Help Needed with Rescue Dog

geraldinec

Our rescue dog is agressive and uncontrolable on a lead. Any advice? He is a Huskie/Shepherd and is over 2.5 years old. We brought him to training classes to then be advised that he is anxious and need to have one to one at a cost of €75 per hour. We are struggling to deal with his behaviour as he manages to get out of his Halti and muzzle. He is agressive towards dogs and humans. As he is 39Kg, he is extremely difficult to control when he gets out. We have tried all the usual advice, treats, short lead, etc but there is no communicting with him once he leaves our house. The previous owners loved him but decided to give him to the pound, now I understand why. They obviously struggled the way we are now. We need help as we don't want to let this lovely dog down. He is a loving dog in the house, but a nightmare out of the house. We are afraid he will hurt someone when out, so really need good solid advice soon. Training with a professional is so expensive, is there no help for people who rescue dogs, other than people making money off them at an extortionate rate?

Bredabe

We had this, dog training sorted it eventually, there are lots of video's on this subject on youtube,tho you would need to exercise discretion on the methods you see, not all are kind or suitable for your dog's personality.

Bells21

geraldinec wrote:

Our rescue dog is agressive and uncontrolable on a lead. Any advice?

Hi Op, perhaps providing a little more information might make it easier for people to offer help/advice. Is your dog lunging at other dogs as the walk past, is it when dogs/people approach? Is your dog pulling on the lead when walking?

geraldinec

He is pulling on the lead for a start. Then when he sees a dog and sometimes people is lunging, barking, jumping in the air, pulling the muzzle & Halti off with paws.

peasant

You might have to start working with a harness and two leads.

A halti really isn't designed as sole fixing point for the lead, more like remote control for steering.

A good harness with a strong lead gives good control and enables you to hold even a 40 kg dog. The halti can then be used for the fine work.

Also, get the dog used to wearing all this gear by putting it on for short periods in the house without going anywhere.
Once the association with lead+halti = action is made it is hard to get in a cool training session because the dog is already wound up before you even leave the house. So try getting him to a point where putting on the gear is regarded as normal and unexciting first, then train in your garden or a quiet area without distractions before going back to your usual haunts.

Getting a dog to walk on the lead nicely can be a long process when starting from where you are at right now (been there, done that years ago) and one occasion where he flips out can undo a week's work of good behaviour.

It will take time and patience.

tk123

A one-on-one session with a good behaviourist will trump any group classes you do so worth the investment if you can afford it. Check http://apdt.ie/index.php/find-a-trainer/ to find on in your area. I've had a couple of sessions with Emmaline from http://www.citizencanineireland.com for different issues that I needed help working on and found her fantastic.

Did you take him from the pound or was it a rescue - if it was a rescue I'd reaching out to them to see if they can offer any support?

Also if he's able to get the muzzle off you may need to up your game and get one that can be fixed more securely like a baskerville ultra eg http://www.petcara.ie/dog/dog-muzzles/plastic-dog-muzzles/baskerville-ultra-muzzle

geraldinec

How long did it take?

JamboMac

Dogs like these need a strong leader that they trust, he see's it as his job to protect you from others. So I think you may need training also. The one on one would probably point out the issues. When I walk our rescue dog he walks normally, when my parents talk of walks with him they claim he constantly pulls.

This dog clearly sees himself as the leader and that's the role you need to take back.

geraldinec

We rescused from a rescue centre that had previously rescued him from the pound. He was only with the rescue centre no more than a week, but was very wound up when we got him. Their support when the dog bit me at the early stages was either that they would take him back or they put us in touch with a dog behaviourist. We contacted that behaviourist who charges €130 for first consultation and €50 per hour thereafter. Bearing in mind that I had just bought the dog €130 , his kennell which he never uses €130, his bowls, food, toys, two different leads, collar, Fido registration, name tag, I just don't want to keep spending. I haven't got it to be honest.

geraldinec

We will try these training tips, thanks. Will keep you posted.

JamboMac

I fully understand that, but it would realistically be difficult for any of us to give you accurate advice. Leads and so on won't change his behaviour, they are merely tools. The biting thing is something that would worry me about a dog, as to why he would fear you I'm assuming the bite was from.

peasant

geraldinec wrote: »

How long did it take?

It didn't take too long to get him from total chaos to sort of manageable (the halti was hung up forever after abut ten trips with two leads) ..the fine work to presentable and trustworthy took months though...but we both learned a lot about each other during that period.

But really...if you can find a good trainer, that's the way to go...makes it so much easier to understand the basics and eliminate unconscius mistakes that you might be making.

Back in the day when we had problems with our rescue dog, good trainers where few and far between...far (away) being the biggest problem for us, so we had to fend for ourselves.

geraldinec

We had him a few weeks, he was out of sorts, rumbly tummy. He was lying at my legs, so I bent down to cuddle him (feeling sorry for him) from behind and he swung his head around and snapped my face. It snap drew blood a left a scar but having researched it online, I blame myslef because I hadn't the experience to know to leave him alone when he was sick.

peasant

geraldinec wrote: »

..there is no communicting with him once he leaves our house.

