HKC self install

carlo_shannon

Hi - Im planning a from scratch self install of a HKC wireless secureComm system at home.

I see from their website that they dont sell to non installers but Ill buy the parts through a registered electrician and install myself.

im an elec engineer but new to this type of install.

are there any parts that would catch me out as a self installer? I see their website portal to activate the securecomm monitoring requires a registered installer to register the bank details for payment.

anything else like that?

essentially I am looking for a smart alarm that I can monitor from my phone without paying monthly fee. I know HKC charge 4/5 euro a month, so any recommendations of different system welcome

Thanks
CS

KoolKid

If you are looking for a smart alarm with no charges look at Siemens Vanderbilt, GSD or Risco. Although HKC is the most freely available panel there is no free option to connect and use their apps.
All the above have free versions with apps that are free to download.

kub

OP, just please be aware that free notifications are the most vulnerable to failure.

KoolKid

Not sure how prone to failure is identified or qualified. But if you are are looking for back up options take a look at the sticky. You be amazed at the difference between the notification times between systems when comms fail.

kub

What are you on about? Electrical failure and your router is gone down, therefore if you were relying on that and as your alarm is still functioning due to its back up battery, it will still work.
So some scrote breaks into your home while the electricity is off, your alarm may make a racket but the guy that decided free was the way to go will not be notified that his alarm has activated.

Being notified of a comms failure will not receive the same attention as a notification of an activation.

altor

carlo_shannon wrote: »

Hi - Im planning a from scratch self install of a HKC wireless secureComm system at home.

I see from their website that they dont sell to non installers but Ill buy the parts through a registered electrician and install myself.

im an elec engineer but new to this type of install.

are there any parts that would catch me out as a self installer? I see their website portal to activate the securecomm monitoring requires a registered installer to register the bank details for payment.

anything else like that?

essentially I am looking for a smart alarm that I can monitor from my phone without paying monthly fee. I know HKC charge 4/5 euro a month, so any recommendations of different system welcome

Thanks
CS

They only sell through distributors.
You can sign up yourself, non branded.

KoolKid

kub wrote: »

What are you on about? Electrical failure and your router is gone down, therefore if you were relying on that and as your alarm is still functioning due to its back up battery, it will still work.
So some scrote breaks into your home while the electricity is off, your alarm may make a racket but the guy that decided free was the way to go will not be notified that his alarm has activated.

Being notified of a comms failure will not receive the same attention as a notification of an activation.

Yes. In the exact same way as a standard monitored alarm works and the phone line goes down and you only know about it 24 hours later.

kub

KoolKid wrote:

Yes. In the exact same way as a standard monitored alarm works and the phone line goes down and you only know about it 24 hours later.

I thought now your technical knowledge was better than that.

Phone lines do not fail when electricity fails.
Unless of course it is the mickey mouse UPC router arrangement.

KoolKid

But they can fail. Power can fail, broadband can fail.
Most people really are not as bothered as you think about all these what of scenarios.
The OP has plenty of information now to look over. I'm sure he can make up his own mind.

kub

They can indeed, but I am specifically referring to electrical failures.

stuartkee

Carlo HKC is the benchmark in domestic intruder alarm panels as you already know. And also the easiest to install. As was said above anything that's has a single communication path is rubbish . Any panel that only works with broadband only is also rubbish and any panel that is relying on electricity to keep it's communication path open is also rubbish . If €5 a month is way to much to invest in a can do panel that protects your home family and all its contents well I'd say you need to have a better look at whats important. YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR. Free is never best





quote="carlo_shannon;104216720"]Hi - Im


planning a from scratch self install of a HKC wireless secureComm system at home.

I see from their website that they dont sell to non installers but Ill buy the parts through a registered electrician and install myself.

im an elec engineer but new to this type of install.

are there any parts that would catch me out as a self installer? I see their website portal to activate the securecomm monitoring requires a registered installer to register the bank details for payment.

anything else like that?

essentially I am looking for a smart alarm that I can monitor from my phone without paying monthly fee. I know HKC charge 4/5 euro a month, so any recommendations of different system welcome

Thanks
CS[/quote]

KoolKid

By that logic every non monitored system in the country is rubbish.??:D
Everyone doesn't want monitoring, everyone doesn't want or have to pay for it.
The OP came on at the start saying he didn't want to pay ongoing subscriptions.
Lets give him the options & let him decide without a sales pitch for the one brand.

altor

kub wrote: »

I thought now your technical knowledge was better than that.

I would of thought the same till I read this in a post last night!!!

KoolKid wrote: »

Emails can be received without coverage on your phone.

I'd like to see that happening 😂

KoolKid

If you are going to quote me please do so showing the context of the quote , Not just a few words that suit.

