Planning/council fees

kingbhome

A site has came on the market near me that im very interested in that first had outline planning back in 2000. Was upgraded to planning for a house a few years later then planning for an extension period in 2012 which brings it up untill early 2018.

Seeing as the decision was made back in 2012, would i be liable for council contributions that came in effect in 2013 along with the new amendments.

Would i have to build to 2012 or 2018 building regs if i was to swiftly purchase this site.

If i where to slightly reduce the size of the rooms but keep the same design, would i need new planning or can i build and put in retention at a later date.

Metric Tensor

The dates don't add up OP.

If it had outline in 2000 that would expire in 2005. (Actually maybe even 2003 - outlines were reduced to 3 years at some point but I'm not sure when). If "permission subsequent to outline" was granted it would still have expired in 2005. An extension could then have brought this to 2010.

Let's say for the sake of argument that the initial outline expired and a whole new application was granted in 2007 that expired in 2012 then this could have been extended to 2017. (Not 2018!)

It's immaterial anyway. Unless you are a very well resourced developer you will not have the house at "roof level" by early 2018 on a site you don't even own yet!!

Ignoring ALL of the above: Fees as per the relevant grant unless otherwise agreed with the council. Size as per drawings on the relevant planning. Current building regulations throughout.

kingbhome

Metric Tensor wrote: »

The dates don't add up OP.

If it had outline in 2000 that would expire in 2005. (Actually maybe even 2003 - outlines were reduced to 3 years at some point but I'm not sure when). If "permission subsequent to outline" was granted it would still have expired in 2005. An extension could then have brought this to 2010.

Let's say for the sake of argument that the initial outline expired and a whole new application was granted in 2007 that expired in 2012 then this could have been extended to 2017. (Not 2018!)

It's immaterial anyway. Unle


ss you are a very well resourced developer you will not have the house at "roof level" by early 2018 on a site you don't even own yet!!

Ignoring ALL of the above: Fees as per the relevant grant unless otherwise agreed with the council. Size as per drawings on the relevant planning. Current building regulations throughout.

I have been on the council website and the dates add up. Ive probably made an error in my OP. The date of 2012-2018 is valid thou. I was surprised myself because i know its 5 years but its saying on the council website, end of Jan it runs out. No clauses on the site either.

Im not a developer however all my family work in construction and if the site could be swiftly bought, i think i could have foundations, block,windows& roof on by the end of Jan. I will have the trusses waiting while the block is going up. And im sure the council wouldnt be too fussed if i was a week or two over the deadline.

As for the fees, was this not something attached to new planning from 2013. Why is it its to be current regs if the planning was granted in 2012.

Metric Tensor

The building regulations have absolutely nothing to do with planning permission and are applied from when construction is started (with some grandfather clauses, none of which apply to you).

It's possible a new application was made in 2012 but not granted until early 2013 thus expiring in 2018. Have a professional check this for you - it may have consequences for your proposed build.

I could be corrected on the fees but the contributions are written on the grant of planning permission so as far as I know these apply unless you get confirmation otherwise from the council. Unless of course it says that the contributions will apply at the prevailing rate of the time.

How long will the purchase process take? Did your solicitor tell you?

How long will it take to prepare the construction drawings including updating the whole design to comply with the current building regulations, designing the structure, etc.

Are you building without a mortgage? How long will it take to secure?

Who's preparing and lodging the commencement documents? What is their schedule and have you factored in the two week wait once lodged?

Honestly if you got all of that done between now and Christmas you'll be doing very well. And that's even before you open the gate.

I'm not trying to be a nay-sayer here but the type of people who could have a house built by the end of January do not need to ask the questions you are asking here. If by some miracle you throw something up by the end of January it will not be right and it will definitely not be of good quality.

Also the "site" is worth little more than agricultural value now - you are being fooled if you are paying more.

Penn

kingbhome wrote: »

Why is it its to be current regs if the planning was granted in 2012.

You have to build to the building regulations which are applicable at the time of construction. Planning is irrelevant.

I agree with Metric Tensor with regards build time. It's the start of October and it's a new house build. Even opting out of BCAR requirements (which will depend on how you're financing the build as some banks will only give the mortgage if you opt-in), you would need to get construction drawings done up (again, to design in accordance with current building regulations), a professional to oversee and sign off the build in accordance with building regulations and planning and you can't start until a minimum of 2 weeks after you submit the commencement notice. You're also entering winter with its bad weather which will affect ground conditions for excavations, foundations, the entire sub-structure and also for the building of blockwork.

