Landlord Retroactively Charging For Waste Bin Charges After 5 Years.

Outkast_IRE

My other half was given proper notice to her landlord that she intends to leave shortly after a tenancy of 5 years.

The landlord is now saying he is going to deduct 5 years of waste charges from the deposit totaling €300.

Not once in the five years were waste charges mentioned or brought up.
She has about 7 weeks left to serve out her notice.

The landord got very defensive when i questioned the arrangement and i told him i find it highly unusual. In his defensive state he asked was i accusing him of something untoward. I replied i was well within my rights to question deductions from deposits.

The landlord also made some brief statements about cleaning charges and the place needing a lick of paint after she moves out.

After 5 years tenancy its fair to say the place could benifit from painting but it is very clean and has always been kept so.


Need advice on the best way to strengthen our position for what could be an upcoming battle. She is a model tenant with rent paid on time every month for five years, hard not to feel a little angry after being good tenants for five years that someone is considering shafting her.

Sarn

He can't apply a five year waste disposal charge at the end of the tenancy. The rent paid was the rent paid. If he had any issue with waste disposal cost it should have been raised at the start of the tenancy.

In relation to the cleaning and painting, once the place is cleaned to a fair standard and no unusual damage has been done to the paint, that's his problem. You would expect that after a five year tenancy and normal wear and tear that a lick of paint would be required.

If he withholds anything unreasonably (and I consider the above unreasonable) and is not willing to discuss the matter, advise him that a case will be raised with the RTB in relation to unfair retention of deposit. Take lots of pictures before leaving to avoid false claims!

SteoL

Sarn wrote: »

He can't apply a five year waste disposal charge at the end of the tenancy. The rent paid was the rent paid. If he had any issue with waste disposal cost it should have been raised at the start of the tenancy.

In relation to the cleaning and painting, once the place is cleaned to a fair standard and no unusual damage has been done to the paint, that's his problem. You would expect that after a five year tenancy and normal wear and tear that a lick of paint would be required.

If he withholds anything unreasonably (and I consider the above unreasonable) and is not willing to discuss the matter, advise him that a case will be raised with the RTB in relation to unfair retention of deposit. Take lots of pictures before leaving to avoid false claims!

LL could have assumed waste was being paid by tenant. My understanding is tenant is responsible for all utilities including waste. I could be wrong but would be surprised. No reason bins are any different to electricity.

Sarn

It is up to the tenant to arrange for bins to be collected from a house, just like electricity so I can't see how or why the LL would have paid for rubbish collection from the start. The rubbish would not have been collected if they didn't pay.

If it is an apartment the bins are generally included in the annual charge that the LL pays so adding on a refuse charge without informing the tenant from the start would also be wrong.

Ayuntamiento

SteoL wrote: »

LL could have assumed waste was being paid by tenant. My understanding is tenant is responsible for all utilities including waste. I could be wrong but would be surprised. No reason bins are any different to electricity.

Have some common sense. I presume we're talking about an apartment here. Waste charges are part of the management fee. The landlord always pays the management fee.
He can factor it into the monthly rent that he charges, but ultimately it's his responsibility to pay it annually.
He can't decide after 5yrs that he should have been charging more rent every month and try and gouge it from the deposit, which is essentially what he's doing here.

SteoL

Ayuntamiento wrote: »

Have some common sense. I presume we're talking about an apartment here. Waste charges are part of the management fee. The landlord always pays the management fee.
He can factor it into the monthly rent that he charges, but ultimately it's his responsibility to pay it annually.
He can't decide after 5yrs that he should have been charging more rent every month and try and gouge it from the deposit, which is essentially what he's doing here.

Obviously bins are included in an apartment rental. I presumed it was a house Op was talking about. Perhaps Op could clarify so people can give proper advice

Outkast_IRE

To clarify it is property is a house. The landlord does not live in it.

Electricity bills are in the landlords name and equal shares paid by the tenants.

