Drug gangs

jopax

I just read this article in the journal, just wondering what other people thought. I know there are drugs everywhere, but it's just scary to hear what goes on. It's a very different country to what it was 20 years ago.

http://www.thejournal.ie/waterford-gang-drug-dealers-3392127-May2017/

Wanderer78

legalise everything, and be done with it. take the industry out of the hands of these lulas

Harry Palmr

A secret war, one the powers that be lost generations ago and don't even seem to be bothering to fight any more.

jopax

Wanderer78 wrote: »

legalise everything, and be done with it. take the industry out of the hands of these lulas

Yes, I definitely agree with that now, it's just so out of control. I would have thought years ago it was a crazy idea, but I think we have to learn to change with the times & help the vulnerable in society.

Wanderer78

jopax wrote: »

Yes, I definitely agree with that now, it's just so out of control. I would have thought years ago it was a crazy idea, but I think we have to learn to change with the times & help the vulnerable in society.

when i was younger i probably thought it was a mental idea but now, its the only thing that makes sense to me. our drug issues have been steady worsening for decades now, its time to change tactics, drastically, and legalising is the only thing i can see being so. we have to start addressing the root causes of drug addiction such as mental health issues etc

Picky owner

Just read the article,so it took a Nigerian drugs gang to scare off local thugs who were terrorising the neighborhood,which is the lesser evil?

jopax

Picky owner wrote: »

Just read the article,so it took a Nigerian drugs gang to scare off local thugs who were terrorising the neighborhood,which is the lesser evil?

Very good question, it's great to hear that the local scumbags​ are out of action. I was surprised to read that there is a Nigerian drugs gang operating here.

Harry Palmr

Sure we may need the Lithuanians to keep the Nigerians in check! :pac:

the_syco

Picky owner wrote: »

Just read the article,so it took a Nigerian drugs gang to scare off local thugs who were terrorising the neighborhood,which is the lesser evil?

It took a gang that is terrorizing another part of Ireland to stop the gang. So now the only reason why this gang is quite is because it owes money to the other gang, who will no doubt move in on the vacuum to expand their own business?

Basically, the snakes killed the rats, but if the snakes move in, they're back to square one.

jopax

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Sure we may need the Lithuanians to keep the Nigerians in check! :pac:

Who knows who's in charge!

Picky owner

jopax wrote:

Very good question, it's great to hear that the local scumbags​ are out of action. I was surprised to read that there is a Nigerian drugs gang operating here.

News to me too,nothing surprises me anymore,Waterford is changing all the time,would be wary of walking around certain areas these days.

Picky owner

the_syco wrote:

Basically, the snakes killed the rats, but if the snakes move in, they're back to square one.

We need St. Patrick back...

MRnotlob606

wtf is happening to our city?

Harry Palmr

It's inhabited by weak willed skangers who can't be arsed to run theirs lives in a responsible and constructive manner.

jopax

MRnotlob606 wrote: »

wtf is happening to our city?

I don't know, it doesn't feel the same as years ago. I suppose it's Society changing but not for the better.
If the guards know there is a Nigerian drug gang operating how come they can't do anything to stop it?

Somedude9

Wanderer78 wrote: »

legalise everything, and be done with it. take the industry out of the hands of these lulas

How about criminalise everything & put them in jail instead.

jopax

Somedude9 wrote: »

How about criminalise everything & put them in jail instead.

Yes that would be the ideal solution but how o you stop the drugs coming in. The guards are finding it hard to manage the local drug gangs. If there are more sophisticated gangs starting to operate it doesn't bode well for what's coming down the line.

Picky owner

These Nigerians must be pretty bad if the local lot are running for cover.

jopax

Picky owner wrote: »

These Nigerians must be pretty bad if the local lot are running for cover.

Yes that's what I thought, they obviously are a more professional organisation. Does that mean they will be running the show here so to speak. I don't think I'd like to have an encounter with them.

Wanderer78

Harry Palmr wrote:

It's inhabited by weak willed skangers who can't be arsed to run theirs lives in a responsible and constructive manner.

