Irish rail student fare fine for wrong leap card type

maclek

So I recently purchased an Irish Rail ticket for my son as he's 16 and can't travel on a child fare.

I checked on the Irish Rail student website to make sure that he would have the correct ID.

It says "Leap Student Travelcard".

This apparently is something different to what he has which is a child 16-18 card with photo so bang €100 fine. Just what a 16 year old needs travelling on his own.

Total scam.

I'll be appealing but I though everyone should know, the website is clear as mud.

snowflaker

They are two different cards, leap involves paying for the travel with the card but tagging on/off

a student card is required when buying student tickets.

https://about.leapcard.ie/about/card-ticket-types#ticketTypes

the page on leap clearly indicates them as two different products

Fighting Tao

Not a scam. The student leap card is different to the child 16-18 leap card. It's up to the passenger to ensure they have the correct ticket.

maclek

I understand that, he was using his leap card as a form of id to be able to use the purchased Irish Rail student ticket.

snowflaker

maclek wrote: »

I understand that, he was using his leap card as a form of id to be able to use the purchased Irish Rail student ticket.

you have to put in a code, how could you do that with no code?

With a 16-18 its tag on/off surely if he tagged, his journey was charged correctly?

Leap is not available on intercity trains

maclek

snowflaker wrote: »

you have to put in a code, how could you do that with no code?

Where do you put in the code?

snowflaker wrote: »

With a 16-18 its tag on/off surely if he tagged, his journey was charged correctly?

Leap is not available on intercity trains

A student ticket was purchased for the intercity train, but a student ticket needs ID. The list of acceptable IDs includes using a student leap card as ID.

If the Irish Rail website said child leap card 16 - 18 is not acceptable then fair cop, but to the average person a student with a leap card has a student leap card, to have to become an expert on the naming conventions of leap cards to avoid a €100 fine is a scam.

snowflaker

maclek wrote: »

Where do you put in the code?



A student ticket was purchased for the intercity train, but a student ticket needs ID. The list of acceptable IDs includes using a student leap card as ID.

If the Irish Rail website said child leap card 16 - 18 is not acceptable then fair cop, but to the average person a student with a leap card has a student leap card, to have to become an expert on the naming conventions of leap cards to avoid a €100 fine is a scam.

Or read the guide???

Student tickets used require a code from the student ID.

Leap dont do intercity trains. only short commuter hop

snowflaker

The following information is relevant to the ticket(s) you have selected.

You have chosen a Student Ticket. Students can purchase InterCity tickets with either a valid college ID, a valid Student Travelcard or a valid Translink Student Discount card in the passengers name. Failure to produce a valid ticket, appropriate ID or surcharge where necessary will result in a fine of €100 together with the relevant unpaid fare.

No mention of student leap card when purchasing this ticket.

Manion

snowflaker wrote: »

Or read the guide???

Student tickets used require a code from the student ID.

Leap dont do intercity trains. only short commuter hop

For someone talking down to another poster you're actually wrong. Leap works fine on intercity routes provided you board at a station within the short hop zone.

maclek

snowflaker wrote: »

No mention of student leap card when purchasing this ticket.

Did you look at the page I linked? Here it is again.

Under "

ID Card Requirements"

Leap Student Travelcard

Where is this code you mention? No code was asked for during purchase.

threetrees

I don't think it's a scam but it would be better to specify on the website that the 16-18 card with a photo is not appropriate ID. Of course it should be, but it's not.

snowflaker

Manion wrote: »

For someone talking down to another poster you're actually wrong. Leap works fine on intercity routes provided you board at a station within the short hop zone.

And leave in short hop. Not considered intercity travel

snowflaker

maclek wrote: »

Did you look at the page I linked? Here it is again.

Under "

ID Card Requirements"

Leap Student Travelcard

Where is this code you mention? No code was asked for during purchase.

How was the ticket purchased? Online- it sets out the requirements as I quoted.

maclek

snowflaker wrote: »

No mention of student leap card when purchasing this ticket.

http://www.irishrail.ie/fares-and-tickets/students

jimmycrackcorm

threetrees wrote:

I don't think it's a scam but it would be better to specify on the website that the 16-18 card with a photo is not appropriate ID. Of course it should be, but it's not.

