Terrible tenants putting homeowners off renting out their house

windmilllane

Our last tenants left our house in a terrible state, just had no respect and did very little cleaning from what we found. I was so nervous about getting new ones after the experience. I often wondered about several neighbouring houses and why the owners don't rent them out when they only use them a few tims a year. I was shocked at the number of people who are afraid to rent out their property because of previous bad experiences with tenants and feeling that homeowners have no rights in this country. It's got me really thinking how many houses are lying empty that could be lived in around the country. I can actually think of several near us. We need to get tenants to pay our mortgage but we are hoping we will be luckier this time around.

ongarboy

I know of people who have six figure sums in their bank accounts but when they were told to invest in buy to let properties and were mad leaving it in the bank, they said they didn't want to engage in the potential risk of nightmare tenants despite getting way more in rent then they'd get in interest rates on their deposits as well as rising property appreciation. Not everyone is cut out or has the personality/temperament to be a landlord or to deal with the responsibilities that go with it nor would they desire it. The regulations and lack of perceived protection is also a detriment to would be landlords and goes someway to explaining the high number of vacant properties around the country.

windmilllane

It was only after our bad experience and talking to other home owners that I realised how many people think like this. I really feel our government should do someone about this issue as there are so many houses left empty.

lau1247

not sure if there are legal issue but if you agree in your lease with the tenants that you are allowed do have a quick inspection at a regular interval with them present (example every 2 months), that would leave you with minimal surprise to say the least at the end of the tenancy.

Ms2011

I'm moving next year & if we can't sell our current house (it's in NE) I'd rather leave it empty & pay the mortgage ourselves than rent it out.

johnnyskeleton

windmilllane wrote: »

It was only after our bad experience and talking to other home owners that I realised how many people think like this. I really feel our government should do someone about this issue as there are so many houses left empty.

Why dont you sell your empty house to someone then?

windmilllane

If you read my posts you'll find my house isn't empty and won't be left empty as we have a mortgage to cover. I was referring to the large number of empty houses thst people are afraid to rent due to fear or getting bad tenants

foggy_lad

windmilllane wrote: »

If you read my posts you'll find my house isn't empty and won't be left empty as we have a mortgage to cover. I was referring to the large number of empty houses thst people are afraid to rent due to fear or getting bad tenants

There are as many bad landlords as there are bad tenants.

Graham

foggy_lad wrote: »

There are as many bad landlords as there are bad tenants.

Can't argue with that statement but the financial downsides aren't nearly as evenly balanced as the statement suggests.

foggy_lad

Graham wrote: »

Can't argue with that statement but the financial downsides aren't nearly as evenly balanced as the statement suggests.

Financially there is no real comparison but a tenant can be left homeless and destitute by the often illegal actions of landlords who would not suffer anything like the same if the tenant was to cause some damage or overstay a few months.

If a landlord(term used loosely) can't afford to take such a hit without the bank taking their houses then they need to sell up and let someone else take over their failed venture.

Graham

foggy_lad wrote: »

If a landlord(term used loosely) can't afford to take such a hit without the bank taking their houses then they need to sell up and let someone else take over their failed venture.

So landlords should be prepared to face upto 3yrs loss of rent and a potentially massive refurb bill because........

You get that it's these sort of costs that contribute directly and indirectly to increased rents?

davo10

foggy_lad wrote: »

Financially there is no real comparison but a tenant can be left homeless and destitute by the often illegal actions of landlords who would not suffer anything like the same if the tenant was to cause some damage or overstay a few months.

If a landlord(term used loosely) can't afford to take such a hit without the bank taking their houses then they need to sell up and let someone else take over their failed venture.

Wow, just wow.

I'd hazard a guess that the majority of landlords would love to do that if only it was that easy. Of course to do that, they probably have to get the tenant out first.

I'd go with stocks over blocks, after over a decade of thought.

Dee5

The house next door to us is empty. Last tenant completely destroyed it by the sounds of things. Not a windowsill left in the place, any wall that could be punched through was!
Im in a semi d and I'm convinced half our heat is being sucked in or something to the empty house. I'd love if someone was in there, for some reason I don't like my neighbouring house empty.
Although telly music and kids playing as loud as they like has some perks!

When I win the lotto I'm buying both houses and knocking all the walls down and having a mini mansion!

c montgomery

foggy_lad wrote: »

So be a better landlord by breaking the law by discriminating and by illegal on the spot evictions?