You will actually find many of these 'weak willed skangers' suffering from very complex issues, the most common being, mental health issues, complex behavioural problems and personality disorders, things such as autism would be common, complex learning disabilities such as dyslexia etc would also be common. You will find many of our institutions such as our educational system, health system, legal systems etc exasperate these issues. Many of these peoples issues would also be undiagnosed, it would also be common for these 'weak willed' people to come from very complex family environments, in which adding further complications to their issues.

Somedude9 wrote:

How about criminalise everything & put them in jail instead.

Strangely, countries such as America have been following this kind of thinking for decades now which has resulted in more prisons, more incarcerations and oddly increasing drug use! It's time to move on from this Neanderthal thinking

CalamariFritti

Somedude9 wrote: »

How about criminalise everything & put them in jail instead.

Because it's been tried and tried and tried and its not working?

dr.fuzzenstein

Somedude9 wrote: »

How about criminalise everything & put them in jail instead.

It is already a crime to import and sell drugs, you are deploying Irish logic to the situation. Make laws and don't enforce them. Toughen the laws and implement mandatory sentencing and don't enforce them. Jump up and down and scream for even tougher laws and don't enforce them. Stand there scratching your head and loudly complain "why isn't this working ????!!!!".
Demand tougher laws.
All the laws in the world won't help you if the Gardai couldn't catch a cold and the judge will hand out suspended sentences to pieces of sh*t with 50+ convictions. All they do is hand out free money to compo merchants.

Harry Palmr

Wanderer78 wrote: »

You will actually find many of these 'weak willed skangers' suffering from very complex issues, the most common being, mental health issues, complex behavioural problems and personality disorders, things such as autism would be common, complex learning disabilities such as dyslexia etc would also be common. You will find many of our institutions such as our educational system, health system, legal systems etc exasperate these issues. Many of these peoples issues would also be undiagnosed, it would also be common for these 'weak willed' people to come from very complex family environments, in which adding further complications to their issues.

Yes the are plenty of bleeding heart cases but there are more weekend drug users I'd suggest.

Sosurface

Its not exactly a new situation for the city, just different faces. For years you head 3 scumbag families from a large social housing estate who were actually all one family left run riot around the place and breed generation after generation of little murderers, thieves and rapists.

The baton has simply been passed on to a traveller group, sounds like a component part of a wheel with the qualifying criteria that they are somehow twice as vicious and have even less scruples than the "3 families"

You can guess how bad the Nigerians must be.

Ineffectual and largely corrupt policing combined with a justice system filled with judges who clearly dont live in the same world.

Solution: When appointing new garda and judges assign them mandatory houses in problem housing estates. If they choose to ignore whats going on around them, they have to live in the **** they create.

jopax

Are the guards actually equipped or given enough training to deal with these type of gangs though. Who knows what they are capable of, we know what the local scum are capable of & it was difficult enough to try to catch them.
What about these other more experienced gangs, how the hell would they manage them.
In fairness to the guards, the hard working ones I mean, it's not a safe environment in Ireland anymore & maybe they should be better equipped.

Picky owner

jopax wrote:

Are the guards actually equipped or given enough training to deal with these type of gangs though. Who knows what they are capable of, we know what the local scum are capable of & it was difficult enough to try to catch them. What about these other more experienced gangs, how the hell would they manage them. In fairness to the guards, the hard working ones I mean, it's not a safe environment in Ireland anymore & maybe they should be better equipped.

The guards must be demoralized,new types of gangs,lack of resources,just fighting a loosing battle.

Sosurface

jopax wrote: »

Are the guards actually equipped or given enough training to deal with these type of gangs though. Who knows what they are capable of, we know what the local scum are capable of & it was difficult enough to try to catch them.
What about these other more experienced gangs, how the hell would they manage them.
In fairness to the guards, the hard working ones I mean, it's not a safe environment in Ireland anymore & maybe they should be better equipped.

If arming them is what you mean, I would agree in theory. But there would need to be a serious clean out/cull of AGS before trusting them with weapons or extra powers. Some of them are bad enough and the corruption so ingrained that the mind boggles at the thought of what they coukd get up to is they got special arrest/search powers and weaponry.

jopax

Sosurface wrote: »

If arming them is what you mean, I would agree in theory. But there would need to be a serious clean out/cull of AGS before trusting them with weapons or extra powers. Some of them are bad enough and the corruption so ingrained that the mind boggles at the thought of what they coukd get up to is they got special arrest/search powers and weaponry.

