Duplex or 3 bed semi?

BBMcQ

athtrasna wrote: »

We have a duplex and the apartment is below. Like the previous poster no noise travels between us and the apartment but we can hear the duplex next door.

Hey, talk about giving an old thread the kiss of life...

Just wondering what people's opinions are of this setup now that the recession has been and gone. The duplex has a separate unit below with its own door access at the opposite site of the building as your own.

We are looking at a 4 bed terraced duplex (climb about 16 steps) to the front door. The other options is a 3 bed semi which would cost about 10% more and have a smaller square footage.

Positives:
- 25% more square footage internally
- More modern build, no huge structural surprises
- 4 bed with one big sitting room
- mortgage would be very comfortable for us
- straight price, no bidding war
- wired for good tv/broadband
- good running showers and kitchen/bathroom is fitted
- 2 front of house parking spaces
- we stop paying rent asap. This is a big one for us as we have been renting for 6 years and over 100k paid off someone else's mortgage. Plus we have childcare costs soon.

Negatives
- no front garden and only a small terrace out back
- the steps, we have a baby and grandparents aren't getting younger (they are all around 60). Will probably add other baby in 3-4 years
- duplex development doesn't look as nice as established estate
- it's not a new build so we lose our FTB rebate and LTV discount
- potentially harder to re-sell if we want to upgrade in future
- many of the units are renting and some social housing

bren2002

Does the duplex have mgt fees and the 3 bed semi have none?

godtabh

<quote snipped>

I've been living in a duplex for the last 7 years as described above.

Two kids. Grandparents in their 60s. No issues there. You figure it out.

Our biggest issue is selling it. Our house is much bigger than the surrounding area which is mainly 3 bed semi-ds. IN 9 months the house was on the market we got zero serious offers. We were the cheapest house in the area.

Irish people want a back garden. They will pay a premium and sacrifice living space.

If you buy one you may not be able to sell it

athtrasna

BBMcQ wrote: »

Hey, talk about giving an old thread the kiss of life...

Mod note

Talk about not doing that. Bumping an 8 year old thread is unnecessary. Split to new thread.

Eric Cartman

buy a semi if you can, the less house your house is attached to the better.
You won't have to deal with neighbours faulty appliances leaking into your property , noise travelling, a giant stairs, parking woes , a management company and all the other craic that comes with duplex/apartment living.

BBMcQ

bren2002 wrote: »

Does the duplex have mgt fees and the 3 bed semi have none?

Yeah 800 a year including bin charges and some site maintenance, gardening etc

BBMcQ

athtrasna wrote: »

Mod note

Talk about not doing that. Bumping an 8 year old thread is unnecessary. Split to new thread.

My bad, I've started new threads and gotten a smack on the knuckles for not checking/referring to other threads. Thanks for the heads up

BBMcQ

godtabh wrote: »

<quote snipped>

I've been living in a duplex for the last 7 years as described above.

Two kids. Grandparents in their 60s. No issues there. You figure it out.

Our biggest issue is selling it. Our house is much bigger than the surrounding area which is mainly 3 bed semi-ds. IN 9 months the house was on the market we got zero serious offers. We were the cheapest house in the area.

Irish people want a back garden. They will pay a premium and sacrifice living space.

If you buy one you may not be able to sell it

Crazy considering most of the year outside space is a waste. The duplexes are set into an established estate with playground, tennis courts, large open fields.

Thanks for the advice on the re-sale difficulty. It's a big concern for us. Have you tried renting out the house or is that a no-go. I'm wondering could you come in with an offer under asking price for a duplex considering the poor re-sale. Then again, there is a nothing stopping a 4 bed large house being a "forever house".

athtrasna

BBMcQ wrote: »

My bad, I've started new threads and gotten a smack on the knuckles for not checking/referring to other threads. Thanks for the heads up

There's other threads (within last 12-18 months) and then there's absolute zombie threads, 8 years qualifies as the latter

On your question, house, house, house. I'm still in my duplex after 12 years but no kids here. My sister has a duplex (which I begged her not to buy but the location won her over) and the lack of private outdoor space is an absolute nightmare with two boisterous under 5s. Add in management company and all the steps, run away would be my advice.

