Lbs vs wiggle

niallo76

Buying ultegra pedals for bike,lbs have them for 180 Euro,wiggle for 100,what to do??????do I say to Lbs that they are well overpriced in comparison,or do i just buy from internet

iwillhtfu

If it's a store you use and would like to keep in your area at least give them the opportunity to price match.

No guarantee they will match but they might get close enough and you never know when you might be stuck for a spare part.

dahat

Ask them to price match (unlikely) but at that difference even the most loyal of LBS punters would buy online.

Like others I do my utmost to get stuff done in the LBS as they are extremely handy for non mechanical types like myself.

ted1

dahat wrote: »

Ask them to price match (unlikely) but at that difference even the most loyal of LBS punters would buy online.

Like others I do my utmost to get stuff done in the LBS as they are extremely handy for non mechanical types like myself.

I use the LBS for items I need to have asap or for small bits and pieces. with three kids to it's impossible to justify paying significant price differences.

ford2600

niallo76 wrote: »

Buying ultegra pedals for bike,lbs have them for 180 Euro,wiggle for 100,what to do??????do I say to Lbs that they are well overpriced in comparison,or do i just buy from internet

Neither pay for r550 and drink the difference.

Even cheap shimano pedals work really well

niallo76

Thanks for replies,yep,I'd love to support the LBS,but 80 Euro is too much of a difference.

jon1981

I used to have this dilemma but stopped having it after the LBS failed to budge on a price a few times. Recent examples were zonda wheels , LBS wanted 580 euro for wheels i can get for 350 online.

Despite being a regular customer for services and bits and bobs they wouldn't move...

OleRodrigo

They have to make a living.

magicbastarder

different area of retail, but i was once shown the wholesale price of an item, being charged to my usual camera shop, which was about 10% higher than the retail price an (irish) online seller was charging. i.e. to price match, the camera shop would have made a straight loss of €20. the difference was probably due to the bulk which the online retailer was ordering in.

would be interested to hear if a similar situation exists for bike shops; say the LBS sold one pair of those pedals a week, and the online retailer sells 20. and that's not taking into account the overheads of running a retail store vs. an online operation based out of an industrial unit.

C3PO

I think the inevitable long term result is that the LBS will become "service centres", will charge properly for their time and will sell only consumables. They simply can't compete with the big online stores!

ford2600

magicbastarder wrote: »

different area of retail, but i was once shown the wholesale price of an item, being charged to my usual camera shop, which was about 10% higher than the retail price an (irish) online seller was charging. i.e. to price match, the camera shop would have made a straight loss of €20. the difference was probably due to the bulk which the online retailer was ordering in.

would be interested to hear if a similar situation exists for bike shops; say the LBS sold one pair of those pedals a week, and the online retailer sells 20. and that's not taking into account the overheads of running a retail store vs. an online operation based out of an industrial unit.

There was an interesting link on yacf.co.uk about online v lbs.

Shimano price goods depending on the economic block they sell into, USA, Europe, Asia wherever.

Big online stores with a presence in different blocks can play the system along with economies of scale and playing with currency movements. The Irish lbs has to buy from Madison (I think).

I wouldn't be surprised if lbs can't buy lots of products for price online stores can sell them

OleRodrigo

The Rapha store and to a certain extent the Cyclesuperstore are heading in that direction - experience based retail. That's a trend across retail generally, not just cycling.

My lbs is close to a major college and he cleans up on repairs & consumables. 35 euro for what he can do well in minutes and there's a constant stream of business. He says his Park Tools only last a year.

magicbastarder

just checked the price difference between wiggle and a shop near me (not my usual one) where i asked about a 105 chainwheel recently - LBS quoted €170, wiggle are €110 or thereabouts; not quite as big a difference as the OP's example.
i asked would the bike shop include fitting in the price, and was given an emphatic 'no'.

clog

The prices that the normal Lbs pays wholesale and what the major online stores can get them for is massive. I was looking at a pair of levers and they were €5 cheaper from Chain Reaction retail than the irish supplier wholesale.

mh_cork

I appreciate that shops have higher overheads and have to make a profit. But the difference is almost 100% for a fairly common item.

