Hamstrings vs quads

Luxman

I went for a spin yesterday around a few local hills. The intent was to pace up the hills (mick Byrne at the end of the month) and not hammer up them. Found a position sitting back on the saddle engaged the hams much more and they never felt fatigued whereas with quads I can only hold pace for a much shorter period of time. Curious to know what others do on long and shorts hills and drags. If there a right or wrong way to do this? Do I need a new bike😜

Beasty

Having been much more of a grinder in the past and prone to get out of the saddle in relatively high gears as I went up hill, this year I've tried to stay in the saddle as much as possible and spin in a low gear. As a result I'm finding myself much stronger towards the end of a (admitedly only 2 hour) race.

Think the general point is muscles will fatigue the harder you push them so taking some of the pressure off the leg muscles and putting it onto the cariovascular sysetm (my HR has typically been higher during those "efforts") allows you to keep going at a similar overall effort for longer.

greenspurs

Ive always been a spinner myself on climbs, and im trying to train myself into using a lower cadence as ive always struggled powerwise on steep gradients when you cant spin due to the gradient.
its tough though.

equivariant

Beasty wrote: »

Having been much more of a grinder in the past and prone to get out of the saddle in relatively high gears as I went up hill, this year I've tried to stay in the saddle as much as possible and spin in a low gear. As a result I'm finding myself much stronger towards the end of a (admitedly only 2 hour) race.

Think the general point is muscles will fatigue the harder you push them so taking some of the pressure off the leg muscles and putting it onto the cariovascular sysetm (my HR has typically been higher during those "efforts") allows you to keep going at a similar overall effort for longer.

Interesting - I am having a somewhat opposite experience. I have always tended to sit and spin in the hills. But I am finding that in a short local league race that tends to have 2 or 3 short sharp (eg 1km at 5-7%) hills and tend to be pretty fast from the get go, I need to grind a bigger gear to try to stay in contact on the hill. I guess that I burn my legs a lot more on the hill but that is compensated by less of having to (try to) chase back on after the hill.

Obviously the OP has very different requirements, so as you suggest, spinning on the hills will save your legs on a longer event where it is not absolutely crucial to stay in contact with the group on the hill.

Beasty

equivariant wrote: »

Interesting - I am having a somewhat opposite experience. I have always tended to sit and spin in the hills. But I am finding that in a short local league race that tends to have 2 or 3 short sharp (eg 1km at 5-7%) hills and tend to be pretty fast from the get go, I need to grind a bigger gear to try to stay in contact on the hill. I guess that I burn my legs a lot more on the hill but that is compensated by less of having to (try to) chase back on after the hill.

Obviously the OP has very different requirements, so as you suggest, spinning on the hills will save your legs on a longer event where it is not absolutely crucial to stay in contact with the group on the hill.

We may be coming at this from two extremes, and I'm sure there's a happy medium somewhere along the line

The stuff I do is mainly IVCA racing, which is going to be not much more than 2 hours but no major climbs - just a few drags on many of the circuits and I'm finding I can stick with the group, assuming I'm not caught the wrong side of a split. I agree that staying in contact is pretty important, although sometimes groups can break up and need to re-consolidate at the top to allow them to work together thereafter. I've found myself once this year leading a group up a bit of a climb only to turn round and find I was just about on my own, and therefore eased up to allow a couple of others to join. Getting to the top ahead of others has the added advantage of allowing a bit of recovery while allowing others to get back on.

eeeee

"Beasty wrote: »

I've found myself once this year leading a group up a bit of a climb only to turn round and find I was just about on my own, and therefore eased up to allow a couple of others to join. Getting to the top ahead of others has the added advantage of allowing a bit of recovery while allowing others to get back on.

Waiting at the top of a climb for people during a race? Man I can't wait to be old enough for that to be normal racing procedure! :P

I would be somewhere in the middle re climbing, I haven't really done enough proper climbing to really figure it out yet. My cadence is entirely based on not dropping the wheel in front of me/dropping those behind me/keeping the group together if we work well. I tend to sit rather than get out of the saddle, being smooth feels better than jumping up and down to me. I suppose it's a personal thing really?

greenspurs

gadetra wrote: »

I tend to sit rather than get out of the saddle, being smooth feels better than jumping up and down to me. I suppose it's a personal thing really?

I have watched "Greatest Climbs" on the Bike channel , and Salvodelli always advises to alternate between sitting and standing when climbing, to give both muscle groups a wee break, and just shift up a gear when standing to keep at the same tempo..
So i suppose it just depends on the individual, i try to try both .

martyc5674

Is the OP's question though about the pros/cons of sliding back on the saddle??(thats how i read it anyway)
Marty.

greenspurs

martyc5674 wrote: »

Is the OP's question though about the pros/cons of sliding back on the saddle??(thats how i read it anyway)
Marty.

....and about using different sets of muscles ....
hence the discussion about 'spinning' or 'grinding' ......

(topic police everywhere, but thanks for your imput ?!)

martyc5674

greenspurs wrote: »

....and about using different sets of muscles ....
hence the discussion about 'spinning' or 'grinding' ......

(topic police everywhere, but thanks for your imput ?!)

Not policing...just interested in the topic myself and what people have to offer, i think most here know their optimal balance/ratios between standing and sitting and the pros and cons of spinning V grinding but position on saddle might not get as much thought.

Luxman

OP here, I didn't feel like I was grinding, actually what I was focusing on was ensuring I didn't slide forward and thus start to engage the quads more. It felt more comfortable (as in I could hold that tempo for longer). I think cadence was around 60 or 70 , it didn't feel like a mash.

harringtonp

Years ago I spun but in recent years I find that by lowering cadence and grinding I have a much better chance of staying on. May burn leg muscles more but in many situations you just have to do it. I often find myself sliding back a little in the saddle as I drop cadence