Prius

from_atozinc

Hello

Thinking of buying a Prius, around 2009 or 10.
I have a good few questions which I hope you can answer.

> was there a facelift etc around this time? If so, would like to get the face lifted one.

> I see some of them branded as T3 and T4, what does this mean?

> what engine sizes do they come in?

> car I am thinking of will be st least 7 years old. Does the battery begin to die at this age ?

> Is it normal to replace batteries, if so, how much ?

> if you didn't want to replace the batteries and just run on petrol, is this possible ? Or just silly?

> how often do they need to be serviced and what happens during a service?

> any special service requirements ? e.g. On "normal cars", the timing belt has to be changes after maybe 60k miles, anything similar here

> what is the rough cost of a service ?

> does servicing have to be done at a main dealer or could a joe soap Indy do it ?

> is the ride harsh ?

> are they slow as Christmas ?

> are they reliable ?

BoatMad

Why not buy a proper EV , like a 2nd hand leaf , the Prius is just a petrol car

Soarer

Jaysus.

Let's try....

Yes there was a change around then, and yes I'd get the face lifted one.
T3, T4, T-Spirt are varying levels of trim on UK models. T3 being the lowest.
Older car was a 1.5. Facelift model is 1.8, but more efficient.
Battery doesn't begin to die.
No it's not common to replace the battery.
It's just silly.
Regular annual servicing, just like any normal petrol engine. The hybrid part needs no servicing.
No timing belt.
Service price depends on what needs to be done. Oil and filter from a main dealer is €100?
Any mechanic can service them.
Ride isn't harsh.
They're not as slow as Christmas.
Ridiculously reliable.

from_atozinc

Soarer wrote: »

Jaysus.

Let's try....

Yes there was a change around then, and yes I'd get the face lifted one.
T3, T4, T-Spirt are varying levels of trim on UK models. T3 being the lowest.
Older car was a 1.5. Facelift model is 1.8, but more efficient.
Battery doesn't begin to die.
No it's not common to replace the battery.
It's just silly.
Regular annual servicing, just like any normal petrol engine. The hybrid part needs no servicing.
No timing belt.
Service price depends on what needs to be done. Oil and filter from a main dealer is €100?
Any mechanic can service them.
Ride isn't harsh.
They're not as slow as Christmas.
Ridiculously reliable.

Thanks.

Laughing at the "jaysus"

Ok, so maybe the batteries don't die but do they loose some of their power etc ?

cros13

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks.

Laughing at the "jaysus"

Ok, so maybe the batteries don't die but do they loose some of their power etc ?

Sure... but the battery is 1/50th of the usable capacity of the Leaf for example when new and only used to recover braking energy and almost immediately send it back to a tiny electric motor.
So it's even if the capacity halved it's not going to make a massive difference.

It would only be a problem if the battery's health was so bad it couldn't accept or output the energy from the motor.

Prius is one of the most reliable cars ever built !

It is rare but the battery can give problems from 10 years + but most cars can give problems at that age.

I had my MK II for 4 years and sold it with 200,000 kms. Great car.

All MK III Prius + have no belts at all. service is usually about 15,000 kms and I recommend gearbox oil changed at 160,000 kms. Not part of the service but recommended by Prius owners on the U.S prius.

As leaf owner now, that change was amazing. I loved the prius but love the Leaf a lot more. The 30 Kwh Leaf should be worth serious consideration. Faster charging than the 24 Kwh from fast chargers. Once you go EV you will not go back.

Anyway, the prius is a great car.

from_atozinc

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Prius is one of the most reliable cars ever built !

It is rare but the battery can give problems from 10 years + but most cars can give problems at that age.

I had my MK II for 4 years and sold it with 200,000 kms. Great car.

All MK III Prius + have no belts at all. service is usually about 15,000 kms and I recommend gearbox oil changed at 160,000 kms. Not part of the service but recommended by Prius owners on the U.S prius.

