Viper-flex shooting sticks

Tikka391

Hi all, I have a question about these shooting sticks.
I've been looking at these sticks and might put them on my wish list,(long list).
I have never used quad sticks before so
I was wondering when the gun is on them and you are acquiring your target, I understand you have some left and right movement but just say you have a fox at say 100 meters on x hairs then he runs in close. How would you adjust, hardly raise stock from v, or lean whole thing forward, might unbalance you.
Or the opposite if he's in close then runs out far and the gun is to low
I'm sure there is an easy way of doing it but I can't picture it in my mind if you know what I mean.
Many thanks.

clivej

Tikka391 wrote: »

Hi all, I have a question about these shooting sticks.
I've been looking at these sticks and might put them on my wish list,(long list).
I have never used quad sticks before so
I was wondering when the gun is on them and you are acquiring your target, I understand you have some left and right movement but just say you have a fox at say 100 meters on x hairs then he runs in close. How would you adjust, hardly raise stock from v, or lean whole thing forward, might unbalance you.
Or the opposite if he's in close then runs out far and the gun is to low
I'm sure there is an easy way of doing it but I can't picture it in my mind if you know what I mean.
Many thanks.

Not using 'Viper' sticks but DIY sticks............. @€;20

Yes you have some sideways movement but it is restricted. And yes as you say you lean forward or backward as need be.
My standing quad sticks now have 1" webbing on the top to give me more sideways movement, just the same as the 1m high smaller sticks as shown. And I hold the top of my scope down as shown to steady the rifle and get a second shot off quickly if needed.
I use the tall standing quad sticks for the sporting rifle competition held in the UK at 100y and 200y, and I'm UK champ at the moment.

My deer stalking quad sticks ...... DIY @€;20
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=100802990

Look for post #81 page 3
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055444087&page=3

post #5 for v1.0 design
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=84875677

cookimonster

Plus one for DIY quad sticks, use mine for open hill stalking, rabbiting and lamping fox.
You'll get very quick at deployment and fast direction changes with use. Very steady base and with the wide stance of the sticks feet your able to shift your aim in or out with very little movement of your own stance.
If going either DIY or commercial route ensure the sticks are as tall as yourself and you'll have no trouble with a rock steady base.

Cass

Apologies in advance. I started off with a short reply and it soon spiralled out of control.

I don't have the Viper Flex so won't comment directly on them, but i have three sets of shooting sticks and one is similar in design, the other is a standard two stick one (essentially a giant bipod) and the last are my Primos Sticks.

Each set has its pros and cons. However my Deerhunter bipod shooting sticks would be the lowest on my rankings. The twist leg adjustment is handy, but the legs are prone to collapse and getting a steady footing can be awkward. They also don't provide the most stable of platforms and basically just take some of the weight of the rifle. Other than that its like shooting off the shoulder.

The quad sticks i have are fixed leg. They can be awkward to carry at times especially in heavy cover. However they are much more secure than the bipod ones. The extra legs and hence extra rest point give a much better feel so i find my shooting improves. The legs not being adjustable can make things awkward but with fixed legs i also am not worried about collapse when resting the rifle on them.

The Viper Flex address this problem with the crutch pin system on the legs. So you get the best of both worlds with adjustable legs, but also no fear of collapse. IOW a very sturdy shooting platform. The front rest seems larger than the one on my set so allows a certain amount of sideways movement while still staying steady.

However, and again i don't own the Viper Flex, i believe they'll suffer the same problem as my own. Quick deployment. I've watched videos on the Viper Flex and other such shooting sticks and all them say how quick they can be deployed. However all the shooters in the videos already have the sticks set to the desired height. Now that seems an obvious thing to do, but what good are adjustable legs when you need to keep them at your desired height for quick deployment.

If you were to set the sticks to their shortest adjustment for easy carrying then you have four legs to click into place, and with the crutch pin system on the legs this will not be quick or quiet. So you keep them at the height you want which essentially eliminates the easy carry claim of the sticks when shortened.

Lastly leg placement. While you have four legs you only have two "anchor" points. However with adjustable or fixed legs this means constant adjustment of the legs to get the desired shooting height especially on uneven ground ( as opposed to the height you need when standing upright on level ground). not a huge issue if you can set up and wait, but for a quick shot its not ideal.

