Found out that property we're buying has an extension - what to ask engineer?

FutureGuy

We are sale agreed on a house and the engineer is going out today. We have had the solicitor ready for a month, the engineer ready for weeks and our solicitor on standby. Our solicitor received the papers from theirs early last week and, just out of sheer luck I said there was an extension. My solicitor said there was no mention of this in the documentation sent her and so more questions needed to be asked. I was advised not to send out the engineer until we had the plans of the property and we only received them Monday.

Now the auctioneer is being, quite frankly, aggressive, stating that the sellers purchase of another house might now fall through. I feel like I'm really being pressured. I told him a few times that the reason we are not sending out the engineer is that there is still an unknown about the extension and that their solicitor never sent it on. In a slightly heated conversation yesterday, I grew a pair of balls and told him we are not dropping that much money without being diligent. All of a sudden, I am getting very jittery about the sale as I do not like being pressured, especially since we had things ready to go.

I am concerned that, given the fact no mention was made about the extension and we are being rushed, there is something that I might miss. Myself and my wife has an incredibly traumatic end to last year and we are recovering from it. The last thing we need is to be sold a lemon.
The house was built in the 30's and has been refurbished to a high level but I have no idea what pipes, heating system, water system is like.

The engineer comes highly recommended and I will be able to attend the survey. Are there any questions I should ask of him?

Anything I should make sure we look for. I'm going to let him so the survey in peace but I do have questions for him at the end. If you have any questions I should consider asking, please let me know.



Thanks all.

beechwood55

Did the extension need planning permission? If so, was planning permission granted?
Does it comply with building regulations that were in place at the time the extension was built?

The_Conductor

Honestly- its an 80-90 year old house- you really should have had a proper survey done before you got to this stage.

It doesn't really matter when it was renovated- or to what standard- you need a proper and complete survey gone- to include, but not limited to- plumbing, electricals, the structure itself etc etc.

There isn't really a checklist to question a surveyor about- its more a case of let them off to do their thing- and ask that they call you to point out any issues they note as they proceed with the survey (but keep out of their way too).

Get a proper written report from the surveyor after the fact- and then sit down and decide can you live with whatever their findings are.

How did you get mortgage approval without a survey?

Anyhow- from the little you've posted thus far- there really isn't anything that would have alarm bells ringing for me- I can understand why the sellers would be unhappy- they are probably trying to time the sale to coincide with a purchase- bridging loans don't really exist anymore- so its a delicate balancing act- and yes, they could loose another property if you dither.

However- you *need* a proper and thorough survey done- you need to ensure you are happy with the property- and you need to get a move on. Normally you'd have done your survey long before you reached this stage in the process.

FutureGuy

beechwood55 wrote: »

Did the extension need planning permission? If so, was planning permission granted?
Does it comply with building regulations that were in place at the time the extension was built?

Good ones, already with the solicitor as it made me very nervous.

FutureGuy

The_Conductor wrote: »

Honestly- its an 80-90 year old house- you really should have had a proper survey done before you got to this stage.

It doesn't really matter when it was renovated- or to what standard- you need a proper and complete survey gone- to include, but not limited to- plumbing, electricals, the structure itself etc etc.

There isn't really a checklist to question a surveyor about- its more a case of let them off to do their thing- and ask that they call you to point out any issues they note as they proceed with the survey (but keep out of their way too).

Get a proper written report from the surveyor after the fact- and then sit down and decide can you live with whatever their findings are.

How did you get mortgage approval without a survey?

Anyhow- from the little you've posted thus far- there really isn't anything that would have alarm bells ringing for me- I can understand why the sellers would be unhappy- they are probably trying to time the sale to coincide with a purchase- bridging loans don't really exist anymore- so its a delicate balancing act- and yes, they could loose another property if you dither.

However- you *need* a proper and thorough survey done- you need to ensure you are happy with the property- and you need to get a move on. Normally you'd have done your survey long before you reached this stage in the process.

Can you define a proper and thorough survey. I was advised by a few people here to go for a particular person and he is coming out today but he said we might have to get a plumber out separately as it would not be his area of expertise?

Am I missing something here? I have a structural engineer booked and it is costing 300 euro. Is there some higher level of visit that I SHOULD be looking to get out? Just to preface it, we were told the house was built in late 50s but the plans only recently revealed it was build in mid-30s.

As for the fact we should be further along, we have been ready with everything on ourside and we were tild NOT to send an engineer out until the plans were received. The plans did not include an extension so they are being questioned. Mot sure what else we could have done apart from going against the advice of the people we are paying to help us buy the house.

brownej

For very old houses the banks ususally require a structural survey as a condition of giving the mortgage.
We were sale agreed on a house that was built ~1910 and the structural survey threw up some building regs compliance issues with internal modifications.
Bank reduced the mortgage offer as a consequence and we had to pull out.
We subsequently bought a 1950s built house and no structural survey was required as the house wasn't old enough to need one by the bank. We got one anyway.
If the bank thinks its a 1950s house and its actually 1930s, it might throw a spanner in the works come drawdown so I would let your morgage advisor know so you can see if you need to supply a bank friendly version of the report to the bank.
A normal structural survey usually does not include plumbing or electrics. Ask your surveyor if he'll do that also.

The reason the solictor has advised you not to send in your surveyor as he is trying to avoid having you send in the surveyor twice. If you don't have the final drawings and property maps then you will need to send your surveyor bakc a second time to verify those. We had (slight) delays with our purchase due to maps not being supplied.

Your delays seem to be completly down to the vendor not having their paperwork in order. Solicitors are really slow so be prepared for the delay.
Next time the auctioneer gives out to you make sure you point out that the vendor paperwork is not in order and shouldn't he really have advised them better on what they needed to be sale ready?
The number of people who only go about getting their paper work in order for sale when gone sale agreed is crazy.

The_Conductor

The reason for having a plumber in- is to make sure piping has been replaced with copper pipes- and you're not still on lead piping internally or externally.
Leaks etc- would also be checked for.

Pretty standard having a plumber check it out.

FutureGuy

The_Conductor wrote: »

The reason for having a plumber in- is to make sure piping has been replaced with copper pipes- and you're not still on lead piping internally or externally.
Leaks etc- would also be checked for.

Pretty standard having a plumber check it out.

So because I don't have aplumber out, are there any questions that I could ask (for example, like asking about copper pipes and not lead etc)

Thanks all!

Parchment

Forget the Estate Agent - the are pushy and get so aggressive when theremight be a delay in them getting their money. Ignore them.

Get your survey done and go from there. The engineer should be able to deal with the house regardless of its age - we had a report done on a 120 year old house, it was a long report but it detailed everything.

Check the boiler (if there is one), water pressure, where the sewer access is etc.

theboringfox

Definitely get your survey done.

I got a structural survey by an engineer. This is what a bank wants to see mainly. With Ulster Bank they only ask to see survey if valuer calls out any potential issues e.g. in Cork a lot of areas have subsidence so valuer would usually comment on same which triggers bank saying show us the report. They want a proper structural report because of PI but also main concern for them is the house is physically fine.

I got my mortgage signed off and it was in house in subsidence area with no underpinning done and leaking pipes. Just got estimates of costs and showed bank I had means to do corrective work after.

Surveys well worth it. House we bought looked like electrics were modern but turned out the rewiring was done wrong and was 3.5k to fix. We negotiated that off.

I did structural survey, plumbing, electrics and chimney. I also had QS look over issues on structure survey to get an idea of costs.

I only renegotiated for electrics as other issues were known. Like house would have cost more if underpinning done and I knew it wasnt done when buying.