The Italian earthquake

RobertKK

A magnitude 6.2 earthquake hit central Italy at 3.36AM. This is the largest earthquake since the L'Aquila earthquake which killed around 300 people in 2009.
The earthquake was shallow at 10km deep.
Many people are trapped in collapsed buildings and the death toll is expected to be in the hundreds given the similarity to the L'Aquila earthquake.

Italy has declared a national state of emergency. The region that has been hit is where Italians and tourists go to avoid the summer heat.
Half the town of Amatrice has been destroyed. The earthquake was felt in Rome.
One of the worst natural disasters to hit Europe in a long time.

Boom_Bap

Thankfully the first thing I woke up to was a check in from a friend that lives in the region saying her and her family are fine.

LordSutch

Perugia is a lovely part of the world & God willing there won't be too many casualties in the very mountainous region of the country . . . .

(6.2 magnitude quake, 65 miles north-east of Rome).

We're so lucky we don't get such natural disasters here.

The Backwards Man

Earthquakes don't wear suicide vests, no one cares R.


Italy seems to be the only European country that suffers damaging earthquakes to any great extent, is it a geological thing or a geopolitical thing?

smash

Aerial photo here shows the scale of some of the damage: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37171953

Howard the Duck

Scary stuff, i'd imagine all the old buildings don't help them. I hope the death toll doesn't rise much more.

philstar

expect death-toll to rise & rise as the hours pass

RIP

meeeeh

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Earthquakes don't wear suicide vests, no one cares R.


Italy seems to be the only European country that suffers damaging earthquakes to any great extent, is it a geological thing or a geopolitical thing?

Geological. But it's also densely populated country so an earthquake will affect more people.

http://www.preventionweb.net/english/professional/maps/v.php?id=3825

The Backwards Man

meeeeh wrote: »

Geological. But it's also densely populated country so an earthquake will affect more people.

I dunno, if you look at all the quakes Italy has, they are all in the, 5.8 - 6.2 range, almost all resulting in fatalities.

Now this is the most generalistic and overly simplistic analysis ever, but Chile regularly endures earthquakes many times greater with no fatalities, even up to magnitude 8.

RobertKK

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I dunno, if you look at all the quakes Italy has, they are all in the, 5.8 - 6.2 range, almost all resulting in fatalities.

Now this is the most generalistic and overly simplistic analysis ever, but Chile regularly endures earthquakes many times greater with no fatalities, even up to magnitude 8.

Italy gets hit with shallow earthquakes which are much more damaging than an earthquake that happens deep in the earth.

The Backwards Man

RobertKK wrote: »

Italy gets hit with shallow earthquakes which are much more damaging than an earthquake that happens deep in the earth.

Aye, true enough, but Chile has the strictest building codes on Earth too which probably helps.

meeeeh

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I dunno, if you look at all the quakes Italy has, they are all in the, 5.8 - 6.2 range, almost all resulting in fatalities.

Now this is the most generalistic and overly simplistic analysis ever, but Chile regularly endures earthquakes many times greater with no fatalities, even up to magnitude 8.

I might be wrong but a lot of Chilean earthquakes are of coast and those that are not caused some severe damage and casualties.

I'm not saying their planning laws are perfect and there is plenty corruption but it depends if epicentre is in populated area or somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Italy also has a lot of historical buildings. I've been about 100 km away from epicentre of 5.4 earthquake and it's no picnic.

The Backwards Man

meeeeh wrote: »

I might be wrong but a lot of Chilean earthquakes are of coast and those that are not caused some severe damage and casualties.

I'm not saying their planning laws are perfect and there is plenty corruption but it depends if epicentre is in populated area or somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Italy also has a lot of historical buildings. I've been about 100 km away from epicentre of 5.4 earthquake and it's no picnic.

Aye, but it's true what they say, no one has ever been killed by an earthquake.

kupus

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Earthquakes don't wear suicide vests, no one cares R.

Are you for real, why would you even bring up stuff like that. You just love the brownie points is that it?:rolleyes:

RobertKK

Death toll now at 37.
The problems for the rescue services is the infrastructure is also affected with landslides, rubble and severely damaged roads.

The 2009 L'Aquila earthquake versus this earthquake.
2009: a 6.3 tremor.
2016: a 6.2 tremor.

Both at a similar shallow depth of around 10km.