Have you a secure garden that he can't get out of?
If so, bring him out there often. Play with him, train recall (bribe him with food or whatever else he likes if he's not a foodie) make yourself the center of his universe (as a food dispenser, ball thrower, cuddle giver...whatever makes him happy)...in short, get a good "outside" relationship with him as well, not just indoors.
Once you have that, start introducing halti,harness and finally after a few sessions put him on the lead ...all while still in the garden, all while still playing / having fun.

Once that works to satisfaction, start taking him outside again. Start with quiet areas / quiet times and increase the level of interaction as and when he seems to cope.

If you don't have (or can create) a secure garden ...try and find something similar close by.

Nody

JamboMac wrote: »

Dogs like these need a strong leader that they trust, he see's it as his job to protect you from others. So I think you may need training also. The one on one would probably point out the issues. When I walk our rescue dog he walks normally, when my parents talk of walks with him they claim he constantly pulls.

This dog clearly sees himself as the leader and that's the role you need to take back.

No; you are so wrong I wish I could go smack a certain American dog trainer around for keeping on spreading these lies.

He does not see himself as a leader; nor does he know what a Alpha dog is, needs to be pushed over to show him who's boss or have people eat in front of him before being served and he has zero need to dominate a pack. Why? Because the whole Alpha dog / pack theory / wolf history has not only been proven to be utterly wrong inc. by the author of the theory in the first place but it does not even apply to wolfs! Yet a certain American TV show host with zero qualification is still spouting it as gospel and people believe it to be true because it's said on tv.

What is however the case is that OP has a dog who's not been socialised properly and who is afraid of other dogs due to this. Hence acting out and being aggressive as a way to keep those scary things away from them at all cost. Add in that it's a highly intelligent breed who're easily bored and known escape artists it does not make his life easy. He needs a lot of training for lead but he also needs training to challenge his mind; have a look around here for tricks you can teach your dog and keep adding to the list because this mental exhaust will also help him calm down beyond pure physical walks.

JamboMac

Nody wrote: »

No; you are so wrong I wish I could go smack a certain American dog trainer around for keeping on spreading these lies.

He does not see himself as a leader; nor does he know what a Alpha dog is, needs to be pushed over to show him who's boss or have people eat in front of him before being served and he has zero need to dominate a pack. Why? Because the whole Alpha dog / pack theory / wolf history has not only been proven to be utterly wrong inc. by the author of the theory in the first place but it does not even apply to wolfs! Yet a certain American TV show host with zero qualification is still spouting it as gospel and people believe it to be true because it's said on tv.

What is however the case is that OP has a dog who's not been socialised properly and who is afraid of other dogs due to this. Hence acting out and being aggressive as a way to keep those scary things away from them at all cost. Add in that it's a highly intelligent breed who're easily bored and known escape artists it does not make his life easy. He needs a lot of training for lead but he also needs training to challenge his mind; have a look around here for tricks you can teach your dog and keep adding to the list because this mental exhaust will also help him calm down beyond pure physical walks.

Who said anything about pushing anybody over, an alpha in a dogs mind is somebody who is confident and knows what they are doing without losing it, just coz your opinion differs doesn't make me wrong. Dogs trust confident people and will become confident in its surrounding's with that person. the simplest way to put is alpha as the vast majority of people understand this.

Alpha has never meant aggressive or dominant to me, just confident.

peasant

JamboMac wrote: »

Dogs trust confident people and will become confident in its surrounding's with that person.

Nearly correct:D
Dogs trust people they have learned to have confidence in.
The person themselves needn't necessarily be confident...but to the dog's mind the person's actions towards the dog need to be predictable, justified and reliable...in other words...confidence instilling.

Once dogs have that trust it becomes possible to work with them.
When you raise a dog from a pup this is a fairly easy process, gradual and natural (unless you really f*ck the dog about)

With a fully grown rescue who doesn't know you from Adam and who has previous experience of what is trustworthy and what isn't, it's a bit more difficult and at times quite hard work.

JamboMac

peasant wrote: »

Dogs trust people they have learned to have confidence in.
The person themselves needn't necessarily be confident...but to the dog's mind the person's actions towards the dog need to be predictable, justified and reliable...in other words...confidence instilling.

Nearly correct:D

Won't have one without the other. If i am predictable to my dog, but not confident when outside meeting a new situation outside, the dog will be able to tell, simple's.

Love the condescension though.:rolleyes:

peasant

Yes, there is of course the element of "insecurity travelling down the lead" ...but all this doesn't really help the OP much.

