What next???

bladespin

Hi guys, I've followed this board for a long time and have found it invaluable and I'm hoping there's some more advice for me now.

Little background first: I turned 42 in August and had a bit of a now or never moment.

I've always been fairly fit with a good build, over the last few years I've gradually acquired a 'dad' bod; moobs etc thanks mainly to a poor-ish diet - I've trained on and off (more on) since I was 14 but never really put too much research into diet bar following a strict one every few years in an attempt to peel back for a holiday, wedding whatever, good for a short term goal but not great for real results until finally at 42 I was 5'8 weighing in at 14st 4.

On the run up to my birthday I'd seen several of the 'transformation' posts in social media, I liked 'The body coach' videos and posts so began researching and designing my own version, I knew about Macros, TDEE etc but as said never really put much into it - until then.

Armed with a 200 cal deficit and a 40/40/20 split I attacked:
Month 1 = HIIT
Month 2 = Muscle building with a little cardio.
Month 3 = Cardio and weight training (high rep)

Training days are broken into Back and chest, legs and abs, arms and shoulders.

It worked great, I'm at 12st 7lb now and the mirror is kind, the 6 pack and V are close too.

I'm delighted and in the best shape since my teens (I kid not) but now the program end is near I'm a little lost as to where/what to do now.

I'd love to build my arms and back a bit more (I admit vanity), my legs are pretty good as they are though want to keep my gains, I'm also a bit frightened of fattening back up.

I'm looking at going with a more traditional weight based training program:
maybe 5 sets, 10-12 reps, 2 exercises per part along with 15 min HIIT in the middle, what do you think of this? or do you have any suggestions?
Thanks in advance.

bladespin

Anyone???

alxmorgan

relatively new to this but I find I like to keep mixing it up myself to keep me interested and also don't like the idea of the body getting too comfortable.

So there are various options:

1) Try heavy days and volume days

2) Give GVT a try (this one is very tough and only to be done short term)

3) Try a more isolation based approach e.g. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLG5kwi_L5a2fyykuVJNPQs-TjEXIn-eTV

Any one thing to do is definitely keep a log of everything. Every weight used, every set, every rep. That way you can always be sure you are pushing yourself to the next level.

Alf Veedersane

bladespin wrote: »

I'm looking at going with a more traditional weight based training program:
maybe 5 sets, 10-12 reps, 2 exercises per part along with 15 min HIIT in the middle, what do you think of this? or do you have any suggestions?
Thanks in advance.

More traditional than what?

What did your (current?) high rep weight training look like?

bladespin

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

More traditional than what?

What did your (current?) high rep weight training look like?

An example of a current W/O would be something along these lines:

Arms/shoulders night
10mins HIIT
Alternating curl:
50 reps rest 1min 30
40 reps rest 1 min
30 reps rest 45sec
20 reps rest 30sec
10 reps

(very close to failure at 50 but not just)
then

10mins HIIT
Arnolds reps and rests as above.

Then secondaries for each part, something like:

Hammer curls
25 reps - rest 1min
20 reps rest 45sec
15 reps
Shoulder flies
25 reps - rest 1min
20 reps rest 45sec
15 reps

Alf Veedersane

I presume 50 reps is 25 each arm.

Why so high?

bladespin

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I presume 50 reps is 25 each arm.

Why so high?

50 each arm, the weight is lighter than I used to lift for the obvious reasons, it's a version of DTP, dramatic transformation principle.

Irishcrx

If you are now looking to build muscle on your arms and back IMO you are going to need to go hard and heavy. High reps will create a pump on your biceps , triceps and back but I've found to really build muscle in those areas you want to be using progressive overload and hitting heavy weights in the 4-6 range. Get to a weight that you can control perfectly in that range but complete no more than 6 reps per set, if you can complete more than 6 you need to go up in weight a little bit.
This combined with a lean bulk will begin to add muscle to those areas.

bladespin

Awesome, thanks.

Alf Veedersane

It doesn't have to be in as narrow a range as 4-6 reps but you need to be going close to failure with something a little more challenging than what you'd use for those high rep sets and there needs to be a progression, week on week.

Mellor

bladespin wrote: »

Armed with a 200 cal deficit and a 40/40/20 split I attacked:
Month 1 = HIIT
Month 2 = Muscle building with a little cardio.
Month 3 = Cardio and weight training (high rep)

The first suggestion I'd have would be to go back to month 2's routine and repeat that. But obviously I don't know exactly what you did then.


Also, you lost 25lbs over 3 months. About 2 lbs a week. That would suggest a 1000cal a day deficit, not the 200 you mention above.

While the issue helped you reach you goal above (200 is too small a deficit imo) not recognising the issue now could hinder muscle gain goals.

bladespin wrote: »

50 each arm, the weight is lighter than I used to lift for the obvious reasons, it's a version of DTP, dramatic transformation principle.

That sounds a bit made up tbh.

Obviously, everything is made up at some point, but you get my meaning. Flashy market label rather than scientific principle.

Transform

bladespin wrote: »

Hi guys, I've followed this board for a long time and have found it invaluable and I'm hoping there's some more advice for me now.

Little background first: I turned 42 in August and had a bit of a now or never moment.

I've always been fairly fit with a good build, over the last few years I've gradually acquired a 'dad' bod; moobs etc thanks mainly to a poor-ish diet - I've trained on and off (more on) since I was 14 but never really put too much research into diet bar following a strict one every few years in an attempt to peel back for a holiday, wedding whatever, good for a short term goal but not great for real results until finally at 42 I was 5'8 weighing in at 14st 4.