Electricity is paid to the landlord bi-monthly, he informs the tenants of how much they owe and they forward the money on top of their rent. (Never had an issue with this as bills were always reasonable and he would provide a copy if requested)

The bins were always in the landlords name. Assumed they were included in the rent. After 5 years and not being asked to pay its a fair assumption.


An update, i have dug out the rent book and under the "Utilities" section it has two items written as follows
"Electricity - Landlord - Annual "
"Waste - Landlord - Annual"

Now as stated the electiricty was paid bi-monthly as requested. There has not been a mention of a waste bill in 5 years of tenancy.

I am not an unfair guy, he has been a good landlord up to this point, we have been good tenants.

We are meeting in person tomorrow night to flesh this out, i was considering going in with the approach that
1. He has not presented us with a bill for the waste in 5 years - to rertrospecitvely pull it from the deposit it not right.
2. If he would like to present us with an equal portion of the waste bill for this year at the end of the year we would understand & accomodate him.


His argument is based on his word that " this is how he does it with all his tenants" however i think that is simply not good enough - its a highly unusual arrangment and to not present a bill for the waste service for 5 years has established that there was no attempt to inform the tennant of the costs building.

davo10

Op, are you saying that your oh has never paid for bin collection, ever in 5years?

Does it say on the lease that the refuse is included in the rent or does it say that LL paid annually and like the electricity, the tenant reimburses LL ?

Op, 5 years worth of refuse collection is an absolute gift, house tenants always pay for refuse collection.

rawn

I don't think the LL is trying to shaft you, but he has gone about this all the wrong way. Since the lease does specify that the tenant pays the waste bill annually, I would be inclined to pay it. But why the LL waited until she leaves to collect it is beyond me. He should be billing annually.

Outkast_IRE

davo10 wrote: »

Op, are you saying that your oh has never paid for bin collection, ever in 5years?

Does it say on the lease that the refuse is included in the rent or does it say that LL paid annually and like the electricity, the tenant reimburses LL ?

Op, 5 years worth of refuse collection is an absolute gift, house tenants always pay for refuse collection.

She has never been asked to pay, or been made aware that a charge was building up, the conversation with the landlord once notice was handed in was that he " always charges this at the end of the tenancy".


If she was presented with a bill each year she would of course paid it. However a bill was never presented - this is the landlord fault.

How can you expect a tenant to pay for a service which you have not provided a bill for or made them aware of ?

Ray Palmer

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

She has never been asked to pay, or been made aware that a charge was building up, the conversation with the landlord once notice was handed in was that he " always charges this at the end of the tenancy".


If she was presented with a bill each year she would of course paid it. However a bill was never presented - this is the landlord fault.

How can you expect a tenant to pay for a service which you have not provided a bill for or made them aware of ?

Yes agreed it was handled badly but it is a charge the tenant is meant to pay. As a tenant she also had responsibility to figure out who paid the bin charges. Two people at fault but one still has to pay for a service they received.

PucaMama

Landlord is chancing it. Wouldn't let him away with it. 5 years of waste charges would be more than a deposit.

Outkast_IRE

PucaMama wrote: »

Landlord is chancing it. Wouldn't let him away with it. 5 years of waste charges would be more than a deposit.

To be honest, it probably wouldnt be when split amongst an average of 4 tenants. I would reckon 300 is about where it would be

PucaMama

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

To be honest, it probably wouldnt be when split amongst an average of 4 tenants. I would reckon 300 is about where it would be

Considering standing charges where I am would be about 120 a year, then 10 when a bin goes out I think it's still less and id be suspicious about how the landlord came to that figure. Is he getting 300 out of everyone's deposit for some other reason.

Outkast_IRE

PucaMama wrote: »

Considering standing charges where I am would be about 120 a year, then 10 when a bin goes out I think it's still less and id be suspicious about how the landlord came to that figure. Is he getting 300 out of everyone's deposit for some other reason.