I was thinking that way in some departments when they are going up against serious criminals & their life could be in danger.
Even in normal day to day patrol why cannot they even have tasers, surely doing that job they should have a right to defend themselves.
There was 2 cases only recently up the country where they were attacked while on duty.
How is it fair to expect them to go out on the streets in today's environment with no protection, I think it's insanity.

Harry Palmr

Does any of this **** get covered in the local meeja? I don't buy the Munster/News and Star or listen to Deise AM.

Picky owner

Only read it on the journal.ie through the link jopax posted,was it reported on any other local or national media,any comments from waterford politicans?

jopax

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Does any of this **** get covered in the local meeja? I don't but the Munster/News and Star or listen to Deise AM.

I haven't heard anything in the local media , but I could have missed it.
It is great that the original scumbags are gone, however it's replaced with a more serious gang which we know absolutely nothing about., .ie where are they living, what punishments do they file out.
With the local scum most people knew them, where they lived & how to avoid them if you could, they were easily identified.

Finnbar01

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Does any of this **** get covered in the local meeja? I don't buy the Munster/News and Star or listen to Deise AM.

John Halligan or John Ahearne was on WLR a while back describing exactly what was said in that article. The gang has left some families so destitute, they had to put their children into care.

They are absolutely ruthless when it comes to getting their money back.

If something is not done about them soon, some housing estates in Waterford will end up going they way of Limerick.

Harry Palmr

I'm not a big fan of heavy handed coppering or application of the laws outer limits but internment without trail is not something I'd be against in this case. Its not as if the criminals are not known and I don't see anyone marching to get them released either!

Picky owner

A lot of people don't care as long as it's confined to certain areas,imagine the uproar if dealers/scumbags were roaming around the likes of butlerstown,dunmore road etc.

jopax

Picky owner wrote: »

A lot of people don't care as long as it's confined to certain areas,imagine the uproar if dealers/scumbags were roaming around the likes of butlerstown,dunmore road etc.

That's true, the attitude of its not in my back yard I don't care.
Still though we should be thinking about what kind of a future we want for our kids, grandkids.

jopax

Finnbar01 wrote: »

John Halligan or John Ahearne was on WLR a while back describing exactly what was said in that article. The gang has left some families so destitute, they had to put their children into care.

They are absolutely ruthless when it comes to getting their money back.

If something is not done about them soon, some housing estates in Waterford will end up going they way of Limerick.

How did it get so bad that their kids had to go into care, that is just shocking in this day & age that people can end up in such a situation.
I hope they got their kids back & got some help to rebuild their lives.

Finnbar01

jopax wrote: »

How did it get so bad that their kids had to go into care, that is just shocking in this day & age that people can end up in such a situation.
I hope they got their kids back & got some help to rebuild their lives.

I guess they had all their money taking off them by the gang, so they couldn't afford rent, food, clothing etc for their children.

Incidentally, I've never ever heard of Nigerian or Moroccan gangs that are meant to be in on the act but I've heard plenty about Eastern Europeans doing the rounds. And I'm pretty close to the coal face (unfortunately) if you know what I mean.

Finnbar01

This was posted by John Hearne on his facebook page on 1st April 2017.

I was 2 hours in the barracks one night and for 2 hours the Garda threatened a girl if she made a statement they would report her to her school and her mother would be reported to social services and fair play to the family they made the statement and we won out a high court case was dropped another night for 2 and a half hours they wouldn't take a statement off me when my life was threatened by a gang member i had to stage a sit in it then went to court and they asked me to drop the charges and another time they charged me with assault to fit me up and refused to take seven witness statements that would clear me but later on they apologised when they found out my dad was a Garda and they couldn't get away with it and i was cleared and i feel sad for the decent Garda out their. It's like the vhi if you have money your ok remember kinneally their should be a criminal investigation into this. But when people elect criminals like Haughey Burke and Lawlor what do you expect it's a rotten corrupt state when FF and Fg left children die of neglect in homes and allowed children to be trafficked to America and they continue to vote for them when their going to spend millions defending Apple to dodge taxes if you vote for them it's your fault.

