2 toddlers dead after been left in car overnight.

Kimbot

I seen this over the weekend and I have to say I'm in complete shock at some of the things mentioned in the article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4590570/Two-toddlers-die-left-car-15-hours.html

Basically she left a 2 year old and 1 year old in a car over night for 15 hours while she went into a house drinking.

She didnt report it and instead tried to hide it.

When in hospital told Drs that the kids fell unwell after smelling flowers at a local park.

All in all apparently she will only serve upto 2 years in prison :mad:

me_right_one

Ah God the poor little things. God Bless them, RIP

mcgovern

jonnycivic wrote: »

I seen this over the weekend and I have to say I'm in complete shock at some of the things mentioned in the article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4590570/Two-toddlers-die-left-car-15-hours.html

Basically she left a 2 year old and 1 year old in a car over night for 15 hours while she went into a house drinking.

She didnt report it and instead tried to hide it.

When in hospital told Drs that the kids fell unwell after smelling flowers at a local park.

All in all apparently she will only serve upto 2 years in prison :mad:

You've got your link mixed up, should be

[PHP]Article[/PHP]

Rubberchikken

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Kimbot

mcgovern wrote: »

You've got your link mixed up, should be

[PHP]Article[/PHP]

Fixed, cheers

Fathom

Sad story. Not the first. Probably not last.

Rubberchikken

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Making a mistake and having a brainfart is one thing. Deliberately doing it is another.
However just to save anyone clicking on the DM link they weren't alone in the car for 15 hours. She left them overnight and allowed someone to sleep in the car for a bit. It was noon and 90 degrees when she let them out. Piece of ****.

Kimbot

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Different country so different justice systems.

Mr. CooL ICE

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Wow. You're not gonna win any medals for sensitivity anyway

techdiver

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Completely different situation and circumstances.

Outlaw Pete

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?

Cases are nothing like each other in fairness.

That man made a mistake and forgot to drop his daughter off at creche.

This case was intentional neglect given that she ignored warnings and also didn't alert medical authorities for many hours after she knew they were ill.

Murrisk

jonnycivic wrote: »

Different country so different justice systems.

It's not just that, the two incidences are very different.

Kimbot

Murrisk wrote: »

It's not just that, the two incidences are very different.

I totally agree. By right we should only be discussing what I posted in the OP and not bringing something up that has nothing to do with it at all.

But surely this is just as emotive and difficult a topic as the tragedy which occurred a few weeks ago? Yet that thread was closed and deleted.

wakka12

Such disregard for any human life, much less your own ****ing children, is just harrowing

KERSPLAT!

jonnycivic wrote: »

Different country so different justice systems.

Eh, I don't think the fact that it's different countries is the reason why he's not being prosecuted.

dreamers75

Both should be prosecuted.

professore

dreamers75 wrote: »

Both should be prosecuted.

One is wilful neglect and covering up afterwards, the other is a genuine mistake, very different. Like running over a toddler and driving off vs not pulling your handbrake and your car rolls over a toddler. The result is the same but the crime is not.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Totally different situations. Can't you just drop it. I'm sure that poor father is suffering enough.

Murrisk

Deleted User wrote: »

But surely this is just as emotive and difficult a topic as the tragedy which occurred a few weeks ago? Yet that thread was closed and deleted.

The other one was accident and people were being incredibly insensitive to that. Very different.

retro:electro

Trying to draw similarities is futile. One was deliberate, the other was a tragic mistake.
Are people really going to try and drag up the story from a few weeks ago again? It has nothing to do with this.

Murrisk

Murrisk wrote: »

The other one was accident and people were being incredibly insensitive to that. Very different.

They are indeed very different. My heart broke for that man, his wife and poor baby. Now we have intentional neglect which has caused the death of two innocent children. I guess I was surprised to see a thread which isn't a million miles away in subject matter from one that was closed.

Riddle101

Sounds like it was deliberate. Leaving her two kids in a hot car overnight to hang out with her friends, shows not concern at all for their health and well being and completely neglects them. This is beyond f*cked up. Lock her up and throw away the key.

Also I can't help but blame her friends for not doing more. They knew what she was doing was wrong, but did nothing about it. She even allowed a guy to sleep in her car. Did he not notice the two toddlers?

whoopsadoodles

And the two years thing isn't even correct.

It was 2 years for neglect but she was charged with that before they died. Now it's more likely she will be charged with manslaughter but that hasn't come to pass just yet.

