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Wrestlemania 33 fallout thread *spoilers*

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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,534 ✭✭✭KKkitty


    8
    You have to feel sorry for Roman if he appears at Raw tonight. He better not have a promo organised because the fans will boo him out of it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,804 ✭✭✭A Brad Maddox Guy


    8
    DM_7 wrote: »
    On the mixed tag.

    Cena and Nikki are the feel good/ showbiz story from the show. The build required the faces to go over.

    The match was all about Cena and Nikki getting back at Miz and Maryse for all the jibes, piss taking. Job done imo.

    Miz can bounce back easily, like AJ did last year after losing to Jericho.

    They go over with the proposal, that's the feel good story. Whether Cena & Nikki win or lose the match they win the feud with the proposal since that's what a big crux of the story was; that Nikki wanted commitment but Cena didn't want to get married. I've no doubt Miz can bounce back easily, for all I know Miz could win a Fatal4Way #1 contender's match tomorrow and this is forgotten immediately. I just think it would have been an easier transition if they won while it wouldn't detract from the proposal at all.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,677 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    7
    Shane O Mac is brilliant. I thought he and AJ stole the show. The Jericho- Owens match was a let down. The Goldberg v Lesnar match was better than expected. It was good to see the Hardy Boys back. Incredible that Jeff is still doing those crazy spots at his age. As the commentator said he is a maniac!

    I felt sorry for Big show if the Battle Royal was his last match. Also what were they doing booking Braun Strowman like this, he had so much momentum built up in the last couple of months. I would have had a three way match between him, Reigns and Taker, if only to let the two young bucks do all the work. As last night Taker was suffering badly even with Reigns carrying him. However i guess taker is old school and wanted to put over the man Vince sees as the future main attraction of the company. I was a bit sad watching the end as he was my favourite wrestler. I first started watching him way back in his WCW days. I wonder will he get an official send off tonight on Raw.

    ... reliving some of my favourite Undertaker moments this afternoon.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBr_Kz2MCrk
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyANgDSO2DM


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,983 ✭✭✭✭PTH2009


    9
    going to remember this for the rest of the my life. Only CM Punk returning would beat that



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 42,429 Mod ✭✭✭✭Lord TSC


    8
    Just finished.

    Gave it a seven.

    I thought it was grand, but I don't know if it was special. And I feel for Wrestlemania, it should be more than "grand". I don't know if there's a specific moment, bar Taker at the end, that will be remembered in years to come. There were some nice moments, some cool moments, but I don't know if there were historic moments, outside of Taker's retirement.

    Mind, there wasn't anything bad at all. I agreed with 99% of the booking decisions over the night.

    Raw tonight, though, is where the smarks get their biggest show of the year :pac:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,877 ✭✭✭✭CastorTroy


    9
    Ok, I'll get teh important comments out of the way first.
    I enjoyed Nikki's Baywatch audition when she was running to the ring alongside Cena.
    I also appreciated the views from the back of HHH's bike. Steph looked great. If she dressed like that every week for Raw, she could be more tolerable. Wind blowing her hair also helped.

    Now for the rest of the show.
    For the preshow I'm not sure Booker T or Shwan cared enough about the SD women's match to know who was in it. When asked about who they think would win, they just said the current champ. How hard is it to say her name if they knew it.
    Are Luke Harper and Dean Ambrose wearing the same ring gear now?
    Think the last 3 for the battle royal made sense in a brand fairness way with a Raw, SD and NXT guy, but when it came to the final 2, it would work better if they could start a feud from it. But since Jinder and Mojo are different brands it wouldn't work. And I think this is a problem with a lot of Battle Royals these days. It's a way to start feuds but it rarely happens. Did like the security botch though.

    On the main show, Shane and AJ was a much better match than expected. On paper it should've been over right away with AJ's ability compared to Shane's, but they made it work. Even got the coast to coast.
    Hardys return was a great surprise and winning was great. Wonder how much of their TNA stuff they can do. I mean tthe whole Delete thing will need to be explained. TNA are probably seeing everyone doing the Delete gestures and all and thinking it would be great if all those people had actually watched their show.