So the Gardaí are also a major part of the problem.

BTW, I am far from a Sinn Fein supporter.

jopax

Finnbar01 wrote: »

I guess they had all their money taking off them by the gang, so they couldn't afford rent, food, clothing etc for their children.

Incidentally, I've never ever heard of Nigerian or Moroccan gangs that are meant to be in on the act but I've heard plenty about Eastern Europeans doing the rounds. And I'm pretty close to the coal face (unfortunately) if you know what I mean.

I had heard stories of what was happening in that area but I didn't realise how bad it was. Absolute animals terrorising families like that, if there was no children involved it would be bad enough, but for innocent kids to have to pay the price.
I'm not too surprised about the eastern Europeans as I have heard stories of bags of white powder changing hands in broad daylight in the park.
I was very surprised to read about Nigerian gangs, unless this is a new thing here.

jopax

Finnbar01 wrote: »

This was posted by John Hearne on his facebook page on 1st April 2017.



So the Gardaí are also a major part of the problem.

BTW, I am far from a Sinn Fein supporter.

This is absolutely shocking, why on earth are the guards defending these scumbags.
It's actually hard to believe it happened, talk about corruption. Where is the justice gone, am actually speechless.
Were the guards even held accountable for anything.

potatohouse

you would not believe the amount of money gangs make from the cannabis trade alone. in the millions/tens of millions. if you think some of that doesn't make its way to the boys in blue you're living in fantasy land. full legalization would cut them off and improve the country tenfold. hilarious to think in this day and age that some would vote no if it came to referendum!

MRnotlob606

Picky owner wrote: »

Only read it on the journal.ie through the link jopax posted,was it reported on any other local or national media,any comments from waterford politicans?

Well John Hearne as done a lot in fairness in combating these thugs. Even had two cars burnt out and had shots fired at his house.

Picky owner

Wonder will there be anything on Deise AM tomorrow,must be more to this story.

koumi

jopax wrote: »

Were the guards even held accountable for anything.

not yet

jopax

potatohouse wrote: »

you would not believe the amount of money gangs make from the cannabis trade alone. in the millions/tens of millions. if you think some of that doesn't make its way to the boys in blue you're living in fantasy land. full legalization would cut them off and improve the country tenfold. hilarious to think in this day and age that some would vote no if it came to referendum!

Yes when you put it like that it does make sense that there must be corruption in the guards as well.
I suppose I'm more shocked that they are so brazen about it,. I would have thought that if you were on the take that a certain level of discretion is needed.
The guards that refused to take the statement are obviously the guilty ones, so how does it go on without anyone reporting them.

Sosurface

jopax wrote: »

I had heard stories of what was happening in that area but I didn't realise how bad it was. Absolute animals terrorising families like that, if there was no children involved it would be bad enough, but for innocent kids to have to pay the price.
I'm not too surprised about the eastern Europeans as I have heard stories of bags of white powder changing hands in broad daylight in the park.
I was very surprised to read about Nigerian gangs, unless this is a new thing here.

Take a walk down the side of Tesco Poleberry oretty much any evening. You might have to do a lap or 2 before you get any activity. You'll see plenty of our "new Europeans" supplying heroin to local users, mainly emanating from the hostel on Bath St(not neccessarily resident there).

And yes I have contacted the gardai multiple times about this, the response has always been comically poor.

jopax

Sosurface wrote: »

Take a walk down the side of Tesco Poleberry oretty much any evening. You might have to do a lap or 2 before you get any activity. You'll see plenty of our "new Europeans" supplying heroin to local users, mainly emanating from the hostel on Bath St(not neccessarily resident there).

And yes I have contacted the gardai multiple times about this, the response has always been comically poor.

Well if it is illegal & the guards don't want to know why not just leagalise it & be done with it.
No wonder this country will attract foreign gangs if it's so easy to deal here. It's such a pity because it takes the look off an area if you see that carry on, especially if you were a tourist.

