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Doctor Who Season 10 [** Spoilers **]

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,452 ✭✭✭✭The_Valeyard


    The Master wrote: »
    The fact that I didn't seem interested in The Doctor's story till he mentioned people dying and I quite literally changed my tune upon hearing that makes me think it's me in the vault.

    Be nice if I was in the vault. I've been patiently waiting a long time now. You've had plenty of chances.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Be nice if I was in the vault. I've been patiently waiting a long time now. You've had plenty of chances.

    I kinda like to think you're Toby Jones really so had at least one more chance.

    (Also, savage episode)


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    They're really focusing on the horror aspects this season, not complaining at all though. We get too many companions to keep doing the awe and wonder episodes every time one appears


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,123 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Is it hyperbole to suggest this has been a flawless season so far? That was yet another, tense, funny, creepy and effective story - even if it wore its politics fairly brazenly on its sleeve (although I like the Doctor's comment that after ditching capitalism, humanity move onto a whole new mistake).

    The ending also genuinely surprised me, which, considering the blabbermouths at BBC made for a nice change; is this the first time Who has played with a cliffhanger more ... immediate and personal than the usual sort? Any dramatic endings have tended to revolve around ticking clocks & world's in peril, this one is obviously simpler yet more shocking. Though on the subject of surprises, Capaldi and Bill have gelled so well I really hope the regeneration is just a planned red herring - the BBC & Moffat basically pulling a prank on its audience...


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Not hyperbole, it's been non stop great episodes BUT they are setting up the vault so much that the whole season now revolves around that.
    So no pressure


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    pixelburp wrote:
    Is it hyperbole to suggest this has been a flawless season so far? That was yet another, tense, funny, creepy and effective story - even if it wore its politics fairly brazenly on its sleeve (although I like the Doctor's comment that after ditching capitalism, humanity move onto a whole new mistake).

    Not hyperbole, it's been non stop great episodes BUT they are setting up the vault so much that the whole season now revolves around that. So no pressure


    I would say we have had 5 consistently decent episodes (I wouldn't say flawless or great) but I haven't watched any of them and thought "wow that was fantastic" and I wouldn't be in a rush to rewatch any of them. But that's the things about Who, everyone wants something different. I hate River Song with a passion but others seem to lover her.

    Re trailer for next week
    the sight of her diary had me in knots and I'm do not of high hopes. Moffat's arc episodes and arcs in general have often left me cold


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,958 ✭✭✭✭CastorTroy


    I was just thinking it was funny that the TARDIS enables people to understand any alien language yet has trouble with Italian.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,981 ✭✭✭✭flazio


    The "Pope" by the way also played the Nobles Housemate in the alternative universe episode "Turn Left"


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,810 ✭✭✭ebbsy


    Classic Doctor Who episode. I will miss Capaldi when he is gone.


  • Registered Users Posts: 60,497 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    This is fast becoming my favorite season since The Doctor returned Capaldi has nailed The Doctor!



    Pearl is a fantastic companion as well I really would love to see her and Capaldi have a run of a few seasons this partnership will be missed when this season ends.


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,123 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    That was a fantastically well-structured, paced and executed episode; very much a Moffat-style 'puzzle box', but one that felt broader and deeper than the usual ones. The wandering narrative between the past & present, and the little stakes and personal threats really galvanised everything into something above the frivolous. It felt like a re-mix of 'Heaven Sent', but in a good way. I wonder if Chibnall might continue this small period of interlocking episodes, because it actually works very well.

    So I'm reading the timelines right that all this basically happened post
    'Oxygen', where this invasion kicked off around the time the TARDIS crew returned; it's not trying to suggest all of Season 10 is happening in this computer game, right? :D

    As to the vault mystery: yeah a bit less exciting than some of the speculation, and I think I claimed myself that it was simply TOO obvious, but hey ho :)

    Oh and props to Nardole: among everything else that happened, it was the one that allowed him to really step forward and establish his purpose and value.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    Well, I thought that was the weakest of the season so far. There were just way too many plotholes. Was it a hologram (as indicated by the room of projectors), or was it a massive computer simulation? And I just didn't buy the 'computers can't do random' thing, how can a computer simulate a whole planet and its population without simulating spontaneity? Even more confusing that the aliens make the blunder of connecting their simulation to the internet in such a way that The Doctor can just pop off an e-mail to his real self, makes no sense. The whole thing was daft and I know it's Doctor Who but when you consider what Agents of SHIELD did with a similar idea, Extremis just didn't hold together.
    pixelburp wrote: »
    So I'm reading the timelines right that all this basically happened post
    'Oxygen', where this invasion kicked off around the time the TARDIS crew returned; it's not trying to suggest all of Season 10 is happening in this computer game, right? :D

    The episode started out with The Doctor, blind, receiving an e-mail marked 'Extremis', the rest of the episode is a record of what happened to to the simulation Doctor that was in the e-mail.

