Gun safe inspections?

Nekarsulm

As a follow-on from the thread about Safe keys, how many here have ever had a Garda actually inspect their security setup?
I have had three guns for nigh on twenty years, and never been inspected. Only put in a safe five years ago, though.
Changed to a centre fire, and when leaving in forms,the Guard at the station asked if I had a Safe installed.
When I said I had, he asked how much I paid for it. When told, he replied "It must be a good one" and that was the last I heard about it. Live in rural area, if that makes any difference.

Luckysasha

I had an inspection a couple of months ago when I applied for my pistol license. I have a .22 rifle already locked away in a safe and I thought I could house the pistol in the same safe. The FO called out for a look and told me, not only did I need a separate safe for the pistol but it couldn't even be in the same room as the rifle safe. On top of that I also needed a separate lock box to store my ammo completely separate from both the pistol and rifle. He did a follow up visit a week or so later when he was " just passing " to see all was in place. Like you I am in the middle of the country on a farm.

Boaty

The crime prevention officer will come inspect your setup if you have over a certain amount of guns, four or more or a restricted gun if I remember correctly.
They see if you have a monitored alarm and safe and that your house meets to basic security standards.
Youd get about a week to get your setup up to scratch.

clivej

CPO has been to the house 5 times for me. Always when away happy with my setup.

richiedel123

Had them twice. Happy both times. Always found them helpful and nice

jimmyd87

They only asked to see my safe when I was applying for the .308 for deer, Im assuming the more serious the hardware, the more diligent they become about actually making sure lads have safes. You would want to be mad not to have a decent safe in a suitable location in any instance.

MarcinG

Before my 1st licence (22) was procesed local garda paid me a visit. Check if safe is already fixed to walls, house alarm present etc. He said without it he wouldn't even touch my application. And tbh i think this is the way it suppose to be.

Grizzly 45

About four or five times over the last eight years.Always have the decency to call me a few days in advance.

Boaty

Depending on the county you'll even get the Cpo out on a Sunday, very flexible and helpful people.

cavan shooter

My local lad came out when I asked him to visit. Tea bickies the works. It's a small rural station now closed....

BattleCorp

The Crime Prevention Officer checked my setup. He did a very detailed check on the house, safes, alarm, windows, doors etc. He was extremely thorough.

He did his best at one stage to rip the safe from the wall but it didn't budge. (Phew)

After that he was happy with my setup. Sound guy to be honest. We had a good chat.

Tikka391

Hi there lads, sorry but if you don't mind me jumping in, what are the actual minimum requirements for the alarm in the house.

In the summer I will be applying for a what will be a fourth gun going in the house, two shotguns and rifle a present, fourth will be another shotgun.
The young lads are growing up quick behind me.

As I understand it has to be a monitored alarm, but does every room need to be alarmed or just a room with a gun safe, what about front and back door.
As for the monitoring does it have to be by a specific monitoring company or can you just have text alerts to the phone
I live in a rented house although it's a long-term lease I wouldn't like to have you spent too much on alarm and then leave the house within 3 to 5 years.

Any information would be Great

Many thanks

Sam Kade

Nekarsulm wrote: »

As a follow-on from the thread about Safe keys, how many here have ever had a Garda actually inspect their security setup?
I have had three guns for nigh on twenty years, and never been inspected. Only put in a safe five years ago, though.
Changed to a centre fire, and when leaving in forms,the Guard at the station asked if I had a Safe installed.
When I said I had, he asked how much I paid for it. When told, he replied "It must be a good one" and that was the last I heard about it. Live in rural area, if that makes any difference.

When I was renewing my shotgun licence last year the Garda asked if I had a gun safe which I don't have. He said I needed to get a trigger lock because if I were inspected I could be fined :rolleyes: I'd say he was bored or having an off day or just trying to show his authority.

BattleCorp

My Super insisted that the rooms that had safes in them had to have a monitored alarm, both landline and with GSM backup. I have every room in the house alarmed so he was happy with my setup.

Not only did he check my alarm setup, he also checked my front and back door for strength, types of locking mechanisms etc. They also had to be to a certain standard (apologies but I can't remember what they were).

