Cost of Design & Planning Application for a House in Co Galway

Dunkel

Hello,

Just looking for some assistance with verifying figures we've been quoted for design and submitting planning permission of an aprox 200sqm house in Co Galway. I have scoured the boards already and can't find an equivalent answer.

We have gained three quotes to do our due diligence - across three counties no less. The figures I will quote are from our preferred option, although all are slightly different and it has been hard to compare like with like.

This quote is from an engineer who has a great deal of experience designing houses.

Design: [font=arial, sans-serif] 3,250 (ex VAT)[/font]
Planning:[font=arial, sans-serif] [/font][font=arial, sans-serif] 1,750 (ex VAT)[/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif]Planning includes EPA test but excludes sundries - newspaper notice, OS pack + planning fee.[/font]

[font=arial, sans-serif]Total including VAT is [/font][font=arial, sans-serif] 6,150[/font]

The house we want to design is bespoke and won't be a 'catalogue' home so it will require some effort. Just to be clear I'm not saying the price above is outrageous, but like many people who ask for help here I've not done this before so would like the expert assistance of the board members for some reassurance.

Having said this my brother in law has just paid [font=arial, sans-serif] [/font]2200 (ex VAT) for a full design and planning... he reckons this was for a bespoke design but it's fairly standard of the usual house that has been going up over the last number of years.

Thank you in advance.

Calahonda52

Its lot for preplanning design which I assume is just planning drawings and not full tender/construction drawings which are IMO, premature at this point.

Its also a lot for a planning application, given the drawings are included in 1.

You need to browse this site to look at different discussions on what needs to be paid for at different stages.

You also need to break out the steps.

[Joined 9th July 2016, 2nd post: I have scoured the boards already ]

Dunkel

Thank you for your reply Calahonda52.

Do you have any figure in mind for what would be appropriate fees?

Luckily boards.ie don't require sign up to view all the advice and I'm not really sure you can draw any conclusions for how much research a member has done based on how long they have been signed up for.

What other break outs would you be looking for? As mentioned the EPA is included as is the rest of the planning process excluding any outside experts that would be required, hydrologist report for example.

Metric Tensor

It is a bit higher than I'd expect to pay for a "standard house" but it sounds like you will be expecting the engineer to put a lot of time into the design and layout of the house (and possibly the site too?). If this is the case and he has to spend (say for example) twice the amount of time on your house and he would if he was doing your brother-in-laws then the fee could be quite justifiable.

Also OP - most professionals also get used to "reading" potential clients and their expectations. I have no idea about you but the engineer may have been able to see that you require/expect a level of service that other clients may not and may be pricing accordingly.

So to sum up - not cheap but difficult to tell without knowing exactly what service you told him you wanted and he thus priced.

Calahonda52

As MT.
In addition: the point I am trying to make here is that,
say, it is 1k just to get the design required for the planning application, plus the 1,750 and that it takes another 2,250 to get the detailed design for tender drawings, then why spend the 2,250 now in case
1: planning is rejected
2: more infö required during planning, maybe a re design, which will have a knockon effect on the tender drawings.

In the light of this
The house we want to design is bespoke and won't be a 'catalogue' home so it will require some effort
To rephrase this from MT a bit
Also OP - most professionals also get used to "reading" potential clients and their expectations. I have no idea about you but the engineer may have been able to see that you require/expect a level of service that other clients may not and may be pricing accordingly.

Perhaps he saw you coming, based on the above.

Metric Tensor

My understanding in this case CH is that the "3250 Design" is the actual preliminary design of the house in terms of shape, layout, style, etc. and then the "1750 Planning" is the EPA Tests, Printing, Application Forms, Rural Linkage documentation, etc. etc., using the house design prepared for the 3250.

Is this correct OP?

In this case tender drawings, details, etc. would cost more again after the planning process is complete.

N.B. - OP as CH points out if you get an request for further information from the council it will entail more work from your consultant and presumably incur further costs at the same rate.