As leaf owner now, that change was amazing. I loved the prius but love the Leaf a lot more. The 30 Kwh Leaf should be worth serious consideration. Faster charging than the 24 Kwh from fast chargers. Once you go EV you will not go back.

Anyway, the prius is a great car.

Hi.

Is a MK II = before 2009?

What kind of problems can happen with the battery?

How much were your service costs on average and did you get them done in an Indy?

from_atozinc

cros13 wrote: »

Sure... but the battery is 1/50th of the usable capacity of the Leaf for example when new and only used to recover braking energy and almost immediately send it back to a tiny electric motor.
So it's even if the capacity halved it's not going to make a massive difference.

It would only be a problem if the battery's health was so bad it couldn't accept or output the energy from the motor.

Oh ok. I have things wrong in my head. I was just thinking solely of a battery. Was not thinking about an electric motor at all. Aplolgies, my knowledge of how these cars work is useless.

Soarer

The battery losing capacity in a Prius isn't really an issue, as it's not solely depending on it. It just means the petrol engine kicks in that little bit earlier.

Like Mad Lad above, we're on our second gen II. We only changed the first after it was written off in a crash after 5 years ownership. Never so much as changed a bulb. This one we've had for near on 4 years, and again, not a bulb has gone wrong.

I personally brought both in from the UK. Both were top spec T-Spirit models. The low co2 emissions, as well as the vrt rebate, makes them an excellent import option. Now would be a good time to buy too as the uk changed their plates in March, so I'd say a lot of 3 year old fleet cars would be coming back off lease about now.

grogi

> was there a facelift etc around this time? If so, would like to get the face lifted one.

No. There was a model update around 2009.

> I see some of them branded as T3 and T4, what does this mean?

Spec levels. T3 lowest, T4 middle and T-Spirit highest.

> what engine sizes do they come in?

1.8

> car I am thinking of will be st least 7 years old. Does the battery begin to die at this age ?

No

> Is it normal to replace batteries, if so, how much ?

No. But it costs a lot.

> if you didn't want to replace the batteries and just run on petrol, is this possible ? Or just silly?

No, not possible.

> how often do they need to be serviced and what happens during a service?

Like a normal car.

Oil service is 15kkm or a year (Oil, oil filter, pollen filter). Every 30kkm/2 years: air filter. Plus regular things such as tyres, breaks (pads, discs or breaking fluid - they are hardly used, so last forever)

> any special service requirements ? e.g. On "normal cars", the timing belt has to be changes after maybe 60k miles, anything similar here

A/C compressor requires a different type of lubricant. Only Toyota - but they are very reasonable with pricing.
Bleeding the breaks is more complicated than in a regular car too. Apart from that it's just a car...

You might consider changing the gearbox oil when you buy one. You require around 3.5l of Toyota ATF-WS oil. Nothing else. WS WS WS. 08886-81210. It is a custom order at the dealer and they might try to sell you something else. But be persistent about what you want. Any other oil might damage the drivetrain.

> what is the rough cost of a service ?

Oil €30 (exp. https://www.micksgarage.com/ProductDetails.aspx?pid=7343340), oil filter ~€10.

> does servicing have to be done at a main dealer or could a joe soap Indy do it ?

Indy will do.

> is the ride harsh ?

No. It is a bit wobbly actually, but driving on 17" helps.

> are they slow as Christmas ?

No, you will be surprised how fast they are.

> are they reliable ?

Very

from_atozinc

grogi wrote: »

> was there a facelift etc around this time? If so, would like to get the face lifted one.

No. There was a model update around 2009.

> I see some of them branded as T3 and T4, what does this mean?

Spec levels. T3 lowest, T4 middle and T-Spirit highest.

> what engine sizes do they come in?

1.8

> car I am thinking of will be st least 7 years old. Does the battery begin to die at this age ?

No

> Is it normal to replace batteries, if so, how much ?

No. But it costs a lot.

> if you didn't want to replace the batteries and just run on petrol, is this possible ? Or just silly?

No, not possible.

> how often do they need to be serviced and what happens during a service?