    ALSO; how can the Doctor can see what's on the smart glasses when he's blind?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,257 ✭✭✭Yourself isit


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    Well, I thought that was the weakest of the season so far. There were just way too many plotholes. Was it a hologram (as indicated by the room of projectors), or was it a massive computer simulation? And I just didn't buy the 'computers can't do random' thing, how can a computer simulate a whole planet and its population without simulating spontaneity? Even more confusing that the aliens make the blunder of connecting their simulation to the internet in such a way that The Doctor can just pop off an e-mail to his real self, makes no sense. The whole thing was daft and I know it's Doctor Who but when you consider what Agents of SHIELD did with a similar idea, Extremis just didn't hold together.



    The episode started out with The Doctor, blind, receiving an e-mail marked 'Extremis', the rest of the episode is a record of what happened to to the simulation Doctor that was in the e-mail.

    ALSO; how can the Doctor can see what's on the smart glasses when he's blind?

    How can he travel in time, though? And why is the TARDIS bigger on the inside?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,353 ✭✭✭corkie


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    ALSO; how can the Doctor can see what's on the smart glasses when he's blind?


    There are the sonic glasses which are transmitting directly to his brain!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,257 ✭✭✭Yourself isit


    The random thing is a bit off but forgivable - computers can't do random numbers but they can seed pseudo random numbers so as to make them seem random. It's possible that sims might work the latter out but it would be too complex to explain.

    As for the email - the aliens just made their world too believable. So email worked.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    How can he travel in time, though? And why is the TARDIS bigger on the inside?

    Sorry I forgot that it was science-fiction which means anything goes and we as the audience aren't allowed question anything, because it's science-fiction and anything goes.
    corkie wrote:
    There are the sonic glasses which are transmitting directly to his brain!

    That makes sense, thank you for a genuine answer.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    And I just didn't buy the 'computers can't do random' thing, how can a computer simulate a whole planet and its population without simulating spontaneity?

    Are you looking for an a real answer on this? Because it's actually kind of interesting.

    There's a reason why computers "can't do random", although much like most TV things it doesn't work exactly the way it's used (although you could argue that if two of the AIs picked a random number at the same time it might come from the same variable or called the same function thus the same number coming up, although I would consider this a flaw that should be patched out in universe 2.0).

    Before the maths gets beyond my years away from college's ability to understand, either your algorithm will ultimately loop, stopping the randomness, or you will run out of memory. This "lack of randomness" is far from meaning two people will get the same answer, but by the same token, it's a nice quirk of computing to see pop up in a TV show for me.

    One particularly amusing aspect of the random problem was in early video games, where they didn't have the memory for proper RNG (Random Number Generation). Thus they would use all kinds of weird and wonderful tricks to simulate randomness (amount of lives a player had left, their score, were they were standing on a screen, things like that)!


  • Registered Users Posts: 285 ✭✭SparklersJo


    Whatever about being able to email out from the simulation and all that jazz, my biggest gripe with the episode was: why leave evidence that the world is a simulation in the simulation? Like, why did that Veritas document exist at all for people to find (and subsequently leak to the real world)? Seems like a massive oversight. I hope whichever alien conquerer left that one lying around gets the sack.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Whatever about being able to email out from the simulation and all that jazz, my biggest gripe with the episode was: why leave evidence that the world is a simulation in the simulation? Like, why did that Veritas document exist at all for people to find (and subsequently leak to the real world)? Seems like a massive oversight. I hope whichever alien conquerer left that one lying around gets the sack.

    I actually totally bought the email thing.

    I received automated mails from systems all the time in work. If a part of one of those systems became sentient I'm pretty sure it'd be constantly pestering me for equivalent of cyber tea :D

    I suspect there'll be some shenanigans where the Doctor ends up leaving the Veritas for himself.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,319 ✭✭✭jasonb


    I have to watch that one again, I wasn't giving it my undivided attention and I get the feeling I missed a good episode!

    However, the way I read it, centuries ago a 'Sect' created the Veritas. I'm guessing they realised/found out that the world was a simulation, wrote it down, killed themselves to check out, and then it was lost in translation. I didn't get the feeling that it was one of these new baddies that wrote it all those years ago, but maybe I missed the point. Maybe one of them rebelled against the others and wrote the truth? But then, why kill themselves afterwards? If the 'person' who wrote it was one of the aliens, they already knew it was a simulation. Hence me thinking it was written by humans who discovered the truth themselves, wrote about it and then checked out.

    Or, as Doctor DooM said above, maybe the Doctor was involved in it himself, though he clearly doesn't remember reading it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    Are you looking for an a real answer on this? Because it's actually kind of interesting.