I use my Primos nearly all the time. The trigger system gives immediate and instant deployment and with each leg independent of the other it means that regardless of the ground conditions the sticks will "self level". I can even adjust them with a simple pull of the trigger and tilt or lean the sticks. Once the trigger is released they lock into position. This means i can carry in the shortest configuration for easy walking, and then within a couple of seconds and i mean seconds i can deploy on any ground with a perfect height, solid foot base, and solid shooting platform. They are by far the quickest set to use.

However these also come with their own issues. They weigh more than any other set of sticks i've owned or do own. Not a hefty bulk by any standard, but compared to others sticks, you'd know you're carrying them. Then the actual shooting platform. You only have one rest point as opposed to the two of the Viper Flex.

While you only have the one rest point i find i don't struggle any where near as much as i do with my Deerhunter ones. The simple reason being the Primos have three legs, and once locked they are locked. no movement in any direction and i can free up both hands to balance and aim the rifle.

I've heard of people having trouble with the Primos. The legs not locking and sometimes collapsing under the rifle. However with years of use i have never suffered any such issues. The key, imo, is maintenance. Like my rifles i clean and maintain my sticks after each shoot. I clean any dirt off them, and don't subject them to any unnecessary abuse.

Vegeta

As the guys have said you simply push forward and the rifle will be pointing closer and pull back and the rifle will point higher. Quad sticks are really stable and the only movement you will see is usually a bit of up and down as you sway slightly forward and back. Extending the non trigger hand straight, gripping the sticks and locking the arm helps reduce that sway (something I have to practice myself)

I have a set of Viper-Flex and they are really good. They are very well made and very easy to use but whether they represent value is another question. I had a set of DIY and didn't get on with them, but my brother and other shooting buddies have no issues with them. Guess I'm a delicate little flower

Vegeta

Cass wrote: »

However all the shooters in the videos already have the sticks set to the desired height. Now that seems an obvious thing to do, but what good are adjustable legs when you need to keep them at your desired height for quick deployment.

I think the main reason the Viper-Flex have adjustable legs is to set them up for different height people rather than any portability benefits. With DIY ones you can cut them to length but not an option on commercial ones really.
Having adjustable legs does allow them to be shortened and used in a sitting position and make them easier to transport in a car or backpack. I think they are side benefits though to the primary reason for making them adjustable which as I say is matching them to the shooters own height.

I know I set mine once and will just leave them at that height. Shortening them won't make them lighter (would be better balanced I guess) and I am going to carry them in my hand anyway so I don't ever see the need to shorten them again

Cass

Seem to have got out wires crossed and reading back i can see how the mix up occurred. My fault.

I did not mean i don't understand having adjustable legs, i meant in the videos i've watched the lads doing the reviews say how quickly they can be deployed. In seconds is the words they use. However the sticks are all set to the desired height.

How quickly can they, and not just Viper Flex, be deployed if they were adjusted to the shortest position for traveling with, and then had to be deployed. IOW adjust each leg out, then set up. I doubt it would be seconds.

Even using my own bipod ones with only two legs, and they are a twist leg system, i know it takes about 25 - 35 seconds. Even that can only be done because i have tape on the leg to mark where i need to adjust to.

The Primos sticks i use have the trigger stick and you walk up, spread the legs, and pull the trigger. They self adjust and when you release the trigger they're set. However, and in the interest of fairness, as i said above they have the drawback of not providing as steady a platform as the quad sticks due to the single rest point as opposed to the dual rest points of quad sticks.

Vegeta

Cass wrote: »

How quickly can they, and not just Viper Flex, be deployed if they were adjusted to the shortest position for traveling with, and then had to be deployed. IOW adjust each leg out, then set up. I doubt it would be seconds.

I'd say it's about the same as you say, maybe 25-30 seconds. I guess the point I was making is that you'd do this once shortly after purchasing them and then never mess with them again.

Another thing I should mention is that they are cold on hands on a frosty morning, but that's back to being a big softy again

Cass

Vegeta wrote: »

I guess the point I was making is that you'd do this once shortly after purchasing them and then never mess with them again.

I get what you're saying, but my point is if you leave them at your set height then the adjustment feature is pretty pointless. Or more accurately you don't need half as much adjustment.