The crowd who pick up the waste are around the 280 per year all in. Split that 4 ways and its 70 each. Across 5 years its greater than 300.

I suppose its neither here nor there, i am not disputing that the waste was picked up and that the service was provided. The issue is the retrospective billing and the manner in which it was handled.

According to the rent book he should of billed annually - the bill was never presented to the tenants.

I think the outcome here is that there will need to be some give and take on both sides, the landlord has handled this extremely poorly and i will not accept a retrospective bill for 5 years.

davo10

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

The crowd who pick up the waste are around the 280 per year all in. Split that 4 ways and its 70 each. Across 5 years its greater than 300.

I suppose its neither here nor there, i am not disputing that the waste was picked up and that the service was provided. The issue is the retrospective billing and the manner in which it was handled.

According to the rent book he should of billed annually - the bill was never presented to the tenants.

I think the outcome here is that there will need to be some give and take on both sides, the landlord has handled this extremely poorly and i will not accept a retrospective bill for 5 years.

So you don't think there should be any charge for waste disposal for 5 years? Seriously? It's not retrospective billing, it is billing based on the service provided for the period your oh was there, now he/she is leaving, the bill becomes due just like any other utility.

PucaMama

davo10 wrote: »

So you don't think there should be any charge for waste disposal for 5 years? Seriously? It's not retrospective billing, it is billing based on the service provided for the period your oh was there, now he/she is leaving, the bill becomes due just like any other utility.

I think he shouldn't be allowed go back 5 years if he never made the effort before now.

Rackstar

It's 300 quid. Your OH hasn't had to pay for waste disposal for 5 years. Let the landlord keep it.

davo10

PucaMama wrote: »

I think he shouldn't be allowed go back 5 years if he never made the effort before now.

Landlord takes it up when tenant leaves, when you leave a rental property you get a final bill for electricity/phone/broadband/sky etc up to that date, why is this utility any different? Sure the way the tenant pays it is not the norm, most tenancy agreements require utilities to be in the name of the tenant but if it is in the LLs name, that does not mean the tenant gets free electricity or refuse collection, it means the tenant pays the LL.

It seems that the terms in the rent book for electricity and refuse are very similar, they are paid by the landlord, the op knows that his other half pays the landlord for electricity so it's a bit disingenuous to say that his oh should not pay refuse.

FAILSAFE 00

Its a bit odd why the landlord has all the utilities in his own name.

I can understand the refuge service. I've seen tenants do all sorts of mad stuff to avoid paying for bins. One guy stored black bin bags on his roof and caused a rodent infestation.

However all the other utilities shouldn't be in his name.

I wonder if hes trying to claim he still lives there so he wont have to pay extra tax.

Sarn

davo10 wrote: »

Landlord takes it up when tenant leaves, when you leave a rental property you get a final bill for electricity/phone/broadband/sky etc up to that date, why is this utility any different?

The final bills would normally at most be for a two month period not five years.

Ask for a copy of the bills and arrange to pay the fair share. If he can't provide them then you would be in a position to dispute them.

kirving

davo10 wrote: »

So you don't think there should be any charge for waste disposal for 5 years? Seriously? It's not retrospective billing, it is billing based on the service provided for the period your oh was there, now he/she is leaving, the bill becomes due just like any other utility.

That isn't what he's saying though. It's unreasonable for the bill to be brought up now, when there has been a fair assumption that the waste charges were included in the rent.

FAILSAFE 00

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Its a bit odd why the landlord has all the utilities in his own name.

I can understand the refuge service. I've seen tenants do all sorts of mad stuff to avoid paying for bins. One guy stored black bin bags on his roof and caused a rodent infestation.

However all the other utilities shouldn't be in his name.

I wonder if hes trying to claim he still lives there so he wont have to pay extra tax.