MentalMario

Wanderer78 wrote: »

You will actually find many of these 'weak willed skangers' suffering from very complex issues, the most common being, mental health issues, complex behavioural problems and personality disorders, things such as autism would be common, complex learning disabilities such as dyslexia etc would also be common. You will find many of our institutions such as our educational system, health system, legal systems etc exasperate these issues. Many of these peoples issues would also be undiagnosed, it would also be common for these 'weak willed' people to come from very complex family environments, in which adding further complications to their issues.




Strangely, countries such as America have been following this kind of thinking for decades now which has resulted in more prisons, more incarcerations and oddly increasing drug use! It's time to move on from this Neanderthal thinking

Complex behavioral problems me hole. Being a scumbag isn't a complex issue. It's a life choice for the majority of them.

I'm sure there are a few genuine cases where mental health issues lead to drug abuse but the vast majority of scumbag junkies deserve no sympathy, and resources would be better spent elsewhere than trying to help them.

I know of 3 or 4 heroin junkies and the estate they currently live in would be a lot better off if they f*cked off and died of an OD.

They've terrorised good people for years, even before they became addicted.

Sosurface

Sosurface wrote: »

Take a walk down the side of Tesco Poleberry oretty much any evening. You might have to do a lap or 2 before you get any activity. You'll see plenty of our "new Europeans" supplying heroin to local users, mainly emanating from the hostel on Bath St(not neccessarily resident there).

And yes I have contacted the gardai multiple times about this, the response has always been comically poor.

I have lived just by Bath street for about 8 years now, I was in college and it was convient for me. In saying that, in the past 3 years the amount of drugs and trouble going on in Manor/Bath street and the surrounding area is shocking :eek:

I can't walk down my street after about 7 at night without getting harrassed asking for money, I have walked out of my house there was people bloodied lying on the ground, people openly selling taking drugs, even last week I went into Madigans to get some cans of Guinness and there was a guy about 50 with face tattoos selling drugs to kids that were about 14 years of age.

When I first moved to this street the main problems were the students who acted the maggot and occasionaly thrashed the car or something but now this area is a lot more seedy and seem more dangerous.

I recently just had my first kid, so I will need to move out of this general area for the safety of my family, with the current rental market that is going to be hard though.

It's a shame how the city is becomign worse and worse, but to be fair at least the city is going to look nice very soon with the apple market canopy etc...... I just hope its not blighted by the druggies.

jopax

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I have lived just by Bath street for about 8 years now, I was in college and it was convient for me. In saying that, in the past 3 years the amount of drugs and trouble going on in Manor/Bath street and the surrounding area is shocking :eek:

I can't walk down my street after about 7 at night without getting harrassed asking for money, I have walked out of my house there was people bloodied lying on the ground, people openly selling taking drugs, even last week I went into Madigans to get some cans of Guinness and there was a guy about 50 with face tattoos selling drugs to kids that were about 14 years of age.

When I first moved to this street the main problems were the students who acted the maggot and occasionaly thrashed the car or something but now this area is a lot more seedy and seem more dangerous.

I recently just had my first kid, so I will need to move out of this general area for the safety of my family, with the current rental market that is going to be hard though.

It's a shame how the city is becomign worse and worse, but to be fair at least the city is going to look nice very soon with the apple market canopy etc...... I just hope its not blighted by the druggies.

It's just the scourge of drugs in this country now has made it unrecognisable to say 20 years ago. I know there was drugs back then but miniscule in comparison to now, especially the hard drugs.
I wouldn't want to raise a child around that kind of environment, it somehow normalises this behaviour as tolerable.
There is a lot of good in the city ,& a lot of potential, but more needs to be done by the powers that be to stop allowing people to do this with no concequence for their actions.

jopax

jopax wrote: »

It's just the scourge of drugs in this country now has made it unrecognisable to say 20 years ago. I know there was drugs back then but miniscule in comparison to now, especially the hard drugs.
I wouldn't want to raise a child around that kind of environment, it somehow normalises this behaviour as tolerable.
There is a lot of good in the city ,& a lot of potential, but more needs to be done by the powers that be to stop allowing people to do this with no concequence for their actions.

Yeah I am not down here by choice, the rent is very cheap compared to the rest of the city. I am about to get a new job finally :pac: so I will be able to get out into the suburbs a bit and away from all this sh!te.