Like a normal car.

Oil service is 15kkm or a year (Oil, oil filter, pollen filter). Every 30kkm/2 years: air filter. Plus regular things such as tyres, breaks (pads, discs or breaking fluid - they are hardly used, so last forever)

> any special service requirements ? e.g. On "normal cars", the timing belt has to be changes after maybe 60k miles, anything similar here

A/C compressor requires a different type of lubricant. Only Toyota - but they are very reasonable with pricing.
Bleeding the breaks is more complicated than in a regular car too. Apart from that it's just a car...

You might consider changing the gearbox oil when you buy one. You require around 3.5l of Toyota ATF-WS oil. Nothing else. WS WS WS. 08886-81210. It is a custom order at the dealer and they might try to sell you something else. But be persistent about what you want. Any other oil might damage the drivetrain.

> what is the rough cost of a service ?

Oil €30 (exp. https://www.micksgarage.com/ProductDetails.aspx?pid=7343340), oil filter ~€10.

> does servicing have to be done at a main dealer or could a joe soap Indy do it ?

Indy will do.

> is the ride harsh ?

No. It is a bit wobbly actually, but driving on 17" helps.

> are they slow as Christmas ?

No, you will be surprised how fast they are.

> are they reliable ?

Very

Thanks,

when you say "model update" do you mean a totally new model was released?

Does MK II mean before 2009?

grogi

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks,

when you say "model update" do you mean a totally new model was released?

Does MK II mean before 2009?

Yes.

goz83

I'm going to pick up from the first response on this thread, but I might put it a bit more eloquently

What is the reason you are considering a prius? Have you considered getting a full electric vehicle, such as a Nissan Leaf?

I ask, because I was set on getting a PHEV (plug in hybrid electric vehicle) before my eyes were opened to the potential of a full EV. The idea with the PHEV was that I would get some free driving on electric and the petrol would be a back-up. Glad I went EV.

Soarer

2nd Gen Prius. 1.5ltr.



3rd Gen Prius. 1.8ltr.



There are a lot of cheap gen 3 cars around, but they are Jap imports. You may have issues with insurance. Also the centre console is in Japanese, so a bit of a disaster!

In the UK, there's this t-spirit for £5,500. Mileage is high, but seeing as it has a FSH, it'd not bother me. The VRT on this one would be around €1200.

There are a few more sub £6k, and the VRT should be around the same for all of them.

from_atozinc

Soarer wrote: »

2nd Gen Prius. 1.5ltr.



3rd Gen Prius. 1.8ltr.



There are a lot of cheap gen 3 cars around, but they are Jap imports. You may have issues with insurance. Also the centre console is in Japanese, so a bit of a disaster!

In the UK, there's this t-spirit for £5,500. Mileage is high, but seeing as it has a FSH, it'd not bother me. The VRT on this one would be around €1200.

There are a few more sub £6k, and the VRT should be around the same for all of them.

Thanks.

The Gen 3 looks nicer

Is there an easy way to spot a Jap import from the outside of the car without seeing the center console?

Miscreant

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks.

The Gen 3 looks nicer

Is there an easy way to spot a Jap import from the outside of the car without seeing the center console?

The Jap import will have a more "square" numberplate recess for the rear, like most other Jap import cars. In other words, they tend to have 2 different sizes of numberplate front and rear whereas an Irish or UK car will have the same size plates front and back

zilog_jones

Deleted User wrote: »

All MK III Prius + have no belts at all. service is usually about 15,000 kms and I recommend gearbox oil changed at 160,000 kms. Not part of the service but recommended by Prius owners on the U.S prius.

Toyota say the gearbox oil is for life, but a lot of people in the US change it after 60k miles or so. Some have sent the oil away for lab tests and it seemed pretty badly contaminated at this stage - but it's hard to quantify how bad that really is for the transmission.

from_atozinc wrote: »

What kind of problems can happen with the battery?

