Dog in Newgrange

http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0603/793064-newgrange-dog/

Given the obviously incorrect headline, I'm not sure how accurate this story is, but was a dog actually found buried in a Newgrange tomb?

slowburner

Deleted User wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0603/793064-newgrange-dog/

Given the obviously incorrect headline, I'm not sure how accurate this story is, but was a dog actually found buried in a Newgrange tomb?

Three dogs were found in Newgrange. One in the east chamber, one in the west, and one near the end chamber.
What is interesting about the new analysis, is that the bones were previously thought to belong to later dogs that strayed into the tomb and died. Clearly this is not the case given the recent dating. Where they were positioned in the tomb may also prove to be of greater significance than previously thought - if that is, the other sets of remains prove to be contemporary with the dated remains.

Thanks, thats fascinating. Guard dogs for the afterlife?? Has anything been published on their skeletal make-up?

robp

slowburner wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0603/793064-newgrange-dog/

Given the obviously incorrect headline, I'm not sure how accurate this story is, but was a dog actually found buried in a Newgrange tomb?

Three dogs were found in Newgrange. One in the east chamber, one in the west, and one near the end chamber.
What is interesting about the new analysis, is that the bones were previously thought to belong to later dogs that strayed into the tomb and died. Clearly this is not the case given the recent dating. Where they were positioned in the tomb may also prove to be of greater significance than previously thought - if that is, the other sets of remains prove to be contemporary with the dated remains.

They are not modern. But has it been made clear if they were deliberately buried in the tomb?

topper75

If there were separate canine remains in a number of chambers then I am happy to go out on a limb and assume their burial was deliberate and had some significance for the buriers.

I hadn't though of crop-growers needing dogs but they could have been for casual hunts, watchers of small domesticated flocks/herds, or simply companions in the settlement. If you are rich enough to construct such tombs, pet food can be budgeted for!

Wibbs

topper75 wrote: »

I hadn't though of crop-growers needing dogs but they could have been for casual hunts, watchers of small domesticated flocks/herds, or simply companions in the settlement. If you are rich enough to construct such tombs, pet food can be budgeted for!

When we started farming of crops and for long after we didn't stop hunting and gathering, even after domestication of animals. Like you say dogs would have been used for tracking, security, companionship, even as pack animals and food in some cultures.

goose2005

being buried with a faithful dog is pretty common

From Christ Church:

wayoutwest

A three headed dog called Cerberus guarded the Greek underworld (Hades). A three dog motif appears in the Book of Kells 15752f846fe43680cbc50895f13cffbb.jpeg. Quite a few mythologies have a 'hellhound' that guards and protects the supernatural world.
Hounds would have been highly prized for guarding stock, hunting and security....probably even back in the neolithic?.Are there any other Neolithic ritual sites that have yielded dog remains?
I also read somewhere (Irish legends?) that ancient Irish shamans or seers used to eat the flesh of dogs in order to access the 'otherworld'.

topper75

Concepts worth mentioning and thinking about here wayoutwest.

If only that traditions and stories can't just be dropped out of left field. They won't stick if they do. They will be the ramblings of a madman and dismissed.

There has to be something in accepted reality for a story like Cerberus to hang on to first.

There was some canine role in the pivot between life and death in ancient European societies. They continued for some time to be an important a grave good as a sword, pot of food, or indeed anything else, even to the days of the Dane and the Norman.

Are there any such links in non-Euro sites out of curiosity?

dubhthach

Of course the importance of the Dog from Newgrange is that it has provided aDNA that has helped better understand the development of dog domestication (once compared to aDNA from eastern Eurasian dog remains)

dubhthach

Relevant paper:

http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2016/08/07/068189

PDF of paper:

http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2016/08/07/068189.full.pdf

Skyfarm

a few dogs found here, they suggest they were part of ritual

Haughey's fort

https://sites.google.com/site/dunloparchive/home/Haugheys_Fort

can't find the reference to the monkey skull found under Haughey's fort in the jumble,again animals and ritual


http://www.voicesfromthedawn.com/the-kings-stables/

Arsemageddon

Skyfarm wrote: »

a few dogs found here, they suggest they were part of ritual

Haughey's fort

https://sites.google.com/site/dunloparchive/home/Haugheys_Fort

can't find the reference to the monkey skull found under Haughey's fort in the jumble,again animals and ritual


http://www.voicesfromthedawn.com/the-kings-stables/

The skull of a Barbary Macaque/Ape native to North Africa was found during the excavation of Navan Fort/Emhain Mhaca in Armagh. I think it dated from 200-100 BCE (I'd have to check the date to be sure). I heard about this discovery when I was in my teens and was absolutely fascinated by it and decided I wanted to study archaeology. Was a live ape brought to Ireland or was the skull alone traded for ritual use?

http://irisharchaeology.ie/2014/05/a-barbary-ape-skull-from-navan-fort-co-armagh/

Skyfarm

Arsemageddon wrote: »

The skull of a Barbary Macaque/Ape native to North Africa was found during the excavation of Navan Fort/Emhain Mhaca in Armagh. I think it dated from 200-100 BCE (I'd have to check the date to be sure). I heard about this discovery when I was in my teens and was absolutely fascinated by it and decided I wanted to study archaeology. Was a live ape brought to Ireland or was the skull alone traded for ritual use?

http://irisharchaeology.ie/2014/05/a-barbary-ape-skull-from-navan-fort-co-armagh/

the mind boggles,my reaction to your text was ,it was part of the ritual when building the fort and the builders were from Africa/Spain,my tendency is to look back and view the past as a dark age in comparison to now,but it wasn't all that unusual to have guests trading and living with the locals,my mind is drifting back to a few years ago and the cargo of oranges found in Schull harbour from the 14/1600s, and then we had the pirates