Is Trump the beast?

realitykeeper

Donald Trump said he would make peace with Russia before he got elected and now he seems to be picking a fight with them.
In Daniel 8:25 it says:
And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also ...
By promising peace with Russia in order to get elected, he used peace as a tool. The question now is how many will he destroy?

hungry hypno toad

He won, get over it.

realitykeeper

hungry hypno toad wrote: »

He won, get over it.

You misapprehend me. Clinton supporters will be delighted he has turned hostile to Russia. For my part, I wanted neither because I disagreed with Clinton and I distrusted Trump.

vicwatson

Reality keeper in not keeping with reality shocker

realitykeeper

vicwatson wrote: »

Reality keeper in not keeping with reality shocker

Really? So you are saying you think Trump will destroy nobody during his tenure? Even benign presidents have done that. Also, I am merely asking the question: Is Trump the beast. I am not necessarily saying he is.

Peregrinus

Is Trump the Beast?

Well, no, not if you pay any attention to the rest of Daniel 8.

In Daniel 8:1-14 the narrator describes a vision he had. Then in Daniel 8:15-26, from which your verse is taken, he tells how he was approached by someone who had "the appearance of a man" and who was called Gabriel. Gabriel explains to him that his vision is about a conflict between the Medes and the Persians on the one hand, and the Greeks on the other. Gabriel is explicit that these are the nations involved. Part of the vision means that Greece will be divided at one point into four kingdoms, and out of one of these kingdoms a king will emerge, described in verse 25, which you quote.

Trump is not Greek, or the king of any Greek kingdom. Therefore, verse 25 does not refer to Trump.

The usual interpretation is that Dan 8 refers to Antiochus IV Epiphanes (who was indeed Greek) and to his persecution of the Jews in the second century B.C.. He engaged in a major conflict with the Persians (which he ultimately lost, an outcome mentioned in the part of verse 25 which you don't quote). When defeated by the Persians he fled, but could find no city which would give him refuge, and eventually he drowned himself, according to one source, or died when he fell from a chariot, according to another.

uck51js9zml2yt

Is he appointed by God for the current situation is more the question.
From a biblical perspective i would say yes.
There is no government appointment with God beijg involved.
Not to mention Cyrus who was mentioned by name in Isaiah a century before he appeared on the scene.
God refers to him as His Servant Cyrus!

.........

I don't like trump, but I think you've been duped by the the hysterical media spin. They're still not interested in learning or publicising the real lessons of why so many ordinary people voted for him, and why thankfully many of them can separate the actual facts from the soap opera style spin. They will vote for him again, because as bad and untrustworthy as trump is, the media sponsored alternative was worse . . and a lot more cunning. Hillary was being bankrolled by Saudi Arabia among others. The owners of the western media thought they could control the US election result, and are still smarting from the fact they are no longer trusted. Ordinary people are not as stupid as the owners of the media like to think they are.

antiskeptic

Rudy Tasty Sandstorm wrote: »

There is no government appointment with God beijg involved.

National Socialism?

K.Flyer

realitykeeper wrote: »

Donald Trump said he would make peace with Russia before he got elected and now he seems to be picking a fight with them.
In Daniel 8:25 it says:
And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also ...
By promising peace with Russia in order to get elected, he used peace as a tool. The question now is how many will he destroy?

When Obama first got elected the amount of people that came out saying he was The Last, The Anti-Christ the this and that The End is Nigh and quoting biblical passages to bolster their theories.
Before him it was J.W. Bush was the bringer of the end.. now it's Trump's turn.
Yes, one day you may be right, but please folks, for now, get on and enjoy life and stop wasting your time on cockamamy theories.

Nick Park

A beast, rather than the beast.

Peregrinus

Rudy Tasty Sandstorm wrote: »

Is he appointed by God for the current situation is more the question.
From a biblical perspective i would say yes.
There is no government appointment with God beijg involved.
Not to mention Cyrus who was mentioned by name in Isaiah a century before he appeared on the scene.
God refers to him as His Servant Cyrus!

His shepherd, actually.

But, more to the point, it's not likely that the passage concerned was written a century before Cyrus's own time. While large parts of the Book of Isaiah date from the 8th century BC, the reference to Cyrus occurs in a section which seems to have a much later composition date. It refers to the destruction of Jerusalem (586 BC) as a past event; its discussion of the destruction is not framed as a prophecy of what will happen, but as a reflection upon, and explanation of, something that has happened. In this section, the restoration of Jerusalem is prophesied, but its destruction is merely observed to have occurred.

Further, Is 44:28 mentions Cyrus not as someone who will be called the shepherd of the Lord, but as someone who already is. Cyrus is spoken of as someone who is already around, and who will in time accomplish various things.

Plus, the section concerned does not claim to be the work of Isaiah or indeed mention him at all, in marked distinction to the earlier part of the Book of Isaiah.