I'm not trying to picky here, really i'm not, but were you have manually adjusted legs such as the crutch clip, or twist and lock systems you will not be set up in seconds. It'll take at least 30 seconds, but you have a pretty stable platform. Other systems do actually deploy in seconds, are much easier to adjust, but may not offer the same level of stability.

So it's a give and take. Which means more to you or which suits your style of shooting the best.

Another thing I should mention is that they are cold on hands on a frosty morning, but that's back to being a big softy again

Sorry bud, can't do anything to help you there. Maybe extra gloves?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMlZfoBYlj0

clivej

And that is why I use the short 1m length sticks. Never found 'Where I shoot' that I needed sticks standing. Apart from being longer and 'Just' getting in the way they weigh more. I've found that when I need the sticks, after spotting a deer or fox, I'm usually hunched down or kneeling anyway.

Also I use a harness for my Bins and can slide the short sticks through the straps, like sideways across my belly, and rest my elbows on the sticks and use the bins, very handy.

My deer stalking quad sticks ...... DIY @€;20
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showt...hp?p=100802990

Tikka391

Thanks lads for your responses.

I have the trigger sticks.
I do find them good but I find it very hard to stay dead still from standing with them. There is always a little side to side movemen I think , it's only very tiny, but on a fox facing you straight on,you know a narrow target, I find it hard to get totally still, i loose confidence and that makes it worse, and if I think I have time I will go down and use the bipod, not always possible due to ground undulating, long grass, fox moving off etc.

Ah I was just thinking the quad sticks might steady me up a bit.

Anyway thanks again.

Cass

That is a fault of the trigger sticks. Only one contact point so it's up to you to steady the rifle while supporting the rear of the gun.

Tikka391 wrote: »

Ah I was just thinking the quad sticks might steady me up a bit.

They will provide a better platform as you have two contact points and it will almost eliminate side to side movement. The only thing after that is forward/backward movement and this can be greatly reduced with time and use.

Tikka391

Cass wrote: »

That is a fault of the trigger sticks. Only one contact point so it's up to you to steady the rifle while supporting the rear of the gun.


They will provide a better platform as you have two contact points and it will almost eliminate side to side movement. The only thing after that is forward/backward movement and this can be greatly reduced with time and use.

Thanks Cass,
I know there has to be a limit to the amount of stuff you bring out before it gets ridiculous, but I saw on the viper flex website they have an extra leg witch goes to the front of the sticks to make them rock solid.
I have a t3 tac it will have a mod on in next couple of months, with me lamp and calling mirror, I'd need a golf cart to carry all gear.

I'm looking forward to the summer nights coming in, I'm going to try and make more time to do lots of practice.
That's if I can get any bullets ha ha, starting to run low.

Captainaxiom

clivej wrote: »

Not using 'Viper' sticks but DIY sticks............. @€;20

Yes you have some sideways movement but it is restricted. And yes as you say you lean forward or backward as need be.
My standing quad sticks now have 1" webbing on the top to give me more sideways movement, just the same as the 1m high smaller sticks as shown. And I hold the top of my scope down as shown to steady the rifle and get a second shot off quickly if needed.
I use the tall standing quad sticks for the sporting rifle competition held in the UK at 100y and 200y, and I'm UK champ at the moment.

My deer stalking quad sticks ...... DIY @€;20
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=100802990

Look for post #81 page 3
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055444087&page=3

post #5 for v1.0 design
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=84875677

After reading this I picked up the few bits today and I'm going to knock them up tomorrow.

Tikka391

Captainaxiom wrote: »

After reading this I picked up the few bits today and I'm going to knock them up tomorrow.

Don't forget take and show loads of pictures and tell us how you found using them. Pros/cons.

Vegeta

Cass wrote: »

Or more accurately you don't need half as much adjustment.

I'd tend to agree with this. I won't use the sticks sitting or break them down for transport so I do not need the wide range of adjustment that they come with. Others might I guess, and it does make them easier to post for the manufacturer but as you say limited usefulness.

garv123

I have the seeland quad sticks from sportsden and a friend has the stable sticks from ballistech..

Both half the price of viperflex at €100..

I got them in August, and I havent gone deer stalking without them since. Absolutely brilliant. Easy to setup and lightweight to carry. Rock solid too.