how muc b should I be paying for maintenance?

PVF

Hi I'm looking for a rough estimation of what single dad's are paying currently on child maintenance please.
Currently I live 200km from my daughter and see her every second weekend where I drive to collect and drop her back both ways.Her mother is now looking for more maintenance as the amount I currently pay 100p/wk isn't enough.She wants more to cover half of all the child's expenses .ie back to school,xmas,bday,extra curricular etc.As it is im struggling between mortgage and other repayments and on paper my balance is in the negative.So if anyone is in the same scenario I'd like to hear how you are managing?

mordeith

Has the mother any income? 100 a week sounds plenty

Kimbot

There is no real set amount, I do believe there is only a max amount per week which is around 150 but I could be wrong. If you genuinely cant afford it then speak with your solicitor, 100 a week seems beyond ok. I think a report a couple of years ago said the average for maintenance across the board was just under 50 per weeek.

Stheno

jonnycivic wrote: »

There is no real set amount, I do believe there is only a max amount per week which is around 150 but I could be wrong. If you genuinely cant afford it then speak with your solicitor, 100 a week seems beyond ok. I think a report a couple of years ago said the average for maintenance across the board was just under 50 per weeek.

150 per week is the maximum that can be awareded in the District court.

PVF

She is working yes but claims that half of the 100 is for childcare and the other half is for food and roof over our daughters head etc.I also paid for her school books and half her Xmas/bday presents last year.

Evd-Burner

€100 is a very fair amount to be honest. I have 2 kids and I pay €130 a week. I pay half a month extra at Christmas, half of vouched school expenses and I pay all of the extra curricular activities. We agreed to go separate for birthdays but so far have ended up just splitting the cost.

Just as an FYI to your child's mum. If she does not live with a partner she can claim the Single Parent Child Carer Credit which depending on her earnings is potentially worth €2650 a year. As the mother of my children does not work she relinquished this credit to me and we split the extra money 50/50.

Has she given you any evidence of what the costs are? Receipts etc

ash23

If the child is in childcare then that's a huge expense right off the bat before accomodation, heat, food, clothes etc even comes into it.

Ask your ex for a breakdown of the costs, where she is getting the figure from. See if it's reasonable. Offer from there what you can afford. It's probably easier to pay a set amount per week than have her asking for half the child's costs at Christmas, birthdays etc.

The costs associated with the child will change and vary as she gets older so it might need to be looked at and discussed annually or bi-annually. I know I thought when childcare finished I'd be saving a fortune but that was not what happened! School costs increased, cost of clothes and shoes increased as she moved into adult sizes and pocket money/social activities came into play also.

PVF

I'm sure she is getting every benefit available.What I'm really wondering is will I be expected to pay two lump sums biannually to cover school and xmas and also keep paying 100 euro a week.?I think I'd be better off going to court and getting it sorted where there is a set amount and that's on paper then.

Evd-Burner

Yes you will be made make 2 biannual lump sum contributions.

I and anybody I know who has gone through court has been directed to do so.

However I still feel €100 is high, but a precedent has now been set on how much to pay and this will be taken into account in court if you go down that road. You would need to argue that your circumstances have changed in some way or that up until now there was no additional contribution in regards to Christmas and that it was covered in the €100 per week. The school costs will be extra to you as these are variable costs that increase as the child ages.

Moonbeam

I would ask for a breakdown of costs.
Do you claim single parent ta credit?you are entitled to it.
Do you give her cash/cheque/credit transfer? Have a record of how much you give her in case it does go to court.
When I had 1 child in full time creche it was 800 for a 3 day week and 1100 full time,creche expenses can be crippling.
I would have no issue with either her telling you what the kid wants for christmas and you buying it and at back to school time buy her uniform or books for her.

PVF

Thanks for all the advice I'll have to get a breakdown of her costs and see what I can juggle then.I didn't realise I was entitled to any tax credit as my daughter doesn't live with me full time.?

January

Only one parent is allowed to claim the tax credit and your ex may already be claiming it.