Landlord perfectly entitled to decide who the best person to give the keys to there multi hundred thousand euro property to.

Particular is a good word for it.

Lumen

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

Why dont you sell your empty house to someone then?

windmilllane wrote: »

If you read my posts you'll find my house isn't empty and won't be left empty as we have a mortgage to cover.

windmilllane on another thread wrote: »

We built a 5 bed detached house 6 miles from a very busy tourist town 10 years ago. When my husbands mum got sick we moved in with her to care for her and stayed on in the house after her death. Our original house has been rented out, we have had some great tenants and some not so great and find we are constantly paying out for maintenance. The house is 13 miles from where we live now so it's a bit of a trek. We have decided to sell it and after paying balance of mortgage etc we hope to have €130k approx

Unless I've misread, you have €130k positive equity and therefore would have no problem selling to clear the mortgage, in fact were proposing to do just that a short time ago.

hytrogen

windmilllane wrote:

It was only after our bad experience and talking to other home owners that I realised how many people think like this. I really feel our government should do someone about this issue as there are so many houses left empty.

It's a bit rich to be getting the government involved in an unregulated market or domestic situation, this whole idea of rent relief for incomes of up to 55k is just inflating the whole situation unnecessarily or example. It should really be the mammy's & daddy's setting good upbringings, ethics & moral hygiene before letting the snowflakes out into the big bad world.

athtrasna

Mod note

The forum charter prohibits tenant v landlord attacks and vice versa so this thread is on shaky ground. Please post with this in mind.

Eirearoeire please do not post again on this thread. Your racist rants have no place on this forum and have been deleted.

Markcheese

Could the PRTB improve the situation... by holding deposits.. and having a handover service to act as a fair referee for both land lord and Tennant...
If the PRTB refuses to act with either a landlord or Tennant you'd know there'd been a major problem in the past ..

TheDoc

windmilllane wrote: »

It was only after our bad experience and talking to other home owners that I realised how many people think like this. I really feel our government should do someone about this issue as there are so many houses left empty.

And other homeowners don't constitute the entire thinking body.

The government clearly won't be anything to really help landlord sin the current climate. Thats not how politics works. There is a "renting" crisis, which immediately constitutes "tenants". The government will ensure that tenants will get any new legislation and be looked after as that is where some bulk votes will come from, simples.

You've had a bad experience. Just need to get over it. Your effectively a business owner now. Your going to get burnt, your going to make mistakes, your going to get stressed.

You use them to mitigate risk in the future, you put those lessons into practice.

I've had three landlords in my time renting, and all three were fantastic. I don't however just not acknowledge there is terrible landlords out there. And I'm also acutely aware that eventually I might have a bad one. But I used what I learned each time, to bring into the next relationship and maintaining what I believe to be a really good relationship. Jesus our last landlord we exchanged presents at Christmas and his family dropped over stuff when our first born came on the scene

You had a bad experience, it's **** and it's crap, and cool you having a moan about it. But there are so many good tenants out there, I'd guess more good than bad, just like with landlords.

Graham

TheDoc wrote: »

The government clearly won't be anything to really help landlord sin the current climate. Thats not how politics works. There is a "renting" crisis, which immediately constitutes "tenants". The government will ensure that tenants will get any new legislation and be looked after as that is where some bulk votes will come from, simples.

That highlights a major part of the problem. You can't legislate in favour of tenants in isolation, especially if the legislation is detrimental to landlords.

Lux23

Markcheese wrote: »

Could the PRTB improve the situation... by holding deposits.. and having a handover service to act as a fair referee for both land lord and Tennant...
If the PRTB refuses to act with either a landlord or Tennant you'd know there'd been a major problem in the past ..

A deposit escrow scheme is coming in as far as I know. But I would assume that both parties have to agree to it.

shar01

13 miles is not a trek (as per your other thread).

You either want to look after your investment or you don't. As a previous poster said, put it into the lease that you will visit every X weeks / months and will give Y notice and then stick to that. Be perfectly clear with your tenants that you expect certain things / areas to be kept clean.

windmilllane

Thanks for all the responses, as I said we intend to get more tenants. I have no doubt there are plenty of excellent tenants out there. I was merely expresssing my shock at the number of empty dwellings which I think is a shame considering the demand for houses.

newacc2015

Markcheese wrote: »

Could the PRTB improve the situation... by holding deposits.. and having a handover service to act as a fair referee for both land lord and Tennant...
If the PRTB refuses to act with either a landlord or Tennant you'd know there'd been a major problem in the past ..

