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People WWE missed the boat on

  • 24-05-2016 5:19pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭


    Talking about your Vaders here, your Goldbergs, your Regals*

    People who the WWE squandered.
    Proven talent they could've used better, people who went on to prove themselves elsewhere, people who showed spark but were ultimately crippled by the system, please try and specify which in your post.



    *well, your Regals without the seriously patchy track records RE: drugs and stuff


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 13,322 ✭✭✭✭briany


    Scott Levy, AKA Raven. Was lumbered with the stinky Johnny Polo character and WWE saw him as more of a backstage employee than someone who could be a great on-camera worker. Went on to make his mark in ECW.

    Dr. Death Steve Williams. Well-known as a legitimate tough guy and was a name in Japan before coming back stateside. WWE made a huge mistake in letting him enter that Brawl for All thing, but plenty of other guys got their arse kicked in that thing as well, and it didn't totally destroy their reputation of being tough, so the WWE could still have followed through on their plans for him.

    The glut of talent that came into WWE after ECW folded. Heyman, as noted by others, had a great talent in taking ordinary guys and making them into stars (within the context of ECW anyway) by playing to their strengths. They obviously had charisma as they were part of a cult show that influenced the course of wrestling in the states but hardly one of them besides RVD, Tazz and the Dudley Boyz were given much to do when they came to WWE. Some of these guys, like Raven, had been under-utilized in a previous WWE run, such as Justin Credible, who wrestled in the WWE in the early/mid 90s as Aldo Montoya.

    Bill Irwin. An old hand of the territories, wrestling as 'Wild' Bill Irwin, he came to the WWE and was given the comedy gimmick of the Goon. Another territory guy, another good hand in the business was Norman the Lunatic who came to the WWE and was made into 'Friar Ferguson', a wrestling monk. Later he was repackaged into Bastion Booger a guy who was.....I don't know what he was, really, but it was never going to get off the ground.

    Just a few examples that spring to mind to start with.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 689 ✭✭✭Straight Edge Punk


    briany wrote: »
    Scott Levy, AKA Raven. Was lumbered with the stinky Johnny Polo character and WWE saw him as more of a backstage employee than someone who could be a great on-camera worker. Went on to make his mark in ECW.

    Dr. Death Steve Williams. Well-known as a legitimate tough guy and was a name in Japan before coming back stateside. WWE made a huge mistake in letting him enter that Brawl for All thing, but plenty of other guys got their arse kicked in that thing as well, and it didn't totally destroy their reputation of being tough, so the WWE could still have followed through on their plans for him.

    The glut of talent that came into WWE after ECW folded. Heyman, as noted by others, had a great talent in taking ordinary guys and making them into stars (within the context of ECW anyway) by playing to their strengths. They obviously had charisma as they were part of a cult show that influenced the course of wrestling in the states but hardly one of them besides RVD, Tazz and the Dudley Boyz were given much to do when they came to WWE. Some of these guys, like Raven, had been under-utilized in a previous WWE run, such as Justin Credible, who wrestled in the WWE in the early/mid 90s as Aldo Montoya.

    Bill Irwin. An old hand of the territories, wrestling as 'Wild' Bill Irwin, he came to the WWE and was given the comedy gimmick of the Goon. Another territory guy, another good hand in the business was Norman the Lunatic who came to the WWE and was made into 'Friar Ferguson', a wrestling monk. Later he was repackaged into Bastion Booger a guy who was.....I don't know what he was, really, but it was never going to get off the ground.

    Just a few examples that spring to mind to start with.

    As soon as I read the thread title 3 guys came to my mind.

    Raven, Justin Credible and Lance Storm. All 3 could have been maim ever gets if Vince didn't have such a hard on for the big men at the time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,689 ✭✭✭sky88


    As soon as I read the thread title 3 guys came to my mind.

    Raven, Justin Credible and Lance Storm. All 3 could have been maim ever gets if Vince didn't have such a hard on for the big men at the time.

    raven could have but lance and Justin never could have just solid mid carders.