Moonbeam

January wrote: »

Only one parent is allowed to claim the tax credit and your ex may already be claiming it.

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/credits/one-parent-family.html
I forgot that they changes it in 2014

Grumpypants

€100 sounds really low.

Our child care is 120 a week for 3.5 days. Rent is 200 a week. Add insurance, heating, esb and we are already looking at 350. Half of that is 175, and thats before food or clothes or activities are even considered. If your daughter is at school then the costs associated with that are going to stack up.

200-250 would be reasonable.

RossieMan

Are you serious? 200 a week?

Get a grip, it's not a hostage she has.

salmocab

100 is high enough, to be fair to your ex it doesn't go far but you also have to pay for your life. If thats all you can afford then there is really not a lot you can do. A court would be unlikely to have you pay more I would think but you might be best coming up with a few quid at Christmas and back to school time if you could at all manage it.

Big Bag of Chips

Grumpypants, you do realise he is required to pay half of his child's costs. Not half of the rent, heating, esb, groceries etc for the whole house! At €200-€250 a week for his share of maintaining his child olus the mothers contribution you are suggesting it costs both parents in the region of €1600-€2000 a month just to maintain 1 child??

Avatar MIA

Grumpypants wrote: »

€100 sounds really low.

Our child care is 120 a week for 3.5 days. Rent is 200 a week. Add insurance, heating, esb and we are already looking at 350. Half of that is 175, and thats before food or clothes or activities are even considered. If your daughter is at school then the costs associated with that are going to stack up.

200-250 would be reasonable.

That must be some landlord charging €200 extra rent for an additional child. :rolleyes:

But, I see where your mind is going.

Big Bag of Chips

PVF, if you can't afford to pay any more, and her mam can't afford certain things then something needs to be adjusted to make everything more affordable. We all have to live within our means. You can't pay what you don't have, and €400 a month seems reasonable. If your child is in school, childcare costs shouldn't be up in the thousands. You do however have to take into account that you see very little of your child and her mother is shouldering 100% of the responsibility for bringing up your daughter. She is 100% responsible for her day to day care. Driving her places, bringing her up, taking care of her, looking after her when she's ill. It is a full-time job and one that you are not really (physically) contributing to in any way.

A court is likely to stick with the €100 a week, maybe even lower it if you show you genuinely cannot afford it, but will most likely agree that you then contribute half of Christmas and back to school costs. These are extra costs that when they arise parents have to come up with the money. But its not fair that only the mother is expected to come up with the money and not the father. Like all people, you have plenty notice that these extra expenses are coming up, so you plan for them.

Grumpypants

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

Grumpypants, you do realise he is required to pay half of his child's costs. Not half of the rent, heating, esb, groceries etc for the whole house! At €200-€250 a week for his share of maintaining his child olus the mothers contribution you are suggesting it costs both parents in the region of €1600-€2000 a month just to maintain 1 child??

I do realize that, but it isn't as simple as getting 25% of the costs and saying that's half the kids portion. The mother needs to rent at the higher end of the market as she needs her own house so incurs an extra cost. It is unfair to push that burden on her.

Heating, esb etc have standing charges regardless of the number of people in the house etc etc.

If they are very lucky and have after school child care for €100 and rent for €200. Then half the childcare and 25% of the rent is €100.

Thats all the €100 gone and there is nothing for health insurane, house insurance, groceries, clothes, school fees, uniforms, books, bags, extra activities, lunch, bills, transport, birthdays, christmas, sports equipment, dance classes, extra clubs. You know all the stuff the mother still has to pay for on top of being the main caregiver.

Big Bag of Chips

Grumpypants wrote: »

Heating, esb etc have standing charges regardless of the number of people in the house etc etc.

Exactly, which the mother would be paying whether or not she had a child. She would be paying rent whether or not she had a child, yes, she may have to rent somewhere slightly bigger than if she didn't have a child but the father should not be responsible for 50% of the mothers rent! That's a crazy notion and one which any judge would think ludicrous.