The guidelines are a minimum standard and your Super has the power to insist on going above and beyond those guidelines.

Rimfire Shooter

Sam Kade wrote: »

When I was renewing my shotgun licence last year the Garda asked if I had a gun safe which I don't have. He said I needed to get a trigger lock because if I were inspected I could be fined :rolleyes: I'd say he was bored or having an off day or just trying to show his authority.

And attitudes like yours are some of the problem.

BattleCorp

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

And attitudes like yours are some of the problem.

As far as I'm aware, you don't need a gun safe if you have only one shotgun.

Ziggieire

The Cpo is out to check my place when ever i get a new rifle or twice a year.
Quick test of the security system, safe fixings and lighting and good to go.

Rimfire Shooter

BattleCorp wrote: »

As far as I'm aware, you don't need a gun safe if you have only one shotgun.

I'm well aware what's required. You don't need a safe for a single shotgun unless Super says you do. However, it seems he doesn't even have a trigger lock or does he realise the gun is meant to be broken down and the parts stored in separate places as well as a trigger lock in the absence of a safe either.

In this day & age a safe should be mandatory for all firearms even if it's not legally required.

I've had 2 x inspections and passed both no bother and have way more security than I supposed to have but I take my responsibilities as a firearm owner very seriously unlike some obviously. People who throw their eyes up at sound advice from Gardai make you wonder should they have firearms.

Kat1170

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

People who throw their eyes up at sound advice from Gardai make you wonder should they have firearms.

If you think threatening someone that they could be fined :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: for not having a trigger lock is sound advice you are deluded. Please, please show me in the firearms act where this is written.

You hear more complaints about these ignorant bully boy scare mongering tactics than is acceptable.

A simple bit of helpful LEGAL information on safe gun storage will go much further and be far more likely to be taken onboard than Bullsh1t.

And before you say it, yes the Super is entitled to request(demand) a gunsafe or trigger lock if he/she see's fit and that's ok, but it is not ok for some Guard to make stuff up.

PSXDupe

I really don't understand why people are caught up on the minimum requirements. Think of it this way, the lad or lady breaking into your home isn't an angel and more than likely will not be using your firearm for any good.

Personally, from day one I've had 3 safes, firearms in one, bolt - mags - slides in another and ammo in the third. House was always monitored by group 4 security and last year upgrade the alarm again to GSM. The safe with the firearms is also alarmed 24x7 regardless if the alarm is set or not. It's setup as a panic zone so the alarm dials the monitoring center immediately if the safe is messed with.

I also have full control from my phone so if you even have a brain fart and can't remember if the house alarm is set or not, I can simply check it remotely. If I could electrify the thing I would.

Ok, monitoring costs a couple hundred quid a year, but so does a couple of boxes of 308 ammo.

Could you imagine how you'd feel if one of your firearms were use in a criminal act all for the sake of a couple of hundred quid.

Rimfire Shooter

Kat1170 wrote: »

Please, please show me in the firearms act where this is written.

And before you say it, yes the Super is entitled to request(demand) a gunsafe or trigger lock if he/she see's fit and that's ok,

You should have a read of the relevant SI & too a lesser extent the Guidelines on the matter.

Boaty

Kat1170 wrote: »

yes the Super is entitled to request(demand) a gunsafe or trigger lock if he/she see's fit and that's ok, but it is not ok for some Guard to make stuff up.

"Some Guard" is ensuring that the public is kept safe from incompetent gun owners who's houses could become a target due to their failure to secure their home. If your underable to understand this then you should sell your gun.

BattleCorp

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

You should have a read of the relevant SI & too a lesser extent the Guidelines on the matter.

There's the link to the relevant S.I.


http://www.garda.ie/Documents/User/SI%20307%202009%20FIREARMS%20(SECURE%20ACCOMMODATION)%20REGULATIONS%202009.pdf

Rimfire Shooter

BattleCorp wrote: »

There's the link to the relevant S.I.


http://www.garda.ie/Documents/User/SI%20307%202009%20FIREARMS%20(SECURE%20ACCOMMODATION)%20REGULATIONS%202009.pdf

Thanks. Hopefully you've not wasted your time & those who need to see it do.