It is a bit of a scam because the fare was correct given that a student and a 16-18 pay the same but the id requirement is fussy when it was obvious from the card.

GM228

maclek wrote: »

Where do you put in the code?

When purchasing.

maclek wrote: »

A student ticket was purchased for the intercity train, but a student ticket needs ID. The list of acceptable IDs includes using a student leap card as ID.

If the Irish Rail website said child leap card 16 - 18 is not acceptable then fair cop, but to the average person a student with a leap card has a student leap card, to have to become an expert on the naming conventions of leap cards to avoid a €100 fine is a scam.

It lists what is acceptable, isn't that enough? It also links to the ID and shows what it looks like. If they were to list what isn't acceptable you could be reading that list for a long time as there is a vast amount of different ticket/ID types.

A student with a leap card has a leap card, not a student leap card - it's that simple. "Student Leap Card" does not equate to "Student with a Leap Card". I would think that the average person would understand that - it's a specific type of ID considering it states "valid forms of student ID", rather than a specific type of person who happens to have a leap card. How else would you know they were a student?

snowflaker

maclek wrote: »

http://www.irishrail.ie/fares-and-tickets/students

When purchasing online and selecting student it giving the warning I posted- no mention of leap card

snowflaker

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

It is a bit of a scam because the fare was correct given that a student and a 16-18 pay the same but the id requirement is fussy when it was obvious from the card.

16-18 do not automatically qualify for a lower fare on Irish Rail without valid student card.

goingnowhere

snowflaker wrote: »

16-18 do not automatically qualify for a lower fare on Irish Rail without valid student card.

Exactly, must be in full time education

Hilly Bill

maclek wrote: »

So I recently purchased an Irish Rail ticket for my son as he's 16 and can't travel on a child fare.

I checked on the Irish Rail student website to make sure that he would have the correct ID.

It says "Leap Student Travelcard".

This apparently is something different to what he has which is a child 16-18 card with photo so bang €100 fine. Just what a 16 year old needs travelling on his own.

Total scam.

I'll be appealing but I though everyone should know, the website is clear as mud.

Website is clear enough just admit you made a mistake and move on.

Hilly Bill

maclek wrote: »

I understand that, he was using his leap card as a form of id to be able to use the purchased Irish Rail student ticket.

There isn't any student fares in the leap zone just a lower capping.

Hilly Bill

maclek wrote: »

Where do you put in the code?



A student ticket was purchased for the intercity train, but a student ticket needs ID. The list of acceptable IDs includes using a student leap card as ID.

If the Irish Rail website said child leap card 16 - 18 is not acceptable then fair cop, but to the average person a student with a leap card has a student leap card, to have to become an expert on the naming conventions of leap cards to avoid a €100 fine is a scam.

You don't have to be an expert it's simple enough to understand. Why is it always a scam instead of people accepting their mistakes.

Hilly Bill

maclek wrote: »

Did you look at the page I linked? Here it is again.

Under "

ID Card Requirements"

Leap Student Travelcard

Where is this code you mention? No code was asked for during purchase.

You enter your student Id code when you buy a student ticket from a ticket machine. If you ignore it and still purchase a student ticket without a student travel card then you face the possibility of being fined. No scam.

liger

maclek wrote: »

So I recently purchased an Irish Rail ticket for my son as he's 16 and can't travel on a child fare.

I checked on the Irish Rail student website to make sure that he would have the correct ID.

It says "Leap Student Travelcard".

This apparently is something different to what he has which is a child 16-18 card with photo so bang €100 fine. Just what a 16 year old needs travelling on his own.

Total scam.

I'll be appealing but I though everyone should know, the website is clear as mud.

I clicked the link you posted.... then I clicked "leap student travelcard" it provides a nice big picture of the card and explanation of what it is..

clear as water

Dravokivich

The 16-18 card is just for teenagers who are 16-18. They could be finished school, working full time and still obtain one.

Charles Babbage

Dravokivich wrote: »

The 16-18 card is just for teenagers who are 16-18. They could be finished school, working full time and still obtain one.

