Another joke of a sentence...

T-Maxx

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/twoyear-sentence-for-driver-who-killed-cyclist-after-running-red-light-34827328.html

I'm just so so mad at the moment.

What an insult to this man's family.:mad:

youcancallmeal

Pretty standard for the Irish legal system

RobFowl

It's even a bit unusual to see some one actually jailed for killing a cyclist.

Carlos Orange

Speeding through a red light while banned from driving, with no insurance , while never having had a driving license and fleeing the scene after killing someone is "the lower half of the medium band" for dangerous driving?

magicbastarder

clearly the perp has a beard and looks middle class, so there's no need for a harsh sentence.

retalivity

magicbastarder wrote: »

clearly the perp has a beard and looks middle class, so there's no need for a harsh sentence.

Nope, had a 'tough upbringing', which immediately validates scumbag behaviour

Muahahaha

magicbastarder wrote: »

clearly the perp has a beard and looks middle class, so there's no need for a harsh sentence.

he's from Rueben Street, a very working class area

rustynutz

He'll do less than two years for taking someone's life, it looks like he only gave himself up because the guards were already on to him. He ran a red light, while disqualified, mowed down cyclist, and then sped off? How this can be considered to be on the lower end of the scale is beyond me. To put it into perspective a man got 6 years for not paying import duty on garlic a couple of years ago, Irish justice system strikes again

Borderfox

All I can hear from the judge is how bad it is for Mr Coleman with his bad upbringing and th.........bla bla bla

I wonder what outcome there is if a judge is affected personally by crime.

terrydel

Its shockingly lenient given the circumstances.
Would make you despair.

tomasrojo

I don't have any legal expertise, but how much more outrageous does someone's driving and behaviour have to be (on the day, prior to the day, and subsequently) to make it past the "medium band"?

TheBlaaMan

This is a really upsetting story and I fail to understand the leniency of the sentence given the prior history if the offender. Is there no recourse to an appeal on the sentence....?

Kaisr Sose

Very lenient sentence. I don't understand how somebody driving a vehicle recklessly while banned from driving can be shown leniency where a life is lost.

I truly feel sorry for the victims family. His life & their subsequent emotional life sentence without him has a legal equivalent value of 2.5yrs jail.

That's just wrong. I wonder will the DPP appeal this?

omri

This is shocking. Disrespectful to the victim and his family. Proves the point that legal system protects the offenders rather than the victims.

wheelo01

The priorities of the legal system are ass about face, this is a complete disgrace, the damage done to this man was collossal, and he and his family deserve better.

Tenzor07

Christ... I'm in shock, this criminal basically got away with it, and no doubt this time next year will be back behind the wheel of a car driving away without a care in the world, going by his track record....

Johnny Jukebox

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Christ... I'm in shock, this criminal basically got away with it, and no doubt this time next year will be back behind the wheel of a car driving away without a care in the world, going by his track record....

Nah he won't cos he was also banned for 15 years, like that stopped him the last time.

FFS. Hope he dies roaring.

crosstownk

Like others, I'm struggling to come to terms with the reasoning behind this particular sentence.

I'm trying to shed my bias as a cyclist and look at it from the fact that despite the defendant's background (as described in the article), he as banned from driving but still drove at speed, in a bus lane, with passengers in the car acting like idiots all of which led to death of this poor man.

Two and half years just sounds, to me , like it's way off the mark.

Like I said, I'm struggling to understand the sentence.

Tenzor07

Johnny Jukebox wrote: »

Nah he won't cos he was also banned for 15 years, like that stopped him the last time. FFS. Hope he dies roaring.

15 previous convictions, 8 of which were road traffic offences, banned from driving 3 times, last one was a 6 year ban in 2012... This criminal never had a licence, had no insurance, drove at 70kph, broke a red light in busy rush hour traffic, and drove off... doesn't get much worse than that...

There's no deterrent to driving like a maniac it seems..Why the judge even bothered to ban this thug from driving as part of this light touch sentence seems like a joke also...

CramCycle

I can't help but feel that when he was banned the second time, he should have faced jail time. Even from an egotistical point of view (in the eyes of the law), it shows a glaring disregard for the law or respect for it and that alone warranted a sentence.

Sentences like this are the reason behaviour like this continues. I cannot imagine the pain of the family, this must be like the Irish legal system, designed to protect them, and if not seek justice on their behalf, sticking a knife in the familys back and twisting with a little grin, nothing short of disgraceful.

dermabrasion

I am incredulous. What actually does constitute the upper band of dangerous driving? Surely the point of the law is to prevent injury and death. Speeding in a bus lane, then breaking a red light and it caused a death.
Justice has not been served here. The judge must be numb to the victims' impact statement; that a selfish, thoughtless and criminal act destroys the lives of this family.
What gives here? Call your TD? Protest on the Dail? Letter pleading the DPP seeks appeal for leniency?
Something has to happen here.

The YOPPA

Paudie, this is the cycling case this thread is discussing & this is the Cycling forum too

paudie2005

The YOPPA wrote: »

Paudie, this is the cycling case this thread is discussing & this is the Cycling forum too

Apologies, thought I was putting it in another forum

laraghrider

crosstownk wrote: »

I'm trying to shed my bias as a cyclist

There is zero bias needed here. Like most I cycle and I drive. This man could have hit another car and killed the occupant of that car as easily as he killed a cyclist given the way he was driving.

The sentence was harsher than I was expecting. I was sure 6 month suspended would have been given. In this country it does seem like if you kill someone on the road there is a sense of "ah, these things happen".