If she needs a bigger place, on her own then she finds it in an area she can afford without asking the father for 50% of her rent. Remember the father is also responsible for his own rent and bills in running his own place. 2 parents are maintaining 2 houses. It can't be compared to a couple sharing a house together. Each will have their own costs associated with their own house, and on top of that they will have the extra costs associated with their child. Everyone has to "cut their cloth". €200-€250 per week is ridiculous to suggest.

sword1

Grumpypants wrote: »

I do realize that, but it isn't as simple as getting 25% of the costs and saying that's half the kids portion. The mother needs to rent at the higher end of the market as she needs her own house so incurs an extra cost. It is unfair to push that burden on her.

Heating, esb etc have standing charges regardless of the number of people in the house etc etc.

If they are very lucky and have after school child care for €100 and rent for €200. Then half the childcare and 25% of the rent is €100.

Thats all the €100 gone and there is nothing for health insurane, house insurance, groceries, clothes, school fees, uniforms, books, bags, extra activities, lunch, bills, transport, birthdays, christmas, sports equipment, dance classes, extra clubs. You know all the stuff the mother still has to pay for on top of being the main caregiver.

Its not simple and every case is different, but you are looking for childcare and school fees which may not be applicable, health insurance is surely a luxury, also the main caregiver will get children's allowance and tax breaks ,i don't think you can make a template when every situation could be so different

Grumpypants

sword1 wrote: »

Its not simple and every case is different, but you are looking for childcare and school fees which may not be applicable, health insurance is surely a luxury, also the main caregiver will get children's allowance and tax breaks ,i don't think you can make a template when every situation could be so different

The OP mentions child care is in place and that 50 of the 100 euro goes directly to this.

Health insurance could be a luxury alright and maybe the school doesnt have any fees, but i fail to see how anyone can say €50 a week for rent, bills, transport, clothes and food etc is "reasonable".

sword1

Grumpypants wrote: »

The OP mentions child care is in place and that 50 of the 100 euro goes directly to this.

Health insurance could be a luxury alright and maybe the school doesnt have any fees, but i fail to see how anyone can say €50 a week for rent, bills, transport, clothes and food etc is "reasonable".

You could be right but there is also child benefit ,tax benefits.The op says he cant pay his mortgage but gives no details of earnings,other kids etc.Impossible to know without a full picture

Grumpypants

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

Exactly, which the mother would be paying whether or not she had a child. She would be paying rent whether or not she had a child, yes, she may have to rent somewhere slightly bigger than if she didn't have a child but the father should not be responsible for 50% of the mothers rent! That's a crazy notion and one which any judge would think ludicrous.

If she needs a bigger place, on her own then she finds it in an area she can afford without asking the father for 50% of her rent. Remember the father is also responsible for his own rent and bills in running his own place. 2 parents are maintaining 2 houses. It can't be compared to a couple sharing a house together. Each will have their own costs associated with their own house, and on top of that they will have the extra costs associated with their child. Everyone has to "cut their cloth". €200-€250 per week is ridiculous to suggest.

She would be paying rent if she was on her own. She would also have the ability to choose a cheaper option. She could house share and get a room for €50 and split all her bills 4 ways.

But she can't she needs a safe and secure home for their child. It is entirely reasonable to expect the father to contribute to that extra cost. Why should the mother be responsible for 75% of this extra cost? Especially when she is the one doing 90% of the work. She is already shouldering the majority of the work and cost in raising their child.

Grumpypants

sword1 wrote: »

You could be right but there is also child benefit ,tax benefits.The op says he cant pay his mortgage but gives no details of earnings,other kids etc.Impossible to know without a full picture

Both the tax credit and childrens allowance will give her about €60 extra a week. Which about covers the cost of the school run.

There is also a huge impact in her ability to earn from having to drop and pick up kids. No overtime, no working late etc. As we know this has a huge impact on earning power.

sword1

Grumpypants wrote: »

Both the tax credit and childrens allowance will give her about €60 extra a week. Which about covers the cost of the school run.

There is also a huge impact in her ability to earn from having to drop and pick up kids. No overtime, no working late etc. As we know this has a huge impact on earning power.