In rooms let seperately house shares its far easier to have bills in the LLs name. It's a royal pain if the gas and esb in particular are in housemates names as when people come and go the account has to be changed over, if someone wants to move out after 6 months then they can have problems if still in contract, new accounts open again and usually taken on by the person moving in and then if they happen to move out again after a few months then more hassle (there is usually a turnover of people like this in many houseshares).

I've lived in both one where we had to have the bills in our name and my last place the bills were in the LLs name, the bills were addressed to him at our house and we simply opened his letters and paid the bills. Having lived both ways the second is far far better.

FAILSAFE 00

Korbin Bald Polygamy wrote: »

In rooms let seperately house shares its far easier to have bills in the LLs name. It's a royal pain if the gas and esb in particular are in housemates names as when people come and go the account has to be changed over, if someone wants to move out after 6 months then they can have problems if still in contract, new accounts open again and usually taken on by the person moving in and then if they happen to move out again after a few months then more hassle (there is usually a turnover of people like this in many houseshares).

I've lived in both one where we had to have the bills in our name and my last place the bills were in the LLs name, the bills were addressed to him at our house and we simply opened his letters and paid the bills. Having lived both ways the second is far far better.

I am thinking from a landlords perspective.

You can be left high and dry with massive bills if the utilities are in your own name versus the tenants.

From the landlords perspective If a new tenant moves in its just a simple phone call to give utility providers the new tenants details. One less headache. Let the tenants sort themselves out.

From my own experience of house sharing we always paid our own bills. Although I am aware many landlords leave the bills in their own name which I think is a horrible business practice.

PucaMama

davo10 wrote: »

Landlord takes it up when tenant leaves, when you leave a rental property you get a final bill for electricity/phone/broadband/sky etc up to that date, why is this utility any different? Sure the way the tenant pays it is not the norm, most tenancy agreements require utilities to be in the name of the tenant but if it is in the LLs name, that does not mean the tenant gets free electricity or refuse collection, it means the tenant pays the LL.

It seems that the terms in the rent book for electricity and refuse are very similar, they are paid by the landlord, the op knows that his other half pays the landlord for electricity so it's a bit disingenuous to say that his oh should not pay refuse.

Yes there's a final electricity bill but that's because you have been paying them all along. He should have told her when she started that's how he was going to charge her. I'd bring it to the prtb. Because it's unfair how he's done it.

davo10

PucaMama wrote: »

Yes there's a final electricity bill but that's because you have been paying them all along. He should have told her when she started that's how he was going to charge her. I'd bring it to the prtb. Because it's unfair how he's done it.

5 years of refuse collection for €300 is not unfair, €60 per year, are you for real? The terms are the same for electricity as for refuse, the op's oh knows he/she had to pay electricity, stands to reason that refuse is the same. Electrical bills are much higher and must be paid to sevice provider monthly/bimonthly, refuse is a yearly bill and the deposit will usually cover it. As a previous poster has explained, when renting rooms individually many tenants do not want the bills in their name and then have to collect from people sharing the property. <mod snip>

PucaMama

davo10 wrote: »

5 years of refuse collection for €300 is not unfair, €60 per year, are you for real? The terms are the same for electricity as for refuse, the op's oh knows he/she had to pay electricity, stands to reason that refuse is the same. Electrical bills are much higher and must be paid to sevice provider monthly/bimonthly, refuse is a yearly bill and the deposit will usually cover it. As a previous poster has explained, when renting rooms individually many tenants do not want the bills in their name and then have to collect from people sharing the property. <mod snip>

I have never had refuse payed for out of a deposit. This is not normal. Also it's not really a yearly bill. Landlord should have said it when she moved in.

rawn

PucaMama wrote: »

I have never had refuse payed for out of a deposit. This is not normal. Also it's not really a yearly bill. Landlord should have said it when she moved in.

It was stated in the lease.

Pkiernan

The RTB will side with the tenant.
Ask LL if he wants to go through an RTB appeal for the sake of €300.