    Wade barret could have been huge but they stuck him and the nexus in that terrible feud with cena and I don't think he could ever fully recover


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,935 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2



    *well, your Regals without the seriously patchy track records RE: drugs and stuff


    I think Regal to some extent blew his chance and I love the guy. I recall his last push he was very over and I would have out good money on him headlining a PPV against Trips who was one the champs at that time. He probably would not have won, but you never know, could have got a brief thank you reign. Pretty sure Trips would have had no beef with that as supposedly they are quiet tight.


    sky88 wrote: »
    raven could

    Wade barret could have been huge but they stuck him and the nexus in that terrible feud with cena and I don't think he could ever fully recover


    Wade is true. He was so over in 2010, but they decided to hold off on him, possibly thinking "not ready and we can stick the rocket on him later" and obviously that did not happen. I got a flashbacks of such booking with Rollins for reasons unknown coming back as a heel last night. :rolleyes:

    Raven?

    Someone would know better than me, but I have read he was a pretty crap influence on Shane back in the day? Again could be bollocks, but maybe that is one of the reasons he never amounted to more than he did.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Music Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators Posts: 24,123 Mod ✭✭✭✭Angron


    Derrick Bateman/EC3. I think he showed a lot of potential while they sort of arsed around with that first incarnation of NXT, but they never actually did anything with him. I believe him to be one of the better things about TNA now. Of course he's still young enough, so he could well wind up back in WWE at some point or another.

    Sean O'Haire. I liked the guy, I thought he was an interesting character, decent on the promo. Then they stuck him with Piper, he played second fiddle in another Piper vs. Hogan feud, and when Piper got released he got nothing. He was a big guy, and I was always impressed that he could pull off the Sean-ton Bomb.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,034 ✭✭✭✭RobbingBandit


    Goldust and Owen Hart for me both should have been champion in their heydays instead both got stuck with dreadful gimicks never getting to reach their peaks. Jake the snake never winning any title was mad too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,322 ✭✭✭✭briany


    Rjd2 wrote: »
    Raven?

    Someone would know better than me, but I have read he was a pretty crap influence on Shane back in the day? Again could be bollocks, but maybe that is one of the reasons he never amounted to more than he did.

    I've heard that he and Shane would go drinking together and just engage in the wrestling party lifestyle, but other wrestlers did this, too, like X Pac and Razor, and they had good careers with WWE.

    Vince or whoever thought that Levy had a good mind for the business and had him in the role of backstage producer where he was fairly unhappy. He used to call TV and say that he was needed down at the office and then call the office and say he was needed at TV. Then he'd stay in bed until 3PM, and go drinking later.

    Another guy the WWE totally underused was DDP. He was one of the shining stars of WCW but he was buried, in relative terms, when he came to the WWE. I think the guy had long since proven he had charisma and star power.

    Then there's Steve Keirn. Wrestled throughout the states during the 80s having success in the AWA as one half of the Fabulous Ones tag team. When he got to WWE, he was given the gimmick of Skinner, an alligator trapper from the Florida Everglades.

    One Man Gang. Another guy who'd worked all over the territories in the 70s and the 80s, working with many of the big names. He was One Man Gang for a little while when he got to the WWE, but he was then repackaged into Akeem the African Dream, a white man who thought he was black, basically, with dance moves and what I suppose was supposed to be traditional African clothing. I actually like this gimmick but only 'cause it's funny. However, the guy could have been more than a comedy wrestler. Also supposedly a jab at Dusty Rhodes.

    Dusty Rhodes himself was a man that was such a hot commodity in the territories he worked. When he got to WWE, he was put in polkadots and given a valet who was a plump middle-aged woman. Even fighting this stink, he was able to make something out of what he was given, however had the machine actually got behind him, he could easily have been Hogan level.


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭spektorfive


    CM Punk/ Daniel Bryan.

    You may say these were top guys but they blew it with both of them. After Punk "Left" with the belt he could came back as a huge star. Instead they rushed it and put into a baby face vs baby face match with HHH that he lost and then some odd ball story line with Kevin Nash. He loses the belt gets it back and keeps it for a year. But he was never the top guy during this time and just loses the belt to The Rock, a part timer.

    Daniel gets his moment at WM 30 and it was great. You think maybe they go all the way with him? No. Straight into mid-card feud with Kane. Even if he didn't get injured his was going lose the belt to Brock at Sumerslam and be out of the main event picture.

    Look at back and think would they have done this with Austin? Rock? even Cena? No cause Vince saw them as stars. He didn't see Punk/Bryan like these. If you don't book your talent as stars people would see them as such.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,441 ✭✭✭✭CSF


    Important to remember that Bryan was only ever a stop-gap champion to get Lesnar insane heel heat when he crushed Bryan for the title at Summerslam, so that Reigns could save the day and go over him at Mania, I think Ziggler was taking the role that Reigns was meant to play at Survivor Series also if Reigns wasn't injured.