Usually when they go bad it's just one or two cells (I forget how many cells are in the battery pack), and they can often be replaced with reconditioned used cells fairly cheap. There are indy specialists who'll do this in the UK but I'm not sure about Ireland yet. And it's usually well over 10 years when they start going bad.

How much were your service costs on average and did you get them done in an Indy?

I paid €155 for a standard service in Lehane Motors. I'd probably do it myself from now on as the hybrid system warranty's up this year (5 years).

With the 3rd gen Prius there's no auxiliary belt, a timing chain, no alternator, no starter motor - so in a lot of ways long-term maintenance will be lower than a normal ICE car, especially a modern diesel.

from_atozinc wrote: »

Oh ok. I have things wrong in my head. I was just thinking solely of a battery. Was not thinking about an electric motor at all. Aplolgies, my knowledge of how these cars work is useless.

Lots of information here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive
At the bottom there are some links to animations/simulations of how the drivetrain works.
In many ways it's simpler than a traditional manual gearbox - less moving parts, and no clutch. No shift shock like with traditional automatics or semi-auto boxes, and in general quite smooth.

grogi wrote: »

Spec levels. T3 lowest, T4 middle and T-Spirit highest.

For the UK, yes. Here for the 3rd gen there is the base model and the "Luxury". There was a facelift in 2012 - most obvious difference is the lights on the front bumper.

Oil service is 15kkm or a year (Oil, oil filter, pollen filter). Every 30kkm/2 years: air filter. Plus regular things such as tyres, breaks (pads, discs or breaking fluid - they are hardly used, so last forever)

One downside to the "friction" brakes (the normal ones) hardly being used is that they probably should at least be inspected every year or two. A fairly common problem is the caliper slide pins on the rear brakes can start sticking or seize (especially in areas where the roads are salted a lot), causing problems with uneven wear and dragging.

Bleeding the breaks is more complicated than in a regular car too. Apart from that it's just a car...

Yes, bleeding brakes requires some special incantations (the official documentation is out there), but does not require special equipment.

from_atozinc wrote: »

> if you didn't want to replace the batteries and just run on petrol, is this possible ? Or just silly?

If there's something significantly wrong with the batteries it may not let you start the car.

> are they slow as Christmas ?

The 3rd gen has a claimed combined power of 134 bhp, which is significantly better than the previous model. I moved from a Peugeot 406 2.0 diesel (90 bhp) and that was gutless in comparison. Once you get used to how the throttle responds, making decent progress and overtaking is not a problem at all. "Eco Mode" (button next to gear lever) will significantly restrict throttle response and linearity for efficiency - I hate it personally and leave it off.

> are they reliable ?

I've heard of a few cases of early 2009-2010 models with inverter failures - this is expensive to replace (€1-2k?) but I imagine very rare. EGR valves getting clogged up on early models also happens, but depends on conditions and driving habits, etc. - and modern diesels are much worse for EGR problems.

I have the Prius Plug-in which was sold in the UK from 2012-2015 (not Ireland) - basically the same thing as the 3rd gen but with a larger battery, external charging capability and higher EV-only maximum speed (85 km/h vs. about 70 km/h). The range on a full charge is about 15-16 km - not much but it suits my commute and can cover about 30-40% of my driving. The standard Prius will do about 2 km in EV mode.

zilog_jones

Miscreant wrote: »

The Jap import will have a more "square" numberplate recess for the rear, like most other Jap import cars. In other words, they tend to have 2 different sizes of numberplate front and rear whereas an Irish or UK car will have the same size plates front and back

With the 3rd gen Prius the number plate holder is different on the front too - see in the picture above there's a thick black plastic piece behind the number plate. This is much squarer on Japanese models, e.g. this one: https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/toyota-prius-zvw30-5dr-auto/15294632
Also note in that example there's a Japanese dealer sticker still on the rear bumper (very small, right side), shaken (vehicle inspection) disc on windscreen, parking sticker on left of rear window and other stuff on rear window - all these are often not removed on imports.

n97 mini

Consider a Honda Civic IMA (hybrid) either. We've had 2 and a 2011 Prius. Fuel economy wise there is feck all difference (speaking from experience here: Prius for 3 years and Civic IMAs for a combined 16 years).