KoolKid wrote: »

A Voice Dialler would notify you if you are out of data coverage
A Text dialler would notify you if you were out of 3/4G coverage
Emails can be received without coverage on your phone.
There are multiple other options to convert different notifications to text/voice

And then the quote reference was mysteriously to some different post from someone else.:eek:

stuartkee

Are Text messages free then ? Is Data free ?

KoolKid wrote: »

By that logic every non monitored system in the country is rubbish.??:D
Everyone doesn't want monitoring, everyone doesn't want or have to pay for it.
The OP came on at the start saying he didn't want to pay ongoing subscriptions.
Lets give him the options & let him decide without a sales pitch for the one brand.

KoolKid

We have done this dance enough times.
I am not arguing with you, I'm giving the OP the information requested.
Its all covered in the sticky here.

kub

KoolKid wrote: »

By that logic every non monitored system in the country is rubbish.??:D
Everyone doesn't want monitoring, everyone doesn't want or have to pay for it.
The OP came on at the start saying he didn't want to pay ongoing subscriptions.
Lets give him the options & let him decide without a sales pitch for the one brand.

I have to agree with what Stuartkee said. HKC is the benchmark and has been recognised as so even by one of their rivals with what they called their panel.
Every non monitored system is rubbish, an alarm is only as good as the response it gets, the days of people firstly noticing and secondly taking any notice of yet another racket from someones alarm system, are gone.
There is no sales pitch here, it is a fact that HKC is the benchmark and that is all about it.

carlo_shannon

I may have explained myself poorly. I want to avoid paying a monthly fee of 30++ euro to a monitoring centre. I want to monitor myself via app. 4/5 euro seems reasonable to me for that.

What I really want to know is are there any other obstacles to me installing the HKC system myself that would need a registered installer to rectify. such as the registration of the monthly payment. i can source all parts myself and install myself. I just dont want to buy everything and then realise I cant activate the system due to some restriction

thank you for comments and advice so far

KoolKid

Thanks for the clarification . You can register and set it up yourself. The payment are made by yourself to them not an installer.

altor

carlo_shannon wrote: »

I may have explained myself poorly. I want to avoid paying a monthly fee of 30++ euro to a monitoring centre. I want to monitor myself via app. 4/5 euro seems reasonable to me for that.

What I really want to know is are there any other obstacles to me installing the HKC system myself that would need a registered installer to rectify. such as the registration of the monthly payment. i can source all parts myself and install myself. I just dont want to buy everything and then realise I cant activate the system due to some restriction

thank you for comments and advice so far

There should be no issues buying and installing the system yourself.
Setting up the App ID is done here, not branded.

carlo_shannon

For info I got 2 quotes from wholesalers for everything I need for securecomm with various PIRs and sensors and it came it pretty much as the same price as a local business will install and fit with guarantee. So a no brainer. Ill let the man do it and save me the heartache

spongerobinson

carlo_shannon wrote: »

For info I got 2 quotes from wholesalers for everything I need for securecomm with various PIRs and sensors and it came it pretty much as the same price as a local business will install and fit with guarantee. So a no brainer. Ill let the man do it and save me the heartache

Likewise when I was considering a self install - only worked out about 50 quid more to let a pro do it.

Blankety

I am changing out my old astec system, going to use hkc to replace it. How does the hkc app work? Once off payment of €8 for the app to enable monitoring over the internet?

spongerobinson

Blankety wrote: »

I am changing out my old astec system, going to use hkc to replace it. How does the hkc app work? Once off payment of €8 for the app to enable monitoring over the internet?

Nope. You have to buy the app, and then pay a monthly amount depending on what level of service you require. The basic one is 4.99 a month.

Just one to remember - you don't necessarily have to buy a copy of the app for each person. If one buys it, you can use family sharing on either Google Play or Apple Store to share the app with others.

Also you will need to purchase the SecureComm module for your system.

Blankety

spongerobinson wrote: »

Nope. You have to buy the app, and then pay a monthly amount depending on what level of service you require. The basic one is 4.99 a month.

Thank you for clarifying, and that changes everything, I'm not interested in a monthly fee.... One more astec repair will be attempted 😀

spongerobinson

Blankety wrote: »

Thank you for clarifying, and that changes everything, I'm not interested in a monthly fee.... One more astec repair will be attempted ��

No problem. I was of the same opinion until my installer made me realize that a fiver a month is not actually much at all when you consider the value of the goods in your home, and to give you that peace of mind.

As far as I'm aware the only other self monitoring options with HKC are either a phone dialler that uses your landline to dial your mobile, which could be even more costly unless you have free/cheap mobile calls.

Other option is the unit that you put your own sim card in that uses texts to alert you. With that one you've gotta make sure you keep the SIM topped up.