    That just makes it worse in terms of Bryan and the plans they made for him between those 2 Summerslams. Probably the most over anyone has been since Stone Cold and Rock and they couldn't use him for anything more as someone to get beaten to create heel heat for f*cking Batista and Reigns to go over.


  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭bobby_says_hi


    Really most of the Cruiserweights in the early 2000s could count, but I felt Crash Holly got the ball dropped. After the Hardcore title was retired and the Cruiserweight Championship given more prominence, he could have offered a lot to the division. He had some good funny charisma and could be the face or heel - not to mention being more than passable in the ring.

    Billy Gunn particularly when he was 'The One'. Probably not main event material, but could have been a good solid midcarder. He unfortunately had his momentum killed during that dumb hot potato with the IC title - from Eddie Guerrero to him to Benoit to Jericho all in the space of about two months. He could have potentially been a good singles guy but he kept getting pigeonholed into tag teams.

    I felt Steve Blackman could have had a lot more done with him, especially with the new ECW guys coming in during the Invasion. I believe he was injured during that storyline and then left on his own terms. But he'd have been great to see in matches like the Elimination Chamber or Money In The Bank.

    As far as women go, there's a laundry list of them. But I think Layla actually hits a sore spot for me. I wasn't a fan during her LayCool days, but she returned from her injury so improved in the ring. And she was someone who could play that peppy girl next door babyface. She could potentially have been over too, but they kept her off TV and gave her nothing. Then they forced her back into that cheesy heel role she wasn't suited for.

    In a weird way, I feel Nikki Bella got a bit of a shaft too. Sure on paper she's the longest reigning champ, but she did absolutely nothing of note. She flip flopped from face to heel every week and had to do ridiculous feuds straight out of Mean Girls. And she was actually trying in the ring. It seemed as if the worse the storylines got, the better her wrestling became. She could have been so much better than what she was with the right storyline and opponent.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,928 ✭✭✭✭chopperbyrne


    Ric Flair

    It started off so great, claiming he was the real world champion.

    Then he wins the title in the best Royal Rumble match ever, and should have main evented Wrestlemania against Hogan, but instead Vince saw the size of Sid and booked him vs Hogan instead, with Flair losing the title to Savage halfway through the show.

    He was only there for a year and a half, and they never did the obvious money match on PPV.

    By the time he was back in WWE he was over the hill and so ashamed of his own body that he wore t-shirts in the ring.

    Goldust after his introduction should have been a heel champion, as should Razor Ramon.


  • Registered Users Posts: 39,249 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Ric Flair

    It started off so great, claiming he was the real world champion.

    Then he wins the title in the best Royal Rumble match ever, and should have main evented Wrestlemania against Hogan, but instead Vince saw the size of Sid and booked him vs Hogan instead, with Flair losing the title to Savage halfway through the show.

    He was only there for a year and a half, and they never did the obvious money match on PPV.

    By the time he was back in WWE he was over the hill and so ashamed of his own body that he wore t-shirts in the ring.

    Goldust after his introduction should have been a heel champion, as should Razor Ramon.

    I'm delighted that flair and hogan didn't happen at wrestlemania VIII.
    Flair and savage might have been in the middle of the show but it is the one of my favourite mania matches ever.

    I don't think it was vince liking sid. It was the orange goblin being unable to be out of the limelight. So we get that cluster**** of an ending.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,216 ✭✭✭Ageyev


    Ric Flair

    It started off so great, claiming he was the real world champion.

    Then he wins the title in the best Royal Rumble match ever, and should have main evented Wrestlemania against Hogan, but instead Vince saw the size of Sid and booked him vs Hogan instead, with Flair losing the title to Savage halfway through the show.

    He was only there for a year and a half, and they never did the obvious money match on PPV.

    By the time he was back in WWE he was over the hill and so ashamed of his own body that he wore t-shirts in the ring.

    Goldust after his introduction should have been a heel champion, as should Razor Ramon.

    Strongly disagree on Ric Flair.


