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DCM 2016 Graduates: Keep On Running
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In no particular order, just to address some recent questions and posts. Going forward it will not be my m.o. to offer unsolicited advice, but rather to give general information and guidance on topics as they come up so you can make informed decisions about your training. You’re graduates now, all qualified and independent, making Nop proud!
There is rarely just one answer to any running question and a one-size-fits-all approach rarely works, BUT there are certain things across the board that just don’t make sense and I will call out anything that I believe could potentially have a negative outcome whether that is overtraining, running while injured, running easy runs too fast etc. etc. You could probably write the list yourselves! So don’t say I didn’t warn yis
Well, as I really enjoyed the DCM and I recovered so well, I had a couple of talks with some experienced runners/coaches... I can do San Sebastian under 5h... and a friend is coming with me to drag me through the Finish line. So I know it is crazy, but as they said I don't race, just run... I could keep the fitness up and do it in 2 weeks. So I am tapering again!
Back to Back Marathons
Yup, it's bags of crazy! I can’t say I agree with the idea of doing marathons in quick succession, especially for recent graduates. I suspect your heart is set on it and you're not about to change your mind ? You've admitted it's crazy, so just be aware of how you are feeling throughout the race and don't be afraid to pull up if something isn't right.Thanks man, I looked into that but MRIs cost a couple hundred euro, I got an x-ray and nothing showed up. Still though, looking into it a bit more I'm starting to think maybe running a half marathon on it would be idiotic.
Racing when injured
Yup, it would! Never a good idea. Running will not improve the injury and will delay your recovery. Seeking professional advice and following it is the surest and shortest route to recovery. I have full sympathy for every injured runner (been there, bought the t-shirt and the shares in my physio's practice :rolleyes:) but sense must prevail.0 -
Question to all... that jacket looks a bit thick for me... I prefer lighter things... do you wear under armour (or whatever the name is?) and lighter jacket or thick-ish jacket? Just curiosity... Thanks
That jacket is certainly not a running jacket and way too heavy (unless you're out for a walk). We are blessed here in Ireland with a temperate climate. If you think the winters are cold, have a look at the map and note we are on a latitude with Newfoundland.
Winter for me means shorts, long sleeved top, maybe a light running jacket but only if windy or wet. Bought some leggings/tights once but they I'll be donating them to uvox as soon as he sends me his address. I have a base layer but never wear it - it's too warm. But each to their own. Experiment.0 -
That jacket is certainly not a running jacket and way too heavy (unless you're out for a walk). We are blessed here in Ireland with a temperate climate. If you think the winters are cold, have a look at the map and note we are on a latitude with Newfoundland.
Winter for me means shorts, long sleeved top, maybe a light running jacket but only if windy or wet. Bought some leggings/tights once but they I'll be donating them to uvox as soon as he sends me his address. I have a base layer but never wear it - it's too warm. But each to their own. Experiment.
Gloves and cozy ear muff are my essentials! Once my hands and ears are warm, the rest of me will be grand (in Ireland anyway).
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Question to all... that jacket looks a bit thick for me... I prefer lighter things... do you wear under armour (or whatever the name is?) and lighter jacket or thick-ish jacket? Just curiosity... Thanks
I christened this one on Saturday night:
http://www.northernrunner.com/clothing-c143/running-jackets-c290/inov8-at-c-windshell-full-zip-teal-pink-womens-p3530/
It's very light, so light I first thought I should send it back to the shop! Felt silly paying (nearly) that amount for something so insubstantial. But it was grand on Saturday in light rain and 10C and seems fine for a bit colder too.
I got it a bit cheaper than that with Sportshoes but they don't seem to have that one any more (2weeks later ...). They have some other possibly heavier (more expensive) options (stormshell, raceshell etc) including some from prior seasons which are discounted.
I can't be relied on as despite years of running it's my first proper "running jacket" and colour was a deciding factor
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The Black Oil wrote: »I laugh any time I see a reference to 'speed work', makes me think we're going to become ninjas.
You mean we're not??
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budhistmonk wrote: »I won't be able to make Jingle Bells but will join my local Parkrun (shanganagh) on the 3rd.
What I am wondering is how to best plan to try and race a 5k on Dec 3rd? Should I try and introduce some speed work (tempo, intervals) at predicted 5K pace (?) on a mid-week run, what pace should my easy/lsr pace be i.e. should these be a bit quicker than the marathon equivalent? Prior to DCM I usually ran 3 easy runs (~4m) during the week and a slightly longer run on Sat (7-10m) so thought I'd keep to 4 runs per week. Any thoughts would be greatly received and appreciated.