I'm not sure of the fine bit but I reckon that and/or a jail term ar a possibility & you'd risk revocation of your licence if you don't follow all the relevant legislation.

BattleCorp

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

Thanks. Hopefully you've not wasted your time & those who need to see it do.

I'm not sure of the fine bit but I reckon that and/or a jail term ar a possibility & you'd risk revocation of your licence if you don't follow all the relevant legislation.

If you didn't receive a fine or a jail term, I'm fairly sure that your licence wouldn't be renewed. And that would really hurt.

Kat1170

I'm all for securing your guns, money, jewellery as much as possible, but, at the end of the day you could end up like one of my friends in work. he had no guns but a very nice car. Woke up one night with two scumbags standing over him and his wife, one had a hammer raised over his wife. I can tell you now, he couldn't give them the keys quickly enough. Real kicker for him was it was the first new car he ever owned.

If they want what you have, they'll get it. One way or the other.

Bad_alibi

Kat1170 wrote: »

I'm all for securing your guns, money, jewellery as much as possible, but, at the end of the day you could end up like one of my friends in work. he had no guns but a very nice car. Woke up one night with two scumbags standing over him and his wife, one had a hammer raised over his wife. I can tell you now, he couldn't give them the keys quickly enough. Real kicker for him was it was the first new car he ever owned.

If they want what you have, they'll get it. One way or the other.

And if he's a proper alarm and security on the house he'd of woken long before the two scumbags made it upstairs to stand at the end of his bed.

The logic of sure if they want it they'll take it so there's no point doing anything doesn't cut it when it comes to firearms security.

Kat1170

Then they'll wait until you step outside your door, or worse, until your wife/kids do. If they want it, really want it, then they will get it.

Tiger kidnapping's anyone ??

Every time I park up my bike it has three locks and an alarm on it. Won't stop scum from stealing it if they want it but hopefully it will make the poor buggers that is parked beside mine seem like an easier option. At the end of the day you can only do so much but its up to each individual to decide when enough becomes too much.

Bad_alibi

Kat1170 wrote: »

Then they'll wait until you step outside your door, or worse, until your wife/kids do. If they want it, really want it, then they will get it.

Tiger kidnapping's anyone ??

Every time I park up my bike it has three locks and an alarm on it. Won't stop scum from stealing it if they want it but hopefully it will make the poor buggers that is parked beside mine seem like an easier option. At the end of the day you can only do so much but its up to each individual to decide when enough becomes too much.

At the end of the day when it comes to firearms it's not your choice to decide it's the supers

Kat1170

Bad_alibi wrote: »

At the end of the day when it comes to firearms it's not your choice to decide it's the supers

Of course its my choice, its my choice if I want to take the Supers requirements as being the maximum I want or the minimum I will work from.

Rimfire Shooter

So you've gone from we need no security as the legislation doesn't say we do to and now you've decided to argue that we shouldn't bother as we may be the victim of a tiger kidnapping. The security is to prevent the more possible burglary while you're out scenario than a tiger kidnapping scenario.

Kat1170

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

So you've gone from we need no security as the legislation doesn't say we do to and now you've decided to argue that we shouldn't bother as we may be the victim of a tiger kidnapping. The security is to prevent the more possible burglary while you're out scenario than a tiger kidnapping scenario.

I'd really love you to point out where I said that ??????

And I'm still waiting on the relevant Act that says you WILL be fined if you don't use a trigger lock on a single shotgun.

Bad_alibi

Kat1170 wrote: »

And I'm still waiting on the relevant Act that says you WILL be fined if you don't use a trigger lock on a single shotgun.

Do you know that little box you tick on the FCA1 that says you've complied with the secure accommemdation regulations. Well if your super tells you to comply with the minimum safety standards for a shotgun that means you've to have a trigger lock, the gun is to be broken into three pieces and each piece is to be hidden in a separate part of the home. I'd say many a farmer would fall foul here.

Rimfire Shooter

Kat1170 wrote: »

And I'm still waiting on the relevant Act that says you WILL be fined if you don't use a trigger lock on a single shotgun.