    Hogan and Flair worked the house show circuit in late 1991 and it didn't do the business expected and then Hogan wanted to leave and go do movies. It was more of a timing issue than a ball dropping issue. Also, by 1992 the 80s bubble had burst and this is why the WWF toured Europe regularly at the turn of the decade - to make more money! The WWF's tours of Europe coincided with them getting on Sky and then you have the SummerSlam in 1992 being held in London.

    Flair left WWF in 1993 of his own volition because Jim Herd had been ousted - the reason he left WCW for WWF in the first place.

    Also, his comment about wrestling in t-shirts was made by him about his match with Sting on the last episode of Nitro. He wrestled regularly sans t-shirt in WWE from 2002-2008.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    I think the house show circuit run of Flair and Hogan happened up in the North East (the old WWF territory)where Flair wasn't as big a name as he was elsewhere.

    Personally I would have liked for it to have gone ahead at Wrestlemania. They could have built it into a NWA vs WWF thing.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭Chain Smoker


    It's a mixture, with Hogan leaving soon it didn't exactly make sense for him to be the one who went over Flair at Mania (this was still the babyface always wins at Mania era, right?) and the less than stellar house show gates were what sealed it ...even though it was an area where Flair wasn't yet a huge star and Hogan's value (along with the WWE in general) was dropping at a staggering rate.

    RE: Flair in shirts, I don't think he wore shirts in 2002 WWE, but he has been very vocal that he was in terrible shape at the time and pretty embarrassed by his fitness levels (think he had to have been getting some cosmetic surgery of some kind around then that he ditched once he regained his fitness too, just look at how terribly his face aged between 2002 and 2004). Taker carried him through their mania match iirc, for example.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,348 ✭✭✭✭ricero


    Kane for me could of been so much more. They killed him eqrly on by having him win the title against austin in a first blood match and then drop it the following night on raw. He then became a big red joke


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Music Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators Posts: 24,123 Mod ✭✭✭✭Angron


    Really most of the Cruiserweights in the early 2000s could count, but I felt Crash Holly got the ball dropped. After the Hardcore title was retired and the Cruiserweight Championship given more prominence, he could have offered a lot to the division. He had some good funny charisma and could be the face or heel - not to mention being more than passable in the ring.

    Billy Gunn particularly when he was 'The One'. Probably not main event material, but could have been a good solid midcarder. He unfortunately had his momentum killed during that dumb hot potato with the IC title - from Eddie Guerrero to him to Benoit to Jericho all in the space of about two months. He could have potentially been a good singles guy but he kept getting pigeonholed into tag teams.

    I felt Steve Blackman could have had a lot more done with him, especially with the new ECW guys coming in during the Invasion. I believe he was injured during that storyline and then left on his own terms. But he'd have been great to see in matches like the Elimination Chamber or Money In The Bank.

    As far as women go, there's a laundry list of them. But I think Layla actually hits a sore spot for me. I wasn't a fan during her LayCool days, but she returned from her injury so improved in the ring. And she was someone who could play that peppy girl next door babyface. She could potentially have been over too, but they kept her off TV and gave her nothing. Then they forced her back into that cheesy heel role she wasn't suited for.

    In a weird way, I feel Nikki Bella got a bit of a shaft too. Sure on paper she's the longest reigning champ, but she did absolutely nothing of note. She flip flopped from face to heel every week and had to do ridiculous feuds straight out of Mean Girls. And she was actually trying in the ring. It seemed as if the worse the storylines got, the better her wrestling became. She could have been so much better than what she was with the right storyline and opponent.
    I could also argue Brooke Adams/Tessmacher on the women's side of things. She did basically nothing but stripteases in her time in WWE, but in TNA she actually proved herself to be one of the best they had in the ring (which made a storyline where she was being "taught how to wrestle" by someone who was already awful kinda confusing).


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,553 ✭✭✭Blue_Dabadee


    I think Jillian Hall deserved more than token Divas championship reign.

    She was given an awful gimmick and played it to perfection much like Sandow.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭Imnotthehulk


    ricero wrote: »
    Kane for me could of been so much more. They killed him eqrly on by having him win the title against austin in a first blood match and then drop it the following night on raw. He then became a big red joke

    Not sure I'd agree with that. I think there have certainly been times when Kane's runs and feuds have been awful, but in the long run he has been a near top card performer for almost 20 years.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,348 ✭✭✭✭ricero


    ricero wrote: »
    Kane for me could of been so much more. They killed him eqrly on by having him win the title against austin in a first blood match and then drop it the following night on raw. He then became a big red joke

    Not sure I'd agree with that. I think there have certainly been times when Kane's runs and feuds have been awful, but in the long run he has been a near top card performer for almost 20 years.

