Ireland would have been a better place under British rule?

Johnboner

Seeing as how our government is so incompetent makes you think if it would have been better to stay part of the UK. Ireland is so badly managed when you compare it to similar mainland countries like Switzerland and Belgium, Ireland comes out as a bit of a joke.

Beanntraigheach

Johnboner wrote: »

Seeing as how our government is so incompetent makes you think if it would have been better to stay part of the UK. Ireland is so badly managed when you compare it to similar mainland countries like Switzerland and Belgium, Ireland comes out as a bit of a joke.

A brilliant and original argument, eloquently delivered.
Kudos sir. :rolleyes:

(There's a thread below inquiring about the apparent decline in numbers using this forum.
I think part of the answer is right here.)

_Whimsical_

Johnboner wrote: »

Seeing as how our government is so incompetent makes you think if it would have been better to stay part of the UK.

If you're judging it on competence of government then look how Brexit has gone down, how they've treated their disabled in the last few years, how they've blood on their hands, many dead and disabled youth and a terrorist target painted on their backs due to being part of wars they had no business being in. On those basis I'd say no we wouldn't be better off.

Junkyard Tom

Take a look at the northeast during the 70's/80's if you'd like to see how Ireland would have fared under British rule.

Johnboner

Beanntraigheach wrote: »

A brilliant and original argument, eloquently delivered.
Kudos sir. :rolleyes:

(There's a thread below inquiring about the apparent decline in numbers using this forum.
I think part of the answer is right here.)

Can say the same about your argument.

Stigura

..... Moves on, in search of a thread worth looking at .....

failinis

Have you seen Northern Ireland.

Ted111

Why don't you go off and marry Switzerland.

Barry Badrinath

Johnboner wrote: »

Seeing as how our government is so incompetent makes you think if it would have been better to stay part of the UK. Ireland is so badly managed when you compare it to similar mainland countries like Switzerland and Belgium, Ireland comes out as a bit of a joke.

Yeah, well so is your face!

Grayson

I doubt it would have done better. I'm not being anti british. It's just that everything in the UK is very London centric. It's become more so post war. We would have seen the same level of interest, if not less, than the north of england.

Johnboner

Senor Fancy Pants wrote: »

Yeah, well so is your face!

How do you know?

Johnboner

Ted111 wrote: »

Why don't you go off and marry Switzerland.

That's the plan

Barry Badrinath

Johnboner wrote: »

How do you know?

Well if its anything like yer aul one.

Johnboner

I think we should hold a referendum, I know what I would vote for.

Grayson

Johnboner wrote: »

I think we should hold a referendum, I know what I would vote for.

Atari Jaguar?

Ted111

Johnboner wrote: »

That's the plan

I believe most central european nation states wouldn't enter into a relationship with anyone with a severe attitude problem.

Have you got a plan for that?

Johnboner

Grayson wrote: »

Atari Jaguar?

British rule over Ireland so we can become great again.

Johnboner

Ted111 wrote: »

I believe most central european nation states wouldn't enter into a relationship with anyone with a severe attitude problem.

Have you got a plan for that?

It's a secret plan.

Collie D

The same UK that voted to leave the EU and will likely lose Scotland?
The same Belgium that went almost two years without a government
The same Switzerland that has a referendum anytime a politician decides what to have for lunch?

Nah, you're grand

Rainman16

The OP is not wrong. I mean what have we really gained as an "independent state"? Was all the years of suffering and hardship really worth it?

Ted111

Johnboner wrote: »

It's a secret plan.

Just remember Switzerland is a grubby little, tax haven while we are....eh actually forget that.

Johnboner

Collie D wrote: »

The same UK that voted to leave the EU and will likely lose Scotland?
The same Belgium that went almost two years without a government
The same Switzerland that has a referendum anytime a politician decides what to have for lunch?

Nah, you're grand

Don't know how is it bad about what you said about Switzerland it's actually a good democracy where people actually have the power and stupid rules and regulations are not forced. If you would prefer to live in Nazi Germany then good for you but I don't.

CaptainR

I love how OP compares us to Switzerland and Belgium... But not the UK.

Edgarfrndly

Pros

• NHS.
• Buses that run on time.
• Cheap beer.

Cons

• Heightened target for terrorist attacks.
• Stupendous amounts of tax wasted on seemingly futile wars.
• London-driven politics, with a situation similar to Scotland where a Tory government with little or no MP's in our country, would decide the fate of our country. Ergo, democracy eroded.
• Neutrality ruined.
• Diluted identity.
• Probably being pulled out of the EU, whereas I suspect a majority of Irish people would have voted to stay.
• Culture & Arts funding probably reduced greatly. Irish language well and truly dusted.
• Every second generation, we'd see our streets turned into warzones in an effort to achieve independence.

I mean, I'm trying to weigh up the good and the bad - but as someone who doesn't drink and hates public transport, I think I'll stay independent for now.

One_Of_Shanks

@ OP, the answer is already there. Northern Ireland is under British rule. So take a look at N-Iron and if you think the answer is yes or no then you have your answer.
Pros's and cons.