BBMcQ

athtrasna wrote: »

There's other threads (within last 12-18 months) and then there's absolute zombie threads, 8 years qualifies as the latter

On your question, house, house, house. I'm still in my duplex after 12 years but no kids here. My sister has a duplex (which I begged her not to buy but the location won her over) and the lack of private outdoor space is an absolute nightmare with two boisterous under 5s. Add in management company and all the steps, run away would be my advice.

Not what I wanted to hear lol, hoping that ppl live normal lives just one storey up yeah the location of the duplex and of the semi d's are the same, both brilliant but I'm not sure a semi-d in a good condition (let alone turnkey) is near our price range. Would the duplex turn offs really outshine the 1300sq ft versus 900 for a semi-d?

Denny_Crane

You have a 60 year old Baby?

House all the way.

bleary

I'm not against apartments or duplexes.ive lived in both but there would want to be a much larger differential than 10% to make me pick one. Probably 30-40%.
Living beside one house is one thing but living over someone is another. To be fair the apartment below you will have most of the issue but do you want to feel guilty whenever you stick in the washing machine, kid goes nuts etc?

Besides that biggest issue I found with the lack of outdoor space was open plan living and washing. Unless you use a drier all the time? Then the steps, you can survive with buggy but when parents aren't great what dya do. My mother is healthy but even my car choice is affected by her advancing age.
Finally who will live in a four bed duplex typically? A bunch of renters, who lives in 3 bed semi d? More likely to be families, so consider who you want to live beside.
House - if you can stretch to it at all.

bleary

You can also extend the house in years to come if needed.

bren2002

Would disagree that outdoor space is wasted most of the year. Our kids were out in the back all summer, April-october. Even now at weekends if it's dry they can draw chalk on the patio. They're home from creche and school too late in weekdays for doing that.

They're asking for a trampoline and slide for next summer. I really like the idea of them having outdoor space that's private. There's a huge green in front of the house too for when they're a bit older.

Also kids will want bikes in the future, could be difficult for them to drag them up and down steps.

Paulw

I live in a 3 bed apt. It's larger than any of the houses in the estate. I have a massive green outside, and we have a private inner courtyard with a small playground. Blessed with facilities.

We looked at houses and found most we looked at smaller than out place and costing more. Our management fees are not bad, and the place is well run.

I've a 3yr old. Most days she has a walk in the park and/or spends some time in the playground. Aside from a good place to play, it's also social since she interacts with other kids there too.

I see no reason yet to consider moving or buying a house.

_Kaiser_

I think it depends on whether you have kids or not...

- couple who both work with no kids or plans for any = a good sized apartment .. preferably top-floor or a duplex as per this thread is very attractive.

- young kids = house. You need the security/space of a back garden for them to play in, a settled road/estate with similar aged kids to mix in. An apartment just won't give you that in Ireland with rare exceptions as per PaulW's setup

BBMcQ

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I think it depends on whether you have kids or not...

- couple who both work with no kids or plans for any = a good sized apartment .. preferably top-floor or a duplex as per this thread is very attractive.

- young kids = house. You need the security/space of a back garden for them to play in, a settled road/estate with similar aged kids to mix in. An apartment just won't give you that in Ireland with rare exceptions as per PaulW's setup

Thanks all for the input. Just addressing some of the points and sorry if I sound like I just started a thread to convince myself of a decision I've already made subconsciously. I really haven't decided yet and maybe some more ppl out there are going thru the same decision.

They are quite well designed duplexes that I'm looking at. The apartments also built on site at the same time are extremely well built. I've lived in an apartment for 6 years now and can't hear anything beyond the walls.