Cyrus conquered the Persian empire in 539 BC and permitted the Jews to return to Jerusalem, thus ending the Babylonian exile. Construction of the Second Temple began two years later, in 537 BC and it was completed and dedicated about 20 years after that. So this section of the Book of Isaiah likely dates from the period when the Temple was being rebuilt and Jerusalem was being restored.

uck51js9zml2yt

Or it could just be that Isaiah was a prophet and exercised his function and in doing so transcended time as he spoke of things to come.

Ash.J.Williams

I've things to say about this but do not have the intellect....maybe later..

Peregrinus

Rudy Tasty Sandstorm wrote: »

Or it could just be that Isaiah was a prophet and exercised his function and in doing so transcended time as he spoke of things to come.

He does speak about things to come. We know he's dong that when he uses the future tense to make predictions. When he speaks of things in terms that suggest they are currently happening or have already happened, he uses the present and past tenses. Those are not prophecies.

Manach

Not really. He has not continued the rather problematic confrontational stance that Clinton has nor has he seemly used the level of drone warfare that Obama used. When looking at books such as Brand's strategy, the has his share of mis-steps but so have all US presidents.

The_Valeyard

His hair might be, in disguise....

Peregrinus

If it is, it's a very bad disguise.

realitykeeper

Nick Park wrote: »

A beast, rather than the beast.

Well then, perhaps he and the White House will feature in the sequel of Fantastic beasts and where to find them.

The_Valeyard

Peregrinus wrote: »

If it is, it's a very bad disguise.

That's what makes it so good.

realitykeeper

Peregrinus wrote: »

Is Trump the Beast?
Trump is not Greek

I don`t think he has seven heads and ten horns either but perhaps if we go deeper ...

learn_more

Would be a bit ironic if he was because it was the Bible Belt states that voted for him.

endacl

I dunno. I always imagined the beast to be smarter and good-looking in a kinda hispanic, slicked-back hair kinda way...

smacl

endacl wrote: »

I dunno. I always imagined the beast to be smarter and good-looking in a kinda hispanic, slicked-back hair kinda way...

Unfair stereotyping...

JohnMc1

realitykeeper wrote: »

Donald Trump said he would make peace with Russia before he got elected and now he seems to be picking a fight with them.
In Daniel 8:25 it says:
And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also ...
By promising peace with Russia in order to get elected, he used peace as a tool. The question now is how many will he destroy?

Were you worried about this when Hilary sold Russia 20% of US Uranium deposits?

sunny2004

The OPs quote applies to many in history..
Hitler, helped his country and killled many..

Its silly to associate quotes from a long time ago onto modern people, the mould fits many

Owdetojoy

realitykeeper wrote: »

Donald Trump said he would make peace with Russia before he got elected and now he seems to be picking a fight with them.
In Daniel 8:25 it says:
And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also ...
By promising peace with Russia in order to get elected, he used peace as a tool. The question now is how many will he destroy?

He is forced to apply sanctions due to the Crimea take over. In additions he is being investigated for colluding with the Russians to wind the election , so he cannot be seen to be too close to Russia. As a farmer I am not allowed to sell beef to Russia, so its costing me a lot.

Owdetojoy

realitykeeper wrote: »

Really? So you are saying you think Trump will destroy nobody during his tenure? Even benign presidents have done that. Also, I am merely asking the question: Is Trump the beast. I am not necessarily saying he is.

He has not done too much harm yet. He has to deal with a hostile media, Democratic party and part of the GOP party. Who could handle that?. There is terrible corruption and he claims to be working to end it. I wish him luck.

branie2

He could be

branie2

While we're on the subject of the beast, this is the 666th thread that I've subscribed to!

uck51js9zml2yt

branie2 wrote: »

While we're on the subject of the beast, this is the 666th thread that I've subscribed to!

You really need to get a life

Thinkingaboutit

Some consider POTUS beastly, but he certainly is not the Beast. Take my word for it.:pac:

Terrlock

Trump gives us a temporary reprieve to get ourselves sorted.

The world will get scarier after his time as past.

monnies

Breadsons wrote: »

Obama is not done yet, he will come back again probably as some global leader of the UN or something like that

11 Years 11 Months 11 Weeks and 11 days prior to Barack Obama's date of birth was 8th June 1949 the date that George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four was published.

https://www.timeanddate.com/date/dateadded.html?d1=8&m1=6&y1=1949&type=add&ay=11&am=11&aw=11&ad=11&rec=

don't be delusional
trump is sending obongo to jail in guantanamo bay , along with hillary and bill clinton and all other satanic traitors

Autochange

Trump threatened to use the THAAD missile defense system to shoot down Santa Claus

Breadsons

K.Flyer wrote: »

When Obama first got elected the amount of people that came out saying he was The Last, The Anti-Christ the this and that The End is Nigh and quoting biblical passages to bolster their theories.
Before him it was J.W. Bush was the bringer of the end.. now it's Trump's turn.
Yes, one day you may be right, but please folks, for now, get on and enjoy life and stop wasting your time on cockamamy theories.