The Civic is considerably cheaper (it's simpler), just as reliable, a better drive, but has less poke at speed.

yannakis

zilog_jones wrote: »

With the 3rd gen Prius the number plate holder is different on the front too - see in the picture above there's a thick black plastic piece behind the number plate. This is much squarer on Japanese models, e.g. this one: https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/toyota-prius-zvw30-5dr-auto/15294632
Also note in that example there's a Japanese dealer sticker still on the rear bumper (very small, right side), shaken (vehicle inspection) disc on windscreen, parking sticker on left of rear window and other stuff on rear window - all these are often not removed on imports.

I've changed the front licence plate holder of my 2010 T-spirit www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=102261485

n97 mini wrote: »

Consider a Honda Civic IMA (hybrid) either. We've had 2 and a 2011 Prius. Fuel economy wise there is feck all difference (speaking from experience here: Prius for 3 years and Civic IMAs for a combined 16 years).

The Civic is considerably cheaper (it's simpler), just as reliable, a better drive, but has less poke at speed.

Can you give numbers about the MPG you got from these two cars? I have the feeling that Honda's IMA is not as efficient in stop & go situations.

Alu

zilog_jones wrote: »

I paid €155 for a standard service in Lehane Motors. I'd probably do it myself from now on as the hybrid system warranty's up this year (5 years).

I have a 2010 (gen 3) and since the warranty ended my Toyota dealer has carried out a hybrid check, and provided a certificate/ 1 year extended warranty, as part of the annual service.

zilog_jones wrote: »

I've heard of a few cases of early 2009-2010 models with inverter failures - this is expensive to replace (€1-2k?) but I imagine very rare.

I'm almost certain that was dealt with in one of the recalls. There have been a few so check that they've been carried out.

I have my Prius for over 5 years without any problems or issues. Despite my heavy foot I have found it very efficient for both city and motorway driving. The only exception is very short journeys on cold mornings when the engine takes a bit longer to warm up - but that's the same if not worse for non hybrid ICE cars (particularly diesel).

Performance isn't bad - acceleration its quite quick from stopped, though not as quick off the mark as the EVs I've tried!

[edit...]

This seems to be the complete list of recalls since 2010 (inverter issue is one of them) - https://www.cars.com/recalls/toyota-prius-2010/

I only remember there being 3 so it could be that most of these were limited to particular cars/ markets. Toyota have been proactive about resolving these issues as they arise - I've received letter detailing the issues and how to get it fixed (free of charge).

n97 mini

yannakis wrote: »

Can you give numbers about the MPG you got from these two cars? I have the feeling that Honda's IMA is not as efficient in stop & go situations.

I found with the Prius that in stop/go as soon as the engine kicks in the fuel consumption was quite poor. A 1.8L is going to consume more than a 1.3L at low speeds after all.

The mpg figures are very subjective, but my wife would get 48 mpg out of both cars over a full tank as she pays no attention to how she drives. I'd be a bit more careful and could squeeze 60 mpg out of either of them.

zilog_jones

yannakis wrote: »

Can you give numbers about the MPG you got from these two cars? I have the feeling that Honda's IMA is not as efficient in stop & go situations.

3rd gen Prius avg. 5.05 l/100km (56 MPG) based on 650 owners: https://www.spritmonitor.de/en/overview/49-Toyota/439-Prius.html?fueltype=2&constyear_s=2010&constyear_e=2015&powerunit=2
2nd gen Civic Hybrid avg. 5.74 l/100km (49 MPG) based on 179 owners: https://www.spritmonitor.de/en/overview/18-Honda/958-Civic_Hybrid.html?fueltype=2&constyear_s=2006&constyear_e=2010&powerunit=2
(filtered to avoid overlapping years, fuel conversions, Prius Plug-in)

Alu wrote: »

I have my Prius for over 5 years without any problems or issues. Despite my heavy foot I have found it very efficient for both city and motorway driving. The only exception is very short journeys on cold mornings when the engine takes a bit longer to warm up - but that's the same if not worse for non hybrid ICE cars (particularly diesel).