    That was genuinely interesting but to be honest it just kind of raises more questions for me re the simulation.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    That was genuinely interesting but to be honest it just kind of raises more questions for me re the simulation.

    Yeah as I was saying the simulation would have to be extremely poorly coded in order for it to work the way they did (all the simalcrum would need to be drawing from the same variable where the random number was being stored, or only one instance of the function running the algorithm would be running for all of them).

    It's not like a simulation of this complexity has ever been run but that'd be pretty shoddy for it, you would think every simalcrum would have their own space in memory in which they could run it. Then again I am not a genius alien bent on destroying earth so what would I know :D

    I'd LIKE to think this is a plot point and at some point the Doctor will go on a huge rant at them about their hubris not doing it properly, but until that happens I must concur it's a bit crappy, even if I let it slide.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,958 ✭✭✭✭CastorTroy


    So just out of curiosity, for anyone who guessed Missy was in the vault, do you think you would've made the same guess if you didn't know Missy or The Master were going to be in this season?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,646 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    I hate the BBC at the minute. I hadn't looked in here for awhile to avoid spoilers. I rarely use facebook anymore and finally my friend who loves to spoil things has stopped.

    Finally pop back here after awhile away and the first thread I see is Peter is leaving. I hate the BBC for not having the backbone to keep things secret anymore, and that now, not matter what, the season will have no punch like it should.

    Episodes so far have been mixed for me, although overall positive.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    CramCycle wrote:
    Finally pop back here after awhile away and the first thread I see is Peter is leaving. I hate the BBC for not having the backbone to keep things secret anymore, and that now, not matter what, the season will have no punch like it should.


    Genuine question; has there ever been a surprise regeneration where the audience didn't know the current doctor was leaving? I can't imagine it since the series came back with Eccleston, that's just the way the news world works. But your lucky if that's the only thing you've spoiled for you in this season.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    Genuine question; has there ever been a surprise regeneration where the audience didn't know the current doctor was leaving? I can't imagine it since the series came back with Eccleston, that's just the way the news world works. But your lucky if that's the only thing you've spoiled for you in this season.

    They did a "fake" one with Tennant where he regenerated into Tennant. I think that's the only one!


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,488 ✭✭✭Goodshape


    CastorTroy wrote: »
    So just out of curiosity, for anyone who guessed Missy was in the vault, do you think you would've made the same guess if you didn't know Missy or The Master were going to be in this season?

    Was Missy in the promos for this episode? I don't usually pay attention to the promos but from what I did see, she wasn't. Because it was a "surprise", right?

    Except that the actress did a Reddit AMA last week on account of her character "returning in the next episode".

    So that's how I knew she was in the vault – because they didn't even attempt to keep a secret. Pity.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,123 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Goodshape wrote: »
    Was Missy in the promos for this episode? I don't usually pay attention to the promos but from what I did see, she wasn't. Because it was a "surprise", right?

    Except that the actress did a Reddit AMA last week on account of her character "returning in the next episode".

    So that's how I knew she was in the vault – because they didn't even attempt to keep a secret. Pity.

    Missy appeared in the various trailers for Extremis, albeit fleetingly & didn't speak.

    As for a surprise regeneration: I don't think so, I'm fairly sure all the previous incumbents of the role publicly announced they were leaving. Ditto when the replacement was picked, the BBC usually announced it, albeit without a half-hour show tediously dragging it out. I suppose technically the very first regeneration was a surprise!

    The BBC really have a weird policy towards Doctor Who; they just seem happy to blab any small or large secret to the press; I guess under the belief that spoiling their own show makes more publicity than something genuinely surprising.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,646 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    FunLover18 wrote: »
    Genuine question; has there ever been a surprise regeneration where the audience didn't know the current doctor was leaving? I can't imagine it since the series came back with Eccleston, that's just the way the news world works. But your lucky if that's the only thing you've spoiled for you in this season.

    I suppose not. I didn't know about Ecclestone but then I wasn't paying attention. Tennant I knew awhile before hand but that's only because he took so bloody long to regenerate :pac:
    I knew about Matt Smith but I cannot remember when that was spoiled.

    I suppose, I like surprises and I just cannot understand why they don't do it like that. I have friends who read all the spoilers before they goto movies or watch TV shows, they seem to enjoy it, I just enjoy it alot less if people tell me what is going to happen.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,488 ✭✭✭Goodshape


    pixelburp wrote: »
    Missy appeared in the various trailers for Extremis, albeit fleetingly & didn't speak.

    Well, the Reddit AMA wasn't the first mistake then. But yeah.. zero surprise once I knew she was in the episode. Knowing she was in the season at all already made her the top contender.

    Not a big deal really though. I wasn't expecting to be shocked or amazed.


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