Almost 15,000 motorists wrongly convicted

challengemaster

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/almost-15-000-motorists-wrongly-convicted-1.3022636

The State is facing a bill of tens of millions of euro after it was revealed 14,700 people had been convicted of motoring offences by the courts in error.
The mistakes arose when motorists who had paid a fine under the fixed charge notice (FCN) system were mistakenly sent summonses to appear before court.
In each of the cases they were convicted and a sanction, including a fine, was imposed.

However, because they had paid a fine on receipt of their FCN for motoring offences the matter should have concluded at that juncture. They should never have been summonsed.

A total of 146,865 summonses had been sent out in error in that way since the fixed charge notice system began in 2006.

However, gardaí believe it is only those cases where the motorists were convicted and sanctioned by a court that action must now be taken.

The Garda plans to contact all of the people involved and make arrangements to have all of the cases brought back before the courts to set aside the convictions.

It must pay the legal and administrative costs involved and may also be sued by some. Motorists who, for example, saw increases in their insurance premium or lost their jobs could take legal action.

Assistant Commissioner Michael Finn, who is in charge of roads policing, said the Courts Service, DPP and the State Claims Agency had been consulted.
“I apologise to all of these people who were brought before the courts,” he said.

Breath tests
The revelations emerged on the same day the Garda was also forced to admit two million breath tests had been record on its PULSE database by gardaí despite only one million tests having been carried out, between 2012 and 2016.

A spokesman for Tánaiste and Minister for Justice Frances Fitzgerald said she was concerned about the findings. She had asked to be “kept informed of progress in this regard and in relation to ensuring issues of this kind do not arise again”.

The Garda said a new IT system already installed should ensure the issuing of summonses to motorists who had already paid fines should cease. And in relation to the breath testing problems, gardaí were now required to record the serial number of the device they are using for tests.

Is it any wonder people see the Gardaí as untrustworthy...

Zubeneschamali

challengemaster wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/almost-15-000-motorists-wrongly-convicted-1.3022636

I don't understand.

15,000 people paid a fixed penalty notice, got summonsed by mistake, and then got convicted in court and fined again?

Why the hell didn't they just tell the courts they already paid the fixed penalty?

cruizer101

Yeah I'm a bit confused also, ~146,000 notice were sent out and in the majority of cases nothing happened but in ~14,000 cases they got convicted, is that not the fault of the judge as you would assume they brought proof of the fine being paid but the judge still convicted.

What happened in the other cases did they turn up and show they paid and the judge throw it out of court? Why in those 14,000 were they convicted?

Buffman

I think that Irish Times article has it a bit mixed up, there were cases a summons was issued after the fine was paid and where the FCPN wasn't issued at all.

The Garda statement on it:

Issue Date:
23/03/2017
Issues discovered with administration of Fixed Charge Notices (FCN) and road side breath tests

Section 103 of the Road Traffic Act 1961, as amended provides that where a member of An Garda Síochána has reasonable grounds for believing that a fixed charge offence is being or has been committed by a person;
a)If the member identifies the person, the member shall serve, or cause to be served, personally or by post, on the person a notice under this section.

An Garda Síochána has issued over 10½ million Fixed Charge Notices since 2006.
In April 2016 a person was summonsed to Court for no NCT Certificate.
It transpired that the person had already paid a Fixed Charge Notice.
As a consequence An Garda Síochána commenced a review to establish how this had occurred.
Failure to have an NCT Certificate became a fixed charge offence on 8th December 2014 and from that date on, no summons should have issued for failing to have an NCT Certificate unless the driver had firstly been issued with a fixed charge notice, and the fixed charge had not been paid.
An initial examination of records for offence –‘Not having a valid NCT Certificate’ indicated that in 759 cases, where a fixed charge notice (FCN) had been issued and paid a summons was later issued. The examination of all fixed charge offences, since the roll out of the FCPS system, identifies that 1,130 cases have had summonses issued for offences where the FCN has been paid.

Extended review
Arising from the initial findings in relation to prosecutions taken where the person prosecuted had paid a fixed charge for the offence; a decision was made by Assistant Commissioner, Roads Policing and Major Event/Emergency Management, to establish if any other issues were arising in relation to the operation of the full FCPS.
This review was carried out in conjunction with Garda IT. An examination of 830,687 summonses issued between 1st January 2006 and 27th May 2016 for road traffic offences declared as fixed charge offences has now taken place.
This review has identified that in addition to prosecutions taken where the person prosecuted had already paid a fixed charge for the offence prosecutions were initiated where a fixed charge notice had not been issued.
A total 146,865 summonses were brought before the Court in these circumstances.
The main offences relating to the 146,865 summonses are set out below.
OFFENCES
Offence Description Total
Non Display of TAX Disc (Use)68664
Non Display of Insurance Disc (10 days after date of authentication of the certificate) 42462
Use Vehicle without NCT 4511
Learner Driver Failing to Display ‘L’ Plates on a vehicle 1000
Non Display of Insurance Disc Owner 6782
Driving Without Reasonable Consideration 5939
Failing To Stop For Garda 3658
Driving Past a Red Traffic Light 1903
Holding a Mobile Phone While Driving. 1217
136136
Other offences: Speeding, Lighting, bus lanes, Parking offence
10729
Total 146865
An estimated 96% of the cases relate to persons that had multiple offences before the Court.
The remaining 4% (estimated at 5,860) summonses relate to persons who were not before the Court for any other offence.
In relation to 146865 summonses 14,700 cases resulted in a penalty being imposed by the courts.
We have undertaken to appeal of those outcomes to the Circuit Court.