As the amendment by the Criminal Justice Act 2006 doesn't list a "punishment" you refer to Section 25 of the original Firearms Act 1925, which states

"25.—Any person who commits an offence under this Act in respect of which no other punishment is provided by this Act shall be liable in respect of each such offence—

"(a) on summary conviction thereof to a fine not exceeding fifty pounds or, at the discretion of the court, to imprisonment with or without hard labour for a term not exceeding six months, or to both such fine and such imprisonment; or

"(b) on conviction thereof on indictment, to a fine not exceeding one hundred pounds or, at the discretion of the court, to imprisonment with or without hard labour for a term not exceeding two years or to both such fine and such imprisonment."

As for justifying my other comment I'll return to that shortly as I've something else to do now.

Kat1170

JEBUS, what I said was instead of making up bull about fine's the Guard/Guards would be better off giving proper helpful advise to people rather than threats.

Rimfire Shooter

Kat1170 wrote: »

JEBUS, what I said was instead of making up bull about fine's the Guard/Guards would be better off giving proper helpful advise to people rather than threats.

You've read my post? They are not making it up about the fine

Bad_alibi

Kat1170 wrote: »

JEBUS, what I said was instead of making up bull about fine's the Guard/Guards would be better off giving proper helpful advise to people rather than threats.

Plus your basing your argument on one side of a conversation with a guard posted on the internet, taking it a gospel and stating with absolute fact that the guard/guards is full of **** and threading the public without known the law.
This is the problem with 99% on the rubbish online & FB, people not known the correct facts but ploughing away with their "opinions"

Sam Kade

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

I'm well aware what's required. You don't need a safe for a single shotgun unless Super says you do. However, it seems he doesn't even have a trigger lock or does he realise the gun is meant to be broken down and the parts stored in separate places as well as a trigger lock in the absence of a safe either.

In this day & age a safe should be mandatory for all firearms even if it's not legally required.

I've had 2 x inspections and passed both no bother and have way more security than I supposed to have but I take my responsibilities as a firearm owner very seriously unlike some obviously. People who throw their eyes up at sound advice from Gardai make you wonder should they have firearms.

Stop jumping to conclusions, for your information I bought the trigger guard when the Garda told me and I always break the shotgun.

Sam Kade

Boaty wrote: »

"Some Guard" is ensuring that the public is kept safe from incompetent gun owners who's houses could become a target due to their failure to secure their home. If your underable to understand this then you should sell your gun.

Did you even see the trigger guard? The one the garda recommended could easily be opened without a key

PSXDupe

Sam Kade wrote: »

Did you even see the trigger guard? The one the garda recommended could easily be opened without a key

So are you saying that because the guard recommend a trigger guard that was useless that you should not have anything.

A trigger guard does not in anyway prevent a firearm from being stolen, it just means the guy taken it has a bit of work to do when he gets home with your stolen firearm.

I suppose if you are happy with that level of security and the guards are happy then that is fine.

I think the point a lot of people are making it that the law states the minimum but is a guide line. And lot of people prefer to secure their firearm a bit better for whatever reason, could be robbery, could be children in the house, lots of reason.

If you don't have a safe, do you leave ammunition unsecured.

Rimfire Shooter

You originally said

Sam Kade wrote: »

When I was renewing my shotgun licence last year the Garda asked if I had a gun safe which I don't have. He said I needed to get a trigger lock because if I were inspected I could be fined :rolleyes: I'd say he was bored or having an off day or just trying to show his authority.

Then you quoted this post with your answer below

Rimfire Shooter wrote: »

I'm well aware what's required. You don't need a safe for a single shotgun unless Super says you do. However, it seems he doesn't even have a trigger lock or does he realise the gun is meant to be broken down and the parts stored in separate places as well as a trigger lock in the absence of a safe either.

In this day & age a safe should be mandatory for all firearms even if it's not legally required.

I've had 2 x inspections and passed both no bother and have way more security than I supposed to have but I take my responsibilities as a firearm owner very seriously unlike some obviously. People who throw their eyes up at sound advice from Gardai make you wonder should they have firearms.