Part of the problem in winter is that the cabin heating gets heat from the engine coolant system like any normal ICE car, so depending on how you set the climate control it can increase ICE running time (including idling) significantly. Heated seats will help reduce this requirement, but that won't help with the windows fogging up in winter.

This seems to be the complete list of recalls since 2010 (inverter issue is one of them) - https://www.cars.com/recalls/toyota-prius-2010/

I only remember there being 3 so it could be that most of these were limited to particular cars/ markets. Toyota have been proactive about resolving these issues as they arise - I've received letter detailing the issues and how to get it fixed (free of charge).

That list is for the US, so recalls are probably a bit different here. Mine was recalled for a charcoal canister replacement (something to do with the fuel tank) - my local dealer had no problem dealing with this considering it's a UK import and one they never sold in Ireland (Plug-in). I think there were airbag recalls here as well for certain models.

n97 mini wrote: »

I found with the Prius that in stop/go as soon as the engine kicks in the fuel consumption was quite poor. A 1.8L is going to consume more than a 1.3L at low speeds after all.

Engine displacement is not very useful for comparing fuel consumption. The engine in the Prius is a very efficient Atkinson cycle engine, and less powerful than a typical 1.8 NA petrol - power is about the same on both, although the Prius has a bit more torque. Live fuel consumption will always look bad when you're pulling off from a standstill, but once you get up to your desired speed it'll go down a lot (or the ICE will go off completely if you're going slow enough).

n97 mini

Google pumping losses. The reason big engines are less efficient at low/no speed.

Chippy01

Got my first Prius in 2010, a 2007 Gen II T-Spirit. Great car, and I was very impressed seeing as I came from a Lexus GS 300

Moved up in 2013 to a 2009 Gen III T-4 (and discovered Fuelly at the same time), and started logging my fuel usage.
Total miles tracked - 34185; Average UKmpg - 59.9; Best - 66.8
I have since moved up to a 2011 T-Spirit recently, and haven't had many fills yet to warrant a fuelly report on it at this stage.

My partner had a 2008 Honda Civic IMA Hybrid for a year, and logged her usage too.
Total miles tracked - 7771; Average UKmpg - 47.6; Best - 51.6

She is a much steadier driver than myself, and earlier this year she 'upgraded' to a 2008 Gen II Prius.
Barely 2000 miles tracked so far, but her average UKmpg is 53mpg, and her best is 60

We also run about 400 + miles before refuelling, so the above figures are based on around 3/4 tank fills (Note here, we are talking miles and gallons, not litres and kilometres)

If you're going on fuel consumption, the Prius wins hands down.
Where the Civic was a lovely car to drive, slightly better than the Prius, unfortunately Honda sold very few of the IMA's in Ireland and I would have a niggle in the back of my mind if their technicians would have the necessary training to work on one should it start going wrong.
Toyota, on the other hand, seem to keep their tech boys up to speed. Both our cars have been pugged into Toyotas computers and have had all the updates/recalls required (at no extra cost), and have had the Hybrid Health Check done as well.
That would be another + mark in my book for the Prius too, as would it's versatility by being a hatchback rather than a saloon.

The three Prius' I have owned have all been UK imports, and can't fault them.
Herselfs 'new to her' Gen II is an Irish 'Luxury' spec, and she loves it.

Oh, and I would avoid any and all of the Jap imports like the plague.

n97 mini

Chippy01 wrote: »

Total miles tracked - 7771; Average UKmpg - 47.6; Best - 51.6

I tracked mine on fuelly for a while too.
EDIT: didn't track the Prius as it wasn't my car.

BlinkingLights

The current generation Prius is actually a *lot* livelier to drive and has far better suspension.
It's just a shame about the design of the tail from a visual point of view.

n97 mini

zilog_jones wrote: »

The standard Prius will do about 2 km in EV mode.