Murrisk

Deleted User wrote: »

They are indeed very different. My heart broke for that man, his wife and poor baby. Now we have intentional neglect which has caused the death of two innocent children. I guess I was surprised to see a thread which isn't a million miles away in subject matter from one that was closed.

But you've answered your own question in this very post. They are ostensibly close in subject but yet oh so disparate.

Murrisk

anna080 wrote: »

Trying to draw similarities is futile. One was deliberate, the other was a tragic mistake.
Are people really going to try and drag up the story from a few weeks ago again? It has nothing to do with this.

A lot of people were quite sore about that thread being closed, for some strange reason.

Summer wind

Every one of the scumbags at the party should be prosecuted. The evil wicked bitch that killed those beautiful little children should never again see the light of day.

Samaris

Riddle101 wrote: »

Sounds like it was deliberate. Leaving her two kids in a hot car overnight to hang out with her friends, shows not concern at all for their health and well being and completely neglects them. This is beyond f*cked up. Lock her up and throw away the key.

Also I can't help but blame her friends for not doing more. They knew what she was doing was wrong, but did nothing about it. She even allowed a guy to sleep in her car. Did he not notice the two toddlers?

From the sounds of it, that was to have someone keeping an eye on the kidlets. I got the impression that the "male friend" referenced (who was the one who eventually pushed the woman into bringing the poor kids to the hospital) was worried by the whole thing. I wouldn't be surprised if he suggested it, since she didn't seem overly worried by it all. Although for god's sake, out of everyone there, did none of them have the brains to bring the children into the house?

Didn't do enough, no, and two children are dead. Same goes for the friend that was quoted anonymously regretting that s/he didn't call child protective services because she thought the kids were being either neglected or abused but didn't want to risk breaking up the family - "I never thought they'd die".

Hindsight is 20:20. I understand the difficulty of risking a friend's family on suspicion, but sadly, no-one stepped up enough and now two children are dead and their mother will be tried for their (awful) deaths. Death of heatstroke in what's basically a mobile oven is a terrible way for children to die.

whoopsadoodles

Samaris wrote: »

Although for god's sake, out of everyone there, did none of them have the brains to bring the children into the house?

It was reported that her friends asked her to bring the children into the house, and she refused.

Yourself isit

Samaris wrote: »

From the sounds of it, that was to have someone keeping an eye on the kidlets. I got the impression that the "male friend" referenced (who was the one who eventually pushed the woman into bringing the poor kids to the hospital) was worried by the whole thing. I wouldn't be surprised if he suggested it, since she didn't seem overly worried by it all. Although for god's sake, out of everyone there, did none of them have the brains to bring the children into the house?

Didn't do enough, no, and two children are dead. Same goes for the friend that was quoted anonymously regretting that s/he didn't call child protective services because she thought the kids were being either neglected or abused but didn't want to risk breaking up the family - "I never thought they'd die".

Hindsight is 20:20. I understand the difficulty of risking a friend's family on suspicion, but sadly, no-one stepped up enough and now two children are dead and their mother will be tried for their (awful) deaths. Death of heatstroke in what's basically a mobile oven is a terrible way for children to die.

Yes the friends – who weren't that old — can't really be blamed. Hopefully the us justice system doesn't.

I swear I thought I saw that story a few years ago with the same picture of the woman.

Baby01032012

Mods

The previous thread mentioned above was closed down for good reason. Let's not repeat the same trolling behaviour here.

Samaris

whoopsadoodles wrote: »

It was reported that her friends asked her to bring the children into the house, and she refused.

Fair enough, I missed that bit.

Nah, her friends tried, and you're likely right, they weren't sure enough to be intervening in someone else's family. And the fault is ultimately hers, not anyone else's.

Godawful consequences though.

lawred2

I hate these stories.

These are the real adverts for pro choice. This woman should never have been gifted with children and these children should never have been cursed with such a selfish careless b!tch.

lawred2

Did not one person leave the house to even have a look in the window of the car? Not one!? Not one thought that leaving the kids in the car overnight might be dangerous..

the_pen_turner

lawred2 wrote: »

I hate these stories.

These are the real adverts for pro choice. This woman should never have been gifted with children and these children should never have been cursed with such a selfish careless b!tch.

I'm completely anti abortion except where medically needed. But it is situation s like this that bring me closer to being on the fence. There are loads of people out there that I wouldn't let have a wheelbarrow let alone a child

ThinkProgress

Rubberchikken wrote: »

the guy who left his child in the car here on the hottest day is not going to be prosecuted. how is this any different to this woman?
pity they don't legislate for stupidity.