MouseTail

The refuse fee is due and fair. Remiss of the LL not to collect annually, but that doesn't mean he cannot collect arrears. The tenant knew they were responsible.
Of concern is the fee for cleaning and painting. If the place is left clear and clean, bar wear and tear (and it would be reasonable to paint a tenanted place every 5 years), there should be no other deductions.

Dial Hard

Outkast_IRE wrote:

I think the outcome here is that there will need to be some give and take on both sides, the landlord has handled this extremely poorly and i will not accept a retrospective bill for 5 years.

Do you actually live there or is it your OH's place? It's very unclear from your posts.

If it's the latter I'd be very careful about how you speak to the landlord as he'd be well within his rights to refuse to deal with you at all.

PucaMama

rawn wrote: »

It was stated in the lease.

In the rent book it said annual, landlord.

GreenFolder2

The contract specifically states annual billing. No invoice was presented and no payment was sought in any form for 5 years.

Under that contact the only bill collectable would be this year's.

davo10

GreenFolder2 wrote: »

Under that contact the only bill collectable would be this year's.

I'd be interested to read the law you are basing this on. Effectively you are saying annual fees must be collected at the end of the year term and if they aren't, they no longer apply. A lot of debtors and indeed creditors would like to know how you came up with that one.

The op is informed in the rent book there is an annual fee for refuse, the land lord is giving him/her this bill now that tenancy is coming to an end.

I wouldn't be so certain an RTB case would go well for the op, the rent book states there is an annual fee, the op is therefore informed that a fee applies. I think it's a bit <mod snip> to expect free refuse collection for 5 years and then complain when the fee is applied at the end of the tenancy when it is clearly stated in the rent book that there is be a charge to the tenant.

GreenFolder2

An unspecified annual fee that was never presented. The use of the term annual implies a billing cycle. If no invoice is presented, no contact whatsoever is made, it is highly unreasonable to expect payment.

The landlord agreed in the lease to collect it annually, not twice a decade.

<mod snip>

davo10

GreenFolder2 wrote: »

An unspecified annual fee that was never presented.

It is specified that the fee is due in the rent book, the op has confirmed that the €300 tallies with what would be owed for 5 years.

Again, I'd like to see a link to confirm that an annual fee must be collected at the end of the year term or it no longer applies.

davo10

GreenFolder2 wrote: »

The landlord agreed in the lease to collect it annually, not twice a decade.

.

The landlord agreed in the lease to collect electricity once a year not six times per year, is the op complaining about this? No, the rent book informs that the tenant pays the land lord for electricity and waste,

GreenFolder2

davo10 wrote: »

The landlord agreed in the lease to collect electricity once a year not six times per year, is the op complaining about this? No, the rent book informs that the tenant pays the land lord for electricity and waste,

They stated that in the contract that they would collect it annually. They did just that for the electricity.

They didn't bother collecting the bin charges as per the agreement.

It's not a case where the tenant didn't pay the bill and it accumulated. No bill was ever presented.

BabySlam

There are a lot of questions in my mind - is this a registered tenancy or is the landlord incorrectly operating the rentaroom scheme? Assuming the tenancy is registered then the landlord may have got tax relief from payment of the refuse bills in his name....will he show you that his accounts included the tenants as debtors for the refuse bills?
And do the accounts show his income from passing on the refuse charge?

In any event ask for a receipt for any sums withheld/ invoice for same.

However, there is probably reasonableness in expecting the tenant to pay for disposing of their own rubbish. This means you might agree to pay some sum, but taking account of the fact that you were not free to source a cheaper refuse disposal arrangement than that entered into by the landlord.

It comes down to what you can peacefully negotiate with the landlord, or whether you wish to pursue it more formally, and sometimes it is good to draw a line and move on.

mugsymugsy

As others have said along the same lines. Ask for the invoice for each year and calculations on how it is pro rata / divided up per resident. Say that you are more than happy to pay / have it deducted under those conditions. Back it up in writing as well as verbal in case it goes to prtb.