In reality the Semi-d house is 10% more expensive for 30% less square footage. You would get 3 small bedrooms and a small living room while in a duplex there is 4 bedrooms (2 double) and a large living room with a separate kitchen /breakfast table.

Duplex is 200 yards away from the local school so should hopefully always hold value or at least be quick to sell at the right price.

The duplexes are in a very quiet cul de sac set within an established estate. There would be no reason that when the kids make friends in school they hang out with whoever they want from the estate houses.

There is a storage room under the steps for bikes/buggies etc.

Has anyone had experience of buying a "set price" property but actually putting in a bid under that price?

DoozerT6

OP, realistically the duplex looks like the better option space-wise, and I think the only things worth worrying about are: a) the steps, and b) the lack of a back garden. It's proximity to the school means it will probably re-sell quickly.

A lot of people have to drag buggies up and down that amount of steps, but if I had the choice I wouldn't want that for myself on an icy morning, especially if you might have a toddler as well in a year or two. Plus if one of you had any sort of accident or injury in the years to come, even a minor one, those steps could be a curse. I know you can't play the 'what if' game, but I would certainly consider it if it were me. Also, I'm guessing parking is communal? You may be sure that the local kids, either from the estate or the duplexes themselves will be playing out there in VERY close proximity to your car, especially as it's in a 'safe' cul de sac. I've seen it myself where I live. Cars have been damaged, either accidentally or wilfully, by kids out playing games in the car park. Even if they're all too young now to play outside unsupervised, give it a couple of years....

The back garden: don't underestimate the value of having a safe, secure place where you can put the kids outside with a trampoline or something, keeping an eye from the windows as you go about your business inside, and know they're safe and have room to entertain themselves. Especially as you don't even have a front garden. I know you said there are play facilities within the estate, but that would involve bringing the kids there (until they're old enough to go themselves) and supervising them, possibly for a couple of hours while they run off their energy. At least with a back garden, they are safe and contained and can also have friends over to play in a safe area.

It's a toughie though: your OP makes the duplex sound very attractive. I'd be torn too tbh.

mel123

The smaller semi all day long. Having lived in both, in my personal experience, you will curse them steps after not so long, I know I did. Try getting a weeks worth of groceries up and down up and down 😀
It sounds like you may have designated parking as most new estates like this do. Is it directly outside your door? Is there ample visitor parking? This was all another curse for me after not so long and then the lovely management co brought in clampers.
You might think 'ah I don't need a garden' trust me when you have one you will be glad of it. Grand bit of drying outside instead of ugly clothes horses around all the time. And even tho we don get great weather, it's so nice to just sit outside in the summer months (granted you probably have a balcony) The semi might have a front garden? Another plus in my opinion for private off street parking.
Not all of course, but a portion of these new estates are fine for a few years, then people stop paying management fees and you see little by little less being done to the area upkeep.
I bought in 2005 and the same duplexes are on the market for less than half (granted the recession and all that - and luckily I got out while the going was good). I was in a block with me on top and a two bed under. I could hear her closing doors etc, but in saying that I'm in a semi now and can hear them next door.
Just my two cents worth for you

BBMcQ

Thanks all - definitely shed light on a few things that I hadn't thought of before. I'm still torn but will see what's on the market in the area in January.

Graham

BBMcQ wrote: »

In reality the Semi-d house is 10% more expensive for 30% less square footage. You would get 3 small bedrooms and a small living room while in a duplex there is 4 bedrooms (2 double) and a large living room with a separate kitchen /breakfast table.

The semi-d has a garden, that's square footage you can't ignore.

The duplex is essentially a low-density apartment.

BBMcQ wrote: »

Duplex is 200 yards away from the local school so should hopefully always hold value or at least be quick to sell at the right price.

Anything can be quick to sell 'at the right price'.