What is the purpose of it other than to secure discounts?

LXFlyer

Charles Babbage wrote: »

What is the purpose of it other than to secure discounts?

The 16-18 LEAP card allows children aged 16-18 to avail of child fares on Dublin Bus and on Bus reann PSO services in the Greater Dublin area and in the provincial cities.

It's valid on Irish Rail services in the Dublin Short Hop Zone and between Cork and Cobh/Midleton.

It's not valid on Intercity rail services or Bus Eireann Expressway services.

Dravokivich

Charles Babbage wrote: »

What is the purpose of it other than to secure discounts?

It was initially for the 12-15 age range. The card then got amended to 16-18, the only criteria for it was that one was within the relevant age profile.

Charles Babbage

lxflyer wrote: »

The 16-18 LEAP card allows children aged 16-18 to avail of child fares on Dublin Bus and on Bus reann PSO services in the Greater Dublin area and in the provincial cities.

It's valid on Irish Rail services in the Dublin Short Hop Zone and between Cork and Cobh/Midleton.

It's not valid on Intercity rail services or Bus Eireann Expressway services.

There is the problem, different age structures, which could indeed confuse the public. In this day and age a very large proportion of 16-18 year olds are in fact students and they should just harmonise things.

CeilingFly

Hilly Bill wrote: »

You don't have to be an expert it's simple enough to understand. Why is it always a scam instead of people accepting their mistakes.

Because no-one wants to accept that its their fault - it always has to be someone else's fault.

wordofwarning

OP write a letter to Irish Rail explaining the misunderstanding etc. They might waive the fine

IMO the student leapcard etc are a racket for CIE. Most other countries in Europe allow students to buy student tickets with forcing them to hand over €12/15 for a piece of plastic to say they are a student. It is bizarre that someone in UCD, UCC, DCU etc get a student ID and then has to pay €12/15 to CIE to travel as a student. In Munich, Berlin, Prague etc, the local bus/train company gives you a free student travel card.

Dravokivich

wordofwarning wrote: »

OP write a letter to Irish Rail explaining the misunderstanding etc. They might waive the fine

IMO the student leapcard etc are a racket for CIE. Most other countries in Europe allow students to buy student tickets with forcing them to hand over €12/15 for a piece of plastic to say they are a student. It is bizarre that someone in UCD, UCC, DCU etc get a student ID and then has to pay €12/15 to CIE to travel as a student. In Munich, Berlin, Prague etc, the local bus/train company gives you a free student travel card.

I thought they didn't need the Student Leap Card (previously branded as Student Travel Card) anymore? A couple of years ago IR did promotions on the basis they'd accept the College ID for student tickets. A lot of people posting here at the time seemed to take it that, that was to lead into College IDs becoming normalised for purchasing those tickets.

Edit:
Also, the Student Leap Card has also acted as a discount card as well, for a rather nonimal buy-in fee to that scheme.

Hilly Bill

Dravokivich wrote: »

I thought they didn't need the Student Leap Card (previously branded as Student Travel Card) anymore? A couple of years ago IR did promotions on the basis they'd accept the College ID for student tickets. A lot of people posting here at the time seemed to take it that, that was to lead into College IDs becoming normalised for purchasing those tickets.

Edit:
Also, the Student Leap Card has also acted as a discount card as well, for a rather nonimal buy-in fee to that scheme.

You can use your student card to buy student tickets and the travel card for weekly and monthly tickets.. You can use the leap part of the card to avail of a lower cap on the daily and weekly fares in the leap zone.

Hilly Bill

wordofwarning wrote: »

OP write a letter to Irish Rail explaining the misunderstanding etc. They might waive the fine

IMO the student leapcard etc are a racket for CIE. Most other countries in Europe allow students to buy student tickets with forcing them to hand over €12/15 for a piece of plastic to say they are a student. It is bizarre that someone in UCD, UCC, DCU etc get a student ID and then has to pay €12/15 to CIE to travel as a student. In Munich, Berlin, Prague etc, the local bus/train company gives you a free student travel card.

The OP has the right to appeal a fine but i don't know if the i made a mistake line will work. No harm in trying though.