GreenFolder2

It's still very unreasonable to expect payment for uninvoiced services from 5 years ago.

In the commercial would you would be waiting a very long time for payment of an invoice out of the blue after that length of time.

It's perfectly reasonable for any customer to expect that invoices will be sent as per an agreed schedule and in a reasonable time frame after the charge has accrued.

It's not reasonable to send a bill 5 years late.

Can you imagine if a phone company sent you a bill from 2011 that had never been presented before ?!

All the landlord had to do was collect the bill annually, as per the agreement in the rent book. They didn't do that.

Outkast_IRE

Its interesting reading the varied responses and opinions here.

The approach i will take during the meeting will be the following.

1. The Utilites section in the rent book states two items

A. Electricity - Landlord - Bi-Monthly (I rechecked the book it did say bi-monthly)

B. Waste - Landlord - Annually

The reason this went unoticed for so long was that 6 months into the tenancy the landlord stopped signing the rent book and it was agreed by both parties that the regular bank transfer to his account was acceptable as evidence.

2. The landlord did not present a bill annually for the waste. He did not bring it up or mention it. He charged water charges when they were applicable but never a mention of waste at any point in 5 years.

3 . In the interests of fairness she is willing to offer to pay her equal portion of this years waste charge when the bill is presented & as an offer of goodwill she will cover an equal portion of last years waste charges.

Outside of this we do not find it acceptable to be presented with a charge for 5 years with no mention of it during that period. Like any reasonable person she would of paid it yearly to stop it building up to a sum of this size.

Its not the amount that concerns me its the unreasonable approach he has taken with the whole issue, whilst also discussing the deposit he slipped in comments about painting and cleaning.

I will update late tomorrow evening after the meeting and hopefully an amicable resolution is found.

davo10

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Its interesting reading the varied responses and opinions here.

The approach i will take during the meeting will be the following.

1. The Utilites section in the rent book states two items

A. Electricity - Landlord - Bi-Monthly (I rechecked the book it did say bi-monthly)

B. Waste - Landlord - Annually

The reason this went unoticed for so long was that 6 months into the tenancy the landlord stopped signing the rent book and it was agreed by both parties that the regular bank transfer to his account was acceptable as evidence.

2. The landlord did not present a bill annually for the waste. He did not bring it up or mention it. He charged water charges when they were applicable but never a mention of waste at any point in 5 years.

3 . In the interests of fairness she is willing to offer to pay her equal portion of this years waste charge when the bill is presented & as an offer of goodwill she will cover an equal portion of last years waste charges.

Outside of this we do not find it acceptable to be presented with a charge for 5 years with no mention of it during that period. Like any reasonable person she would of paid it yearly to stop it building up to a sum of this size.

Its not the amount that concerns me its the unreasonable approach he has taken with the whole issue, whilst also discussing the deposit he slipped in comments about painting and cleaning.

I will update late tomorrow evening after the meeting and hopefully an amicable resolution is found.

So you acknowledge that in the rent book it says the tenant pays the landlord for waste, you acknowledge that your girlfriend has used the service for waste disposal, you acknowledge that €300 is a fair reflection of what the cost would be over 5 years, you acknowledge that she should pay for the last year and even the year before, but you don't acknowledge that she owes anything beyond that? Why, just because the LL is presenting the bill at the end of the tenancy? She used the service and at €60 per year, that is more than fair. I don't know why you are telling us about the approach "you will take", you're not the tenant, most LLs would tell you to PFO, and deal only with the tenant. Op there is a good chance you will do more harm than good.