If the problem is with the supply chain, i.e. distributors charging more for Ireland, then I feel zero guilt about buying online. If the difference to the price is mostly going to the middle-man and not the LBS, why should I be fleeced?

I do feel some sympathy for the LBS. They are kept going with the B2W scheme, and if it goes, then a lot of them might go under. But if they are being fleeced by their suppliers, then they need to take action - maybe even buy from the online retailers themselves.

magicbastarder

i suspect they wouldn't be able to offer a warranty in those circumstances.

mh_cork

magicbastarder wrote: »

i suspect they wouldn't be able to offer a warranty in those circumstances.

Good point about the warranty.

But I really think that the LBS should be more proactive in telling its suppliers to get stuffed if this is what is happening. I want to support the LBS, but if the middleman is making more profit on the item than the LBS, its not right. And as a consumer, why should I support that business model?

Another example is that some bike brands cannot be bought online, only through some dealers. Why? Because it keeps the prices artificially higher.

uck51js9zml2yt

Got a new crankset on CRC and my lbs for it for €25.

Both of us are happy.

rodneyTrotter.

magicbastarder wrote: »

just checked the price difference between wiggle and a shop near me (not my usual one) where i asked about a 105 chainwheel recently - LBS quoted €170, wiggle are €110 or thereabouts; not quite as big a difference as the OP's example.
i asked would the bike shop include fitting in the price, and was given an emphatic 'no'.

Whoever told you that in the shop needs training fast
He should have said he could fit it for an extra 10/15€ therefore at least making some effort to get the sale making a customer happy and likely to come back .
It's all about building relationships. Unfortunately some people never see the bigger picture or think you are pulling a fast one and insulting them.

magicbastarder

as mentioned, not my usual shop, and the above explains why!

Macy0161

Having this dilemma myself. Have had a dodgy freehub on a wheel that came with the Giant bike. One replacement under warranty, but replacement lasted about the same time before giving trouble (and I've been ultra careful about doing anything that may cause issue second time around, although don't think I was culpable the first time, and LBS saying they're just where they save money).

LBS have been fine to deal with over it, but their initial offer for a replacement wheel was they could do a wheelset only (not just the rear that's needed), and guts of a third higher for that wheelset than online. Really not sure on the best approach to take to maintain the relationship, as basically can't justify the cost difference?

2 Wheels Good

I remember chatting with a (now closed) bike shop owner. One of the brands he sold did a deal with CRC and started selling their bikes online. The bikes were cheaper on CRC than the wholesale price he bought them at, impossible to compete with that and not a nice thing to have to deal with mid season when he still had stock to sell.

It looks like the "buy online, fit in LBS" model will be the only way for LBS to compete.

selwyn froggitt

OleRodrigo wrote: »

They have to make a living.

I think everyone undertands that, but there are some LBS who are just taking the piss.

I was quoted €37.50 recently by the Edge in Cork for an Ultegra 6800 Bottom Bracket, I got one delivered for €12 from Wiggle

smacl

2 Wheels Good wrote: »

It looks like the "buy online, fit in LBS" model will be the only way for LBS to compete.

Depends to an extent on the manufacturer as well. Some have a business model that supports their local resellers a bit better than others, e.g. bought a Frog bike for youngest recently and it was the same price locally as online. For higher end bike manufacturers there's good reason to develop a network of quality resellers rather than being beholden to the big box droppers where you can only really compete on price.

dvntie

Gatlin Scary Scene wrote: »

Got a new crankset on CRC and my lbs for it for €25.

Both of us are happy.

This is the way forward

PoorFarmer

I actually had this discussion with one of the guys in my LBS lately about Ultegra pedals as it happens. His supplier was charging him €135 for a set but they could be bought online for around €25 less. He said he just couldn't compete with that.

ednwireland

selwyn froggitt wrote: »

I think everyone undertands that, but there are some LBS who are just taking the piss.

I was quoted €37.50 recently by the Edge in Cork for an Ultegra 6800 Bottom Bracket, I got one delivered for €12 from Wiggle

But that's the problem wiggle are buying in bulk and making a euro or 2 the bike shop prob ably won't make more than a fiver. Were the products both boxed items . A lot of stuff I get on line isn't boxed whilst the lbs ends up with a bb in a box which no doubt cost loads more trade.

