small claims court question (just money issues or return of property?)

wazzoraybelle

Might be an odd question but can the small claims court be used to compel a business to hand over someone else's lawful property (i.e. not seeking refund or payment) , if the property is below the value threshold of the small claims court?

And if so, what if the business in question has had no professional dealings with the claimant other than it has come into control of the claimants property through a third party?



Thanks
Wazzo

Peregrinus

You're going to have to be a bit clearer about the nature of the claim. Why is the business not returning the property on demand? Will they be out of pocket if they do? Is there any possibility that they have, or claim, a right to retain the property? Do they have a security interest in the property? (I.e. are they holding it as security for the payment of a sum that is owing, or that they say is owing, to them?) How did they come into possession of the property in the first place? (You'll need to be a bit clearer than "through a third party".) How did the owner lose or cede possession of the property, and to whom?

GerardKeating

wazzoraybelle wrote: »

Might be an odd question but can the small claims court be used to compel a business to hand over someone else's lawful property (i.e. not seeking refund or payment) , if the property is below the value threshold of the small claims court?

And if so, what if the business in question has had no professional dealings with the claimant other than it has come into control of the claimants property through a third party?



Thanks
Wazzo

Is this an item left with the "company" for repair and they won't return it cause the repair not paid for ?

wazzoraybelle

I was hoping just to get an idea of the jurisdiction of the Small Claims court. However, and hypothetically, if a company who was acting as an agent of the claimant went into liquidation, and the liquidator subsequently refused (and refused to acknowledge that the claimant had legitimate ownership of the documents) to had over the documentation that came about as a result of the agency relationship.Could an action be brought in the Small Claims Court to have them handed over?

Thanks

johnnyskeleton

wazzoraybelle wrote: »

I was hoping just to get an idea of the jurisdiction of the Small Claims court. However, and hypothetically, if a company who was acting as an agent of the claimant went into liquidation, and the liquidator subsequently refused (and refused to acknowledge that the claimant had legitimate ownership of the documents) to had over the documentation that came about as a result of the agency relationship.Could an action be brought in the Small Claims Court to have them handed over?

Thanks

Here is the relevant rule of court:

http://www.courts.ie/rules.nsf/0c609d7abff72c1c80256d2b0045bb64/f2cf06a3faa6c48380257c900053b892?OpenDocument

Suffice it to say that it deals with things like consumer contracts for the purchase of goods or supply of services etc.

Peregrinus

wazzoraybelle wrote: »

I was hoping just to get an idea of the jurisdiction of the Small Claims court. However, and hypothetically, if a company who was acting as an agent of the claimant went into liquidation, and the liquidator subsequently refused (and refused to acknowledge that the claimant had legitimate ownership of the documents) to had over the documentation that came about as a result of the agency relationship.Could an action be brought in the Small Claims Court to have them handed over?

No. The issue at stake is whether documents that came into existence as a result of the agency arrangement belong to the principal, rather than the agent. That's not a small claims matter.

wazzoraybelle

Peregrinus wrote: »

No. The issue at stake is whether documents that came into existence as a result of the agency arrangement belong to the principal, rather than the agent. That's not a small claims matter.

Thanks. There is long standing authoritative precedent that settles this. Leicstershire Co. Co. v Michael Faraday and Partners.

It is also well recognized that the work of employees as agents of the employer is considered the property of the employer.

I'm aware that such a claim can be made at district court level, but I'm wondering if the small claims court might be a more cost effective course of action.

Peregrinus

Leicestershire deals with the ownership of documents on a solicitor's file; it doesn't necessarily generalise to every agency relationship.

But, even assuming that Leicestershire disposes of the issue of title in this instance, that's not your only problem. The small claims procedure covers business small claims and consumer small claims; your claim has to come under one or other head to be dealt with through the small claims procedure.

A business small claim has to be a claim by a business purchaser against a business vendor, but (leaving "business" aside) this isn't a vendor-and-purchaser claim; it's a principal-and-agent claim. And, since it seems from the OP that there was a third party interposed between the claimant and the respondent, it doesn't look at though this a straightforward agency arising as an incident of a contract of sale or purchase, but some kind of implied or imposed agency relationship, the nature of which is not entirely clear to me. But I don't get the sense it will be easy for you to present this as a vendor-and-purchaser matter.

For a consumer small claim, you have to be dealing as a consumer, and I don't know whether you were or not, and your claim has to be in respect of goods or services purchased which, again, from the detail in your OP might be problematic.

wazzoraybelle

Thanks Pereginus, the situation certainly is a complex one.