Served notice

Today my landlord informed me that he's "losing control of the building" and that I'll have to leave. Was all apologies and said he'll do what he can for me in giving references and returning the deposit.

However he said something in passing about giving me a "couple of months" to find a new place. I've been there since September 2010 and only signed a one year lease, so I should be in a part 4 tenancy. In which case, would it be right to say that I have 140 days from today?

I guess I'm just in shock at the moment, all I keep hearing about is how bad the rental market is at the moment.

Sad Professor

Yeah, you are entitled to 140 days beginning from the date of written notice.

Some landlords aren't up to the date with required notice periods. I've been in the same place for 12 years and my landlord said: "There's no rush, you have 3 months".

Penny Tration

You're entitled to 140 days notice in writing. Until you get it in writing, your eviction notice hasn't started.

Mrs OBumble

Realistically you want to keep him on side so that when you find somewhere to go you can agree a move out date with as little overlap as possible, and ideally none. Hopefully this will be in less than your notice period.

Mrs OBumble

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Realistically you want to keep him on side so that when you find somewhere to go you can agree a move out date with as little overlap as possible, and ideally none. Hopefully this will be in less than your notice period.

That's a good point, I'm not sure how this works at all.

On paper, would this mean that I'd have 140 days (from date of written notice) and I'd still be liable for rent up until the end of that period, even if I found somewhere else in the meantime?

Sad Professor

Karsini wrote: »

That's a good point, I'm not sure how this works at all.

On paper, would this mean that I'd have 140 days (from date of written notice) and I'd still be liable for rent up until the end of that period, even if I found somewhere else in the meantime?

No, you can go anytime. But obviously you don't want to be paying for a whole month in your current place if you are going to be leaving it mid-month.

The_Conductor

Penny Tration wrote: »

You're entitled to 140 days notice in writing. Until you get it in writing, your eviction notice hasn't started.

For the umpteenth time- a notice to quit- is not an eviction.
In addition- if the current landlord looses control of the building- the OP will instead have to deal with a receiver.
In a situation like this- the landlord has given the OP a headsup that there is a problem- his deposit is being taken care of- and it would be prudent to seek alternate accommodation.

Given the circumstances- it would appear the landlord is trying to do his best by the tenants- and this 140 day eviction notice lark- is not a valid or pertinent manner of trying to bludgeon him over the head.........

The 'notice' given by the landlord is not 'notice' it is an advisory of an issue- clarification that the OP's deposit is safe- and a suggestion that it would be prudent for he/she to seek alternate accommodation. He has not said he is ending the tenancy- nor does he have grounds under the Act to do so (as the OP is well into the second cycle of a Part IV tenancy).

Sad Professor

I know there's some legal ambiguity in this situation and tenants can get caught in the crossfire, but if the OP can't find a place so soon they shouldn't allow themselves to be bullied by either the receiver or the landlord.

If it looks like you are going to have to stay a while, OP, I'd suggest getting advice from Threshold. Here's some tips from their website:

The following tips are a guide to help you when a receiver is appointed to the property you are renting.
1. Your tenancy continues and you have a right to remain in the property.
2. If you have a current lease the receiver should honour the pre-existing tenancy terms and conditions.
3. There is no legal obligation on you to sign a new lease if you do not wish to do so.
4. Your tenancy can only be ended by the serving of valid notice in accordance with the Residential Tenancies Act 2004.
5. The receiver must provide you with a deed of appointment for your property (this is the document signed by the landlord’s bank which confirms the bank have appointed a receiver).
6. Get the receiver to confirm if they will take on the responsibility of returning your deposit at the end of the tenancy.
7. Get confirmation from the receiver that in addition to accepting the rent that they will take on responsibility for ongoing tenancy issues such as maintenance and repairs.
8. If the receiver will not confirm that he has become the landlord and/or the original landlord continues to demand rent or indicate that the receiver is to be ignored, contact Threshold for further guidance.

http://www.threshold.ie/download/pdf/tips_for_receivership.pdf

Mrs OBumble

Karsini wrote: »

That's a good point, I'm not sure how this works at all.

On paper, would this mean that I'd have 140 days (from date of written notice) and I'd still be liable for rent up until the end of that period, even if I found somewhere else in the meantime?

No.

You have been there for 4 years or longer but less than 8 years, so you have to give notice of 12 weeks (84 days). (Yes, this is a different amount of notice to what the landlord needs to give you.)

(ref: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/types_of_tenancy.html - under Required Notice Periods).

So on paper, even if you found somewhere to go tomorrow and moved out, you are liable for the rent for the next 84 days after you give the landlord written notice.

But, this time-period can be reduced if both parties agree. In the ideal scenario, you agree to only pay rent for the actual time you are living there. The LL might be particularly agreeable to this if he's not actually getting the rent any more.

