Dublin café VS. the Gluten Free by choice

Noveight

Earlier today, the White Moose Café (in Dublin, apparently) put up this Facebook post:

**DOCTOR’S NOTE REQUIRED TO GET GLUTEN-FREE FOOD**
This morning a girl asked us if we did gluten-free pancakes and when we asked her if she was a coeliac, she didn’t even know what the word meant and then proceeded to order regular, gluten-rich pancakes anyway. From now on, guests who demand gluten-free food are required to produce a doctor’s note which states that you suffer from coeliac disease. Guests following a gluten-free fad, who don’t even know what gluten is, can cop the fcuk on and eat regular food like everybody else.

It gathered a heap of likes and shares and anyone who commented against their stance was basically told to fcuk off by the café themselves - cue rustled jimmies and general outrage.

Whatever about their PR, is their stance on gluten free for coeliac's only correct? If a non-coeliac customer asks for gluten free stuff and is happy to pay a bit more for it, then why not let them crack on, fad or not?

markpb

Isn't this the same cafe and/or owner who puts up tripe like this every six months, winds people up and gets lots of attention?

maudgonner

Noveight wrote: »

Earlier today, the White Moose Café (in Dublin, apparently) put up this Facebook post:



It gathered a heap of likes and shares and anyone who commented against their stance was basically told to fcuk off by the café themselves - cue rustled jimmies and general outrage.

Whatever about their PR, is their stance on gluten free for coeliac's only correct? If a non-coeliac customer asks for gluten free stuff and is happy to pay a bit more for it, then why not let them crack on, fad or not?

They're looking for publicity. And it worked.

They have a track record of this. They banned vegans before: http://www.independent.ie/life/food-drink/food-news/dublin-caf-owner-attracts-the-attention-of-angry-irish-vegans-after-banning-them-from-the-establishment-34144818.html

ETA: And annoyed Brazilians: http://www.dailyedge.ie/white-moose-cafe-brazlians-2626306-Feb2016/

LeBash

The bloke who runs it is a tosser. Nobody in the area has any time for him. He's a wannabe media darling.

Sh1tbag OToole

Surely even the legit gluten free crowd dont be carrying doctors notes around with them

Cee-Jay-Cee

He was showing his ignorance by telling people they weren't really coeliac as they had spelt it celiac (the American:Canadian spelling)

The guy/girl is a prize winning prick.

Vic_08

Noveight wrote: »

Earlier today, the White Moose Café (in Dublin, apparently) put up this Facebook post:



It gathered a heap of likes and shares and anyone who commented against their stance was basically told to fcuk off by the café themselves - cue rustled jimmies and general outrage.

Whatever about their PR, is their stance on gluten free for coeliac's only correct? If a non-coeliac customer asks for gluten free stuff and is happy to pay a bit more for it, then why not let them crack on, fad or not?

Presumably because it is an expense and waste of manpower they don't want to go to except for those who actually require gluten free food for a medical reason.

It is a ridiculous fad for the most part, coeliac is a serious condition but the vast majority of those demanding gluten free food are just ignorant morons slavishly following the latest trendy food "intolerance".

Demanding medical certs from people is a dick move and I can see how it would upset genuine coeliac sufferers to be expected to do that.

Edit: is that the same guy who runs a crappy hotel on the North Circular and rants on social media against any customers that complain? If that's the case it is just more media-whoring from a particularly unpleasant wanker.

andekwarhola

Another spot to add to the Flamethrower Tour that I will hopefully one day conduct in my hijacked city.

andekwarhola

andekwarhola wrote: »

Another spot to add to the Flamethrower Tour that I will hopefully one day conduct in my hijacked city.

Can you include anywhere that does 'Babychinos' in that, and follow up with a world tour of cardigan factories?

andekwarhola

Candie wrote: »

Can you include anywhere that does 'Babychinos' in that, and follow up with a world tour of cardigan factories?

Regrettably, the list would become unmanageable. :pac:

Icemancometh

I'm trying to imagine how I'd react if a patient asked me for a letter for a cafe to get gluten free bread. Trying not to laugh would be a start.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Making a point of visiting this fine establishment next time I'm back in Dublin!

