Wireless options when upgrading to Siemens SPC

Hector Mildew

Hi All
I'm looking at upgrading my old HKC securewave alarm system. The replacement panel I have in mind is the Siemens SPC (4320 or 5320) - mainly for its net connectivity and free self monitoring.

I'm planning on keeping the existing inertia and contact sensors and add wireless sensors to some widows where I need additional shock or contacts for new openings.

Now my questions...

Siemens don't make inertia sensors and from my reading here it looks like I'll need to use a receiver to bridge wireless to wired zones in the panel. What is the best wireless receiver/ sensor combination (I have no existing wireless sensors)?

Is it possible (or necessary) to map each wireless sensor to its own zone? I'm thinking that this would be required to distinguish between contact and shock sensors on a window.

Is it possible to pass info about battery life from a receiver to the panel?

Also considering the GSDi 10-70 - would that would be better and easier upgrade?

Thanks!

KoolKid

The Easier upgrade would be the GSD i1070 if you want to keep away from ongoing charges.
If going with the Siemens/Vanderbilt system the SPC4320 would be sufficient but you would be getting in zone expanders & 3rd party receivers which will also have to be wired into the panel & expanders.

altor

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Hi All
I'm looking at upgrading my old HKC securewave alarm system. The replacement panel I have in mind is the Siemens SPC (4320 or 5320) - mainly for its net connectivity and free self monitoring.

I'm planning on keeping the existing inertia and contact sensors and add wireless sensors to some widows where I need additional shock or contacts for new openings.

Now my questions...

Siemens don't make inertia sensors and from my reading here it looks like I'll need to use a receiver to bridge wireless to wired zones in the panel. What is the best wireless receiver/ sensor combination (I have no existing wireless sensors)?

Is it possible (or necessary) to map each wireless sensor to its own zone? I'm thinking that this would be required to distinguish between contact and shock sensors on a window.

Is it possible to pass info about battery life from a receiver to the panel?

Also considering the GSDi 10-70 - would that would be better and easier upgrade?

Thanks!

If you have a SecureWave installed this can take up to 70 wire free devices.
This would give you more control over wire free devices installed.

Using the SPC Ideally one per zone, this helps if you ever have to fault find.
No, you would be depending on the receiver to see if you have a low battery. You could use a spare zone and set up the supervisory.

Hector Mildew

KoolKid wrote: »

The Easier upgrade would be the GSD i1070 if you want to keep away from ongoing charges.
If going with the Siemens/Vanderbilt system the SPC4320 would be sufficient but you would be getting in zone expanders & 3rd party receivers which will also have to be wired into the panel & expanders.

Thanks, after looking into it more I've come to the same conclusion. As much as I like the SPC web configuration and other nice features, the gsdi-10-70 would be a lot easier and quicker to set up.

Its a pity Siemens don't do wireless shock sensors..

Hector Mildew

altor wrote: »

If you have a SecureWave installed this can take up to 70 wire free devices.
This would give you more control over wire free devices installed.

Using the SPC Ideally one per zone, this helps if you ever have to fault find.
No, you would be depending on the receiver to see if you have a low battery. You could use a spare zone and set up the supervisory.

Thanks, I looked at the SecureWave but ruled it out because of the annual app/ network access fee. Other than that it would be the obvious upgrade!

KoolKid

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Thanks, after looking into it more I've come to the same conclusion. As much as I like the SPC web configuration and other nice features, the gsdi-10-70 would be a lot easier and quicker to set up.

Its a pity Siemens don't do wireless shock sensors..

It is a pity. I've done a lot of pushing for it.Maybe some day.
But the GSD is an ideal solution with a full wireless portfolio. Inertia contacts can also be split into separate zones giving even more information in the event of an activation.
You also have the option of free apps & free usage.

fred funk }{

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Thanks, I looked at the SecureWave but ruled it out because of the annual app/ network access fee. Other than that it would be the obvious upgrade!