You can be as self assured, confident and "Alpha" as you like...if your dog is insecure/untrained/poorly socialised/distrusting of you you have to fix that first.
Only then can you have the confidence to act confidently around your dog.
No point in being/acting "alpha" when at the bottom of your heart you know that the dog is going to loose all coherence around the next corner.

geraldinec

Well, I've been to the pet shop, bought a new harness with double lead. I will take the advice, try train him in the garden and build the fun side of our relationship before taking on the long stressful walks. It's hard to be a confident secure dog owner, when we rescued such a pain in the ass, that carries on like a psycho dog. At least I feel like someone is prepared to give advice and good advice I might say, without charging us a mint. I believe you both are correct, it's the dog but it's us too. His behaviour is out of control, and our reaction to it is not helping. Here's hoping we have the guts and patience to stick with it, that he doesn't hurt anyone and that in a couple of months time, I will be back on to say "Hey, anyone need advice on Rescue Dogs, I can help you".....Free of Charge!

peasant

Small steps is the secret to success ...both for him and for you.

And praise ...tons of praise for every little single thing that he does right. Don't take good behaviour for granted (not for a good while anyway) but give constant reassurance for whatever it is that he is doing right ..try to ignore bad behaviour as much as possible (because you can make many mistakes when "giving out" including inadvertently re-enforcing bad behaviour ...but you can hardly ever go wrong with praise)

He needs to learn and understand that he is most loved and appreciated when he's a good boy...eventually he will try and figure out what it is that he needs to do to earn that praise...and that's when he'll really open up to training.

As for correction:
As I said ..try to ignore as much as possible, but when you really have to say something ..don't shout, don't yell, don't rattle off whole tirades...try and stick to a short, disapproving "aah-aah" and then move right on.

Good luck

linema81

Hi There,

we had very similar situation with our dog, she is also rescued, no trust for humans and other dogs except our other dog, as he was living with us since she come to our home, so they both getting very well.At first i would recommend to get Haity pulling control harness, i only know 2 places selling them dogs trust and Pets shop at Charlestown Shopping Centre. We tried couple different dog trainers but all where the same, so no solution made. So we took training into our control once we got these harness. Before you take out you need also be come and trust your dog, dog feels your anxiety and worry all he is doing protecting you. Dont let dog to feel your worry before you go for a walks, try to keep him close to you and if he sees dogs or other human just pull him near you distract his look and make to look at you. I know its tuff to get train your dog but its worth it. It took me nearly 2 years to train our dog, she still not socialising with other dogs, but at least we can walk her on a lead knowing she would not bark or attack people ( old people as she was beaten by older person) or other dogs. I

Ms Doubtfire1

1 thing springs out: this is a HUSKY * GSD. Both working breeds. So get him to work. Have you ever heard of dry land mushing? Muddypaws on here has huskies and I'm sure she may be able to give you advise re your boy.

linema81

All i wish is pation, training and control, eventully he will be trained and change his attitude. Just to remember there is no bad dogs, its only wrong techniques we approach for dogs. Do a bit of research online its plenty of advise and try to train. All the best with your pet

sillysmiles

The other thing to bear in mind is that he can from a home, dumped in pound, moved to a rescue centre and then to your house. It could take time for him to trust that you aren't going to abandon him too. Also, he possibly needs to burn off a lot of excess energy! It is impossbile to do any training if he is hyped up and wired - like trying to teach a 5 year old fine motor skills while bouncing off the walls.

Patience patience patience - you will get there and once you do, you will be the centre of that dogs world.

Ashbx

Ms Doubtfire1 wrote: »

1 thing springs out: this is a HUSKY * GSD. Both working breeds. So get him to work. Have you ever heard of dry land mushing? Muddypaws on here has huskies and I'm sure she may be able to give you advise re your boy.

Another thing you could try is putting a backpack on the dog. You may need to work on managing the aggressiveness first as this is not going to solve the problem. But as Ms. Doubtfire said, they are both working breeds and putting a backpack with a bit of weight in it gives them something to do.

I tend to use backpacks on my two dogs if we are going for a "boring" walk (i.e. just walking on the lead around the roads). I find they are more focused and tires them out so much more!

muddypaws

Whereabouts are you OP?

deadlybuzzman

As was pointed out to me by a guy that has IPO GSDs, you'd be all day trying to tire out a dog like that just by walking and even then you'll probably fail.
What he does and it worked great for us for burning off energy is just to play ball with 2 tennis balls using a throwing stick. Throw a ball one way, dog sprints that way, throw the other ball the other way dog sprints that way.
Maybe he brings it back maybe he doesn't but 10-30 mins of that will wreck any dog!

muddypaws

deadlybuzzman wrote: »

As was pointed out to me by a guy that has IPO GSDs, you'd be all day trying to tire out a dog like that just by walking and even then you'll probably fail.
What he does and it worked great for us for burning off energy is just to play ball with 2 tennis balls using a throwing stick. Throw a ball one way, dog sprints that way, throw the other ball the other way dog sprints that way.
Maybe he brings it back maybe he doesn't but 10-30 mins of that will wreck any dog!

Depends how much of the husky traits the dog has, throw a ball it runs past it and disappears.

deadlybuzzman

muddypaws wrote: »

Depends how much of the husky traits the dog has, throw a ball it runs past it and disappears.

Very good point! Its also just occurred to me that the OP would also need to consider how likely it would be for the dogs aggression to come out once it would be all worked up chasing the balls...... If it did chase them and not just overtake them!