Barry Badrinath

The owner certaintly is a dickhead but I still laughed at his comments on the FB link

Not.backing.down.at.all..

Outlaw Pete

Wouldn't mind seeing Ramsey do a Kitchen Nightmares from this place, sounds like they wouldn't get on at all.

In saying that, it's a wonder this guy hasn't his own show at this stage.

freedominacup

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Wouldn't mind seeing Ramsey do a Kitchen Nightmares from this place, sounds like they wouldn't get on at all.

In saying that, it's a wonder this guy hasn't his own show at this stage.

They'd get on like a house on fire. You know, flames, explosions, screams, people running for safety. I'd watch it.

How much more up his own arse is he than half the people running trendy eateries in any city?

holly44

If the internet did not exist neither would Gluten intolerance.

The Raptor

How can someone order regular and gluten free pancakes?

Would the regular pancakes be like normal with gluten?

Spanish Eyes

I think he is right.

Sometimes the information on a menu re allergies and gluten and etc. is longer than the menu!

Why doesn't some enterprising enterpreneur set up a gluten free, nut free, food free cafe? It would be packed.

Or would it? Because then, the gluten free afficionados would not be noticed as precious by the glutenous customers.

Costs a lot to cater for them. Go away and bring your own.

Or just eat potatoes and rice.

end of the road

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I think he is right.

no he's an attention seeking moron.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Sometimes the information on a menu re allergies and gluten and etc. is longer than the menu!

i'm nearly sure that it is the law that such information must be availible. fair enough, we have had people die from nut allergies and they're are genuine cases who can't eat certain foods. non issue.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Why doesn't some enterprising enterpreneur set up a gluten free, nut free, food free cafe? It would be packed.
Or would it?

i don't know, or care. more important things to worry about tbh. i don't eat such food and i couldn't care a less about those who do. it doesn't effect my life in any way shape or form.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Because then, the gluten free afficionados would not be noticed as precious by the glutenous customers.

do you mean just the non genuine cases who don't need such food or are you including those who do as well?

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Costs a lot to cater for them. Go away and bring your own.

costs a lot to cater for them on what basis. we are supposed to believe they're are hords of people using the eating of such food for attention so it shouldn't cost very much really.
they're is a very simple, mannerly, non attention seeking way to deal with people looking for such food if a business doesn't wish to do it. customer, do you do gluten free food? person behind the counter, we don't i'm afraid. simple, truthful, and non attention seeking.

_Whimsical_

Vic_08 wrote: »

It is a ridiculous fad for the most part, coeliac is a serious condition but the vast majority of those demanding gluten free food are just ignorant morons slavishly following the latest trendy food "intolerance".

The thing is though that coeliac is often not diagnosed for many years, a lot of people only discover it in mid-adulthood after years of knowing that wheat based products haven't suited them

Also full diagnosis is something that requires colonoscopy or gastroscopy. I know someone waiting 18 months now for that test as a public patient.

It's crazy to dismiss everyone who claims to have an intolerance as being a slave to a food fad or just plain daft.

Also and most importantly there IS convincing medical evidence for NonCeliac Gluten Intolerance now. This is an extract from an article published this week on a The Cleveland Clinic site, one of the most prestigious medical centres in the world.

But recent research is providing provocative clarity to the possible etiology of NCGS. A group from Columbia University, led by Armin Alaedini, PhD, conducted a carefully controlled experiment on patients with NCGS whose bowel biopsies were negative for both celiac disease and IgE food allergy. Researchers challenged the patients with gluten and assessed for markers of intestinal cell damage and immunologic activation. They were compared to two other groups, one with documented celiac disease and the other with healthy controls.

And they found multiple lines of scientific evidence for NCGS. The NCGS group had significant elevations of soluble CD14 and lipopolysaccharide-binding protein (both markers of translocation of microbial products from the bowel) in comparison to the healthy controls and to patients with classic celiac disease. The group also detected additional markers of systemic immune activation. Immune activation markers normalized when the individuals with gluten sensitivity excluded wheat from their diets.

These data provide evidence of systemic immune activation and gut epithelial damage in the absence of celiac disease. The findings are also provocative for the investigation of patients with other medically unexplained disorders, such as such as chronic fatigue syndrome. We don’t yet have biomarkers for NCGS, but I think we are ready for clinical discovery, based on searching for optimum biomarkers of immune activation and bowel injury.