Edit: the real question here is what you are getting for your 3250. Multiple revisions and regular consultations (good) or a design presented to you with extra charges to revise (not so good).

Dunkel

Metric Tensor wrote: »

My understanding in this case CH is that the "3250 Design" is the actual preliminary design of the house in terms of shape, layout, style, etc. and then the "1750 Planning" is the EPA Tests, Printing, Application Forms, Rural Linkage documentation, etc. etc., using the house design prepared for the 3250.

Is this correct OP?

Thank you for your reply MT.

Yes you are correct in your understanding of my initial break down.

There will be a pre-planning meeting of course, which if there is an indication of any major issue then we won't go ahead and so won't be paying for drawings etc. Obviously things can change from pre-planning to planning application and nothing is a certainty.

Metric Tensor wrote: »

Edit: the real question here is what you are getting for your 3250. Multiple revisions and regular consultations (good) or a design presented to you with extra charges to revise (not so good).

We have terms to include all revisions, queries and consultations within that fee, including further information requests from the council.

Metric Tensor wrote: »

It is a bit higher than I'd expect to pay for a "standard house" but it sounds like you will be expecting the engineer to put a lot of time into the design and layout of the house (and possibly the site too?). If this is the case and he has to spend (say for example) twice the amount of time on your house and he would if he was doing your brother-in-laws then the fee could be quite justifiable.

I expect this will be quite an involved project so your logic makes sense, and it's ok if the consultant has factored this in. I'd rather get the design right at this stage than have regrets after it goes through planning. Also we'll be looking to value engineer the project, better to pay a fraction more here and get the plans / construction methods inline with the budget etc.

I appreciate your input Metric Tensor.

Metric Tensor

As CH points out when people know you are willing to pay more you have to be very careful that you are paying the premium for a premium service rather than paying the premium for "premium talk"!

I'm not for a second suggesting this is the case here -

BUT it always pays to check the references of whomever you are planning to use. Ask to talk to previous clients and if they are amenable see if you can visit their house(s). You'll learn a lot about your proposed engineer pretty fast.

Dunkel

Thanks MT. Our budget is small for the build so that would be an indication I hope to everyone quoting that we don't have money to be throwing around. This guy was actually the lowest of the quotes.
We want the house to be Passive standard, so that narrows down who we've been talking to and does require more attention detail and thought. We're not in a position to visit any houses but we have got recommendations and I'm happy that these guys can do the job well.
We've negotiated some extras into the price now so I think we are happy with the result, but always a leap of faith engaging any professional service no matter how much due diligence you do.

Dunkel

Sorry duplicate post.

Metric Tensor

Just one point:


This:

Dunkel wrote: »

Our budget is small for the build

And This:

Dunkel wrote: »

We want the house to be Passive standard

Do not go together and will not go together.


Assuming you come up with the money you need to define what you mean by "Passive Standard" as there is no such thing. If you want a certified "Passivhaus" then say so. Otherwise work closely with your engineer to tell him what you understand "Passive Standard" to mean so that he can design the house accordingly.

I have found many people think they want a super-dooper-passive house until they find out the price and compromises required to just meet the current energy (Part L) regulations - then the requirements of going a few steps beyond that are suddenly no longer palatable to them.

Dunkel

Thanks MT for the insight.
I chose not to mention the Passivhaus initially as it can be a divisive topic and I'm looking for feedback purely on the quote so don't want to go off topic.
I have 10 months recreational research into the area so I'm fairly well versed on the ins and outs.

Thanks

Metric Tensor

No probs - listen to / read all advice that comes your way but always ask yourself which bits of it have vested interests and which bits are based on anecdotal evidence, pseudo science, actual science, on-site testing and in-use results!

And bear in mind that a "passive" lifestyle is not something that everyone would enjoy - think about how you plan to live your life as well as focusing on build costs, maintenance costs or running costs.