EV mode on the standard one is only really a gimmick. It only does around a mile and knocks off once you hit 30 mph. The manual states that you will get better economy by not actually using it!

grogi

n97 mini wrote: »

EV mode on the standard one is only really a gimmick. It only does around a mile and knocks off once you hit 30 mph. The manual states that you will get better economy by not actually using it!

It only makes sense when you need to move the cold car. Couple of meters without the ICE kicking in. Otherwise I did not see any use for it.

EV mode is really only for when you're stopped at lights and the engine doesn't turn off for reasons like warm up, press it to kill the engine.

Using EV mode will considerably reduce efficiency of using it to drive. Running the battery down means the car has a lot less power and there is a lot less power going to the Motor.

Alu

zilog_jones wrote: »

Part of the problem in winter is that the cabin heating gets heat from the engine coolant system like any normal ICE car, so depending on how you set the climate control it can increase ICE running time (including idling) significantly. Heated seats will help reduce this requirement, but that won't help with the windows fogging up in winter.

Yeah, I've noticed that I can turn the engine on and off by adjusting the air temperature!

zilog_jones wrote: »

That list is for the US, so recalls are probably a bit different here. Mine was recalled for a charcoal canister replacement (something to do with the fuel tank) - my local dealer had no problem dealing with this considering it's a UK import and one they never sold in Ireland (Plug-in). I think there were airbag recalls here as well for certain models.

There was another for the brake pedal as there was an issue where some floor mats could prevent the brake from engaging properly.

Alu

n97 mini wrote: »

Google pumping losses. The reason big engines are less efficient at low/no speed.

From what I remember the Atkinson cycle increases efficiency by reducing pumping losses. Something to do with dynamically reducing the effective displacement volume by sucking back any extra fuel from the cylinders.

yannakis

grogi wrote: »

It only makes sense when you need to move the cold car. Couple of meters without the ICE kicking in. Otherwise I did not see any use for it.

EV mode won't engage when the Prius is cold.

Alu wrote: »

Yeah, I've noticed that I can turn the engine on and off by adjusting the air temperature!

I use EV mode (when the heating is on) to prevent the ICE from running when I'm in slow traffic or stopped at traffic lights. If coasting at a speed higher than EV mode can be engaged, I'll just hit the Off button for a bit.

grogi

yannakis wrote: »

EV mode won't engage when the Prius is cold.

If you are fast enough, it will

yannakis

grogi wrote: »

If you are fast enough, it will

We're both talking about Gen 3, right?

yannakis

Learned something new today - EV will engage as @grogi said. Very handy for small manoeuvres (when no further driving is involved).

aunmotani

Anyone here can help me with contact details of a mechanic who can work on Toyota Prius battery in Dublin?

Got a master cautions sign on the dashboard, got it checked with Toyota, diagnosed with battery failure. I learnt from some forums that it would probably a couple of cells / modules in the battery that cold not have been performing well but Toyota does not do that. Cost to replace the battery is 2700 Euros.

I was thinking to work with a local mechanic to diagnose the bad cells and probably find on adverts etc to get the good ones.

Thanks!

Soarer

Did you get a printout of the faults?

That warning light can be anything from low oil to 12V battery on the way out.

If you can get an OBDII dongle, plug it into the car, and download the Torque app. That can tell you your issues. It can also clear any faults, in case it was just a temporary thing.

who_ru

Wondering if anybody has the new Prius PHEV - reviews all extremely positive and fuel economy is outstanding by all accounts. It isn't a fast car though if that's what matters most. Cost here starts at €37k AFAIK which isn't cheap by any means.

I'd love to hear some owner reviews.

grogi

who_ru wrote: »

Wondering if anybody has the new Prius PHEV - reviews all extremely positive and fuel economy is outstanding by all accounts. It isn't a fast car though if that's what matters most. Cost here starts at €37k AFAIK which isn't cheap by any means.

I'd love to hear some owner reviews.

