're implemented like the lights at the Wooden Bridge at Clontarf, not a hope. The only time I've seen those green for cyclists is some time after somebody pressed the pedestrian button and walked on after getting impatient. They don't even include a cyclist phase when the side road gets a green!

Type 17

plodder wrote: »

the "toucan" (where do they get these names?)

magicbastarder wrote: »

two can cross; i.e. a pedestrian and a cyclist, side by side.

Also a back-formation from Pelican Crossing - PEdestrian LIght CONtrolled Crossing, and Puffin Crossing - Pedestrian User Friendly INtelligent crossing.

[/trivia factoid]

Alanstrainor

cdaly_ wrote: »

If they're implemented like the lights at the Wooden Bridge at Clontarf, not a hope. The only time I've seen those green for cyclists is some time after somebody pressed the pedestrian button and walked on after getting impatient. They don't even include a cyclist phase when the side road gets a green!

A can dream!

Felexicon

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I see the concern, but I just don't see how it would have been possible without these crossing/entry points. I would hope that whatever lights there are at Moyne Road would give priority to pedestrians and cyclists. This should mean that people of all ages can now get between Baldoyle and Portmarnock. As it stands only the hardcore will brave that stretch, even in daylight.

I went that way on Saturday at about 10:00 and must have had about 10 close passes. It's a crazy stretch of road

Colonel Claptrap

Public consultation on the baldoyle stretch begins next week.

Edit: I'm going to head to the consultation. I'm happy to pass on any suggestions/concerns boardsies have while I'm there?

TK Lemon

Sorry to bump. I see this has begun getting traction again. The mayor of Fingal said he hopes to compete the Greenway first stage from Malahide to Donabate by 2022.

He said he hopes to eventually extend it from Sutton to Balbriggan.

Will this follow the train tracks along Rogerstown Estuary? Thus allowing people to cycle from Lusk into the Greenway or will it bypass the area totally.

Shedite27

TK Lemon wrote: »

Sorry to bump. I see this has begun getting traction again. The mayor of Fingal said he hopes to compete the Greenway first stage from Malahide to Donabate by 2022.

He said he hopes to eventually extend it from Sutton to Balbriggan.

Will this follow the train tracks along Rogerstown Estuary? Thus allowing people to cycle from Lusk into the Greenway or will it bypass the area totally.

Yeah it goes across the causeway with the train

TK Lemon

Shedite27 wrote: »

Yeah it goes across the causeway with the train

Thanks for the reply.
I know it comes across the Malahide Donabate one but does it also go across Donabate to Rush/Lusk?

plodder

TK Lemon wrote: »

Thanks for the reply.
I know it comes across the Malahide Donabate one but does it also go across Donabate to Rush/Lusk?

No, the route is from Malahide Castle to Newbridge House. But, long term the plan is to go to Balbriggan, so there will be a crossing of Rogerstown as well I presume.

Mercian Pro

There was a preliminary consultation a few months on the Donabate to Balbriggan route. The outline maps indicated that they are thinking of running the Greenway alongside the railway at Rogerstown, similar to Broadmeadows. An earlier report had mentioned a possible bridge from the Burrow, Portrane to near Rush Harbour but that seems to have been dropped now. It's still at a very early stage.