As a LL I'd tell your oh to go ahead and complain to the RTB, the €300 would be deducted from the deposit and I would show the RTB the rent book where it states that the tenant pays for waste. I wouldn't fear the judgement at all, worst comes to worst the RTB would rule on a compromise and I might have to refund some of the money, in six to twelve months time when the case is adjudicated on.

dilallio

Have any other tenants moved out in the last 5 years - if so, were they billed for Refuse Charges?

Outkast_IRE

dilallio wrote: »

Have any other tenants moved out in the last 5 years - if so, were they billed for Refuse Charges?

Some of the tenants pay a regular charge for refuse to the landlord. Im not sure of the details of their arrangement, but it is certainly different.

Outkast_IRE

davo10 wrote: »

So you acknowledge that in the rent book it says the tenant pays the landlord for waste, you acknowledge that your girlfriend has used the service for waste disposal, you acknowledge that €300 is a fair reflection of what the cost would be over 5 years, you acknowledge that she should pay for the last year and even the year before, but you don't acknowledge that she owes anything beyond that? Why, just because the LL is presenting the bill at the end of the tenancy? She used the service and at €60 per year, that is more than fair. I don't know why you are telling us about the approach "you will take", you're not the tenant, most LLs would tell you to PFO, and deal only with the tenant. Op there is a good chance you will do more harm than good.

As a LL I'd tell your oh to go ahead and complain to the RTB, the €300 would be deducted from the deposit and I would show the RTB the rent book where it states that the tenant pays for waste. I wouldn't fear the judgement at all, worst comes to worst the RTB would rule on a compromise and I might have to refund some of the money, in six to twelve months time when the case is adjudicated on.

You quite nicely ignore any responsibilty for the landlord to produce the bill regularily to the tennant. You also ignore the implied threats of taking money to clean and paint from the deposit. The landlord couldnt actually remember what was written into the rent book with regards to utilities, he seems to make it up as he goes along.

Have no issue going to the PRTB. Its just a sad way to end what has been a very amicable tenancy for all concerned up to this point. In my opinion having a tenant for 5 years who keeps the place in pristine condition is a tough thing to find and am a little disheartened for it to be going down this route. Once moved out the place will need at most a lick of paint, and the paint is just to freshen it up.

This country full of amateur Landlords who make up and bend the rules to suit as they go. It is unprofessional to not bill a tenant for 5 years. Quite happy to go all the way with this but will try to comprimise first.

FAILSAFE 00

There is fault on both sides.

Personally at the end of year 1 if the landlord did not send me the bill for refuge collection I would have contacted him to arrange payment.

There appears to be negligence on both sides.

I'd arrange to repay the landlord over a short time frame. Maybe 3 months and suggest the landlord takes only the 1st months repayment from the deposit.

April 73

To me it's pretty straightforward. Regardless of the rights and wrongs of how the LL has presented the refuse bill - the tenant has received the service for 5 years and should pay for it. Forget the RTB for this - there are much more important disputes going through it.

Repainting costs after the normal wear & tear of a 5 year tenancy cannot be deducted from the deposit.

Pay the refuse charges & tell the LL he can't charge for repainting. If he does then go to RTB.

SteoL

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

There is fault on both sides.

Personally at the end of year 1 if the landlord did not send me the bill for refuge collection I would have contacted him to arrange payment.

There appears to be negligence on both sides.

I'd arrange to repay the landlord over a short time frame. Maybe 3 months and suggest the landlord takes only the 1st months repayment from the deposit.

Was just going to post same. Tenant was aware of refuse charge since tenancy began so should have chased LL for Bill when one wasn't presented.

davo10

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Some of the tenants pay a regular charge for refuse to the landlord. Im not sure of the details of their arrangement, but it is certainly different.

Why didn't she ask? she knew she had to pay it.

Brego888

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Some of the tenants pay a regular charge for refuse to the landlord. Im not sure of the details of their arrangement, but it is certainly different.

Ah come on now OP, initially I was on your side but with that kind of evidence of knowledge you can't plead ignorance to the fact that refuse had to be paid for.