There are other systems you'll see people talk about on here that have free apps too. Personally I like HKC as I've always had them in houses and I have found them incredibly reliable systems. I can't speak about the reliability of Siemens etc as I've never used them, but I'm sure they are just as good if installed properly. From a self-install point of view, HKC is definitely easiest I think.

KoolKid

Blankety wrote: »

Thank you for clarifying, and that changes everything, I'm not interested in a monthly fee.... One more astec repair will be attempted 😀

Also take a look at the GSD i1070. This will integrate with your Astec sensors and contacts and will give you the option of free apps and usage.
If you want sim back up then it's €40 per year.
Some more information in the sticky

kub

KoolKid wrote:

Also take a look at the GSD i1070. This will integrate with your Astec sensors and contacts and will give you the option of free apps and usage. If you want sim back up then it's €40 per year. Some more information in the sticky

Please give all options as you claim you do. Just let the poster aware the weaknesses of the Free usage above.

Stoner

Ok guys can we leave the comparason content for the sticky.

That means, don't make your point and then point them to the sticky. Make your point in the sticky
Thank you

KoolKid

kub wrote: »

Please give all options as you claim you do. Just let the poster aware the weaknesses of the Free usage above.

Giving the options about Astec integration. The GSD i1070 is the only panel that offers this.

fred funk }{

At best, Astec sensors would be 5 years old and more than likely a lot older. I wouldn't recommend a type of system based on connecting to the, now obsolete gear, that's long gone.

KoolKid

5-6 years or more is not relatively old for sensors/contacts.
Plenty of upgrades out there older than that working perfectly.

fred funk }{

As you know, after about 5 years sensors can start to go.

KoolKid

And as you know they can also be good for 10 years +.
Unless your wanting to sell the customer something new ofcourse.

fred funk }{

KoolKid wrote: »

And as you know they can also be good for 10 years +.
Unless your wanting to sell the customer something new ofcourse.

.....or unless you wanted to get some service calls to change dodgy old sensors.

KoolKid

Much more to be made if you were selling customers all new sensors after 5 years.
Dont know anyone who would be recommending replacing sensors after 5-6 years. Easy enough to find the faulty ones if there's a problem.

fred funk }{

As usual, it's turned into an argument with you. I'm out.

KoolKid

Just giving the OP some other options.
Most installers I know, a good percentage of the work is upgrades. Not everyone wants to buy a complete new system every few years.

Blankety

KoolKid wrote: »

Also take a look at the GSD i1070. This will integrate with your Astec sensors and contacts and will give you the option of free apps and usage.
If you want sim back up then it's €40 per year.
Some more information in the sticky

Thanks for the advice all.
I changed the battery in astec, it has the battery error displayed for the last few months. Not sure if it was the cause of the issues but probably contributed to the recent instability. I agree that sensors etc could be starting to get dodgy they are about 9 years old.

The astec panel I have has a dialer built in, is there any means to use something like an internet relay or RPi to reset the alarm remotely? Maybe use the sounder signal to trigger an email alert, I have a few RPi lying around.... I disconnected the phone line years ago.

I know I'll probably have to bite the bullet and upgrade/replace the kit so don't shoot me for the perhaps silly questions.

KoolKid

Hi Blankety.
There are ways to keep most of your existing equipment if you really want to.
Here are a few scenarios.
New Sensors & Contacts can be converted easily enough to work with your existing panel , keypad , bells etc.
Existing sensors & contacts can be connected to a new panel/keypad & bells using the GSD i1070.I can't recommend you any other panel here as this is the only one that is designed to connect existing Astec sensors & contacts to.
You could use a 2 wire interface to replace the internal/external bell . This would allow you to connect lots of different diallers etc by giving you a negative trigger to work with.
With a dialler with an output you could link to a zone programmed as key for arm/disarm options. A bit complicated , but if you want to keep the panel & want a challenge its possible. Its up to you.
Replacing the panel also opens up the options of apps and remote control over IP.
GSD systems have the options of free apps & usage replying on IP only or at €40 per year including GPRS back up over an international SIM card.

A lot would depend on what alarm events your getting & if they continue after the battery replacement.

Blankety

KoolKid wrote: »

Existing sensors & contacts can be connected to a new panel/keypad & bells using the GSD i1070.......
Replacing the panel also opens up the options of apps and remote control over IP.
GSD systems have the options of free apps....

Thank you Koolkid, you have been very helpful, I missed the significance of using the GSD panel with it being backward compatible and giving the options for IP control. Why would I bother with a cobbled together RPi solution when an off the self one exists.

I'll try to get a reasonable price now from a GSD wholesaler, probably few and far between - everyone seems to be reselling HKC.

thanks again - great job.

KoolKid

Hi, I was trying to cover all your options.
GSD will happily put you in contact with companies in your area.

testicles

This post has been deleted.

altor

testicles wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

You missed the point :D:D