For now, this is both a fascinating area of research as well as a strong reminder of how we must constantly reassess what we believe to be conventional wisdom about patients with medically unexplained disorders.

https://consultqd.clevelandclinic.org/2016/09/not-heads-non-celiac-gluten-intolerances-immunologic-basis/

_Whimsical_

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

The thing is though that coeliac is often not diagnosed for many years, a lot of people only discover it in mid-adulthood after years of knowing that wheat based products haven't suited them

Also full diagnosis is something that requires colonoscopy or gastroscopy. I know someone waiting 18 months now for that test as a public patient.

And doing a follow up blood test where you've to make yourself sick eating that sh1te again. No you're grand thanks one blood test is enough

_Whimsical_

bluewolf wrote: »

And doing a follow up blood test where you've to make yourself sick eating that sh1te again. No you're grand thanks one blood test is enough

Yes! And you also should be eating gluten in the weeks running up to colonoscopy and gastroscopy too or you can receive a false negative on those tests as long term Gluten exclusion can mask the visually apparent damage in some people.

Spanish Eyes

@end of the road....

Eh I think you doth protest too much!

It was tongue in cheek. But seek and you shall find, read with an open mind and a sense of proportion (and a jot of humour), and you'll be grand.

I had a friend here for tea a few weeks ago. She is gluten free. I bought gluten freef stuff for her, and she did eat a bit of it. I gave the rest to her to take home.

Then last week we were at a function for someone leaving her work (a former colleague of mine also). She was horsing into the sausage rolls and cakes. None of which were gluten free. Jeez. It's an attention seeking fad in some cases. That's the reality my friend.

The guy must have read some book by O'Leary.. Fair play to him.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I'm tested every single month for coeliac disease and each time it comes back negative. My haemotologist repeatedly tests me, my GP does my bloods every 4 weeks and includes it, and endocronology tests me each appointment too.

Its been neg for years, but my GP is pretty certain it'll come back positive one of these days.

Now I came off gluten a while ago and within a few days I felt so much better. But until that blood test comes back positive, I'm just a precious wanker inconviencing waiting staff and kitchens.

Grayson

I wonder if the guy who owns it was reading the thread here about gluten intolerance.

Grayson

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I'm tested every single month for coeliac disease and each time it comes back negative. My haemotologist repeatedly tests me, my GP does my bloods every 4 weeks and includes it, and endocronology tests me each appointment too.

Its been neg for years, but my GP is pretty certain it'll come back positive one of these days.

Now I came off gluten a while ago and within a few days I felt so much better. But until that blood test comes back positive, I'm just a precious wanker inconviencing waiting staff and kitchens.

Doesn't mean it's gluten though. There's loads of other stuff in bread.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Grayson wrote: »

Doesn't mean it's gluten though. There's loads of other stuff in bread.

It's not just bread though is it? Even putting gravy on my dinner would be enough to give me cramps. Who knows? It could be anything. But whatever it is is causing me to be an anemic with severe thyroid issues. I trust my doctors though and I'm sure they'll figure out the problem

Grayson

LexieOnRale wrote: »

It's not just bread though is it? Even putting gravy on my dinner would be enough to give me cramps. Who knows? It could be anything. But whatever it is is causing me to be an anemic with severe thyroid issues. I trust my doctors though and I'm sure they'll figure out the problem

I have a friend who discovered he was gluten intolerant when he went to a nutritionist. She got him to hold vials of liquid in one hand and an electrode in the other. She took readings based on different vials and then told him he was gluten intolerant.
The guy has a masters in engineering but he immediately cut out all wheat. I think that proves that engineers aren't scientists

but back on topic. I think a lot of the people who are gluten intolerant have no problems. Some think it's a fad. Some think gluten is just bad for everyone. Some have been "diagnosed" by quacks. However that doesn't mean that all are like that. Of the ones who have problems and aren't coeliac I think a lot could be down to reactions to other proteins besides gluten or to additives/preservatives/pesticides/fungicides. Just because someone has a bad reaction to a wheat based food doesn't necessarily mean it's gluten. It's just that gluten is the first thing that springs to mind. Thing is it's a bitch to figure out what the exact thing (Or combination of things) is causing the problem.