Personally, I'd go for the smaller semi-d. Housing densities are only likely to increase, the premium for houses with a garden will do likewise.

goz83

As above, the garden space in the semi-d needs to be seriously considered. You can't extend the living space in an apartment, but you can add a rear extension to a semi-d often without planning, up to 40sqm. You can also convert the attic in most instances to get an extra bedroom. The only thing that would be attractive about the larger apartment, would be the fact that my arse muscles would be firm and tight from all the walking up and down the stairs I would get.

Apartments in Ireland = singles, childless.
Houses = families.

That's just my view, as someone who considered an apartment, but made the right choice on a house. We need extra living space, so there will be an extension going in next year. We would have to move if we lived in an apartment.

Onthefence

House all the way.
As other posters have alluded to, being able to let the kids out the back to trampoline, chalk the patio, play with the water table or search for slugs, without the need for me to be out there too, is invaluable.
The washing line. The garden shed. The garden bench. The flowers. The tiny veggie patch for the kids. The illusion of having more space out there than you actually do.
Now, my husband's opinion could well be very different. He's out at work from 6am to 7pm, the garden space doesn't mean much to him other than extra weekend jobs-sweeping up a week's worth of sand and water play, and cutting the grass.
But to me, as the parent currently at home with the kids, give me the garden over the balcony any day.

Parchment

For me it would be no question - semi all the way. Duplexes mean you are in closer proximity to multiple neighbours - more potential for noise.

Also as stated duplexes / apartment developments have huge potential to become social housing properties .... I wouldn't buy near those.

Maybe it's the Irish in me but I see apartments/duplexes as rental properties not homes. That's just me.

James Forde

Currently living in a duplex with a toddler. I cannot wait for the day that we move out.

It has stairs up to the property too, absolute nightmare with buggy, shopping etc.

Noise travelling from all directions. Feel for our neighbours too given the noise that we create!

Semi D all the way

Graham

Parchment wrote: »

Also as stated duplexes / apartment developments have huge potential to become social housing properties .... I wouldn't buy near those.

Can someone explain why an apartment or duplex is likely to suddenly become social housing?

goz83

Graham wrote: »

Can someone explain why an apartment or duplex is likely to suddenly become social housing?

I can only say that the only residents that have moved into priory hall so far are all council tenants. A block of 6 (i think) apartments (some duplex). My brother is one of them. The people who are buying will move in this month.

My sister is in a duplex with her family...also social housing. Many of the residents in her area are social housing and the majority are in apartments.

I'm in a semi-d with a big mortgage :pac:

It's not quite the answer you might be looking for, but it's all I have.

Parchment

Graham wrote: »

Can someone explain why an apartment or duplex is likely to suddenly become social housing?

I would assume that it's because they are cheaper to acquire than houses generally.

the_syco

Living in a two bed apartment now with mates atm. No storage space. Thus miss the attic for seasonal decorations.

The duplex; is it actually yours, or some bizarre 999 year lease? If the latter, what restrictions is there to internal and external changes? Are you allowed use a satellite dish? (most aren't).

The benefit of a house; it's yours. You can extend to it, you can use the attic, convert the attic (I'd advise to at least floor the entire attic after you put down insulation; warmer house, and more storage space).

Oh, and you could expand the ground floor out the back of the semi-d in the future (a lot of people on my parents road have done this).
If it has a garage; can be converted, or a bedroom placed on top of it. Parents have recently extended their small kitchen into very big kitchen, and put the washing machine, etc, into the converted garage.

BBMcQ wrote: »

They are quite well designed duplexes that I'm looking at. The apartments also built on site at the same time are extremely well built. I've lived in an apartment for 6 years now and can't hear anything beyond the walls.

This varies alot, I found. You got lucky for 6 years. Some places aren't as well built.

=-=

Sound... travels. Apartments, duplexes, semi d's; you may get lucky, or you may hear the TV next door. It really is pick of the draw.

Irish_rat

Semi-D all the way. Get a small one if size matters.

Teyla Emmagan

Definitely the house. A million times the house.