    Really don't think Cena/Nikki should've won. They didn't need it. Especially with how over Miz clearly was. Even Miz seemed surprised.

    Great to Steph go through the table, in a comeuppance way.

    The SD women's match was far too short. Wonder if they were told to cut it short or if it was gonna be that length on the preshow as well. Was Becky dressed as the main character from Horizon Zero Dawn?

    The Taker match was not good. A lot of botches. That apparent tombstone reversal mess seemed to be caused by both guys. Taker for not being able to get his legs up and Reigns for not being able to lift him. I've seen instances before where Reigns has bitten off more than he can chew with regards lifting. He's not as strong as he or whoever teels him to do it thinks he is.
    I didn't like how Reigns was in the corner looking at Taker as if he couldn't believe what was happening and couldn't understand. It's the kind of thing that's usually reserved for veterans fighting the less expereinced guys. Like Taker fighting Shane and Shane not giving up and Taker getting respect for him. It doesn't work when the new guy is the one doing it.
    I agree Taker retiring now is a bit late but at the same time, I'm half thinking he left the coat and hat in the ring because he's going back to his American Badass gimmick. :)
    I would prefer him to be on Smackdown for any kind of send off he gets. But I know it'll be Raw and there's also a chance he'll tell Roman it's his yard now.
    There is also the possibility that he'll be the kind of guy he's known to be and just leave without wanting to break character by having such a send off and maybe turn up fo rHoF next year. Though kissing Michelle last night was breaking character anyway.



    One thing I really disliked about the long ramp was people in multio person matches having their entrances cut short. Just doesn't feel right. Like look at the SD women. All got cut short, but then Naomi comes out and gets hers all the way to the ring and beyond. Even went longer than planned since she seemed to be improvising at the end.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,680 ✭✭✭thesultan


    Very good mania, some great matches and how great was stephanie looking on her entrance with HHH?


  • Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭Ali Bomaye


    9
    Overall, I thought it was a very enjoyable show, and the first couple of hours of the main show absolutely flew by.

    Neville vs Aries was very good. I'm a big fan of both guys and thought the build was excellent. Pity this wasn't further up the card.
    Hated the finish to the battle royal, but at least we had that moment with the security trying to stop Gronk getting to the ring. Ambrose vs Corbin was just okay, glad it was on the pre show.

    Styles vs Shane was great. Before the match I hated the thought of Shane getting a lot of offense against AJ, but my god what a performance by Shane. That Shooting Star Press attempt was insane.

    Owens vs Jericho was very good, though it was in a difficult position on the card. The raw women's match was fine. Some nice spots but would have been so much better if it was Bayley and Charlotte one on one with Bayley stopping the PPV streak.

    I marked out like mad when the Hardy's music played and had a grin on my face from then until some point during the Rollins/HHH match. Incredible to see them back in the WWE. I hope they don't play up the Broken stuff too much. In TNA there was a long story arc that led to that character, and it reached its natural conclusion when they won the tag titles over there. I'm so happy to see the Hardy Boyz back, just not really interested in the Broken stuff anymore.

    The mixed tag was fairly poor. I liked the Miz playing up to the crowd early on and doing the Daniel Bryan kicks, but then Cena and Nikki just hit their moves and that was it.

    The HHH/Rollins match was decent, but it went on way too long. Found myself checking the time a lot during this and realising how late this thing could run. Typical HHH mania match really. Steph looked unreal.

    Wyatt vs Orton was an absolute disgrace. I hated their match at No Mercy, yet was still looking forward to this given the build. But this was a complete dud. Maybe the worst WWE Title match I've ever seen. A farce.

    Lesnar vs Goldberg was tremendous. Really this whole feud has been brilliant, and this was a great finish to it. I legit jumped out of my seat when Goldberg hit that first spear. It had the aura of a big time title fight and it delivered. Two proper stars.

    Smackdown women's match was fine. Was cool to see Naomi get to do her entrance. Bit of a nothing match really.