Their annual sub will be far less than a service call from your installer with the extra servicing other systems need. Some mentioned here are horrendously unreliable.

Hector Mildew

fred funk }{ wrote: »

Their annual sub will be far less than a service call from your installer with the extra servicing other systems need. Some mentioned here are horrendously unreliable.

Do you mean that the GSD and Siemens systems I'm looking at are unreliable? I searched the forum but couldn't find any references but if you know of issues, please let me know!

Thanks.

Hector Mildew

KoolKid wrote: »

It is a pity. I've done a lot of pushing for it.Maybe some day.
But the GSD is an ideal solution with a full wireless portfolio. Inertia contacts can also be split into separate zones giving even more information in the event of an activation.
You also have the option of free apps & free usage.

Do they recommend another option which makes shock detection unnecessary or is it that they don't support wireless shock detection?

KoolKid

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Do you mean that the GSD and Siemens systems I'm looking at are unreliable? I searched the forum but couldn't find any references but if you know of issues, please let me know!

Thanks.

All the systems here conform to the same standards En50131.
Siemens /Vanderbilt is a brand famous for their reliability
We are dealing with GSD for around 10 years now. You will have some issues with all brands, but nothing with one more than another.
Usually guys putting you off one system or another is because they don't want to install it or they don't know how to.
Would you be suspicious if you went into Harvey Norman's and the sales lad said all the brands there are terrible except this one or that one.

KoolKid

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Do they recommend another option which makes shock detection unnecessary or is it that they don't support wireless shock detection?

It's just that they are such a big manufacturer covering all of Europe . I think it's only Ireland and Italy are the only ones using inertias.

fred funk }{

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Do you mean that the GSD and Siemens systems I'm looking at are unreliable? I searched the forum but couldn't find any references but if you know of issues, please let me know!

Thanks.

Siemens is fine - have it in my own house. GSD would have reliabilty issues. I have installed it myself and had lots of problems. HKC is the most expensive gear out there and most installers opt to use their stuff over other cheaper stuff. Why would us installers opt to spend more on gear if the other cheaper stuff was the same thus reducing our profit margins?

As I said earlier - the savings made by not installing HKC is quickly forgotten about when you're calling out your installer a few times a year.

KoolKid

I have installed Siemens Vanderbilt and have had issues at some stage.
I have installed HKC and had issues at some point.
I have installed Risco and have had issues at some point.
I have have installed GSD and have issues at some point.
I have installed UTC and have had issues at some point.
I have installed Honeywell and have had issues at some point.
But to use experience like that to make a statement that any other systems, bar the one you want to sell, requires more maintenance is just silly.
Not to mention all new systems would be under warranty, so if there were any system issues you would be covered.

fred funk }{

KoolKid wrote: »

I have installed Siemens Vanderbilt and have had issues at some stage.
I have installed HKC and had issues at some point.
I have installed Risco and have had issues at some point.
I have have installed GSD and have issues at some point.
I have installed UTC and have had issues at some point.
I have installed Honeywell and have had issues at some point.
But to use experience like that to make a statement that any other systems, bar the one you want to sell, requires more maintenance is just silly.
Not to mention all new systems would be under warranty, so if there were any system issues you would be covered.

Of course, even the most reliable products can have problems. It's the ratio of problems per system installed is the important fact. I have installed nearly all of the most common systems at one stage and HKC are be far the most reliable system I have ever installed, it's extremely rare we ever go back to any job after installation and we do a lot of them.

What warranty is there with GSD? And when that runs out who covers the charge for the service calls?

KoolKid

So how many GSD systems have you installed to base this ratio on?
GSDs warranty would be the same as any other manufacturers I'd imagine. A good installer should cover call and labour related to any product under warranty.

Hector Mildew

Thank for your answers and advice - they're much appreciated. I'm going to go with the GSD as its the best fit all around for my requirements. Hopefully there won't be any problems but it seems to have a decent warranty (3/5 year depending on the installer) just in case...