Time of earthquake:
2009: 3.32am
2016: 3.36am

endacl

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I dunno, if you look at all the quakes Italy has, they are all in the, 5.8 - 6.2 range, almost all resulting in fatalities.

Now this is the most generalistic and overly simplistic analysis ever, but Chile regularly endures earthquakes many times greater with no fatalities, even up to magnitude 8.

Chile is mostly MAMONAL.

MILES AND MILES OF NOT A LOT.

RobertKK

Putin has said Russia is in mourning with the Italian people and has offered assistance to Italy.

Shannon757

Why do the earthquakes happen so early in the morning? Must be the worst thibg to wake up to.

RobertKK

Apart from the death toll and many many injured, the earthquake will likely cost Italy well in excess of €10 billion.

wakka12

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Earthquakes don't wear suicide vests, no one cares R.


Italy seems to be the only European country that suffers damaging earthquakes to any great extent, is it a geological thing or a geopolitical thing?

What a childish and disrespectful comment

readyletsgo

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Earthquakes don't wear suicide vests, no one cares R.

I get ya, but you know lots of people on boards here won't get it.

Absolutely terrible thing to happen, RIP to the dead and I hope no more are added to the list

RobertKK

In the link you can see how the towns looked before the earthquake and after. It is so bad.
http://trib.al/IpmHn3n

RobertKK

A 6.5 to 6.8 earthquake has hit Myanmar.

Widdershins

We are so lucky that we don't have earthquakes in Ireland. I feel terrible for those people.

Shannon757

RobertKK wrote: »

A 6.5 to 6.8 earthquake has hit Myanmar.

Is this the end of the world as we know it?

SEPT 23 1989

Widdershins wrote: »

We are so lucky that we don't have earthquakes in Ireland. I feel terrible for those people.

most of what was thrown up during the tiger would collapse

we are very lucky indeed

Widdershins

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

most of what was thrown up during the tiger would collapse

we are very lucky indeed

We only need a strong wind for that!

bear1

My family is from that region but luckily weren't touched.
Friends over 200km away woke up to their buildings swaying.
Not sure if anyone has even experienced an earth quake but it's seriously eerie.
I remember the L'Aquila quake of 09 and that city is still being repaired..

V_Moth

Widdershins wrote: »

We are so lucky that we don't have earthquakes in Ireland. I feel terrible for those people.

We do get earthquakes, every day in fact:

http://earthquaketrack.com/p/ireland/recent

Widdershins

V_Moth wrote: »

We do get earthquakes, every day in fact:

http://earthquaketrack.com/p/ireland/recent

I forgot about that. I meant serious earthquakes. I think there was one that could be felt slightly a couple of years ago on the East coast and in Wales.

Wigglepuppy

wakka12 wrote: »

What a childish and disrespectful comment

I know. And "no one" cares in a thread where people are talking about it.

readyletsgo wrote: »

I get ya, but you know lots of people on boards here won't get it.

What's there to "get"?

ardinn

Im Just back from Italy on wednesday - Lucky me eh!

I woke up during an earthquake about a year ago - in carlow!! We do get them!! It was a bit weird!

The Backwards Man

Wigglepuppy wrote: »

I know. And "no one" cares in a thread where people are talking about it.

What's there to "get"?

This will probably be the biggest catastrophe in terms of loss of life and human displacement Europe will see this year, and it ain't even reached page two yet. That's what's to 'get'.

Widdershins

The Backwards Man wrote: »

This will probably be the biggest catastrophe in terms of loss of life and human displacement Europe will see this year, and it ain't even reached page two yet. That's what's to 'get'.

I think this is because people are helpless, it's an uncontrollable natural event and nothing to discuss in terms of preventing it from happening it again. There's not much you CAN say other than express your shock/sympathy.

The Backwards Man

Widdershins wrote: »

I think this is because people are helpless, it's an uncontrollable natural event and nothing to discuss in terms of preventing it from happening it again. There's not much you CAN say other than express your shock/sympathy.

Yeah, that's probably what it is alright

wakka12

The Backwards Man wrote: »

This will probably be the biggest catastrophe in terms of loss of life and human displacement Europe will see this year, and it ain't even reached page two yet. That's what's to 'get'.

There is much less to discuss when its an earthquake. Its a natural disaster, it wasnt anybodys fault, nothing could be done to prevent it. With a terrorist attack, there is more to discuss as in who did it, their motive, could it have been prevented, how will we stop another occurring , did social issues such as racism or war contribute.. Also a group of terrorists massacring innocent people in some of the worlds safest cities and countries is a lot more shocking to me than an earthquake I will admit.