    The main event was sad to watch. Undertaker just can't go anymore. I'm a big fan of Reigns but this was a huge failure as a match, and Reigns looked like he knew it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,868 ✭✭✭Andersonisgod


    I'm not gonna go into too much detail so I'll sum it up with:

    Things I liked: Neville vs Aries was the best match tonight (I'd go 4.15). The set was spectacular and the production created a typicallyincredible spectacle. The Hardy's return was great, as was that massive pop. Kurt Angle appearing in front of the live crowd. The layout of the Goldberg vs Lesnar match. The post match Undertaker stuff.

    Things I didn't like: I can't remember the last time I hated the layout of a match more than Styles vs Shane (though a recent Thatcher vs Cobb match ran it close), the action was quite good but the layout of that match was the dirt worst for obvious reasons. Triple H vs Rollins sent the live crowd into a slumber from which they never really recovered. Orton vs Wyatt was insultingly bad and embarrassing for anyone who calls themself a wrestling fan. The booking of Reigns is either the dumbest booking of a top guy in a major company, or it's a continued attempt to turn him into the next "love him or hate him he provokes a reaction" main man but we've just seen 10 years of that with Cena and I'd really like something different. And, including the pre show, a 7 hour show is ridiculous, total overkill for even the most loyal WWE fans.

    All in all I enjoyed the show. Some good things, some bad things, 2 moments that cracked the mainstream (Cena's proposal and Taker's retirement) and ultimately, that's what Wrestlemania is really about so WWE will consider this a creative success.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,767 ✭✭✭Ben Gadot


    8
    Ali Bomaye wrote: »
    The main event was sad to watch. Undertaker just can't go anymore. I'm a big fan of Reigns but this was a huge failure as a match, and Reigns looked like he knew it.

    He shouldn't be too hard on himself as I think most wouldn't have done much better the way Taker is now. If he really was in tears backstage then I think Vince needs to cop on and do what's best for the bloke rather than what he thinks is best for his company.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 48,990 ✭✭✭✭Lithium93_


    9
    Pentecost wrote: »
    I'd say WWE are still figuring out what they can or want to do with the 'Broken' gimmick even if Matt owns it the WWE mightn't want the hassle of TNA taking action against them. Matt was shouting 'Wonderful!' when they came out and they gave a YouTube promo afterwards where he threw in some 'DELETE's. Plus Cole saying "things are about to become broken".

    Please, WWE will go all in with the Broken gimmick, if they run with it, do you really think TNA if they kicked up any fuss could pose any threat to WWE in a courtroom, and besides Matt himself tweeted that the whole Broken gimmick is his intellectual property AND NOT TNA's.


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    8
    exactly my feelings on Pitbull


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,440 ✭✭✭Chip Whitley


    8
    I thought it was a good Mania, at times verging on very good so I gave it a 7.

    The 2 things I felt they got really wrong were:
    Orton winning. The commentators were putting over that Wyatt has become more powerful since Randy burned down the compound but Orton didn't realise it and underestimated Wyatt early on. The visual projections were great I thought and should have spooked Randy more, to the point of distraction and a loss. That way their overall story would have been; Wyatt converts Orton, Orton comes to his senses, Orton plays the long game and earns Wyatts trust, Orton makes sure he's the only 'family' member left before the betrayal, the betrayal weakens Wyatt, but Wyatt uses it to becomes stronger, Ortons plan backfires and he loses. Then we have a stronger Wyatt going forward as champ.

    The other thing from last night that I felt was wrong was not having Reigns actually completely dismantle and destroy Taker. To the point of the match being called off. The problem is they won't turn Reigns heel, which means (imo) they've watered down Takers last match, Reigns is neither over as a heel or a face now and Taker has finished off his career in a match that never felt like an all out war yet they were both reacting to each other like it was.

    Happy to see the Hardyz back, but Matt was himself in all the post-match stuff, not Broken Matt, so I hope WWE haven't already ruined what was one of the most entertaining things in wrestling.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,534 ✭✭✭KKkitty


    8
    How would ye have booked The Undertaker's last match?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭johnnysmack


    8

    Happy to see the Hardyz back, but Matt was himself in all the post-match stuff, not Broken Matt, so I hope WWE haven't already ruined what was one of the most entertaining things in wrestling.

