Training contracts at medium sized firms

novus actus

Hi all,

I've decided that I would like to do my traineeship at a medium sized firm. I think the right place would provide a good breadth of experience, allowing me to specialise in a particular area which would be transferable to larger firms and other medium sized firms while also providing the experience to set up my own practice down the line if I choose to do so.

A more immediate problem of mine is financial though. Would anyone know the general approach of medium sized firms for paying fees and or paying you while you are at Blackhall? I have a very large student loan as is, this will jump to the size of a nice deposit on a house in Dublin if I have to pay for Blackhall myself! I worry that there would be a massive variation in the approach taken by the different firms?

Any shared experiences would be appreciated!

Mr. Incognito

It depends on the firm.

Top tier firms pay for Blackhall and pay you a wage.
The pay off is you are likely to be photocopying for a prolonged period of your training contract.

Mid Tier Firms can pay fees or seek a contribution. I know of some firms that do half and half plus a salary.
Experience depends on the type of firm. It can specialise in Criminal for example or Employment or any other niche area.

Lower tier firms or one man bands rarely pay for Blackhall and, in breach of the law, don't pay trainees. As a trainee you are entitled to minimum wage including when you are in Blackhall. The non payment of Trainees is a huge problem in Blackhall because trainees are not exactly in a position to push for it and most borrow heavily to qualify. The payoff can be good experience or terrible experience.

In my view mid tier is the way to go. Better all round experience and not too much financial hardship. The top tier firms tend to recruit the mid tier firm newly qualified solicitors which tells you all you need to know about a top tier training. There are exceptions of course but thats my experience of it anyway.

novus actus

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

It depends on the firm.

Top tier firms pay for Blackhall and pay you a wage.
The pay off is you are likely to be photocopying for a prolonged period of your training contract.

Mid Tier Firms can pay fees or seek a contribution. I know of some firms that do half and half plus a salary.
Experience depends on the type of firm. It can specialise in Criminal for example or Employment or any other niche area.

Lower tier firms or one man bands rarely pay for Blackhall and, in breach of the law, don't pay trainees. As a trainee you are entitled to minimum wage including when you are in Blackhall. The non payment of Trainees is a huge problem in Blackhall because trainees are not exactly in a position to push for it and most borrow heavily to qualify. The payoff can be good experience or terrible experience.

In my view mid tier is the way to go. Better all round experience and not too much financial hardship. The top tier firms tend to recruit the mid tier firm newly qualified solicitors which tells you all you need to know about a top tier training. There are exceptions of course but thats my experience of it anyway.

Thanks very much for the great reply Mr Incognito. This has helped me really decide that a mid tier term is the way to go. I have read posts in the past which also very much agreed with what you have said.

Just one question on that, would you say it would be unusual for a mid tier firm not to at least pay you the minimum wage while at blackhall?

Mr. Incognito

novus actus wrote: »

Thanks very much for the great reply Mr Incognito. This has helped me really decide that a mid tier term is the way to go. I have read posts in the past which also very much agreed with what you have said.

Just one question on that, would you say it would be unusual for a mid tier firm not to at least pay you the minimum wage while at blackhall?

It would be very unusual and not a firm I would be interested in working for if their culture is to exploit their own staff.

Any firm is only as good as their staff and any firms reputation depends on its own staff. If your own trainees are going around bad mouthing their firms because they are not getting paid that spreads fast.

LegallyAbroad

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

It depends on the firm.

Top tier firms pay for Blackhall and pay you a wage.
The pay off is you are likely to be photocopying for a prolonged period of your training contract.

Mid Tier Firms can pay fees or seek a contribution. I know of some firms that do half and half plus a salary.
Experience depends on the type of firm. It can specialise in Criminal for example or Employment or any other niche area.

Lower tier firms or one man bands rarely pay for Blackhall and, in breach of the law, don't pay trainees. As a trainee you are entitled to minimum wage including when you are in Blackhall. The non payment of Trainees is a huge problem in Blackhall because trainees are not exactly in a position to push for it and most borrow heavily to qualify. The payoff can be good experience or terrible experience.

In my view mid tier is the way to go. Better all round experience and not too much financial hardship. The top tier firms tend to recruit the mid tier firm newly qualified solicitors which tells you all you need to know about a top tier training. There are exceptions of course but thats my experience of it anyway.

I'm not sure what you're basing that on (perhaps your own traineeship? Which is fair enough if you did), but having trained in a large firm, it certainly was not my experience.

I had plenty of client exposure, attended a few trials, was frequently down in court, attended board meetings, closings, was on daily client calls during large deals etc.

The trade-off, I'd imagine (I've never worked in mid/small firm), is the hours/client pressure/demands.