This is the type of situation where being a human and open to negotiation rather than focussing on the legals can lead to a better solution for everyone.


All the best with finding somewhere new to live.

Areas

I am in a similar situation this month and I contacted Threshold, it's a lot easier to talk to someone over the phone than to read up about it on a website. They were able to tell me what I was entitled to and what to do next.

Sad Professor

Somehow I don't see the landlord looking for or pursuing the OP for 84 days of rent if the OP leaves tomorrow. The landlord has suggested that the OP leave. Even if the landlord is not entitled to issue an official notice, he'd want some nerve to turn around and demand that the tenant give him 84 days notice.

I don't see anything to be negotiated here. The OP should probably go as soon as they can find a place. If they can't, they are entitled to stay.

MrDerp

I often wonder about these notice periods.

Any attempt I've ever made to rent a gaff a month out from moving has been entirely fruitless. So 28 days or 128 days, you are likely to be doing all of your viewings in the last 7-14 days. It's no extra protection at all, other than maybe giving you more time to box up a few things and start hitting the dump and charity shops.

I've heard nothing since but I do have another question, although maybe this is more suited to another forum.

I signed an 18 month contract with Eir for my broadband back in March. I may not be able to transfer this to a new address, depending on whether I move into a house share or my own space. Therefore I could be liable for termination fees to leave the contract early. A couple of people have told me that the landlord would be responsible for covering this fee but is that true?

The_Conductor

You entered into a contract.
It is your contract- it is nothing to do with the landlord.
Any termination fees are your responsibility.
It is your duty to return the property to the landlord as you were given it.
Any subsequent tenant is within their rights to approach whomsoever they choose for their supply of services (including internet) they have no obligation whatsoever to take over your supplier.

I thought as much.

Highly considering buying my next place.

PMBC

Karsini wrote: »

I thought as much.

Highly considering buying my next place.

Oddly enough I was dreaming of records and stereo players last night. Ah well dream on. Its heartening that there are good landlords out there and looking for a practical solution, working along with landlord, seems to me a good idea rather than enter into legal jungle.
What does the phrase in a tenancy agreement 'notice of termination of tenancy must be in writing and ...in accordance with the provisions of the Residential Tenancies Act, 2004' For a twelve month tenancy where rent is paid monthly is the notice period one month? the clause seems to me to read that either party can give notice.

PMBC

PMBC wrote: »

Oddly enough I was dreaming of records and stereo players last night. Ah well dream on.

What do you mean by that?

L1011

Karsini wrote: »

What do you mean by that?

Your signature, I imagine

L1011

L1011 wrote: »

Your signature, I imagine

Haha, duh! Can't say anyone has ever commented on it before.

Meh, I'm freaked out about this whole thing. Not sure what to do or where to go next.

mel123

Sad Professor wrote: »

I know there's some legal ambiguity in this situation and tenants can get caught in the crossfire, but if the OP can't find a place so soon they shouldn't allow themselves to be bullied by either the receiver or the landlord.

If it looks like you are going to have to stay a while, OP, I'd suggest getting advice from Threshold. Here's some tips from their website:



http://www.threshold.ie/download/pdf/tips_for_receivership.pdf

In plain English can anyone clarify what this point means/what notice is etc, if receivers are appointed and a tenant has signed a lease?

4. Your tenancy can only be ended by the serving of valid notice in accordance with the Residential
Tenancies Act 2004.

So receivers can still serve you notice even if you have a signed lease?

_Kaiser_

Karsini wrote: »

Haha, duh! Can't say anyone has ever commented on it before.

Meh, I'm freaked out about this whole thing. Not sure what to do or where to go next.

I'd start looking for alternative accommodation or seeing what you'd get as a mortgage if that's a possibility

The LL has been honest and upfront with you and assured you that your deposit is safe/will be returned. Ignore notice periods and such for now - if you found a place in the morning I'd be highly surprised if he had an issue with it.

If for some reason though you can't find another place before the "next phase" of this process kicks in, it would seem (per the above) that you do still have some rights to stay on in the interim.

Michael D Not Higgins

mel123 wrote: »

In plain English can anyone clarify what this point means/what notice is etc, if receivers are appointed and a tenant has signed a lease?

4. Your tenancy can only be ended by the serving of valid notice in accordance with the Residential
Tenancies Act 2004.

So receivers can still serve you notice even if you have a signed lease?

The tenancy is the legal occupation of the property under the terms of the RTA 2004. The lease is the contract between the parties involved in the renting of the property and may grant additional rights like a fixed term.

Edit: In general they shouldn't issue a notice of termination while a fixed term lease is in place. The lease may however be invalid by the actions of the landlord, for example if he signs the lease after the property is in receivership.