All My Stars Aligned

I remember when the bike to work scheme was introduced a number of bike shops prices seemed to increase overnight. About 3 months prior to it being introduced I was looking for a new bike and me not being the most decisive person was still looking after it was introduced. Over that period bikes prices rose from between 100 - 200 euro. When I questioned them about it I was met with a kind of tough **** attitude. Since then I do my best not to buy anything from Dublins bike shops. What goes around comes around...

C3PO

I personally know quite a few guys in the bike shop business in Dublin .... if any of them are making a fortune they're keeping it well hidden!!

All My Stars Aligned

C3PO wrote: »

I personally know quite a few guys in the bike shop business in Dublin .... if any of them are making a fortune they're keeping it well hidden!!

I'd imagine you right but how some of them behaved when the BTW scheme was introduced to my mind was terrible and thanks to that I now always buy online. It also gave me an incentive to learn how to properly maintain my bikes.

There are lots of other things that I buy regularly that can be found cheaper online but I will always try to buy locally even if it proves to be a bit more expensive.

equivariant

I have very little sympathy for LBS's in this situation. There are very few other retailers who have their customers sponsored by the revenue ireland to the tune of 42% of the price of their core products.

mo_bhicycle

Don't forget that the BTW middlemen that a lot of big companies use charge 10% to the bike shop on every purchase. My work went with cyclescheme.ie and my LBS wasn't overly happy

moonshadow

So out of curiosity , has anyone presented a new groupset to a lbs for fitting only and if so what was the reception they got and also of course the charge to fit?

Wanderer78

moonshadow wrote:

So out of curiosity , has anyone presented a new groupset to a lbs for fitting only and if so what was the reception they got and also of course the charge to fit?

Purchased rear mech online, lbs fitted it for small money but I know them fairly well. They were unable to offer me same deal for part but they had no issues

C3PO

moonshadow wrote: »

So out of curiosity , has anyone presented a new groupset to a lbs for fitting only and if so what was the reception they got and also of course the charge to fit?

I regularly bring parts into my lbs for them to fit when servicing my bikes. As lots of people have said, I can buy online from Germany at less than they can buy from a local distributor. They have no issue fitting them but (and it's a big but) I also expect to pay a proper rate for their work. In my opinion it is reasonable for a shop to charge €60+ an hour for their time so if I was asking my lbs to fit a complete groupset I would expect to pay at least €100 for the service and I would be paying for cables etc on top of that!

Crocked

I had a LBS supply and fit a new groupset about two years ago.

I'd priced locally with 2 stores to supply and fit, and fit only. Both came back with a similar enough pricing. When I checked online to see what deals I could get for the groupset there wasn't too much of a saving by buying it online and having them fit, so it was easier and simpler to get them to supply and fit. Also easier to get warranty cover if something went wrong by having it all done by one store.

I think the future for the LBS isn't in new bike sales but in local support. The majority of people will still pay to have someone do the work than do it themselves. Even if they can buy the parts online and do it. The time saving is usually worth the cost of a reasonable premium paid to the lbs.

lukegjpotter

Crocked wrote: »

The time saving is usually worth the cost of a reasonable premium paid to the lbs.

This.

I have the basic tools, but I still have mental scars from trying to index a rear mech.

Macy0161

I've no problem paying something of premium. In my own example, if they could supply a new rear wheel rather than just a wheelset, with a similar % price difference, I'd go for it for the pure convenience!

I think the btw examples are just the same as every business - price insulation and you'll end up paying the same whether getting a grant or not - they basically take the grant on top, no saving to the household. Same for water treatment, boilers or anything else with a Government subsidy or grant - consumer pays the same regardless.

Andy Magic

I find it's nearly always the Shimano products that are significantly different in prices between LBS and chain reaction/wiggle.

Techo

There's arguments to use both online and LBS but for mechanical items I'd lean towards LBS. Recently bought a front mech here 2nd hand and got lbs to fit it..they also changed cable and checked rest of bike, cables, wear and tear etc. all for cost of 1 hr labour. Plus they gave the cassette an ultrasonic cleaning for free. This was the first time I used these guys as the LBS where I bought bike had closed down.