On the run up to my birthday I'd seen several of the 'transformation' posts in social media, I liked 'The body coach' videos and posts so began researching and designing my own version, I knew about Macros, TDEE etc but as said never really put much into it - until then.

Armed with a 200 cal deficit and a 40/40/20 split I attacked:
Month 1 = HIIT
Month 2 = Muscle building with a little cardio.
Month 3 = Cardio and weight training (high rep)

Training days are broken into Back and chest, legs and abs, arms and shoulders.

It worked great, I'm at 12st 7lb now and the mirror is kind, the 6 pack and V are close too.

I'm delighted and in the best shape since my teens (I kid not) but now the program end is near I'm a little lost as to where/what to do now.

I'd love to build my arms and back a bit more (I admit vanity), my legs are pretty good as they are though want to keep my gains, I'm also a bit frightened of fattening back up.

I'm looking at going with a more traditional weight based training program:
maybe 5 sets, 10-12 reps, 2 exercises per part along with 15 min HIIT in the middle, what do you think of this? or do you have any suggestions?
Thanks in advance.

as the lads have suggested do some lower rep range work but with that comes 'some' increased risk as the loads tend to be heavier and you should be asking - how strong is strong enough? Maybe you dont need to change anything with your current training program and just make sure you're doing enough mobility work i.e. can place palms on the floor comfortably, reasonable attempt at front splits, no issues going overhead etc

Think its easy for guys/gals under 40yrs old to say "yea go heavier" but from what i see most dont need to move much beyond hitting some basic numbers and building a more rounded version of 'fitness'.

personally - for me its mobility work, oly lifting or gymnastics, strength work in lower rep ranges, accessory work or a metcon in higher rep ranges, more mobility work

bladespin

Mellor wrote: »

The first suggestion I'd have would be to go back to month 2's routine and repeat that. But obviously I don't know exactly what you did then.


Also, you lost 25lbs over 3 months. About 2 lbs a week. That would suggest a 1000cal a day deficit, not the 200 you mention above.

While the issue helped you reach you goal above (200 is too small a deficit imo) not recognising the issue now could hinder muscle gain goals.


That sounds a bit made up tbh.

Obviously, everything is made up at some point, but you get my meaning. Flashy market label rather than scientific principle.

Thanks, it was GVT in the middle, I've started GVT phase 2 now (yesterday) it ticks the boxes the lads suggested above.

10 reps x 6 sets, heavy weight (for me), 2 exercises per body part each w/o.

I did basic calculations re deficit, my TDEE came out around 2000cals, I dropped back to about 1700 to 1800 (didn't include veg), having messed about with calorie controlled diets before this actually meant I was eating more during my average day though cutting out all the rubbish - no sweets at all, no takeaways, alcohol too etc for the 100 days.

I have upped cals since then, 2000 per day now, going with an approx 45, 35, 20 split. Maybe I should add some though still a little paranoid about fat.

More about DTP here DTP, saw some reviews and though it might be good (it was for me).

Mellor

bladespin wrote: »

I did basic calculations re deficit, my TDEE came out around 2000cals, I dropped back to about 1700 to 1800 (didn't include veg), having messed about with calorie controlled diets before this actually meant I was eating more during my average day though cutting out all the rubbish - no sweets at all, no takeaways, alcohol too etc for the 100 days.

I have upped cals since then, 2000 per day now, going with an approx 45, 35, 20 split. Maybe I should add some though still a little paranoid about fat.

There's the error in your numbers. You TDEE was't only 2000. Probably around about 2700.
A 200 cal deficit is very small, and works out as 5 or 6lbs over 100 days.
At 2700 TDEE, you were running a 900 calorie deficit, which equates to 25 lbs in 100 days. Exactly what you lost as it happens.

When trying to lose weight, the TDEE error speed up weight loss results. But by not correcting it, you're really hinder your muscle gain goals. At 2000 calories you are still in a deficit, and will continue to lose weight, albeit slower.

At you new weight (175lbs), your TDEE is probably 2400, for mass gaining you'd need to be eating over TDEE. I'd suggest eating at maintenance for a month (2400), and seeing how your feel, monitor weight changes. Then after a month considering increasing calories if needed.

Transform

Mellor wrote: »

There's the error in your numbers. You TDEE was't only 2000. Probably around about 2700.
A 200 cal deficit is very small, and works out as 5 or 6lbs over 100 days.
At 2700 TDEE, you were running a 900 calorie deficit, which equates to 25 lbs in 100 days. Exactly what you lost as it happens.

When trying to lose weight, the TDEE error speed up weight loss results. But by not correcting it, you're really hinder your muscle gain goals. At 2000 calories you are still in a deficit, and will continue to lose weight, albeit slower.

At you new weight (175lbs), your TDEE is probably 2400, for mass gaining you'd need to be eating over TDEE. I'd suggest eating at maintenance for a month (2400), and seeing how your feel, monitor weight changes. Then after a month considering increasing calories if needed.

this is all bang on plus im not a huge fan of high rep training only thats supposedly (no one is 100% certain about this process) mainly focused on sarcoplasmic growth versus myfibrillar growth

do some higher rep range training, some lower rep range training, eat right to elicit the results you want

bladespin

Thanks guys, I guessed my figures were a bit off but not as much as it turned out eek!

I'll go with Mellor's suggestion, helps that Christmas is on the way (I'll try to keep it clean), did bit of forward planning hoping a switch back to deficit in the New year would shift any 'unwanted' gains.

Thanks again, love this forum, straight talk, trying to find this kind of advice on the internet was like pushing weight.

Edit, I thought it was a bit odd this morning weighing in after 4 days of my calculated (old method) over maintenance to find I'd lost another lb lol.