Ultimately they are both cases of neglect... it's just that one appears to be a far worse example than the other!

People trying to convince themselves that the two cases are nothing alike, are quite frankly deluded and naive! There are different degrees of neglect... that is the only real difference we see here!

Nicolas Cage wrote: »

Wow. You're not gonna win any medals for sensitivity anyway

Yeah, because that's what matters most in this PC bs liberal fantasy land we inhabit... right??

Sensitivity before truth... Heaven forbid that forcing people to face the harsh reality of a given situation, might hurt a few feelings, bruise a few egos or bring about a moment or two of reflection or introspection!?

c68zapdsm5i1ru

lawred2 wrote: »

I hate these stories.

These are the real adverts for pro choice. This woman should never have been gifted with children and these children should never have been cursed with such a selfish careless b!tch.

I think they're more an advert for some people not being allowed to keep their babies after they're born. There are genuinely some children who would be better off being adopted.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Ultimately they are both cases of neglect... it's just that one appears to be a far worse example than the other!

People trying to convince themselves that the two cases are nothing alike, are quite frankly deluded and naive! There are different degrees of neglect... that is the only real difference we see here!



Yeah, because that's what matters most in this PC bs liberal fantasy land we inhabit... right??

Sensitivity before truth... Heaven forbid that forcing people to face the harsh reality of a given situation, might hurt a few feelings, bruise a few egos or bring about a moment or two of reflection or introspection!?

One was deliberate, the other was a tragic mistake. I hope, if you ever make a genuine mistake with serious consequences you receive more kindness and understanding than you're prepared to dish out to others.

lawred2

Caden Unimportant Selflessness wrote: »

I think they're more an advert for some people not being allowed to keep their babies after they're born. There are genuinely some children who would be better off being adopted.

an advert for saving children from such people by whatever means

ThinkProgress

Caden Unimportant Selflessness wrote: »

One was deliberate, the other was a tragic mistake. I hope, if you ever make a genuine mistake with serious consequences you receive more kindness and understanding than you're prepared to dish out to others.

I'm not devoid of kindness.

It just frustrates me that so many people like to shield themselves from many of the harsh realities and truths of this life...

And this forum is just a microcosm of the lives that so many are living in general.

Discussions often get shut down around here, simply to protect certain people's delicate constitutions...

And to add insult, many of the people that are not actually afraid to discuss these difficult emotive subjects... we get labelled as insensitive or trolls or crass etc.

Just because some people like to live in their safe little bubbles, doesn't mean we should all be forced to inhabit that same world...

Surely there is a place for kindness and understanding, while also not completely shutting down a worthwhile debate??

Mr. CooL ICE

ThinkProgress wrote: »

I'm not devoid of kindness.

It just frustrates me that so many people like to shield themselves from many of the harsh realities and truths of this life...

And this forum is just a microcosm of the lives that so many are living in general.

Discussions often get shut down around here, simply to protect certain people's delicate constitutions...

And to add insult, many of the people that are not actually afraid to discuss these difficult emotive subjects... we get labelled as insensitive or trolls or crass etc.

Just because some people like to live in their safe little bubbles, doesn't mean we should all be forced to inhabit that same world...

Surely there is a place for kindness and understanding, while also not completely shutting down a worthwhile debate??

This is a load of rubbish and completely irrelevant to this thread. It's not about political correctness at all, so don't bother trying to turn the discussion into something it isn't.

My post that you quoted was made in response to somebody mentioning a toddler dying was caused by stupidity, when it was in fact a tragic accident and not comparable to this case.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

ThinkProgress wrote: »

I'm not devoid of kindness.

It just frustrates me that so many people like to shield themselves from many of the harsh realities and truths of this life...

And this forum is just a microcosm of the lives that so many are living in general.

Discussions often get shut down around here, simply to protect certain people's delicate constitutions...

And to add insult, many of the people that are not actually afraid to discuss these difficult emotive subjects... we get labelled as insensitive or trolls or crass etc.

Just because some people like to live in their safe little bubbles, doesn't mean we should all be forced to inhabit that same world...

Surely there is a place for kindness and understanding, while also not completely shutting down a worthwhile debate??

They get shut down to stop people from making unfair or even slanderous comments about other people's situations.

