Worst tenant is an irish tenant..

handlemaster

http://m.independent.ie/life/home-garden/comment-irish-landlords-now-prefer-to-take-on-foreign-rather-irish-tenants-and-quietly-discriminate-against-our-own-35401100.html

Personally I aggree with alot been said here. The irish have an issue with knowing how to behave and treat a rental property. Would rent to a foreigner first, not that I wouldnt respect my obligations as a landlord but that the tenants are more likely to honour the contract.

Paulw

Mod Note: Any blanket racist comments will result in an immediate ban. Please remember that this is Accommodation & Property, so keep the discussion civil and constructive. If not, infractions will follow.

borderlinemeath

Anecdotally, I can't say I've had the same experience. The only tenants that ever damaged my property were Polish (deliberately setting fire to the kitchen during a drunken row). My husband had a house destroyed by Argentinian contractors, who punched holes through doors and walls and broke every stick of furniture, and left food to rot in the kitchen, fridge and outdoor bins. The rent was always paid on time but that house was looked after by an agency so they should have been on the ball. Another foreign national stole a tumble dryer after skipping out on 2 months rent.

I would somewhat agree that perhaps some Irish tenants are less inclined to clean their rented accommodation. I had a rental where the Irish tenant was working at the start but went on RA part way through a tenancy. While the house needed a deep clean and decoration after a long tenancy, it was left beyond filthy, as well as wardrobes left full of unwanted old clothes along with other discarded possessions hidden about the house and garden shed. Perhaps other nationalities are more aware of stricter policies in their own home countries where the deposit is returned when the property is handed back in the same condition it was originally rented. You can't really hide anything in an empty painted white house or apartment.

handlemaster

Thats somthing people under estimate is the cost of the clean up after a bad tenant. Rubbish is expensive to get rid of.

borderlinemeath

It is expensive, but deductible. I always submit my receipts for disposal of rubbish, old mattresses, furniture to my accountants at year end.

newacc2015

It is easy to say Irish tenants are troublesome. IMO the biggest issue with them is tardiness of rent. Having their rent less than a week late is considered good by a lot of their standards. A lot are quite filthy and I know air hostesses who say Irish are the dirtiest on flights. They just don't clean up after themselves. Irish will be the first tenants to complain about the state of the house when they move in, yet the same tenants when they move out will likely not bother cleaning.

A certain continental nationality who are allegedly the best tenants as there is low home ownership in their country and they all rent. They are the worst. I have yet to hear of a landlord not having issues with them. Between not paying rent, parties and being so demanding ie one wanted the light replaced in the tumble dryer.

There are so good tenants and some bad tenants. Irish people would be great tenants if they all paid on time.

Robineen

Well, I'd imagine Irish tenants greatly outnumber foreign ones so it makes sense that you're more likely to meet a troublesome Irish tenant. That doesn't mean that a greater proportion of Irish tenants cause trouble, there's just more of us.

Mrs OBumble

Robineen wrote: »

Well, I'd imagine Irish tenants greatly outnumber foreign ones so it makes sense that you're more likely to meet a troublesome Irish tenant. That doesn't mean that a greater proportion of Irish tenants cause trouble, there's just more of us.

There are bad in all ethnic groups.

In most countries indigenous people twho have their s*it together are more likely to have purchased a property so no longer be in the tenant pool. So the proportion of bad among the indigenous tenant pool is higher.

Robineen

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

There are bad in all ethnic groups.

In most countries indigenous people twho have their s*it together are more likely to have purchased a property so no longer be in the tenant pool. So the proportion of bad among the indigenous tenant pool is higher.

This is supposition. I'd say most tenants in this country are in a younger demographic so have just not got to the point of buying property yet. That says nothing of their character.

pillphil

newacc2015 wrote: »

...Irish will be the first tenants to complain about the state of the house when they move in, yet the same tenants when they move out will likely not bother cleaning.
...

Why would they if the place wasn't clean when they moved in?

El_Duderino 09

borderlinemeath wrote:

It is expensive, but deductible. I always submit my receipts for disposal of rubbish, old mattresses, furniture to my accountants at year end.