I also hate the way it has been portrayed in the media but it's always the same in these stories. Cyclist hit by car etc... Report it for what it really is, stop de-humanising road users. What it boils down to is a man was killed and now a husband, daddy, grandfather and brother has been taken away.

Kaisr Sose

laraghrider wrote: »

There is zero bias needed here. Like most I cycle and I drive......

The sentence was harsher than I was expecting. I was sure 6 month suspended would have been given. In this country it does seem like if you kill someone on the road there is a sense of "ah, these things happen".

I have to disagree. People have got harsher sentences for assault that led to a death. Eg. Somebody punches somebody, they fall, hit their head and suffer brain damage. Even where death is not caused, sentencing can be high where there is a previous record for violence.

It should be no different on our roads. The driver showed a blatant disregard for the law (driving while banned, previous bans, ignoring rules of the road) and in doing so endangering other road users. The judiciary should be sending out a message that this lack of respect for the law will not be tolerated on our roads.

average_runner

But if this was an insurance claim for braking a toe nail, they would of given 100,000 cash!!

laraghrider

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

I have to disagree. People have got harsher sentences for assault that led to a death. Eg. Somebody punches somebody, they fall, hit their head and suffer brain damage. Even where death is not caused, sentencing can be high where there is a previous record for violence.

It should be no different on our roads. The driver showed a blatant disregard for the law (driving while banned, previous bans, ignoring rules of the road) and in doing so endangering other road users. The judiciary should be sending out a message that this lack of respect for the law will not be tolerated on our roads.

You're not actually disagreeing with me. You're backing up everything I said. My point was there should be no difference but in this country once a car/van/lorry is involved the court sees it as "ah well, s**t happens, have 6 months and a 10 year driving ban". It's ridiculous, disgraceful and downright inhumane.

Carawaystick

I can't understand why we have separate crimes of dangerous driving causing death and careless driving causing death, instead of just manslaughter, which has a maximum sentence of life.

Although I suspect it's because when cars first came out, only rich people had them and when they killed someone, the stigma of manslaughter was too much, so lesser crimes were invented for their killings.

and here we are today. Repeat criminals killing people and meagre sentencing.

TheBlaaMan

Is there any process that could be used to get the DPP to look again at this case? It seems such a disproportionate sentence for causing a death, and the judge seems to have given far more weight to the offenders background (positively) compared to the impact on the victims family.

secman

I came across that "accident " last year while heading out to Bull wall... terrible terrible, the way he was ploughed out of it and a joke of a sentance. Thankfully I did not actually see it happening, arrived at the junction shortly afterwards. R.I.P. to the victim.

Carawaystick

TheBlaaMan wrote: »

Is there any process that could be used to get the DPP to look again at this case? It seems such a disproportionate sentence for causing a death, and the judge seems to have given far more weight to the offenders background (positively) compared to the impact on the victims family.

Yeah, the DPP can appeal the leniency of the sentence if she thinks its worth while.

TheBlaaMan

Carawaystick wrote: »

Yeah, the DPP can appeal the leniency of the sentence if she thinks its worth while.

Yeah, but I really meant whether a public appeal/petition etc would be useful to show her the level of sentiment obvioulsy being felt out there ...

TG860

He said his client had little driving experience and was not a good driver. He has been assessed as at low risk of re-offending.

I cannot understand how the probation report would assess him at a low risk of re-offending, given 15 previous convictions and being banned from driving on 3 separate occasions before this.

Between this and the judges' comments about the offence being in the "lower half of the medium band", the court seems to be completely devoid of reality in this case.
Such a terrible miscarriage of justice for the family to have to endure.

cdaly_

TheBlaaMan wrote: »

Yeah, but I really meant whether a public appeal/petition etc would be useful to show her the level of sentiment obvioulsy being felt out there ...

This is something the DPP absolutely must ignore or you end up with witch-hunts...

Varik

cdaly_ wrote: »

This is something the DPP absolutely must ignore or you end up with witch-hunts...

Of the DPP yes, but Frances Fitzgerald shouldn't get a minutes rest without someone calling for reform.

The death probably wasn't as big a concern than the car not being insured or taxed, no justice in Ireland.

Chiparus

Varik wrote: »

Of the DPP yes, but Frances Fitzgerald shouldn't get a minutes rest without someone calling for reform.

The death probably wasn't as big a concern than the car not being insured or taxed, no justice in Ireland.

Yep, Judges need to realize that sentences are not just about punishment, they are also to protect society. I don't for one second believe this guy will stop once he is released in 18 months.

schemingbohemia

Varik wrote: »

Of the DPP yes, but Frances Fitzgerald shouldn't get a minutes rest without someone calling for reform.

The death probably wasn't as big a concern than the car not being insured or taxed, no justice in Ireland.

what reform? the option for a 10 year sentence was already there.

Kaisr Sose

TheBlaaMan wrote: »

Yeah, but I really meant whether a public appeal/petition etc would be useful to show her the level of sentiment obvioulsy being felt out there ...

DPP is independent and must remain independent.

Thud

wasn't there another hit and run recently (possibly a pedestrian) by some guy who'd also been banned for driving several times?

is there anyway of monitoring these banned drivers, some sort of ankle tag/immobilizer/probation officer combo

Limestone1

Thud wrote: »

wasn't there another hit and run recently (possibly a pedestrian) by some guy who'd also been banned for driving several times?

is there anyway of monitoring these banned drivers, some sort of ankle tag/immobilizer/probation officer combo

There are many ways of tagging them, watching them or following them about but that is not the issue.Sentencing them properly for their crimes that they will inevitably commit, is ........

Lavinia

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057613353