The RTB could improve the system by being abolished tomorrow. It was set up around 12 years ago and has been a complete and utter failure. IMO it is beyond repair.

Allowing it handle deposits IMO is just another way it is trying to stop itself being abolished. 99.7% of tenancies end with no deposit dispute and out of that 0.3% of remaining tenancies with a deposit dispute, only 40% were unfairly withheld(an additional 40% partially unfairly withheld). So we are going to spend millions one setting up a system to protect deposits and hire a tons of people to process the system at another massive cost to protect a few hundred unfairly withheld deposits. It would probably be significantly cheaper for the state to write a cheque to these people who have a deposit dispute than the system that the RTB wants

We need a US style housing court. You go to the local court house, pay a small fee and within a few weeks a non-paying tenant is evicted. None of this waiting for months as the RTB have a backlog. You should be able to go to the courts to evict a seriously anti-social tenant within 24 hours.

If a landlord fails to pay his mortgage, some banks are entitled to repossess the house within 2 months. Yet a tenant who doesnt pay his rent can live in the house for years without recourse. It makes no sense at all

The_Conductor

Markcheese wrote: »

Could the PRTB improve the situation... by holding deposits.. and having a handover service to act as a fair referee for both land lord and Tennant...
If the PRTB refuses to act with either a landlord or Tennant you'd know there'd been a major problem in the past ..

The Irish system they are planning to bring in- is to be based on the system in place in Scotland. The Scottish escrow company holding deposits- this week sent a report to Holyrood- advising they have millions in orphaned deposits on the one hand (one person is suggesting 48 million sterling) which has not been given back to either tenant or landlord and which has been in their possession for a period of over 5 years- what should they do with it? They also report over a quarter billion (sterling) in unfunded claims by landlords for damage to residential properties, which the deposits held are insufficient to remedy (the suggestion being that the deposit levels are set at far too low a level- and should be massively hiked). The SNP have said they are not going to allow the legislation required to hike deposits beyond their current multiples...........

Escrow- is great in theory- however, if you sit down and look at how it functions even just across the way in Scotland- you rapidly see that for every problem it has solved (and it has solved many)- it created at least one new problem. For example- residential property rent is soaring in Scotland- at a pace higher than any other part of the UK (some areas- including some quite desireable London districts- are actually falling). The local papers in Edinburgh have almost verbatim the same stories about soaring rent- and the same discussions on how it can be tackled, that we have over here. There is also the self-same discussions on whether owners can be compelled to let vacant or holiday properties, to try to alleviate some of the supply side issues.

There genuinely is not a magic wand that can be waved- which will alleviate the concerns of landlords, give security of tenure to tenants, fix the taxation issues with rental property and promote the better use of vacant properties.

A lot of the suggestions being bandied around- have been tried and tested elsewhere- and have not been shown to deliver the benefits that either tenants or landlords imagine will accrue.

Spanish Eyes

Overstayers without paying rent is the problem. How long is a piece of string?

Whereas, adequate statutory notice to quit must be provided by the LL.

There is a bit of imbalance there IMV. And afaik no sanctions apply to tenants who stay, rent free and are evicted after months/years.

Has to be a two way street here.

4ensic15

If there is a dispute about a termination notice the tenant should have to pay the full rent to the RTB during the dispute or they are out within 7 days. The genuine tenants would be protected and the scammers would be out on their ear.

the_syco

foggy_lad wrote: »

There are as many bad landlords as there are bad tenants.

Tenant can live rent-free for a year, but the landlord cannot charge over a certain amount. Laws currently favour the tenant very much in Ireland.

foggy_lad wrote: »

they need to sell up and let someone else take over their failed venture.

Negative equity often stops this.

Markcheese wrote: »

Could the PRTB improve the situation... by holding deposits.. and having a handover service to act as a fair referee for both land lord and Tennant...

Not the PTRB (chronically underfunded), but yes, it needs to happen.

newacc2015 wrote: »

We need a US style housing court. You go to the local court house, pay a small fee and within a few weeks a non-paying tenant is evicted. None of this waiting for months as the RTB have a backlog. You should be able to go to the courts to evict a seriously anti-social tenant within 24 hours.

If a landlord fails to pay his mortgage, some banks are entitled to repossess the house within 2 months. Yet a tenant who doesnt pay his rent can live in the house for years without recourse. It makes no sense at all

100% agree!