LexieOnRale

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Now I came off gluten a while ago and within a few days I felt so much better. But until that blood test comes back positive, I'm just a precious wanker inconviencing waiting staff and kitchens.

How dare you eat food that doesn't make you sick. You're a terrible person

Outlaw Pete

Think a lot of people that feel better when they give up wheat do so because their particular microbiota isn't producing much phytase and so absorbing minerals (especially zinc) is problematic for them (especially if they're vegetarians). It's not really an absence of wheat that has them feeling better, but more the absence of 'phytic acid'.

Not that phytic acid is only in wheat (it's in a lot of foods) but given that we eat a hell of a lot of wheat, everything from toast to biscuits, sambos to pastry, battererd foods etc etc, just given up that one source of it, can result in that person suddenly consuming less phytic acid than they may ever have before in their lives and as a result absorbing minerals more efficiently.

Synode

holly44 wrote: »

If the internet did not exist neither would Gluten intolerance.

Complete horse ****. I'm not coeliac but have a gluten sensitivity that means I can't eat it. This only became obvious in my 30s. And I'm raging because I fecking love bread

Winterlong

Less Gluten = less wind for me.

*Joins the shamed ones.

Outlaw Pete

Synode wrote: »

Complete horse ****.

Yeah, it's nonsense.

Sure I bought many a many a book on wheat intolerance back in the 90's after my coeliac diagnosis (mentioned Terrance Stamp's Wheat free cookbook on the other thread recently) and that was long before the Internet was available to all and sundry.

looksee

I also discovered that I felt better not eating wheat way back in the '80s when there was no knowledge about gluten free food, and inevitably while I was out my lunch was chips. I drifted back onto wheat after ten years off it but a couple of years ago went off it again, and again I felt healthier than while I was on it. Now I don't eat completely gluten free, but I do try to keep it down.

So no, I am not allergic, just a bit sensitive, I feel better without it. I do not make a fuss about eating in restaurants, if gf is available I will take it in preference to wheat, but if not, I will eat it occasionally. I can use my cop-on when reading a menu and figure out what is gf and what is not. I do not ask for it, I just avoid gluten. No drama.

Nervous Wreck

How can so many people not get that it was an obvious joke?

neenam

Whatever about bread, I can eat pretty much anything except for taytos. More than 1 packet and I can get a case of the runs and a growling stomach. I definitely don't have an allergy to potatoes....

SB_Part2

Nervous Wreck wrote: »

How can so many people not get that it was an obvious joke?

I'm baffled that it's getting so much attention.

NiallBoo

LexieOnRale wrote: »

It's not just bread though is it? Even putting gravy on my dinner would be enough to give me cramps.

what kind of gravy? Home-made from scratch with flour or something using bisto? Pretty sure the latter would be gluten/wheat free.

PARlance

NiallBoo wrote: »

what kind of gravy? Home-made from scratch with flour or something using bisto? Pretty sure the latter would be gluten/wheat free.

Standard gravy isn't but most of the main brands do a GF line.

carefulnowted

NiallBoo wrote: »

what kind of gravy? Home-made from scratch with flour or something using bisto? Pretty sure the latter would be gluten/wheat free.

Bisto contains wheat flour.

johnnyskeleton

Noveight wrote: »

Whatever about their PR, is their stance on gluten free for coeliac's only correct? If a non-coeliac customer asks for gluten free stuff and is happy to pay a bit more for it, then why not let them crack on, fad or not?

Because the era of good service is gone. The friendly waiters of the mid to late 2000s are no more and the snooty waiters of the 90s are back:

https://youtu.be/GSLjzYMnGuA

LollipopJimmy

Chances are this never happened. This guy is a complete and utter tosser who started a tirade against a woman who dared to leave a bad review. He put up cctv of the lady in question referring to her as an elephant or a hippo, I forget which.

IvyTheTerrible

NiallBoo wrote: »

what kind of gravy? Home-made from scratch with flour or something using bisto? Pretty sure the latter would be gluten/wheat free.