ThinkProgress

Nicolas Cage wrote: »

This is a load of rubbish and completely irrelevant to this thread. It's not about political correctness at all, so don't bother trying to turn the discussion into something it isn't.

My post that you quoted was made in response to somebody mentioning a toddler dying was caused by stupidity, when it was in fact a tragic accident and not comparable to this case.

Of course the two are comparable... just because that makes you uncomfortable, doesn't make it any less of a reality!

And you responded to that post by calling into question an element of the poster's character, rather than addressing the point. Even if you disagree with the comparison... automatically assuming that they must lack sensitivity, is wrong.

It is PC... your comment, as mod, shows that upholding a certain image around here, is more important than actually allowing a real serious debate to take place. Feelings before truth... Image over substance!

Caden Unimportant Selflessness wrote: »

They get shut down to stop people from making unfair or even slanderous comments about other people's situations.

If that's what you wanna believe... it's not the reality of what I see around here. This place only wants soft debates. Once anything controversial breaks out, where there is a minority that hold perfectly legitimate, but often unpopular, views... those discussions are often shut down very quickly!!

Certain people are afraid to discuss certain issues, and this site frequently panders to their wishes over and above the need to actually have a worthwhile discussion. The ostriches, with their head's in the sand, get to set the agenda and decide what does and doesn't get discussed. Stamp your feet, throw a hissy fit... and the mods close the discussion! It's pathetic... but that's the world we now live in, sadly!

JupiterKid

Poor, poor little things. Pure wanton neglect by their immature mother who should never have had children in her care in the first place.

Throw the book at her.

Kimbot

lawred2 wrote: »

Did not one person leave the house to even have a look in the window of the car? Not one!? Not one thought that leaving the kids in the car overnight might be dangerous..

One of the friends slept in the car with the kids for a while and others told the mother to bring the kids inside and she refused.

lawred2

jonnycivic wrote: »

One of the friends slept in the car with the kids for a while and others told the mother to bring the kids inside and she refused.

wtf

How did this progress to the point of the kids dying then?

And she didn't even take them to a hospital until the day after... The poor things. Where were her parents? Where was the father?

Mr. CooL ICE

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Of course the two are comparable... just because that makes you uncomfortable, doesn't make it any less of a reality!

And you responded to that post by calling into question an element of the poster's character, rather than addressing the point. Even if you disagree with the comparison... automatically assuming that they must lack sensitivity, is wrong.

It is PC... your comment, as mod, shows that upholding a certain image around here, is more important than actually allowing a real serious debate to take place. Feelings before truth... Image over substance!

I'm not uncomfortable with you saying the two cases are comparable. I am saying you are wrong. The only thing in common between both cases was children dying after being left in a car.

One was an accident, the other was not. One was intentional, the other was not. One was caused by neglect, the other was not. If you cannot acknowledge that, then I don't know what else to say.

Also, I am only a mod in this forum when moderating. Nothing about image. If you see anything wrong with my moderation, either address it with me over PM or take it to a CMod. Discussion of moderation on thread ends here.

Kimbot

lawred2 wrote: »

wtf

How did this progress to the point of the kids dying then?

And she didn't even take them to a hospital until the day after... The poor things. Where were her parents? Where was the father?

Well she said no to the kids coming into the house, they were in the car for about 15hours. She took them to the hospital the next day and claimed they fell ill when they sniffed flowers in the local park.
It doesnt really matter where her parents were tbh because as a parent she is responsible (Well she wasn't very responsible in this matter) for the children.

elefant

ThinkProgress wrote: »

Of course the two are comparable... just because that makes you uncomfortable, doesn't make it any less of a reality!

They're comparable in the most simplistic way possible.

It's bemusing that you can't see that accidentally leaving a child in a car while you're at work is different to intentionally leaving them in a car all night despite being urged by your friends not to, and then lying to hospital staff about what happened.

How can you not see that?

lawred2

jonnycivic wrote: »

Well she said no to the kids coming into the house, they were in the car for about 15hours. She took them to the hospital the next day and claimed they fell ill when they sniffed flowers in the local park.
It doesnt really matter where her parents were tbh because as a parent she is responsible (Well she wasn't very responsible in this matter) for the children.

I'm not passing blame to anyone if that's what you think I was doing.. I'm just amazed that there wasn't even one single person near to her with a strong enough character to demand that she do the right thing..

There were numerous missed opportunities.

Sad. Really sad.

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

I feel physically sick reading that story. It's heart breaking. The poor kids. I wish I hadn't read that story