Its interesting to see the differences in opinion - much the same in other forums like motors and technology

KoolKid

Thanks for the feedback. We have lots of these out there working away without issues.
If you need any thing else come back to us.

Stoner

Mod note.

The difference is Hector that you are receiving advice from installers here. In the motors forums you have more users. Lads obviously have brands they like to use. But you don't have a bunch of car sales men advising you on the motors forum, I'm not saying that is good or bad, however it is a distinction.

Some of the opinions here have received some attention relating to potential negativity of a certain product. The installers here have a certain amount of brand loyalty, backed up with some real experience, some of this experience is up to date while some is possibly out of date as installers don't tend to switch manufacturers regularly.

I've read the opinions of some of the posters in relation to some products.
I have no idea if the HKC and Siemens panels require less callouts than others.
What I see here is a summary of people's experience in using some systems. I'd agree that a significant amount of installs would be needed to form such an opinion.
We can't tell that from here and I don't want to derail another thread by digging into it as I've attempted to reduce the significance of any opinion held by a poster with a commercial interest in one product over another.

I also don't want to show the fine and experienced posters here in a negative light. Just note op the difference between a review and a position here versus a thread in the motor forum.

altor

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Thanks, I looked at the SecureWave but ruled it out because of the annual app/ network access fee. Other than that it would be the obvious upgrade!

There is more to a system than just the fee for annual access.
I dont look at it like that, the fee covers you for App control, plus texts for alarm activation's from the alarm system.
The down side to the free version is if your internet is down you have no access to your panel.
I only had this a few months ago when I put it to the test.
Had full access to see the mains fail on the HKC and no access on the GSD as I had not internet access at home due to the power cut.
I had no way of knowing what was up, yes I got the communication failure but what use is that without knowing what was happening.
Id advise using the mutli paths on either system you have installed for this reason alone.

Hector Mildew

Stoner wrote: »

Mod note.

The difference is Hector that you are receiving advice from installers here. In the motors forums you have more users. Lads obviously have brands they like to use. But you don't have a bunch of car sales men advising you on the motors forum, I'm not saying that is good or bad, however it is a distinction.

Some of the opinions here have received some attention relating to potential negativity of a certain product. The installers here have a certain amount of brand loyalty, backed up with some real experience, some of this experience is up to date while some is possibly out of date as installers don't tend to switch manufacturers regularly.

I've read the opinions of some of the posters in relation to some products.
I have no idea if the HKC and Siemens panels require less callouts than others.
What I see here is a summary of people's experience in using some systems. I'd agree that a significant amount of installs would be needed to form such an opinion.
We can't tell that from here and I don't want to derail another thread by digging into it as I've attempted to reduce the significance of any opinion held by a poster with a commercial interest in one product over another.

I also don't want to show the fine and experienced posters here in a negative light. Just note op the difference between a review and a position here versus a thread in the motor forum.

Of course and I didn't mean that in a negative way - we all have our preferred tools and methodologies in work. Saying that recommendations or criticisms are only useful when put into context - which I think has been the case in this thread.

Hector Mildew

altor wrote: »

There is more to a system than just the fee for annual access.
I dont look at it like that, the fee covers you for App control, plus texts for alarm activation's from the alarm system.
The down side to the free version is if your internet is down you have no access to your panel.
I only had this a few months ago when I put it to the test.
Had full access to see the mains fail on the HKC and no access on the GSD as I had not internet access at home due to the power cut.
I had no way of knowing what was up, yes I got the communication failure but what use is that without knowing what was happening.
Id advise using the mutli paths on either system you have installed for this reason alone.

Thanks, that's something I'm looking into. I may end up using a paid service if the free app isn't enough but having that option is important in any system I choose.

altor

Hector Mildew wrote: »

Thanks, that's something I'm looking into. I may end up using a paid service if the free app isn't enough but having that option is important in any system I choose.

As security installers all we can do here is advise.
As an end user you will make the final decision.