Wouldn't you just deduct the fees from the deposit? You could make a bit extra through deducting the tax, but if you passed the fees to the tenant through the deposit, that would be tax fraud.

The_Conductor

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Wouldn't you just deduct the fees from the deposit? You could make a bit extra through deducting the tax, but if you passed the fees to the tenant through the deposit, that would be tax fraud.

A deep clean and a significant quantity of items to be dumped/replaced? A deposit- which most people consider to be one month's rent in Ireland- is hardly more than a gesture if there is anything other than a cursory clean needed at the end of a tenancy.......... Also- 'normal wear and tear' should not equate with needing a new kitchen, bathroom, carpets, floor tiles etc etc- despite what some tenants insist.......... Its all well and good to say people won't treat a rental property properly- because they don't own it- but for a lot of people, you'd wonder if ownership would make one iota of difference, there are feral animals who take better care of their dwellings.

Any landlords I've spoken to- normally state their tenants of preference are guys in their 20s- preferably interns of some type or description (around here- that tends to be Intel staff). They don't give a hoot about nationalities- its more avoid young women and students at all costs- try to get guys in, they're more likely to take good care of the property. Seems a bit counter-intuitive to me- but its what the spoken wisdom is around here.

borderlinemeath

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Wouldn't you just deduct the fees from the deposit? You could make a bit extra through deducting the tax, but if you passed the fees to the tenant through the deposit, that would be tax fraud.

Have you any idea how much it costs to clean up after a bad tenant? Even if you rightfully hold onto the deposit, you'll still be well out of pocket. IIRC, the damage done by the Argentinian letting ran to about €5k and their deposit was €1600. It's no wonder that most landlords are asking for 2/3 months deposit to secure a tenancy.

Graces7

pillphil wrote: »

Why would they if the place wasn't clean when they moved in?

If the house was what they wanted; if there was really no other choice.... Been there done .

colm_c

An Uncle of mind has property rented out in San Francisco, the stories reported here, aren't even a patch.

He has tenants who stopped paying rent and refused entry, took two years of no rent and sheriffs to get them out.

When he got access to the property, the whole place was destroyed, needles, faeces and trash on every floor surface, fist holes in every wall, doors missing, remnants of open fires in the middle of the living room, loads more damage.

Cost 30k to put right and the ex-tenant didn't pay a penny.

Since then he only rents to friends or personal introductions.

The_Conductor

colm_c wrote: »

An Uncle of mind has property rented out in San Francisco, the stories reported here, aren't even a patch.

He has tenants who stopped paying rent and refused entry, took two years of no rent and sheriffs to get them out.

When he got access to the property, the whole place was destroyed, needles, faeces and trash on every floor surface, fist holes in every wall, doors missing, remnants of open fires in the middle of the living room, loads more damage.

Cost 30k to put right and the ex-tenant didn't pay a penny.

Since then he only rents to friends or personal introductions.

You do get the same and worse here.
A twist on this would be the tenants who tapped the gas and electricity mains illegally- and knocked out the power for a whole block for 4 days in the middle of winter over the holiday period, while off duty engineers tried to determine whether it was safe or not for the other tenants to remain/return to their dwellings.

No country has a monopoly on nightmare tenants- nightmare damage or illogical legal processes to be followed to evict dangerous (as opposed to non-paying) tenants from dwellings.

I've also detailed my sister's experience in Galway here on this forum- where her tenant decided to hold a barbeque behind the house (right beside the gas tanks for the kitchens in Jury's- just off Bridge Street). The structural damage cost 42k to repair- and the tenant argued that the one month's deposit was all my sister was entitled to towards the damage. Thankfully no-one was seriously injured- through some not so small miracle. Remarkably the PRTB (as it then was) agreed with the tenant- if my sister wished to have a buffer against a tenant causing damage to the property- her only recourse was to increase the deposit for subsequent tenants.

The framework in which the letting industry operates- is illogical in the extreme- and that too- is far from being unique to Ireland- or Irish tenants.

pilly

In my experience it's more about someone's personality and upbringing than their nationality.

Also, although I hate to be sexist I think having male tenants or a couple in my experience saves a lot of hassle because you haven't got them ringing you to bleed a radiator or change a light-bulb.

swervring

I've lived in rented properties with different nationalities over the course of 16 years of renting, and I don't think its true that Irish people are the worst. This includes living with Irish people in other countries so the indigenous comments don't apply to that situation.

