Owed 200euro debt, how to proceed recovery

ando88

Hi a friend mine is owed 200.00euro which is safe to say will not be returned willingly as the person whom money was loaned has deleted their number and not responded to calls.

No address is known but car registration is known but will the Garda give this information over if requested? Can the person be traced and arrested?

Thanks in advance for any information

minikin

Civil matter, absolutely nothing to do with the Gardaí
Your friend loaned €200 to a stranger? Tell them to write it off and move on.

Uncle Ben

No guarantee the car is registered to the person you are looking for. Furthermore, I think the days of the gardai looking up Pulse etc on a whim are long gone since Sgt McCabe/Wilson etc.

Kepler 186f

The Gardai will not give over the address. Whether they can arrest the person it would depend on the basis of how your friend is owed the money, it could be a civil matter

ando88

Thanks for the replies all, I was hoping we could go to the station and at least get the address to take it to court. I guess lesson learned!

I wonder how do people prosecute those who give a false address etc...

Yes this was a loan, what he (my friend) was going to do was say it was stolen but again this would have to be proved...

MarkAnthony

ando88 wrote: »

Thanks for the replies all, I was hoping we could go to the station and at least get the address to take it to court. I guess lesson learned!

I wonder how do people prosecute those who give a false address etc...

Yes this was a loan, what he (my friend) was going to do was say it was stolen but again this would have to be proved...

Well that would be something that could be reported to the gardai - your friends actions I mean. Hopefully he'd not only get a criminal record but the person he loaned the money to would launch a defamation claim.

Don't lend money, ever. If you do, don't expect it back. Don't go wasting the time of the guards and making false claims.

Steve

Hire a PI to find out where they live and sue them in District court

simdan

200euro to get rid of a person, who isn't a friend, is cheap in my opinion

ando88

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Well that would be something that could be reported to the Gardai - your friends actions I mean. Hopefully he'd not only get a criminal record but the person he loaned the money to would launch a defamation claim.

Don't lend money, ever. If you do, don't expect it back. Don't go wasting the time of the guards and making false claims.

I agree with you mark and told him as such, I also told him that just turning up at this persons address would be dangerous and not to mention cause a lot of trouble if it was found out that Garda gave this information out

Hollister11

Write it off.

It's 200 not 20K. The time and effort to get the money back isn't worth it.

ando88

Steve wrote: »

Hire a PI to find out where they live and sue them in District court

It would cost more than 200 for a PI I assume

MarkAnthony

In regard to how people go about recovery usually - it's sold to a recover firm for cents on the Euro and they hound people to the point of illegality. There is very little than can be done in Ireland. Even if one does get a judgement, enforcing it is nigh on impossible.

ando88

MarkAnthony wrote: »

In regard to how people go about recovery usually - it's sold to a recover firm for cents on the Euro and they hound people to the point of illegality. There is very little than can be done in Ireland. Even if one does get a judgement, enforcing it is nigh on impossible.

okay thanks for that information, I guess all he can do is text the person and maybe threaten to go to the Gardai maybe this will force them into handing it back, but as was mentioned it was a loan not stolen so it would be a waste of Garda time...

Steve

simdan wrote: »

200euro to get rid of a person, who isn't a friend, is cheap in my opinion

Agreed, but it's also wrong.

The law is supposed to protect the innocent (not gullible gobshítes, mind, and I'm not making judgement there) but in general.

Maybe they only have 50 previous convictions, they'll be grand. :rolleyes:

ando88

Steve wrote: »

Agreed, but it's also wrong.

The law is supposed to protect the innocent (not gullible gobshítes, mind, and I'm not making judgement there) but in general.

Maybe they only have 50 previous convictions, they'll be grand. :rolleyes:

It could be a case that the person in question has done this before so what seems like little amount this time (200) if it was done to a few people then it would be classed as fraud I assume..

Anywho I guess no point going to Garda, they will not go to the persons home for 200.00 loan :rolleyes:

Steve

If you have reasonable proof that the 'loan' was obtained by deception then they have to.

clairewithani

A friend is hardly a stranger!. I signed for a loan for my brother years ago. 8,000. Car loan. He had bad credit and couldn't get a loan.Can't remember what we were to pay back but 11, 000 is in my head. He paid me back 240 euro. Nothing to do with op., just saying.

ando88

Steve wrote: »

If you have reasonable proof that the 'loan' was obtained by deception then they have to.

How to prove this though, it could be paid back in cash no receipt no trace how would the Gardai prove this in court?wouldn't be word against word?

ando88

clairewithani wrote: »

A friend is hardly a stranger!. I signed for a loan for my brother years ago. 8,000. Car loan. He had bad credit and couldn't get a loan.Can't remember what we were to pay back but 11, 000 is in my head. He paid me back 240 euro. Nothing to do with op., just saying.

Hi claire, I think that might be slightly different to my friends situation, he loaned someone 200.00euro that person has deleted his details (number no answering etc..) my question was how to find the persons address in order to bring them to court

clairewithani

ando88 wrote: »

Hi claire, I think that might be slightly different to my friends situation, he loaned someone 200.00euro that person has deleted his details (number no answering etc..) my question was how to find the persons address in order to bring them to court

Ya sorry I see thet.

Steve

ando88 wrote: »

How to prove this though, it could be paid back in cash no receipt no trace how would the Gardai prove this in court?wouldn't be word against word?

It would be up to you to provide proof (or reasonable suspicion) of fraud to the Gardai so they could investigate.

In a civil court, if you went that route, it would be up to you to prove that a contract to repay existed (contract can be verbal).

ando88

Steve wrote: »

It would be up to you to provide proof (or reasonable suspicion) of fraud to the Gardai so they could investigate.