    He seems broken in this

    https://youtu.be/UVz71YzHvw0


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,018 ✭✭✭✭CSF


    4
    Last night might have been the final nail in their ever being able to get Reigns over as a face.

    He's going to make such an effective heel, in that people are going to be so eager to see faces get one over him. But I can't see the heel turn being the end of people complaining endlessly about how ridiculously strong he is booked.

    Their best bet may well be to use Reigns going forward as the HHH to your Austin/Rock. So really they need to figure out who that's going to be.

    Somewhere down the line, he may get some nostalgic sentiment in the way that Cena has over the last year (up until this tagging with Nikki thing at least), but if they actively use a heel run to get him over as a face (and they almost certainly will), then people will reject that completely.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,054 ✭✭✭D.Q


    CSF wrote: »
    Last night might have been the final nail in their ever being able to get Reigns over as a face.

    He's going to make such an effective heel, in that people are going to be so eager to see faces get one over him. But I can't see the heel turn being the end of people complaining endlessly about how ridiculously strong he is booked.

    Their best bet may well be to use Reigns going forward as the HHH to your Austin/Rock. So really they need to figure out who that's going to be.

    Somewhere down the line, he may get some nostalgic sentiment in the way that Cena has over the last year (up until this tagging with Nikki thing at least), but if they actively use a heel run to get him over as a face (and they almost certainly will), then people will reject that completely.

    Reigns Balor?


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,018 ✭✭✭✭CSF


    4
    Balor is definitely a reasonable shout if they're willing to go all-in with him. They booked him very strong on his arrival but they also booked Kevin Owens very strong at the beginning before taking some of the steam away, so it'd be interesting to see where he'd be now if he hadn't gotten injured.

    Kind of scary that it's hard to see too many obvious alternatives for the future face of the company. Like you know in Vince's head he's looking at someone like Big Cass but that's kind of repeating the mistakes that gave Reigns no real hope of ever being what they wanted.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 24,774 Mod ✭✭✭✭Loughc


    8
    Couple of things I fear, I don't think we'll ever see a Reigns heel turn. Vince sticks to his guns when he wants to make a new Cena mega face.

    I also fear Vince won't push Balor as strong due to him getting injured. Vince always believes the smaller wrestler get injured more that's one of the reasons he always gravitates towards the bigger guys.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,929 ✭✭✭kopite386


    8
    I would give it a 7.5 as I felt it was more than a 7 but not quite an 8 but seeing as the poll didn't do halves I gave it a solid 7.
    I didn't see the preshow so can't comment on that but what a let down for Dean Ambrose after being a main event last year with Lesnar to be put on the preshow this year
    AJ V Shane - was much better than I expected it to be and for me was the match of the night. That coast to coast and then the attempted shooting star press wow. Thought at times the match could go either way

    Raw Women's Championship - I have to agree with what others said it would have been more special if Bayley won the championship for the first time at wrestlemania and thus ending her undefeated PPV streak as a solo wrestler but still happy Bayley retained and i think we now need Charlotte to step away from the championship scene for a while

    KO Vs Y2J - was meh for me after all the build up I was expecting more just wasn't that great for me in all honesty not that it was bad either

    Tag Team championship match - I avoided all spoilers so it came to a complete shock to me that the Hardy Boyz were back what a moment that was especially after thinking we were going to end up the New Day in there. And Jeff Hardy with that jump off the ladder onto Cesaro along with Shane they are two of the maddest men in WWE fearless jumping off anything. Vintage Jeff Hardy going to the top rung of the ladder and jumping off onto someone.