Thanks budhistmonk for the timely question. Here’s my suggestions for anyone planning to do the 5K (and I think a lot of you are, which is great). Remember, you are still in recovery mode. Ideally you should be doing easy running exclusively for another 10 days or so. By easy I mean genuinely easy i.e. you’re not out of breath, you could hold a conversation, sing a song, whatever. EASY. EEEZEE. Try and ditch the watch (or at the very least ignore it and drool over your stats later – this is called a naked run :eek:. More on this anon. I may invite a very special guest speaker to talk to you about naked running).
That brings us up to 1 week to go before the 5K. Time to figure out what your goal/likely pace is going to be so you don’t go off like a lunatic. The various calculators will throw up times based on your marathon but the correlation between 5K and marathon times is tenuous to say the least, particularly with less experienced runners. So most of you will have a 5K/parkrun time from 2016, maybe even a PB. If you feel at this point that you are in good shape and are fully recovered I suggest you use that time to set your current 5K training pace (In your case @budhistmonk you'd be looking at around 4:50 min/km, yes?). So, the week before the race you should be back running your full complement of days whether that is 3,4,5 or 6. Structure this final week (Sat-Fri) as usual with a long run (reduce this by 20% or so if you wish), and shorter easy runs, but you may wish to throw in a session on the Monday or Tuesday such as 1-2 miles w/up, 2 x 400m (or 2 x 2 mins) @5k pace (not faster), 3 mins jog recovery in between, then 1-2 miles c/d. I’d also suggest including strides to your last run before the 5K whether that’s on the Thursday or Friday. Make sense ? Shout if not. If I’m making assumptions anywhere let me know. Pay special attention to your stretching pre-race week. We’ll talk about the race itself and how to pace it in due course.
The idea of the 5K at this point is to see where you’re at post marathon. It’s not a goal race as such, plenty of time for that later on. So, who’s bringing the flapjacks ???0 -
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paddydriver wrote: ». also helps to sweat off more pounds.. :PThe Muppet wrote: »I'm with you there H, with the reduced milage I'm finding it difficult keeping those extra few pounds in check so every little bit helps.
:pac::pac::pac: Lads, I hate to break it to you but the vast majority of weight lost through sweating is water-weight and the effect is only temporary and not sustainable. If you find the weight creeping up a little post-marathon don't worry about it too much, it'll sort itself out when you're back in a regular training routine. In the meantime keeping the hands out of the cookie jar will have a better outcome than wearing too many layers 0 -
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Bungy Girl wrote: »Thanks budhistmonk for the timely question. Here’s my suggestions for anyone planning to do the 5K (and I think a lot of you are, which is great). Remember, you are still in recovery mode. Ideally you should be doing easy running exclusively for another 10 days or so. By easy I mean genuinely easy i.e. you’re not out of breath, you could hold a conversation, sing a song, whatever. EASY. EEEZEE. Try and ditch the watch (or at the very least ignore it and drool over your stats later – this is called a naked run :eek:. More on this anon. I may invite a very special guest speaker to talk to you about naked running).
That brings us up to 1 week to go before the 5K. Time to figure out what your goal/likely pace is going to be so you don’t go off like a lunatic. The various calculators will throw up times based on your marathon but the correlation between 5K and marathon times is tenuous to say the least, particularly with less experienced runners. So most of you will have a 5K/parkrun time from 2016, maybe even a PB. If you feel at this point that you are in good shape and are fully recovered I suggest you use that time to set your current 5K training pace (In your case @budhistmonk you'd be looking at around 4:50 min/km, yes?). So, the week before the race you should be back running your full complement of days whether that is 3,4,5 or 6. Structure this final week (Sat-Fri) as usual with a long run (reduce this by 20% or so if you wish), and shorter easy runs, but you may wish to throw in a session on the Monday or Tuesday such as 1-2 miles w/up, 2 x 400m (or 2 x 2 mins) @5k pace (not faster), 3 mins jog recovery in between, then 1-2 miles c/d. I’d also suggest including strides to your last run before the 5K whether that’s on the Thursday or Friday. Make sense ? Shout if not. If I’m making assumptions anywhere let me know. Pay special attention to your stretching pre-race week. We’ll talk about the race itself and how to pace it in due course.