Widdershins

mYANMAR EARTHQUAKE WAS 7.1

Little CuChulainn

I was in Rome when the l'Aquila one hit. i think I was about 80km from the epicenter. Really strange to wake up and see the walls bending and swaying around you. I can only imagine what it must be like closer to it. My other half had the sense to get in a doorway. Would have been nice if she'd woken me up first.

RobertKK

The Backwards Man wrote: »

This will probably be the biggest catastrophe in terms of loss of life and human displacement Europe will see this year, and it ain't even reached page two yet. That's what's to 'get'.

I knew what you were implying.
A terrorist maybe kills less than ten people in some western European country, hundreds of pages in no time, maybe because it plays on fear, the coverage is a bit like watching a movie and people thinking, it could be themselves caught up in it, and it was intentional killing by other humans.

When I came on this morning I looked at the first page of AH for the Italian earthquake thread, then checked page two and saw none. I am not saying anything against anyone on why there was no topic given Italy is a country we are close to in many ways, but it was clear the loss of life was going to be big and the damage looks as bad if not worst than some of the bombed cities of Syria.

I got what you were saying.

The Backwards Man

wakka12 wrote: »

There is much less to discuss when its an earthquake. Its a natural disaster, it wasnt anybodys fault, nothing could be done to prevent it. With a terrorist attack, there is more to discuss as in who did it, their motive, could it have been prevented, how will we stop another occurring , did social issues such as racism or war contribute.. Also a group of terrorists massacring innocent people in some of the worlds safest cities and countries is a lot more shocking to me than an earthquake I will admit.

Earthquakes can't be prevented, but there's a whole hell of a lot can be done to prevent earthquake deaths, which is why i cited Chile as an example.

Flint Fredstone

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Yeah, that's probably what it is alright

Well there's nobody to be angry with is there? There's nobody to blame. It's nothing like a suicide bombing situation but you already know that...

RobertKK

Widdershins wrote: »

I think this is because people are helpless, it's an uncontrollable natural event and nothing to discuss in terms of preventing it from happening it again. There's not much you CAN say other than express your shock/sympathy.

I suppose the big question here is, did the people follow the advice to reinforce their buildings with anti-seismic reinforcements as advised after the L'Aquila earthquake.
Given the devastation, for the most part one would think they did not, or if they did it was not enough.

Wigglepuppy

RobertKK wrote: »

I got what you were saying.

Seriously, anybody would have "got" what he was saying, it's not complicated! What's with the pretence that it's so deep?!

There was only a few posts so he threw a dig, making reference to another issue, while stating "no one" cares, as opposed to his post just oozing with care - what else could a jibe post relating to another issue be other than caring? Bingo, not much to get.

It's an horrific occurrence for the people affected by it, all the best to them. Not a whole lot more (other than discussion of the scientific side of it) to say. I don't think Italy's economy is doing so well, so how they fare in terms of aid might not be great.

wakka12

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Earthquakes can't be prevented, but there's a whole hell of a lot can be done to prevent earthquake deaths, which is why i cited Chile as an example.

Such as? In italy, a country dotted with thousands of ancient towns, what do you propose,clear away all their heritage and history to make the country safer with modern buildings in the case of earthquakes /
It was a powerful shallow earthquake, in a country with so many old stone and brick buildings, the level of destruction isn't really that high
Apart from completely redeveloping the entire countrys infrastructure I don't really know what else can be done to prevent earthquake deaths. The emergency services currently seem to be trying their hardest to recover trapped people.

Samaris

Mod: Let's be getting away from how it can be compared to terrorist attacks now, please, it's disrespectful and utterly pointless. This is a thread discussing the earthquake and does not need multiple pages of one-up-manship.

RobertKK

The death toll is starting to rise fast now as the recovery work continues, currently at 63.

They are saying now the earthquake was only 4km deep, so it was very shallow which makes the shaking a lot worse.
Over 2.1 million people live in the region which felt strong to severe shaking.

The only good thing is the weather, which is helping the recovery services.

Samaris

http://horizon-magazine.eu/sites/default/files/SHARE-map.png
Topographical map of European earthquake zones

http://f.tqn.com/y/geology/1/S/Z/j/1/europeeasteqmap.png
Geopolitical map of European earthquake zones for the people like me that are a bit hit and miss on locational geography!

http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/eventpage/us10006g7w#map Interactive map of the region.