Obama is not done yet, he will come back again probably as some global leader of the UN or something like that

11 Years 11 Months 11 Weeks and 11 days prior to Barack Obama's date of birth was 8th June 1949 the date that George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four was published.

https://www.timeanddate.com/date/dateadded.html?d1=8&m1=6&y1=1949&type=add&ay=11&am=11&aw=11&ad=11&rec=

monnies

Autochange wrote: »

Trump threatened to use the THAAD missile defense system to shoot down Santa Claus

better than obongo sending santa claus to the clinton/weinstein assault island

monnies

Breadsons wrote: »

Obama is not done yet, he will come back again probably as some global leader of the UN or something like that

11 Years 11 Months 11 Weeks and 11 days prior to Barack Obama's date of birth was 8th June 1949 the date that George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four was published.

https://www.timeanddate.com/date/dateadded.html?d1=8&m1=6&y1=1949&type=add&ay=11&am=11&aw=11&ad=11&rec=

forget about it, he will have to get through Trump's army first, that is millions of men from neraly every country,
not gonna happen,
the tide has turned

Autochange

monnies wrote: »

better than obongo sending santa claus to the clinton/weinstein assault island

10/10 for randomness anyway.

Kanye West 2020

monnies

Autochange wrote: »

10/10 for randomness anyway.

Kanye West 2020

with all due respect ths is the christianty forum,
kanye west-degenerate

4068ac1elhodqr

FaceZucker 2020 (the start of Skynet).

Autochange

Koa Elegant Stag wrote: »

FaceZucker 2020 (the start of Skynet).

We had a good run. Let the computers take over

looksee

This 'beast' discussion has about as much to do with Christianity as the Bible Code or Bible Numerology. It is conspiracy theory stuff that cheapens and distracts from faith much more than any atheist arguments ever would.

4068ac1elhodqr

looksee wrote: »

This 'beast' discussion has about as much to do with Christianity as....

...the Bible itself?

Daniel 7:3-7 - "And four great beasts were coming up from the sea, different from one another. "The first was like a lion and had the wings of an eagle. I kept looking until its wings were plucked, and it was lifted up from the ground and made to stand on two feet like a man; a human mind also was given to it^. "And behold, another beast, a second one, resembling a bear. And it was raised up on one side, and three ribs were in its mouth between its teeth; and thus they said to it, 'Arise, devour much meat!' read more.

Revelation 11:7 - When they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up out of the abyss will make war with them, and overcome them and kill them.

Revelation 13:1 - And the dragon stood on the sand of the seashore. Then I saw a beast coming up out of the sea, having ten horns and seven heads, and on his horns were ten diadems, and on his heads were blasphemous names.

Revelation 17:3 - And he carried me away in the Spirit into a wilderness; and I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast, full of blasphemous names, having seven heads and ten horns.

Image Of The Beast - Revelation 13:15 - And it was given to him to give breath± to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed.

Mark Of The Beast - Revelation 13:16-17 - And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead,

Mark Of The Beast On Forehead - Revelation 13:17 - and he provides that no one will be able§ to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.

...The whole thing about 10 horns and 7 heads and controlling §trade may indicate it to be a organisation/group (rather than a single individual). The entity could be given a ^human like mind or ± living breath via, AI.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Bizarre question to pose.

A year on and the wounds are still raw. People really need to get over his election.

JohnMc1

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

A year on and the wounds are still raw. People really need to get over his election.

The same people that can't get over Trump winning are the same people who couldn't get over W winning [plus it was the same people who said they would leave the US if Bush won and surprise never did] Yet these had the nerve to beg Conservatives to give Obama a chance. They should be begging one side to give their candidate a favor when they're unwilling to do the same when the other side wins.

mdebets

JohnMc1 wrote: »

The same people that can't get over Trump winning are the same people who couldn't get over W winning [plus it was the same people who said they would leave the US if Bush won and surprise never did] Yet these had the nerve to beg Conservatives to give Obama a chance. They should be begging one side to give their candidate a favor when they're unwilling to do the same when the other side wins.

The same people that now say we should get over Trump's election are the same people who for 8 years whined constantly, that Obama was the wrong president, was Muslim and not even born in the US.

JohnMc1

mdebets wrote: »

The same people that now say we should get over Trump's election are the same people who for 8 years whined constantly, that Obama was the wrong president, was Muslim and not even born in the US.

I was none of that. Nice attempt at deflection though. A failure,but still an attempt.

Autochange

Riddle me this. You are all only Christians because of the location on the planet you were born. If you were born in the middle East you would most likely be Muslim. Both groups can't be correct. Most likely neither are.

J C

Autochange wrote: »

Riddle me this. You are all only Christians because of the location on the planet you were born. If you were born in the middle East you would most likely be Muslim. Both groups can't be correct. Most likely neither are.

... and using the same (defective) logic ... if you were born in Ireland you would be a Roman Catholic ... NOT !!:)

Peregrinus

Autochange wrote: »

Riddle me this. You are all only Christians because of the location on the planet you were born. If you were born in the middle East you would most likely be Muslim. Both groups can't be correct. Most likely neither are.

I'm not seeing the riddle here.