You'd be amazed at what has wheat in it.
Tayto used to be gluten free, but then when they got taken over by Hunky Dory, they started using flavouring with flour in it.

PARlance

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

You'd be amazed at what has wheat in it.
Tayto used to be gluten free, but then when they got taken over by Hunky Dory, they started using flavouring with flour in it.

At least you can check in advance with such products. The MIL has had it for over 10 years, she got in before it was cool. Dining out is getting better but still a bit of a lottery.

A few months back she got served GF gnocchi that was rolled in normal flour before cooking... not what you would expect in a Michelin star restaurant.

Ken.

Candie wrote: »

Can you include anywhere that does 'Babychinos' in that, and follow up with a world tour of cardigan factories?

Double life ban for dissing the cardi. On the very slight chance that there is reincarnation then your reincarnated self is also life banned from after hours:D.

tradhead

I spent well over an hour reading the comments and arguments on the cafe's FB page after this was posted and laughing out loud at some of them, I think it's hilarious the amount of people that think he's being genuine after he's also threatened to dope screaming babies with Valium and shoot vegans in the face for setting foot on the property...come on lads!

My personal favourite was the 5 corkage fee for breastfeeding mothers as they weren't buying the milk onsite, I was howling

entropi

Have seen stuff by this place before posted online. Every single time it reads: "small café seeks publicity, puts edgy and humourless shitpost on social media to generate interest".

Shint0

tradhead wrote: »

I spent well over an hour reading the comments and arguments on the cafe's FB page after this was posted and laughing out loud at some of them, I think it's hilarious the amount of people that think he's being genuine after he's also threatened to dope screaming babies with Valium and shoot vegans in the face for setting foot on the property...come on lads!

My personal favourite was the 5 corkage fee for breastfeeding mothers as they weren't buying the milk onsite, I was howling

He's just trying too hard and coming across as a knob. His PR strategy is a fail, in my opinion.

Samaris

I'm curious as to if people would cool their heels if it was called "gluten sensitivity" or something instead? Maybe "gluten intolerance" is considered to sound too medicky?

While the plural of anecdote is not data, there seems to be enough evidence out there to suggest that there is a fairly large minority population who don't do well on gluten (or perhaps wheat for a similar reason). There's a list of foods that disagree to some extent or another with various people depending on something as small as a specific gene setup on one particular loci. Red wine, chocolate for those who tend to get migraines, milk for the lactose intolerant (a far more documented issue with up to 99% intolerance in regions of sub-Saharan Africa and China where there isn't a history of drinking cow's milk), - I once tried to replace milk in my diet with rice milk. Once. Never again. Horrible reaction that I see no reason to court again merely because some busy-bodies think that they know my body better than I do! :pac: You don't have to live with the results!

People react differently to different set-ups of nutrients. Sure, rarely are they bad enough to make it a case of "this food will kill you" (obvious exceptions being foods known to cause anaphalaxis in unfortunate victims), but otherwise, it's probably best that everyone keep their noses out of other peoples' business and lay off the judging when someone who avoids gluten eats it occasionally (sometimes one just can't be arsed and live in vague hope that it won't have an effect this time or with a small dose - again, this discounts people who could actually -die- from eating X!). I ate too much gluten this weekend and my stomach is in a state of rumbling discontent. Nothing that's going to harm me particularly, but it's unpleasant. I'm trying to steer a bit clear of it, but gluten-free food is expensive. But honestly, I've spent most of my life in a vague state of awareness that my stomach is grumpy, but when it's continuous, one doesn't really think of it as not being normal.

If I want to try to avoid that situation (and including being allowed to fail at it, thanks!), that's no-one's business but my own (and my partner's since he does the majority of the cooking). I don't think that it's at the same level of importance as coeliac disease or anaphilaxis, but nor do I reckon that I should have to eat the dratted stuff just because other people think it's a craze.

chrissb8

Whatever about him being a prick or whatever he's right. Stupid lifestyle choice with smugness and ignorance on a lot of people who decide to go gluten free. More people should be calling it for what it is, utter bulls**t. Most of the time it's selective as said people who are oh so intolerent can be found gorging on pizzas, fries etc. after a skinfull of beer (contains gluten). Just shut up and eat the food that has sustained you and helped you grow.