Can see from the first that long train of mountains down the spine of the Italian peninsula, suggesting it's where two plates are colliding and pushing up the upper plate. Actually, that isn't the exact place the plates meet, there's three relevant ones. The Eurasian plate, bordering the African plate in North Africa is moving east, the North African (and Arabian) plates are moving roughly north. So without having time to examine it too closely, I suspect that the combined movements of the Eurasian and North African plates are causing a sort of diagonal push upwards into Europe, resulting in the NA and E plates "catching" on each other, building up pressure slowly for decades and then "snapping", jerking roughly in the direction they want to go, hence sudden and sharp earthquakes.

Italy has over 30,000 earthquakes in the last 2500 years (bearing in mind that that region has a long history of writings and recording history), with seven large ones in the 20thC. The country also leads Europe in terms of the use of anti-seismic systems (unsurprisingly!), but their geology and long history of building (including building over previous buildings) makes it harder to cope with.

RobertKK

At least 73 dead and all some have left to wear are the pyjamas and maybe a blanket they escaped the earthquake with.
For some they lost everything, family and friends who died and are left homeless.
The damage is so bad that there are complaints of a lack of rescue services in some areas as the routes are blocked, and many bridges have collapsed.

Irish Stones

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I dunno, if you look at all the quakes Italy has, they are all in the, 5.8 - 6.2 range, almost all resulting in fatalities.
Now this is the most generalistic and overly simplistic analysis ever, but Chile regularly endures earthquakes many times greater with no fatalities, even up to magnitude 8.

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Aye, true enough, but Chile has the strictest building codes on Earth too which probably helps.

Chile is a relatively young country, with modern buildings, and given its recent history of earthquakes (the quake in 1960), they started building according to newer rules and technologies and materials to prevent further catastrophes.

Italy is much more densely populated than Chile (Italy is half of Chile with 4 times its population), and most of towns still retain old buildings most of them dating back to about 200+ years ago.
How do you think that a strictest building code could help in such cases?
Since the last 40 years all new buildings have to be built following strict anti-seismic rules, depending on the area where they are being built.
Different areas have been given different seismic grade

https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classificazione_sismica_dell'Italia

so, where I live the classification is low (on the border between a grey and light yellow scale), low risk of damages during or after an earthquake, and all new buildings MUST be built in order to meet these requirements or exceed them, or they CANNOT be built. The more the colour on the map goes to red, the stricter the rules are, and more expensive is to build a house. As you can see, the quake of last night was in an area with dark orange colour.
All that is older than this building code can be strengthened with actions of stabilization, but they cannot act as a brand new building.
These houses can be of medieval origins, some are made of stones and mortar.
That's the reason for the high death toll and for the great destruction.
It's history and heritage, not politics.

I am Italian, I live in Italy, I know what I'm talking about.

ThinkProgress

RobertKK wrote: »

I knew what you were implying.
A terrorist maybe kills less than ten people in some western European country, hundreds of pages in no time, maybe because it plays on fear, the coverage is a bit like watching a movie and people thinking, it could be themselves caught up in it, and it was intentional killing by other humans.

When I came on this morning I looked at the first page of AH for the Italian earthquake thread, then checked page two and saw none. I am not saying anything against anyone on why there was no topic given Italy is a country we are close to in many ways, but it was clear the loss of life was going to be big and the damage looks as bad if not worst than some of the bombed cities of Syria.

I got what you were saying.

We are? That's news to me...

I know we beat them in a world cup, but I don't really think we have any cultural ties with them historically.

Very few Irish will be personally affected by a tragedy in Italy. And not to be crass or anything, but sh!t happens... It's sad and unfortunate, but life marches on!

In a week or so, most that are not directly affected will simply forget about it and move on to some other news story! (there's never a shortage)

JupiterKid

Central Italy is prone to earthquakes so this unfortunate event is not a major surprise. Italy is located in a seismically active zone, with earthquakes and volcanoes (like Mount Etna and Vesuvius) because of plate boundaries between the African Plate and the Eurasian one.

Because so much of Italy's built heritage is historic when earthquake building codes simply didn't exist, it's not surprising that there has been considerable damage. I just hope the casualties can be kept to a minimum and that the rescue effort proceeds well.