Irish Spouse or EU spouse

on_my_oe

I married my OH and moved to Ireland on a stamp 4 visa. At the time OH was EU non Irish and I'm non EU. I was granted the EU family visa which expires next month. OHs recently gained Irish citizenship so holds dual nationality - both EU.

I'm looking at the INIS site trying to work out which process to follow to renew my visa. I think we must use the Irish process, but 17.2 of the reunification document states OH must earn 40k. OH doesn't earn that much.

Is there any rules that say Irish citizenship must come first or can I apply under the EU stamp 4? I'm eligible to apply for Irish citizenship myself but for personal reasons I don't want to apply yet.

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Family%20Reunification%20Policy%20Document.pdf/Files/Family%20Reunification%20Policy%20Document.pdf

Pro Hoc Vice

on_my_oe wrote: »

I married my OH and moved to Ireland on a stamp 4 visa. At the time OH was EU non Irish and I'm non EU. I was granted the EU family visa which expires next month. OHs recently gained Irish citizenship so holds dual nationality - both EU.

I'm looking at the INIS site trying to work out which process to follow to renew my visa. I think we must use the Irish process, but 17.2 of the reunification document states OH must earn 40k. OH doesn't earn that much.

Is there any rules that say Irish citizenship must come first or can I apply under the EU stamp 4? I'm eligible to apply for Irish citizenship myself but for personal reasons I don't want to apply yet.

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Family%20Reunification%20Policy%20Document.pdf/Files/Family%20Reunification%20Policy%20Document.pdf

To the best of my knowledge that question has not been answered by the courts. I believe that INIS are saying the Irish Citizen rules apply, but I believe an argument can be made that EEA rules should still apply as the original permission is European.

BTW I think the 40,000 is not per year but the total income excluding SW in previous 3 years.

"An Irish citizen, in order to sponsor an immediate family member, must not have been totally or predominantly reliant on benefits from the Irish State for a continuous period in excess of 2 years immediately prior to the application and must over the three year period prior to application have earned a cumulative gross income over and above any State benefits of not less than €40k."

GerardKeating

Pro Hoc Vice wrote: »

To the best of my knowledge that question has not been answered by the courts. I believe that INIS are saying the Irish Citizen rules apply, but I believe an argument can be made that EEA rules should still apply as the original permission is European.

BTW I think the 40,000 is not per year but the total income excluding SW in previous 3 years.

"An Irish citizen, in order to sponsor an immediate family member, must not have been totally or predominantly reliant on benefits from the Irish State for a continuous period in excess of 2 years immediately prior to the application and must over the three year period prior to application have earned a cumulative gross income over and above any State benefits of not less than €40k."

but would "sponsor an immediate family member" apply to a spouse ?

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Pro Hoc Vice

GerardKeating wrote: »

but would "sponsor an immediate family member" apply to a spouse ?

Yes. Under EU law the definition is very broad and of course includes spouse for Irish law it's very narrow and one of the few people it covers is spouse can't really get mor immediate than spouse.

Pro Hoc Vice

Fred Swanson wrote: »

I don't think so.

Who do you think it applies to then?

Pro Hoc Vice

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2004:229:0035:0048:en:PDF

See definition in Article 2.

Pro Hoc Vice

"a) Immediate Family
Nuclear family – Spouse and children under the age of 18;
de facto partners (for the purposes of this document a de facto
relationship is a cohabiting relationship akin to marriage duly
attested); (b) Parents;
(c) Other family."

From page 7 http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Family%20Reunification%20Policy%20Document.pdf/Files/Family%20Reunification%20Policy%20Document.pdf

The Veteran

This is quite simple; if the OP already has EU FAM4 (he suggests early on in the thread he has) and his spouse is still whatever EU nationality, then this is a straightforward renewal - nothing to do with spouse now also being Irish

Pro Hoc Vice

The Veteran wrote: »

This is quite simple; if the OP already has EU FAM4 (he suggests early on in the thread he has) and his spouse is still whatever EU nationality, then this is a straightforward renewal - nothing to do with spouse now also being Irish

That can be a problem as in some cases the EEA national may not be allowed to keep old passport as in the case of A number of countries that do not allow two passports. My view is based on a situation where the person was informed by department that as spouse would then be Irish only then the Irish rules would apply.

The Veteran

OP said in first post spouse had dual nationality, hence why his case case is simple.

Pro Hoc Vice

The Veteran wrote: »

OP said in first post spouse had dual nationality, hence why his case case is simple.

You are correct.