Sam Kade wrote: »

Stop jumping to conclusions, for your information I bought the trigger guard when the Garda told me and I always break the shotgun.

I din't jump to conclusions I made assumptions that I based on your original statement.

The Guard gave you some advice rather than make it an issue that you had no trigger lock (this came to light upon renewal no application) and you have an attitude over it. You'll learn

You say you split it up & hide the parts and have always done. I'll take your word for it.

And if you notice I showed in an earlier post you could be fined or get jail or both, so the Guard was right

cursai

Some people here should not be given a renewal. They should also be checked for proper butter knife storage. The gall. And the attitude.

Sparks

Kat1170 wrote: »

Of course its my choice, its my choice if I want to take the Supers requirements as being the maximum I want or the minimum I will work from.

How in the name of basic literacy is this still in anyone's mind?
No. It's not your choice. The law is very, very clear in only a few areas and this is one of them. The SI sets out the statutory minimum requirements. If the Super wants you to have more than those, he is legally empowered to set the standard you have to meet. You can't simply ignore the guy. If you did want to say he was wrong, you'd have to go to the district court and argue your case to the judge; and unless the Super was demanding 24hr manned security in your home or something equally ridiculous, you're going to lose. As far as I know, nobody has ever even tried to challange their Super's security requirements like that (no, that's not what the "gun safes" case was about), and I've not heard of any Supers taking liberties with that particular legal power either.

I mean, come on. It's been law for over a decade now.

Kat1170

Kat1170 wrote: »

Of course its my choice, its my choice if I want to take the Supers requirements as being the maximum I want or the minimum I will work from.

Sparks wrote: »

How in the name of basic literacy is this still in anyone's mind?
No. It's not your choice. The law is very, very clear in only a few areas and this is one of them. The SI sets out the statutory minimum requirements. If the Super wants you to have more than those, he is legally empowered to set the standard you have to meet. You can't simply ignore the guy. If you did want to say he was wrong, you'd have to go to the district court and argue your case to the judge; and unless the Super was demanding 24hr manned security in your home or something equally ridiculous, you're going to lose. As far as I know, nobody has ever even tried to challange their Super's security requirements like that (no, that's not what the "gun safes" case was about), and I've not heard of any Supers taking liberties with that particular legal power either.

I mean, come on. It's been law for over a decade now.

Maybe, just maybe, you should read what I said just once more !!!!!!!!!!!!

What I said is it is my choice whether I took the Supers requirements as the MAXIMUM amount of security I would have OR take them as the MINIMUM and work from there. I certainly did NOT say that it was my choice whether or not to ignore them.

Boaty

Kat1170 wrote: »

Maybe, just maybe, you should read what I said just once more !!!!!!!!!!!!

What I said is it is my choice whether I took the Supers requirements as the MAXIMUM amount of security I would have OR take them as the MINIMUM and work from there. I certainly did NOT say that it was my choice whether or not to ignore them.

Why would he give you the MAXIMUM? It seams like your reluctant to have basic security measures, some people even have safes in their vehicles for gun transportation.

Sparks

Kat1170 wrote: »

Maybe, just maybe, you should read what I said just once more !!!!!!!!!!!!

What I said is it is my choice whether I took the Supers requirements as the MAXIMUM amount of security I would have OR take them as the MINIMUM and work from there. I certainly did NOT say that it was my choice whether or not to ignore them.

Ah, I see. Sorry Kat, my bad.

Kat1170

Boaty wrote: »

Why would he give you the MAXIMUM? It seams like your reluctant to have basic security measures, some people even have safes in their vehicles for gun transportation.

Where did I say what he requires 'is' my maximum ????
I said it was my choice 'IF' I took that as my minimum or my maximum .
I may not have joined in with the 'Willy Waving' mine is better than yours re. security, but then I have no intentions of giving anyone on an internet forum any indication of what security set-up I have or have not.

Captainaxiom

Haven't had an inspection in 15yrs

goz83

Haven't had a visit, but I made sure everything was secure and in place before I applied. My security is already way above what is required, but I have plans for more security upgrades, including safe alarms and concealment before applying for a pistol license.