The only experience I had of people I lived with causing any damage was on Erasmus with a load of Belgian students who completely trashed the apartment we lived in, they never cleaned up after themselves anyway and left rubbish and dirty dishes pile up on the balcony. They would then move the dishes back in at the weekend when they went home to the point that one weekend there was a fly infestation as the maggots from their dirty dishes hatched and I was left to sort it out as I had nowhere else to go. The last straw came when they smashed the place up, broke all the furniture, tore cabinets off the walls and let off the fire extinguisher in the hallway. The next day I went back to the student accomodation agency and begged them to find me somewhere else, which thankfully they did after intervention from my home university.

Point being that I've lived with people from all over the world, in several different countries, and I've never once had any issues with Irish people as tenants - always kept the place clean and had it perfect moving out.

I was also one of those lucky tenants with a Landlord who kept the rent way below market value for 6 years, she was very sad when we moved out even though she was getting 40% more rent. Don't think its in any way fair to take advantage of a good Landlord, doing so will only ruin it for the next person.

rossmores

I agree totally the attitude of Irish renters is mostly of disregard for the rented property.

I pay for a weekly refuse service for house hold rubbish collection the one Irish lady in the building when i asked if she needed green bags (it is the LLs responsibility to supply for free) replied "oh i don't want to know about recycling i just throw everything into the household bins" all the other foreign tenants are eagerly compliant even request bags when stocks are running low

Ashbx

pilly wrote: »

In my experience it's more about someone's personality and upbringing than their nationality.

Also, although I hate to be sexist I think having male tenants or a couple in my experience saves a lot of hassle because you haven't got them ringing you to bleed a radiator or change a light-bulb.

Wow....despite saying you do, you don't seem to hate being sexist anyway.

Are you a landlord that has had a previous tenant like that or do you just live in the 1940s? Maybe that is your experience, but I have lived in my house for 6 years...I am female and live alone. I have called my landlord once to replace a washing machine that was leaking. I think 99% of women I know can manage bleeding a radiator and changing a lightbulb.

pilly

Ashbx wrote: »

Wow....despite saying you do, you don't seem to hate being sexist anyway.

Are you a landlord that has had a previous tenant like that or do you just live in the 1940s? Maybe that is your experience, but I have lived in my house for 6 years...I am female and live alone. I have called my landlord once to replace a washing machine that was leaking. I think 99% of women I know can manage bleeding a radiator and changing a lightbulb.

Maybe I am being sexist, if I am I apologise but yes I am a LL that has had this experience with female tenants. I've never had it with male tenants.

And by the way I'm female also.

howzy2016

Is there any system where tenants have insurance for doing stupid stuff, like having a BBQ beside the gas, and causing substantial damage?To me that seems like a good idea. PRTB is pretty much useless for LL and tenant, slow at making decisions and to me, wildly off base.

izzyflusky

howzy2016 wrote: »

Is there any system where tenants have insurance for doing stupid stuff, like having a BBQ beside the gas, and causing substantial damage?To me that seems like a good idea. PRTB is pretty much useless for LL and tenant, slow at making decisions and to me, wildly off base.

In Spain it has been increasingly popular to ask the tenant to pay for rent insurance. They look at the tenant's finances, etc to see if they qualift and if they do and get approved they will cover missing rent's costs and legal fees, etc. So I would assume they would go after the tenant also if such damage was caused. Another option is requesting 6 months bank guarantee, plus the usual deposit of course. It won't be enough depending on the damage but it would take care of some of the expense I guess.

Samuel T. Cogley

pilly wrote: »

Maybe I am being sexist, if I am I apologise but yes I am a LL that has had this experience with female tenants. I've never had it with male tenants.

And by the way I'm female also.

And typing this from the kitchen I hope! (Please take that as it's intended which is tongue in cheek)

You've been sexist so I'm going to be ageist. I'm not sure it's sex but age! For a generation that was brought up with access to information I could only dream of as a kid it amazes me how thick Generation Y can be. I do think you're right about upbringing and being a landlord seems to be like being mammy to some.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Are we shure about this article....? I mean:

"One property owner told me this week..."
"Someone else I know in the property profession..."
"Yet another landlord I spoke to talked about..."