So the 'lost in the post' excuse used by lots of people in court has been proven to be half true, because the fines were never posted in the first place!

And regarding the 'made up' breath test figures.

From RTE:

It has also been revealed that from 2011 to 2016, the number of drink-driving tests gardaí claimed to have carried out was hugely exaggerated, by over 937,000.

Speaking on RTÉ's Drivetime, Assistant Commissioner Michael Finn said a mistake was made and it was due to a systems failure and carelessness.
He said it happened in every garda region and was due to deficiences in practices.
He also apologised to those affected.
Earlier gardaí say they do not know why it happened and have pointed to system and policy failures.


However, they accepted it is reasonable for people to conclude many of the figures were just being made up.

At this stage they're almost making Chief Wiggum look professional!

challengemaster

Buffman wrote: »

At this stage they're almost making Chief Wiggum look professional!

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/garda-figures-for-number-of-breath-tests-carried-out-were-hugely-exaggerated-35556449.html

in relation to one period, it was discovered that the figures for roadside breath tests alleged to have been carried out was bigger than the total number of mouthpieces available to the force at that time.

I think it's a pretty reasonable conclusion that they are just making shít up.

Zubeneschamali

challengemaster wrote: »

I think it's a pretty reasonable conclusion that they are just making shít up.

The 15,000 people penalized by the courts when they had already paid the fixed penalty is a more serious issue, I think it is rather less important that they made up the test figures on some press release - no-one was prosecuted or punished in the made-up breath tests.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Buffman wrote: »

So the 'lost in the post' excuse used by lots of people in court has been proven to be half true, because the fines were never posted in the first place!

No you are incorrect. Just read the other thread where I have explained it.

BlinkingLights

Often judges were incredulous that people didn't get the fixed penalty points by post and were effectively accusing them of lying.

A relative of mine got no notification whatsoever of fixed points and ended up in court and was grilled about her postal services.

Her address on the driver file contained a typo and she was basically told that was her fault as if she couldn't spell her own address?!?
The motor tac record is correct and always was but somehow the driver file that was used to send out the letters was missing lines.

Anyway the whole experience was humiliating but she did get off after having to actually take the stand and argue.

I could area lot a lot of people feeling they've been very wronged as they'll have been accused of lying to the courts about not receiving documentation which, now looks to be very probably true, and many will have been convicted and ended up with major insurance hikes and even potentially issues with work if they're a commercial driver.

At the very least all fixed point notices should be sent out by registered post. The cost could be easily recovered in the fine.

I foresee this getting very expensive very quickly.

Buffman

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

Originally Posted by Buffman

So the 'lost in the post' excuse used by lots of people in court has been proven to be half true, because the fines were never posted in the first place!

No you are incorrect. Just read the other thread where I have explained it.

OK, I've read your other post and don't see where you're coming from?

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

The two stories are completely different and not linked.

In the OP story, 14700 people were summonsed to court without being given a chance to pay a fine first, ie there was no fine issued and the case proceeded straight to court where they were fined/convicted.

In the other case a FCPS fine was issued, that is not being disputed as there will be a record of it having been issued. In the case of the 14700, no fine was ever issued. The judge didn't believe that the person didn't receive the fine saying it was lost in the post.

How is that so difficult to understand?

I suspect many people who tried the 'I never got the FCPS fine' defence line will think they are one of the 14700 people, theyre not and will not be included in any reversal of the fines or penalty points.

Have you read the Garda statment I quoted? The two scenarios/stories are linked, both show serious flaws in the whole FPN operation.

This review has identified that in addition to prosecutions taken where the person prosecuted had already paid a fixed charge for the offence prosecutions were initiated where a fixed charge notice had not been issued.

Seems pretty clear to me. A person never receives a FPN, just a summons. The person goes to court, the judge asks why they didn't pay the FPN. The person says they never recieved the FPN (In some cases we now know this was the truth, as they weren't sent). The judge either believes them or not depending on what side of the bed he/she got out of.

McCrack

BlinkingLights wrote: »

Often judges were incredulous that people didn't get the fixed penalty points by post and were effectively accusing them of lying.

A relative of mine got no notification whatsoever of fixed points and ended up in court and was grilled about her postal services.

Her address on the driver file contained a typo and she was basically told that was her fault as if she couldn't spell her own address?!?
The motor tac record is correct and always was but somehow the driver file that was used to send out the letters was missing lines.

Anyway the whole experience was humiliating but she did get off after having to actually take the stand and argue.

I could area lot a lot of people feeling they've been very wronged as they'll have been accused of lying to the courts about not receiving documentation which, now looks to be very probably true, and many will have been convicted and ended up with major insurance hikes and even potentially issues with work if they're a commercial driver.

At the very least all fixed point notices should be sent out by registered post. The cost could be easily recovered in the fine.

I foresee this getting very expensive very quickly.

Its doubtful a typo in an address will throw the postal service off particularly in a rural area.

People will try it in court but usually fail miserably.