I was amazed that the Scots didn't want to get out of British rule but they voted to stay. So read into that what you will.

I share your frustration with our lot. People like Leo Varadkar, Joan Burton, Mary Harney and Inda Kinneh have sucked the life out of my faith in Irish politicians over the years.
But that's just me.

If we had been under British rule during that cow Maggy Thatcher's reign then I would have felt like killing her myself. So it's swings and roundabouts.

Johnboner

CaptainR wrote: »

I love how OP compares us to Switzerland and Belgium... But not the UK.

It's more comparable due to size and population.

Collie D

Rainman16 wrote: »

The OP is not wrong. I mean what have we really gained as an "independent state"? Was all the years of suffering and hardship really worth it?

Self-governance which while you may think is not great is a lot better than someone in Westminster making decisions about a place and people they don't really give a **** about. The north and Scotland are already examples of this.

Johnboner

Collie D wrote: »

Self-governance which while you may think is not great is a lot better than someone in Westminster making decisions about a place and people they don't really give a **** about. The north and Scotland are already examples of this.

Scotland had a referendum and decided to stay so your argument is invalid. They voted in favour of staying because they knew it's a smart decision to be part of the UK instead of being isolated like Ireland and having absolutely no advantage.

Beanntraigheach

Wouldn't it, perhaps, be a good idea to just set up a single "Ireland is Shìte!" thread where those obsessed with the topic can whitter back and forth to one another about it endlessly?

darkpagandeath

Edgarfrndly wrote: »

Pros

• NHS.
• Buses that run on time.
• Cheap beer.

Cons

• Heightened target for terrorist attacks.
• Stupendous amounts of tax wasted on seemingly futile wars.
• London-driven politics, with a situation similar to Scotland where a Tory government with little or no MP's in our country, would decide the fate of our country. Ergo, democracy eroded.
• Neutrality ruined.
• Diluted identity.
• Probably being pulled out of the EU, whereas I suspect a majority of Irish people would have voted to stay.
• Culture & Arts funding probably reduced greatly. Irish language well and truly dusted.
• Every second generation, we'd see our streets turned into warzones in an effort to achieve independence.

I mean, I'm trying to weigh up the good and the bad - but as someone who doesn't drink and hates public transport, I think I'll stay independent for now.

What Neutrality ?

Johnboner

Edgarfrndly wrote: »

Pros

• NHS.
• Buses that run on time.
• Cheap beer.

Cons

• Heightened target for terrorist attacks.
• Stupendous amounts of tax wasted on seemingly futile wars.
• London-driven politics, with a situation similar to Scotland where a Tory government with little or no MP's in our country, would decide the fate of our country. Ergo, democracy eroded.
• Neutrality ruined.
• Diluted identity.
• Probably being pulled out of the EU, whereas I suspect a majority of Irish people would have voted to stay.
• Culture & Arts funding probably reduced greatly. Irish language well and truly dusted.
• Every second generation, we'd see our streets turned into warzones in an effort to achieve independence.

I mean, I'm trying to weigh up the good and the bad - but as someone who doesn't drink and hates public transport, I think I'll stay independent for now.

You are more likely to win the lottery or die from a lightning bolt than die from a terrorist attack in the UK.

Yourself isit

Johnboner wrote: »

Scotland had a referendum and decided to stay so your argument is invalid. They voted in favour of staying because they knew it's a smart decision to be part of the UK instead of being isolated like Ireland and having absolutely no advantage.

Scotland will probably leave someday.

Of course we'd be worse off under British rule. Not one big IT company would be here. We'd be Wales.

rickfisher1988

Is this thread a joke?

Look at Northern Ireland. A tiny economy with no real companies dependent on a subsidy to keep it running.

We have created a dynamic and vibrant economy. Criticize politicians all your like, but we have a healthy and innovative economy.

Beanntraigheach

Johnboner wrote: »

Scotland had a referendum and decided to stay so your argument is invalid. They voted in favour of staying because they knew it's a smart decision to be part of the UK instead of being isolated like Ireland and having absolutely no advantage.

Yep, those canny Scots can see the advantages of seeing their country sucked dry of its vast oil wealth while across the north sea independent Norway uses its oil to create a huge sovereign wealth fund for its people.
As I said, very "canny" those Scots.

Collie D

Johnboner wrote: »

Don't know how is it bad about what you said about Switzerland it's actually a good democracy where people actually have the power and stupid rules and regulations are not forced. If you would prefer to live in Nazi Germany then good for you but I don't.

Here's a list of all thirteen referenda in Switzerland this year alone. I'm quite happy to let decisions like the building of a road be decided upon by the Dept. of Transport or even the relevant County/City Council.

Only three of them had a turnout above 50%.

Not sure how wanting to elect representatives to make these decisions makes me a Nazi but I have already concluded you're more than likely on a windup.

Your OP said you were fed up of incompetent governments. Seems the Swiss government aren't even considered competent enough to make the most basic of decisions.