    Goldberg Vs Brock - Right ending good match for the length of time haha all they did was produce their finishing moves - what was it 5 minutes

    Cena & Nikki Vs Miz & Maryse - I actually enjoyed the match the mind games from Miz at the start and then Nikki setting Maryse up for the double nuckle shuffle then the rack attack 2.0 AND I also enjoyed the proposal, I do wonder though if it was a complete shock but either way it was a nice moment

    Randy V Bray - Another meh match for me it just wasn't a great match at all

    Smackdown womens championship - I knew from the moment Naoimi got that long entrance that I felt just wouldn't end that she would end up winning and with it being her hometown hopefully she doesn't hold it for long - I was hoping Becky would win it but heres hoping they push her for another championship run

    HHH Vs Rollins - good decent match Rollins really sold the knee problem which will probably be fine tonight, sorry to say it but Steph going through the table was the highlight for me - I just found it so funny

    Taker V Roman - Sad to see Taker retire and I agree he should of retired when his streak was broken. I know he was only a part timer that came out every​ wrestlemania season but still he will be missed. And for him to break character. I wonder if he will be given a farewell tonight for if last night was it. I was thinking before the match Jesus its going to take him the length of the match just to walk down the ramp but smart to have him walk halfway and have the stage lift thing haha :D


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,847 ✭✭✭764dak


    Al Roker mispronounced Maryse.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭lycan238


    9
    I voted 8/10

    Good points in my opinion were as follows:
    New Day Swerve. Coming out before the Raw Tag Team Title Match and announcing it was now a fatal 4 way with Woods and Kofi dressed to wrestle made this believable. Then the Hardy Boyz music hits. Wow what a reaction. I wonder if recent events led to New Day not wrestling at all last night?
    Kurt Angle pop: When he came out at the end of the Hall of Fame class of 2017 the crowd gave him a great reception.
    Entrances: HHH's I enjoyed minus the sirens which made me annoyed, Seth's in the same match was also good, Naomi's entrance was good as well I enjoyed it and finally Undertakers entrance which I assume started half way down the ramp certainly looked like it.
    Taker vs Roman: I actually enjoyed this match mainly as I was listening to the commentary mostly rather than watching the match. JR put Roman over more in one match than WWE have done in three years in my book. A big opportunity was missed in this match though. If they did the spear through the barricade spot in this match instead of Goldberg/Lesnar and after about ten seconds the lights go out. Gong goes a few times then lights come back on and Taker is standing in ring. Do that a few times then Roman looses it and beats Taker up. Finish match like they did with Roman running ropes into a super spear for the 1-2-3.
    Other matches: Shane/AJ and Y2K/KO were 2 very good matches the rest good to very good. I need to rewatch pre show as I can't remember those matches other than that god awful security botch.

    I do agree however if Undertaker does hang around on screen it should be as the American Bad Ass rather than the deadman but his career as an active wrestler is certainly over baring maybe one or two appearances as maybe Team Coach for Survivor Series Teams etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 48,990 ✭✭✭✭Lithium93_


    9
    Undertaker's entrance did start at halfway down the ramp, took him 5:23 to walk to the ring.


  • Registered Users Posts: 45,552 ✭✭✭✭Mr.Nice Guy


    8
    I would give it a 7/10. I think it will go down as one of the most memorable Manias ever, but the match quality wasn't on a par with classic Manias and along with the excessive length, that hurt it overall. To me, it was a show notable more for non-match reasons.

    Neville/Aries - I thought this was a good match. It would have been more engrossing on the main show. I thought Aries broke his neck the way he landed on that German suplex. That was scary.

    Battle Royal - Disappointing. They were looking for the mainstream publicity so I guess from that perspective it did what it was supposed to do. So many geeks at the end though.

    Ambrose/Corbin - Real let-down. Not even good enough for a Smackdown show. Really don't see what people see in Corbin and I feel Ambrose is very overrated.

    Styles/Shane - This match pissed me off. In the Attitude Era, Shane-O-Mac was never presented as a badass. 'Shane's a p*ssy' was the usual chant from the crowd. When a match was made by a babyface, say Foley or Linda, pitting Rock vs Shane, the crowd got excited because it was a chance for Rock to lay the smackdown on the weak link of the McMahon/Helmsley faction. The whole 'Shane: The Giantkiller' shtick was tongue-in-cheek. Yeah, he fell off things, did crazy sh*t, but he wasn't supposed to be on a par with top calibre wrestlers.