I am a huge fan of Prii - had the Mk2, love the Mk3. But the Mk4 just hurts my eyes - and that's a lot from a person who honestly liked Multipla. PHEV version looks much better IMHO. But my eyes still cry, this time looking at the bill. €37k is just silly.

Buying a full electric - Ioniq or 2018 Leaf should be much better money spent.

Soarer

I think Zilog has the MK3 PHEV. Don't think anyone here has the MK4.

zilog_jones

Yes, i have a 2012 Prius Plug-in. As has been said the €37k is madness, but in my experience (buying in the UK) after 3 years the depreciation makes them worth no more than the standard Prius - of course we don't know if the same will happen with this version.

Apparently 11 of the new PHV have been registered in Ireland so far - I wonder how many aren't demo cars?
They certainly look a lot less butt-ugly than the standard 4th gen, but the reduction in boot space and lack of 5th seat are much more of a compromise in terms of practicality compared to mine (I only really lost the spare wheel well). In terms of efficiency and performance, it's significantly better - over twice the range, more power in EV mode, and higher EV mode speed limit (130km/h instead of 85km/h).

I'll consider one if a used Tesla Model 3 is still too much for me in 2021

aunmotani

Thanks. Not the printout exactly but got it tested from Toyota dealer which say to replace the battery.

Soarer wrote: »

Did you get a printout of the faults?

That warning light can be anything from low oil to 12V battery on the way out.

If you can get an OBDII dongle, plug it into the car, and download the Torque app. That can tell you your issues. It can also clear any faults, in case it was just a temporary thing.

grogi

aunmotani wrote: »

Thanks. Not the printout exactly but got it tested from Toyota dealer which say to replace the battery.

Hybrid battery or Aux battery?

aunmotani

Hybrid. Costs 2700 euros to replace with new one.

grogi wrote: »

Hybrid battery or Aux battery?

Soarer

I'd definitely be getting an OBDII dongle, Torque app, checking my oil, and running a test on my 12V battery.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFaHKKx4mME

Bigus

If you can get a second hand battery for around 400 euro I'd recommend you chance it , a good few in breakers in Ireland.
Replacing the whole battery is relatively straigforward , once you pull out the main orange fuse wire on the battery pack.

yannakis

I'd consider the Prime for less than 15k (euros) on the road, however it seems to come at about 20k (apologies) there are very few used ones to get a correct cost. Anyway at that pricepoint, anyone should really just chip in a bit more and go for a proper PHEV like the BMW 330e

zilog_jones

It's called the "Prius PHV" in Europe, not the Prime - your link showed standard 2016 petrol hybrid Prius models (the PHV looks significantly different and didn't come out until 2017). It's a much more efficient and capable PHEV than the 330e.

@aunmotani: I've heard of Toyota dealers misdiagnosing Prius issues which turned out to just be the 12V battery. If the battery is over 5 years old it may well be on the way out.

grogi

zilog_jones wrote: »

It's called the "Prius PHV" in Europe, not the Prime - your link showed standard 2016 petrol hybrid Prius models (the PHV looks significantly different and didn't come out until 2017). It's a much more efficient and capable PHEV than the 330e.

@aunmotani: I've heard of Toyota dealers misdiagnosing Prius issues which turned out to just be the 12V battery. If the battery is over 5 years old it may well be on the way out.

I am not sure if the Prius PHV is more capable than 330e. It is more practical for sure, being a hatchback with a bigger boot. It will be much cheaper to run as well. But 330e will crash the Toyota performance wise... Depends what is expected out of a car...

zilog_jones

I meant more in terms of being a PHEV - it has nearly double the EV range than the 330e (40 vs. 23 km in US EPA tests) and it's a hell of a lot more efficient in hybrid mode. I think the Prius is actually more powerful in EV mode than the 330e, but of course it's not as good in terms of driving dynamics or ICE performance.

I've heard many good things about the way the current generation Prius drives, and some saying the PHV is slightly better (different weight distribution, etc.). But it's still a front wheel drive car.