Went into them a few weeks ago (2nd only time) for a 105 cassette for the turbo wheel...online and local Halfords was around €40. I went with the LBS which was €60. They did the fitting for free and swapped cassettes between the good wheel and the turbo wheel, and got ultrasonic cleaning done on the old cassette again for free and checked over bike as well for free. I can't complain with that kind of service. I'm sure they'd fit other bits and pieces if I bought online, but for the sake of a few euro, I'd rather throw the business their way, unless there was a huge difference.

brocbrocach

Similar enough situation to yourself I priced a 105 cassette online for about 35e delivered. It was 60e in lbs and they'd charge 20e to fit (to be fair the rear mech needed work as well). In the end I went with a 40e Tiagra and got it fitted for convenience sake. They did a good job, mechanics went out of their way, but the shop definitely haven't earned any loyalty from me I'm afraid.

Macy0161

Well LBS back up in the estimation, as going to argue the warranty aspect. Probably secured themselves a very good fighting chance if I do go for an upgrade on the wheels later on in the year!

rtmie

moonshadow wrote: »

So out of curiosity , has anyone presented a new groupset to a lbs for fitting only and if so what was the reception they got and also of course the charge to fit?

I bought a secondhand groupset on eBay couple of years ago and chickened out of trying to fit myself. Asked lbs , slightly nervously, if they would do it. Was told, of course, that's our bread and butter! Cost was very reasonable, as in at the lower end of my expectation.
Mind you last time I passed it looks like shop is no longer there unfortunately, so make of that what you will!

dvntie

clog wrote: »

The prices that the normal Lbs pays wholesale and what the major online stores can get them for is massive. I was looking at a pair of levers and they were €5 cheaper from Chain Reaction retail than the irish supplier wholesale.

and that wholesale price is excluding vat of 23%

sy_flembeck

When I got my new winter steed on the BTW last year it came with a Tiagra 12-28 rear block. Asked when ordering if it could be swapped over for an 11-28 pre-collection and was told no problem.

When I collected the bike this was done and not only that it was fitted with a 105 block as there was no compatible Tiagra version. And there was no cost to me. Excellent service, particularly as I'd only ever bought a few small bits in this particular shop.

Don't think I'd have got that service online.

Chuchote

Was Sammy Wilson proved right when he forecast massive job losses in Chain Reaction Cycles?

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-37785201

dvntie

Chuchote wrote: »

Was Sammy Wilson proved right when he forecast massive job losses in Chain Reaction Cycles?

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-37785201

And rumour has it that wiggle has opened a base in Germany also

C3PO

Chuchote wrote: »

Was Sammy Wilson proved right when he forecast massive job losses in Chain Reaction Cycles?

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-37785201

Sad ... but hardly a surprise!

Sinbad_NI

Doagh CRC warehouse shop front is closing on the 21/4 I believe.
That sure will be completely gone by September.

Not sure about the Carrickfergus warehouse.

:-(

bazermc

I am in need of new set of Look Keo Cleats - they are €25 in my LBS but only a tenner on Wiggle.

Id like to support my LBS but that is a heck of a difference even with the delivery factored in.

run_Forrest_run

I was looking to buy a wheelset and I noticed the Edge Sports had the ones on their website at a very competitive rate so I popped into the shop to ask.
After waiting over 10 minutes while the young fella was on the phone to his Overlord I was told there was a 'glitch' with the online system and that the online price was incorrect. I laughed then saying I should just buy them quickly online so and he said the system wouldn't have allowed it because the discount was too much...what a load of sh1t.

As an act of goodwill they said they would give me a 10% discount on wheelset so I thought OK, I'll stick with them.

I was also going to buy a new cassette (and probably chain) but when I saw the price of the cassette I thought to myself feck this.

The final straw was being told it would be 5 days before they could take in the bike and do the small amount of work.

In the end I walked and bought everything (plus tools) online (CRC) and did it myself.

I must admit the service from CRC was brilliant, I ordered the stuff and had it delivered the following day (I paid the €3 for next day delivery).

I wouldn't be in a rush to go to a LBS again.