Popcorn. check
sarcasm meter. operating
Let the fun begin!

Johnboner

What about the hospitals being third world country level (probably worse) a man died a few backs because he was waiting at the hospital for so long.
What about the Irish water flip flop. Millions wasted.
What about the poor condition of our roads.
What about our terrible public transport.
What about our congestions.
No proper cycle tracks.
Extortionate motor taxes.
Extortionate insurance prices.

Johnboner

Collie D wrote: »

Here's a list of all thirteen referenda in Switzerland this year alone. I'm quite happy to let decisions like the building of a road be decided upon by the Dept. of Transport or even the relevant County/City Council.

Only three of them had a turnout above 50%.

Not sure how wanting to elect representatives to make these decisions makes me a Nazi but I have already concluded you're more than likely on a windup.

Your OP said you were fed up of incompetent governments. Seems the Swiss government aren't even considered competent enough to make the most basic of decisions.

Irish government certainly is!
Just look at our amazing condition roads. Almost smashed my head in with a bicycle when drove over 20 pot holes. I have a car as well and pay over 1000 tax, and where does it go??? Oh yes Irish water which is disbanded what an amazing government I am certainly proud to be Irish. No wonder young people emigrate.

One_Of_Shanks

Yourself isit wrote: »

Scotland will probably leave someday.

Of course we'd be worse off under British rule. Not one big IT company would be here. We'd be Wales.

Would we get Gareth Bale?

Collie D

Johnboner wrote: »

Extortionate insurance prices.

Ah, those lovely British insurance companies are dying to get in to the Irish market to save us from being ripped off by the likes if Aviva, Axa, Aon, etc.

Johnboner

Collie D wrote: »

Ah, those lovely British insurance companies are dying to get in to the Irish market to save us from being ripped off by the likes if Aviva, Axa, Aon, etc.

Don't forget our rents which are an absolute bargain.

A Little Pony

Would have had more of a say on the world stage if you remained in the Union. But then that damn yankee De Valera decided to cause mischief.

Collie D

Johnboner wrote: »

Don't forget our rents which are an absolute bargain.

OK, you're good at finding problems. Give me a solution that the British government can use to solve this one.

Just looking for one answer. Not another tangent.

Edgarfrndly

Johnboner wrote: »

You are more likely to win the lottery or die from a lightning bolt than die from a terrorist attack in the UK.

It's not just the deaths, it's the economic costs of each attacks. The london tube bombings hit the UK economy hard.

AnGaelach

I'm only a humble knave, but wasn't that tried before?

Collie D

A Little Pony wrote: »

Would have had more of a say on the world stage if you remained in the Union. But then that damn yankee De Valera decided to cause mischief.

Yeah, because we had loads of say in things before the creation of the State

jimmy blevins

Strange logic op, so because Ireland isn't as well run as Switzerland the brits should take over? Considering the north is disfunctional money pit would not a better option be for Ireland to become the 27th canton.

Ted111

Johnboner wrote: »

Don't forget our rents which are an absolute bargain.

We wouldn't have won five Eurovision contests.
You know why?
Because we wouldn't exist ....in your post-apocalyptic, colonial nightmare world. We'd be a quaint off shore weekend destination for Jeremy Clarkson and his mates. We'd be sitting around drinking tea. Going to B&Q on Sunday before having a carvery with the wife and kids. Casual racism, oxford boat race, WMDs, pie and mash.

Are you happy Johnboner. You've destroyed the country.

Johnboner

Collie D wrote: »

OK, you're good at finding problems. Give me a solution that the British government can use to solve this one.

Just looking for one answer. Not another tangent.

That would take a long time and I am not paid to do if but here are few quick ones.
Reduce the wages of all our politicians including taisoeach and president which interestingly get more than the US counterparts (Really more than the USA? Most powerful country in the world.
Make companies like eflow which operate the m50 and make a ridiculous amount of money to give a large cut to the government which will be spent on Dublin roads, cycle tracks, public transport (they make insane amount of money).

Most of these problems could be solved by having a good government that makes good decisions, unlike ours (Irish water) first thing that comes to mind. If other nations can do it that means we can do it, just takes examples from all the successful countries (Belgium, Switzerland, Sweden etc.) These nations don't have insane amount of natural resources so they don't really have an advantage over us but they are well managed and people are happy. The attitude with "oh nothing we can do let's just accept this terrible situation and be happy with it" will not get you far.

Johnboner

Ted111 wrote: »

We wouldn't have won five Eurovision contests.
You know why?
Because we wouldn't exist ....in your post-apocalyptic, colonial nightmare world. We'd be a quaint off shore weekend destination for Jeremy Clarkson and his mates. We'd be sitting around drinking tea. Going to B&Q on Sunday before having a carvery with the wife and kids. Casual racism, oxford boat race, WMDs, pie and mash.

Are you happy Johnboner. You've destroyed the country.

Couldn't be much worse than it is now.

irishfeen

After the Easter Rising and the shooting of the leaders Ireland became ungovernable from a British POV ... it was the straw that broke the camels back.