The idea of the 5K at this point is to see where you’re at post marathon. It’s not a goal race as such, plenty of time for that later on. So, who’s bringing the flapjacks ???
Thanks BG this is perfect. Yep I think 4.50 mins/km is my ~5k pace. I'm a miles man so I think that's somewhere around 7.45 mins/m. So it's really easy until the week before and then a possible interval session as you suggested on the Monday (I usually run mon, wed, thur and sat) and then throw in a few strides at end of thurs easy run. For the "easy" runs the week before should they be at the usual marathon easy pace (i.e. the pace we're running at now) or will that change since we're training for a shorter distance? Apologies if these are extremely basic questions.0 -
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budhistmonk wrote: »Thanks BG this is perfect. Yep I think 4.50 mins/km is my ~5k pace. I'm a miles man so I think that's somewhere around 7.45 mins/m. So it's really easy until the week before and then a possible interval session as you suggested on the Monday (I usually run mon, wed, thur and sat) and then throw in a few strides at end of thurs easy run. For the "easy" runs the week before should they be at the usual marathon easy pace (i.e. the pace we're running at now) or will that change since we're training for a shorter distance? Apologies if these are extremely basic questions.
I'm a miles fan myself. Usually only switch to Km for a 5 or 10K race. No such thing as a basic question on this thread so don't be afraid to ask.
To answer your question continue to run your easy runs at the same effort as you are doing now - that doesn't change because you're training for a shorter distance. But don't be surprised if your Garmin data shows your easy pace getting gradually faster over time.
Try to think less about pace and more about effort. The reason being, as you get fitter aerobically, your easy pace becomes faster for the same effort. (All other things being equal. External and internal factors can have an impact too). If you continue to think of 'easy' as a particular pace and stick rigidly to that pace then you're not claiming the full benefit of your increased ability to cover more miles than before at an easy effort.
Take Home Message: Don't be a slave to your Garmins! Let them guide but not dictate your training.0 -
Bungy Girl wrote: »:pac::pac::pac: Lads, I hate to break it to you but the vast majority of weight lost through sweating is water-weight and the effect is only temporary and not sustainable. If you find the weight creeping up a little post-marathon don't worry about it too much, it'll sort itself out when you're back in a regular training routine. In the meantime keeping the hands out of the cookie jar will have a better outcome than wearing too many layers
It's not the cookies with me . I just need to eat less for now until I get back to some proper milage . It's good actually I made some changes to my diet over the last few weeks and am back to where I was marathon week . Just hoping they are sustainable and the progress continues . It's an area I need to improve anyway.0 -
Thanks so much again BG. Makes perfect senseBungy Girl wrote: »I'm a miles fan myself. Usually only switch to Km for a 5 or 10K race. No such thing as a basic question on this thread so don't be afraid to ask.
To answer your question continue to run your easy runs at the same effort as you are doing now - that doesn't change because you're training for a shorter distance. But don't be surprised if your Garmin data shows your easy pace getting gradually faster over time.
Try to think less about pace and more about effort. The reason being, as you get fitter aerobically, your easy pace becomes faster for the same effort. (All other things being equal. External and internal factors can have an impact too). If you continue to think of 'easy' as a particular pace and stick rigidly to that pace then you're not claiming the full benefit of your increased ability to cover more miles than before at an easy effort.
Take Home Message: Don't be a slave to your Garmins! Let them guide but not dictate your training.0 -
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Bungy Girl wrote: »I'm a miles fan myself. Usually only switch to Km for a 5 or 10K race. No such thing as a basic question on this thread so don't be afraid to ask.
To answer your question continue to run your easy runs at the same effort as you are doing now - that doesn't change because you're training for a shorter distance. But don't be surprised if your Garmin data shows your easy pace getting gradually faster over time.
Try to think less about pace and more about effort. The reason being, as you get fitter aerobically, your easy pace becomes faster for the same effort. (All other things being equal. External and internal factors can have an impact too). If you continue to think of 'easy' as a particular pace and stick rigidly to that pace then you're not claiming the full benefit of your increased ability to cover more miles than before at an easy effort.
Take Home Message: Don't be a slave to your Garmins! Let them guide but not dictate your training.
That totally makes sense. Have been doing easy 3 miles this week and pace has increased but I didn't even notice. Really trying to run by feel now, which can be easier said than done!0
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