Are you ops ex ?You seem to know alot more about the situation.

Big Bag of Chips

You're presuming a lot grumpypants.

Like it or not single parents (both of them) are financially less well off than their childless friends, or their friends who have children but are together as a couple. That's just reality. And it's a reality that single parents have to work around. You can try to justify it all you like, but the amount you are suggesting is over the top.

Grumpypants wrote: »

Both the tax credit and childrens allowance will give her about €60 extra a week.

So she only needs to add €40 of her own money to match the dad's contribution of €100. €100 from the dad, matched with €100 from the mam means €200 per week to maintain a child. Should be more than enough, even taking into account all the expenses you listed. Even without the mam contributing her own €40, €160 per week is plenty for one child. My friend gets €80 a week from her ex for 2 children.

As for €60 barely covering the school run, I live in a rural area that is very hilly! So heavy enough on fuel. I put €50 in my car and can get nearly 2 weeks out of it, and that's includes school runs, shopping, town, after school activities of which there are many! I have 4 children, so a 7 seater car. If the school run is costing her (or you!) €60 a week you need to get a more efficient car. And you needn't start listing car tax and insurance because she would more than likely have a car if she didn't have a child, so that's her own expense.

€400 a month (at least) from the father plus €140 children's allowance plus whatever the tax credit is worth brings the total contribution to maintaining the child to ~€600 a month, for 1 child. And that doesn't include any financial contribution from the mother at all. If she only contributed €40 a week that would be roughly €800 a month to cover the extra expenses relating to having 1 child.

I have 4 children, all in school, all in various after school activities. €2000 a month solely to spend on expenses for just one child?? I'd love it!!!! I'm sure so would most parents. But we don't have it, so we work with what we do have.

I often hear of €250 A MONTH maintenance being paid for 1 child. A week is just fantasy.

Evd-Burner

Grumpypants wrote: »

She would be paying rent if she was on her own. She would also have the ability to choose a cheaper option. She could house share and get a room for €50 and split all her bills 4 ways.

But she can't she needs a safe and secure home for their child. It is entirely reasonable to expect the father to contribute to that extra cost. Why should the mother be responsible for 75% of this extra cost? Especially when she is the one doing 90% of the work. She is already shouldering the majority of the work and cost in raising their child.

Where do you think the father is living? Surely he also has no choice in this as he needs to provide a safe and secure home for the child during his weekend access? That also takes him out of the equation in regards to house sharing.

Moonbeam

I also have 4. , I think on average they may cost 100 euro per week each if I factor in all costs for the year but not in a normal week .
It depends on age too .

Dravokivich

In all honesty, you can only pay what you've got available to pay. A court won't order you to bankrupt yourself to pay maintenance. I hope the current arrangement is on a the back of a court order and not a mutual agreement. If not, you'll need to get that sorted out.

PVF wrote: »

She wants more to cover half of all the child's expenses .ie back to school,xmas,bday,extra curricular etc.

Why are you supplementing what the mother chooses to do with your daughter for Christmas? We get our son presents ourselves. Try to keep a big gift to one from each of us and then some small things. But we do that ourselves, we aren't supplementing each other.

Grumpypants wrote: »

She would be paying rent if she was on her own. She would also have the ability to choose a cheaper option. She could house share and get a room for €50 and split all her bills 4 ways.

But she can't she needs a safe and secure home for their child. It is entirely reasonable to expect the father to contribute to that extra cost. Why should the mother be responsible for 75% of this extra cost? Especially when she is the one doing 90% of the work. She is already shouldering the majority of the work and cost in raising their child.

To me it sounds like there might be a bit of excess from the mother's side and she's attempting to guilt the OP into paying more especially when taking into account his current financial situation. I'm assuming she's aware of it.

pilly

I went to court on this many years ago now and the judge took a list from both of us of our expenses and crossed off what she wasn't allowing and then said the remainder was our disposable income and 50% of this should be paid for the children.

That was how she arrived at it then anyway.