You also don't own the site (it's not always a straightforward thing to buy a site, for example there could be boundary issues which arise which could delay the sale for months) and the planning is not in your name (check the planning conditions in case it was conditioned that the applicant has to live in the home for 7 years after construction, which can be a common condition depending where you are, or based on local needs requirements).

This isn't something you should be rushing into. I'd suggest first and foremost to organise a pre-planning meeting and discuss submitting your own new planning application for the site and the requirements of same.

Angry bird

Doubtful if doable in that time frame.

kingbhome

Penn wrote: »

You have to build to the building regulations which are applicable at the time of construction. Planning is irrelevant.

I agree with Metric Tensor with regards build time. It's the start of October and it's a new house build. Even opting out of BCAR requirements (which will depend on how you're financing the build as some banks will only give the mortgage if you opt-in), you would need to get construction drawings done up (again, to design in accordance with current building regulations), a professional to oversee and sign off the build in accordance with building regulations and planning and you can't start until a minimum of 2 weeks after you submit the commencement notice. You're also entering winter with its bad weather which will affect ground conditions for excavations, foundations, the entire sub-structure and also for the building of blockwork.

You also don't own the site (it's not always a straightforward thing to buy a site, for example there could be boundary issues which arise which could delay the sale for months) and the planning is not in your name (check the planning conditions in case it was conditioned that the applicant has to live in the home for 7 years after construction, which can be a common condition depending where you are, or based on local needs requirements).

This isn't something you should be rushing into. I'd suggest first and foremost to organise a pre-planning meeting and discuss submitting your own new planning application for the site and the requirements of same.

Thanks for your reply. I was of the thinking that if it was 2012 planning, then it was built to 2012 regs. Thanks for clearing this up.

This site has no clauses in it for living in the area or has to live in the house for x-amount of years.

Itll be a cash build. Was hoping to buy the site and have it sealed before the deadline.

How long does it take for the council to go over the new drawings. Is it an 8 week period same as planning?

kingbhome

Metric Tensor wrote: »

The building regulations have absolutely nothing to do with planning permission and are applied from when construction is started (with some grandfather clauses, none of which apply to you).

It's possible a new application was made in 2012 but not granted until early 2013 thus expiring in 2018. Have a professional check this for you - it may have consequences for your proposed build.

I could be corrected on the fees but the contributions are written on the grant of planning permission so as far as I know these apply unless you get confirmation otherwise from the council. Unless of course it says that the contributions will apply at the prevailing rate of the time.

How long will the purchase process take? Did your solicitor tell you?

How long will it take to prepare the construction drawings including updating the whole design to comply with the current building regulations, designing the structure, etc.

Are you building without a mortgage? How long will it take to secure?

Who's preparing and lodging the commencement documents? What is their schedule and have you factored in the two week wait once lodged?

Honestly if you got all of that done between now and Christmas you'll be doing very well. And that's even before you open the gate.

I'm not trying to be a nay-sayer here but the type of people who could have a house built by the end of January do not need to ask the questions you are asking here. If by some miracle you throw something up by the end of January it will not be right and it will definitely not be of good quality.

Also the "site" is worth little more than agricultural value now - you are being fooled if you are paying more.

Im considering trying to get the planning extended if thats possible.



Heres the dates from the co/co site.


EXTENSION OF DURATION Status: Application Finalised
Received: 27/01/2012 Due Date: 22/03/2012

Valid Date: 27/01/2012 Incomplete Date:
Decision: Unconditional Expiry Date: 24/01/2018 No Con/Res: 0
Withdrawn Date: Appeal Date:
Extend Date: Decision MO Date: 13/03/2012 Appeal Decision:
Applicant Details
Applicant Name:
Agent Details
Agent Name:
Agent Address:

Proposed Development
Development
Description: EXTENSION OF DURATION OF ....... THE DEVELOPMENT WILL CONSIST OF 1. DEMOLITION OF EXISTING DERELICT COTTAGE 2. THE CONSTRUCTION OF SINGLE DWELLING, PROPRIETARY EFFLUENT TREATMENT UNIT, PERCOLATION AREA AND ALL ANCILLARY SITE WORKS
Development Address:


Protected Structure? N
Location Key:
Appeal Details
Notification Date: BP Reference No.:
Appeal Type:
Appeal Decision: Decision Date:
Withdrawn Date: Dismissed Date:

Metric Tensor

Firstly - you can only extend the time once. (If you were NAMA you'd be allowed do it twice!)

More importantly I think there's a typo on the website and the expiry date should be 2017. Download the copy of the actual written grant (It will be there as a PDF, JPEG or a god-awful DJVU file) and check the dates written on that. Do it tonight before doing anything else. 6 years seems wrong in this case.