    Now fast forward to today where the guy is pushing fifty and suddenly he's able to go out there and hold his own against one of the best wrestlers in the world in a wrestling match? Get the f*ck out of here. And the fact that the fans didn't boo this out of the building, but will boo a guy like Reigns who has far more of an upside for this business that the nepotism of the McMahon egomaniacs, tells you all you need to know about what's wrong with the business today. Whoop de doo. Shane hit a shooting star press. Now please go away.

    Jericho/Owens - underwhelming. Some people wanted this as a main event of Mania. Yikes.

    Raw Women's match - was alright. This would have been much better if Bayley had been chasing the title. The decision to have her win before Mania I find baffling.

    Raw Tag Match - The return of the Hardys was my favourite moment of the show. I really hope they sort out the legal situation so they can fully use their characters; it seems they are doing a hybrid, part Broken thing at the minute to be safe. Match was fun.

    Cena/Nikki vs Miz and Maryse - The match wasn't much but the booking was correct. I thought the way Cena did it was tremendous. Got a kick out of the women going bonkers for it as well.

    HHH vs Rollins - Selfless Hunter got his big entrance. Yay. I thought this match was largely a snoozefest. For someone who the writers constantly tell us is one of the all time greats on a par with Hogan, Rock, Austin, and Cena, the fans sure care about his matches a lot less than the others.

    Wyatt vs Orton - This was another disappointment and again some people wanted this on last. The graphic on the canvas was pretty goofy. Orton wins so I guess Wyatt is back to being an upper mid card act again,

    Goldberg vs Lesnar - Finally some great action after the last few duds. I thought this was fantastic. The smarks sh*t all over Goldberg the last few weeks but he put on a better Mania spectacle than Ambrose, Owens, and several other darlings. I've really enjoyed his return and I hope we see him again down the line.

    SD Women's Match - Tough spot. Fine for what it was.

    Taker vs Reigns - For Taker's last match this had to go on last. Can't believe some were complaining about its position. I wanted a Reigns heel turn going in, not knowing it was Taker's last bout, but with it being his last one you couldn't have Reigns go heel to win because then Taker would have needed a revenge match. They booked it the way they should have. Saw some complaints about Reigns going over but no way Taker was leaving with a win. Not his style. I thought the match was okay, a few dodgy moments. Taker does look old now. He struggled with The Last Ride. I think it's time he left.

    Overall, a good Mania. It didn't have the classic match that would have put it on another level, and it would have benefitted from fewer matches, but I thought they booked it well and it sets up things well for Raw.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,348 ✭✭✭✭ricero


    9
    This wont be a popular opinion but i thought roman reigns looked like a big deal last night and that he belonged in the main event. If he was to adjust a few aspects of his character and in-ring ability he would be a proper star


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,534 ✭✭✭KKkitty


    8
    I'm just wondering if Roman doesn't mind being booed at all?


  • Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I'd give the show 4.17 overall.

    Sickened that the one spoiler I had today was the Hardys return. Hadnt followed for a few weeks so Angle was food to see (the crowd's reaction was priceless), as was JR coming out for the main event.
    Brock and Goldberg was all it could've been. Really, really didn't need the belt involved.
    Shane showing that he can put on far better matches than he has any right to :p
    Orton and the other boring lad was boring.
    Reigns was Reigns. The immediacy of the boos as soon as his music hits ia impressive though.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 24,774 Mod ✭✭✭✭Loughc


    8
    KKkitty wrote: »
    I'm just wondering if Roman doesn't mind being booed at all?

    If I was getting paid what he is I wouldn't give a damn.

    They're at least reacting to him. If the audience stayed silent or refused to watch the product as he's main eventing that would speak volumes more. But as they're booing and still buying the product Vince doesn't care.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,877 ✭✭✭✭CastorTroy


    9
    I was following along here today while watching rather than reading the whole thread after, so had JR's return spoiled by ones posting things like "wonder if this is the match JR is commentating" well before Taker's match as hadn't read he was coming back


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,680 ✭✭✭thesultan


    Stephanie looked like a rock godess. Hope the fall into the table will not have her absent from Raw.


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