    True but how many title runs has he had ? Kane has been an enhancment talent for most of his career


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1 The_Real_Irish


    William Regal being a massive heel in 2008 is my pick for the "what could have been" question. Regal is without a doubt one of the best performers in ring and on the mic and pretty much turns anything he is given into gold. If he was treated as a massive treat to Triple H at the time, then he would have been a joy to watch and he is one of those that deserved a world title run.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,935 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2


    William Regal being a massive heel in 2008 is my pick for the "what could have been" question. Regal is without a doubt one of the best performers in ring and on the mic and pretty much turns anything he is given into gold. If he was treated as a massive treat to Triple H at the time, then he would have been a joy to watch and he is one of those that deserved a world title run.

    If he hadn't failed wellness, he may have at least got a few matches with Trips who was champ at that time, but unfortunately he blew it. Not the E's fault this one.

    Shame as I love Regal:(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,096 ✭✭✭✭the groutch


    Matt Morgan, had a great run in TNA.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,138 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    I think Mike Awesome was one of the biggest under used talents in WWE history. He was exactly what they wanted. A big man with a jakked up body. Then when you look to what he could do in the ring? Super powerbombs, plancha's, slingshot shoulder tackles... the list goes on. All from a really big guy.

    The man could have printed money if booked right. But I guess the whole Paul Haymen burying him and WCW treating him as a jobber tarnished things. The latter perhaps due to ECW making him legally come back and drop the title to Taz (Only time a WWF contracted wrestler ever wrestled a WCW contracted wrestler) But who knows.

    WWF missed the boat on him. WCW missed the boat on him and the only place that positioned him right was ECW.


    Anyways Rip Mike.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,614 ✭✭✭AllGunsBlazing


    Rick Rude. This guy really had the total package of physique, mic skills and was a bloody good wrestler. I don't know the reasons for why he left, but McMahon might have regretted not putting the belt on him in the summer of 1990 when he was feuding with Warrior. Would have been a great heel champion imo and a much needed change of style to what went before him in Hogan and Warrior.


  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭bobby_says_hi


    I could also argue Brooke Adams/Tessmacher on the women's side of things. She did basically nothing but stripteases in her time in WWE, but in TNA she actually proved herself to be one of the best they had in the ring (which made a storyline where she was being "taught how to wrestle" by someone who was already awful kinda confusing).

    Ironically I was never much of a Brooke fan. Quite good in the ring but awful on the microphone, and couldn't play a babyface to save her life. She tried too hard to be sassy and instead came across as very bratty and bitchy (the same problems Paige has). I liked what they were doing with her when she was a heel in Aces & Eights, but then for no good reason they forced her back into that face role she couldn't play.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭Sirsok


    Paul Burchill....really a victim off WWE bringing talent up with terrible gimmicks like the pirate and incest one. Was an animal in FPW in England and was great by all accounts with his ripper gimmick in OVW. I remember being astounded by him watching the wrestling channel with standing ahooting star presses and swantona over the turnbuckle to the floor


  • Registered Users Posts: 838 ✭✭✭A Rogue Hobo


    Colt Cabana. He was hired at a time when WWE was stuck in a rut and unwilling to change and he was shoved out the door. Had he been hired in today's era, he could be as over as New Day are now.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭slicus ricus


    Rick Rude. This guy really had the total package of physique, mic skills and was a bloody good wrestler. I don't know the reasons for why he left, but McMahon might have regretted not putting the belt on him in the summer of 1990 when he was feuding with Warrior. Would have been a great heel champion imo and a much needed change of style to what went before him in Hogan and Warrior.

    The fact that Hogan point blank refused to work with him was probably the main factor in Rude not getting a run with the belt. Apparently Hogan called him a Tazmanian Devil and just would not wrestle him. It would be pretty tough to have a run with the belt as the top heel when the eternal top face refuses to work with you. One of Hogan's many fine contributions to the wrestling business!!!:rolleyes:

    Explained by Flair below:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,689 ✭✭✭sky88


    wasnt rude crazy tho i can see why hogan wouldnt want to work with him in a way.

    Didnt he pull a gun on bischoff over returning a belt. think it was on flairs podcast.


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