In a civil court, if you went that route, it would be up to you to prove that a contract to repay existed (contract can be verbal).

only thing he has is a message on whatsapp asking for the loan and promising to repay end of august 2016 but as I said friend is now blocked on whatsapp and not sure if Garda would entertain that (whatsapp) as evidence...

Squall Leonhart

Honestly, write it off. Forget about it, chalk it down as a learning experience and move on. Don't lend money you can't afford to lose in future, and be lucky you got off with only a 200 euro loss.

ando88

Squall Leonhart wrote: »

Honestly, write it off. Forget about it, chalk it down as a learning experience and move on. Don't lend money you can't afford to lose in future, and be lucky you got off with only a 200 euro loss.

Cheers wasn't actually my money but yes I agree with you it's not worth the hassle

Steve

ando88 wrote: »

only thing he has is a message on whatsapp asking for the loan and promising to repay end of august 2016 but as I said friend is now blocked on whatsapp and not sure if Garda would entertain that (whatsapp) as evidence...

It doesn't matter what a Garda considers evidence or not, they do get it wrong the odd time. Judges do the judging.

MarkAnthony

Steve wrote: »

The law is supposed to protect the innocent (not gullible gobshítes, mind, and I'm not making judgement there) but in general.

Maybe they only have 50 previous convictions, they'll be grand. :rolleyes:

What ever gave you that idea?

The law is there to punish the guilty, social policy is there to protect society. In regards to civil matters the law lets the innocent get shafted everyday of the week, that's business to many.

The only thing that courts will do is give the benefit of the reasonable doubt to an accused in an effort to avoid wrongful convictions.

Steve

MarkAnthony wrote: »

In regards to civil matters the law lets the innocent get shafted everyday of the week, that's business to many.

And that's a big problem.

Mod
post amended

MarkAnthony

Steve wrote: »

And that's a big problem. :mad:

I'm on a bit of a jurisprudential bent this evening so sorry OP for the OT but to be fair it does look like you have your answer.

The justice system isn't there the interfere in society - thank God. I've a huge amount of respect for many of our Judges but do you really want them setting social policy. As a corollary do you really want the same shenanigans that results in elected officials dictating who sits on the bench? I for one do not want to see Chief Justice Healy-Rae.

I take your point though that businesses should be more accountable if that was the point you were making.

Avatar MIA

Per the "contract" your friend cannot do anything until the end of August anyway. Deleting contact details is not a crime.

Your friend was silly to lend money to this guy.

He's a complete idiot to go to the lengths required to get anywhere officially with this.

Do your friend a favour. Tell him to forget it and to learn his lesson.

topmanamillion

Tell your friend to buy the following items.
1. Balaclava
2. Gloves
3. Sledge Hammer

METHOD
1. Put on balaclava and gloves.
2. Pick up Sledge hammer.
3.Begin smacking own head with sledge hammer while repeating the phrase "I must not lend money to anyone, particularly strangers".
(repeat step 3 as often as required)

The balaclava will prevent the Sledge hammer from becoming blodied and the gloves will help with grip so adequate force is used.

Little CuChulainn

Is your friend a bad loan shark or something? It seems odd that he'd be giving out loans to strangers with only Whatsapp as a point of contact.

wigsa100

I am going to assume it wasn't a complete stranger and that the money was lent in good faith. I wouldn't be writing it off if I were you.

I'll probably get an earful from a few others who have posted in this thread, but if you're friends with a Garda, they will look up the reg for you and get you the address. This kind of thing happens all the time.

What you do with it is up to you, but I would certainly confront him(not violently) and ask him why he hasn't paid the money back. You could record the entire thing and threaten to put it on Facebook. Social media has become a very effective way of getting things done in the 21st century.

Everyone posting in the thread seems to think the person in question lent the money to a stranger who happens to be a convicted criminal and thug and is likely to be armed and dangerous at all times. As I said above, I'm going to assume the money was loaned to a regular person in good faith, and that person has taken advantage of the situation.

Don't let it go. Like you said, if they've done it now, they've probably done it before and probably will do it again. I know people in my locality who have nearly made careers out of conning people out of bits and pieces of money and it shouldn't be tolerated.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

brian_t

wigsa100 wrote: »

I'm going to assume the money was loaned to a regular person in good faith, and that person has taken advantage of the situation.

ando88 wrote: »

and promising to repay end of august 2016 ...

This is not even the end of July 2016.

wigsa100

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

How would anyone find out? An individual could come across the address a thousand different ways through word of mouth.

And if you think logging into Pulse and looking up a car owner is going to cost a Garda his job, you obviously haven't been paying attention to the level of shenanigans that has been endemic in the Garda Síochána for decades and has thankfully been put under the spotlight again recently.

Little CuChulainn

wigsa100 wrote: »

How would anyone find out? An individual could come across the address a thousand different ways through word of mouth.

And if you think logging into Pulse and looking up a car owner is going to cost a Garda his job, you obviously haven't been paying attention to the level of shenanigans that has been endemic in the Garda Síochána for decades and has thankfully been put under the spotlight again recently.

Your outrage is a little outdated. There is a lot of auditing on PULSE records and access these days.

FishOnABike

Steve wrote: »

It doesn't matter what a Garda considers evidence or not, they do get it wrong the odd time. Judges do the judging.

And you think judges get it right - you've obviously not seen much of our family 'law' courts in action.

Steve

FishOnABike wrote: »

And you think judges get it right - you've obviously not seen much of our family 'law' courts in action.

Not saying I agree with them but, yeah, when they adjudicate, it tends to be binding... regardless of whether it is 'right'