All very vague if you ask me.

I have a room I rent out here occasionally, but I tend to keept it to people in their late 20s or older, regardless of nationality. No way would I rent out to a student under 25 unless I knew them beforehand.

Samuel T. Cogley

On RAR I've had the greatest success with people under 25 TBH.

Point is well made though. The worst journalism is generally Irish Journalism!

ted1

My best tenants are an elderly traveller couple, worst was a single mum with 2 kids and a secret live in boyfriend. They see there for s few years and never cleaned the place or let me know if anything needed repairing.

Had to do a lot of work when they moved out.

Hollister11

The tenants who rent from my parents are usually medium term. They stay for about 4-5 years on average. <mod snip>

They had a couple with 4 kids who rented for 2 years and completely destroyed the place.

Firstly they were on rent allowance, so they didn't even pay for the house themselves thus they had no respect for it. It took my parents 4 months to get rent at all. They cancelled the rent cheques 5 months before they moved out, and lived in the house rent free. We found medical cards in multiple names of the same person, attempted to report it to the social welfare, and they refused to talk to us.

They left the house in a reck. It cost my parents 10K to gut the place and redo it. They had to pay the 1000 deposit back to them so they left the house (as suggested by threshold!!!) no rent the the last 5 months of the tenancy and 3 months of no rent for the duration of redoing the property.

The_Conductor

izzyflusky wrote: »

In Spain it has been increasingly popular to ask the tenant to pay for rent insurance. They look at the tenant's finances, etc to see if they qualift and if they do and get approved they will cover missing rent's costs and legal fees, etc. So I would assume they would go after the tenant also if such damage was caused. Another option is requesting 6 months bank guarantee, plus the usual deposit of course. It won't be enough depending on the damage but it would take care of some of the expense I guess.

I think this is an excellent idea.
Landlord's obligations are already being policed by Threshold, the RTB and others- but there is no quid-pro-quo.

EmoCourt

pilly wrote: »

Maybe I am being sexist, if I am I apologise but yes I am a LL that has had this experience with female tenants. I've never had it with male tenants.

And by the way I'm female also.

Same here. I had two female tenants who texted me asking for me to replace lightbulbs. I just said no. I wouldn't blacklist female tenants based on that though.

Not much mention on this thread about checking references before letting to nightmare tenants.

<mod Snip>

pilly

Libertarian Kant wrote: »

And typing this from the kitchen I hope! (Please take that as it's intended which is tongue in cheek)

You've been sexist so I'm going to be ageist. I'm not sure it's sex but age! For a generation that was brought up with access to information I could only dream of as a kid it amazes me how thick Generation Y can be. I do think you're right about upbringing and being a landlord seems to be like being mammy to some.

Of course I'm in the kitchen baking scones as we speak with the apron on. :P

Yeah, a lot of it could be to do with age alright because as an older woman I can do a lot of practical things simply because I had to figure them out because I didn't have the money to call someone to fix things.

But then both my sons and daughter can do the same because I showed them how.

You're right, it's probably more to do with upbringing than anything else.

pwurple

I've yet to notice any pattern with nationality.
The only generalisation I make, is that I prefer tenants to have full employment. It's purely for practical reasons. They spend less time in the place and do less wear and tear damage if they are working. 
My worst tenants were a French couple, whose relationship broke down and had a domestic row in the place. Smashed down doors, damaged walls throwing things at eachother, and pissed off the neighbours, who called me and asked me to call the gardai as they thought someone was being killed in there with the roaring. 
My best tenants currently are an Irish and Canadian couple who pay their rent on time by bank transfer, let me know quickly if something needs repair and are generally trouble free. But on the whole I've had good thai tenants, good polish tenants, good irish tenants. 

You can get fruitcakes of any nationality.

pilly

I'm going to accused of more generalisation here but I have found lads from certain countries very handy when it comes to anything mechanical and very hard working when it comes to decorating and gardening.

Paulw

Mod note: I think we've had enough discussion here and enough generalisation. Thread Closed.