Sowing financial seeds? - Vulture TV Networks

Danye

Flicking through the channels and I've come across "Word Network" and there is a guy / preacher asking people to ring up and donate ($1,000) money to sow a seed and this will be returned to them tenfold.

There "season" is coming?? He's claiming he done this many years ago, and through Gods blessing a businessman just started sending him checks!

This isn't the first time I've seen such programmes. How are these TV Networks, who claim to be Christian, allowed air these programmes?

alma73

Danye wrote: »

Flicking through the channels and I've come across "Word Network" and there is a guy / preacher asking people to ring up and donate ($1,000) money to sow a seed and this will be returned to them tenfold.

There "season" is coming?? He's claiming he done this many years ago, and through Gods blessing a businessman just started sending him checks!

This isn't the first time I've seen such programmes. How are these TV Networks, who claim to be Christian, allowed air these programmes?

Probably Benny Hinn. Evangelical preachers don't make the rich list by just praying.

It is known as preaching a prosperity gospel I think.

Danye

alma73 wrote: »

Probably Benny Hinn. Evangelical preachers don't make the rich list by just praying.

It seems to go completely against Christian principles no??

I can't believe people fall for it!

alma73

Danye wrote: »

It seems to go completely against Christian principles no??

I can't believe people fall for it!

Ahh,.. you find greed everywhere and in every Church. There are certain evangelicals who believe that their faith will make them wealthy. I'm always skeptical of people who want to get your bank details.

Danye

alma73 wrote: »

Ahh,.. you find greed everywhere and in every Church. There are certain evangelicals who believe that their faith will make them wealthy. I'm always skeptical of people who want to get your bank details.

No I actually can believe it. I can imagine some poor individual desperate for a few quid willing to try anything and falling into this trap.

uck51js9zml2yt

While I disagree with the "prosperity Gospel" I cant help think about all the riches that are found in Vatican City.
If Catholics want to slate "prosperity" preachers...fine...but look closer to home first.

alma73

Amia Delightful Waltz wrote: »

While I disagree with the "prosperity Gospel" I cant help think about all the riches that are found in Vatican City.
If Catholics want to slate "prosperity" preachers...fine...but look closer to home first.

Yes.. And what to you propose?

Cabaal

alma73 wrote: »

Yes.. And what to you propose?

The sell of alot of the valuable's and give to the poor?

alma73

Cabaal wrote: »

The sell of alot of the valuable's and give to the poor?

Who is going to sell what to who? La pieta is not the Popes property, it belongs to the Church. You can only sell what you own.

Benny_Cake

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg

I thought John Oliver nailed it, personally.

I don't think that these guys should be lumped in with evangelical Christians. Lots of evangelical Christians do great things, including in this country. Prosperity Gospel televangelists have a product to sell and the mansions and private jets show that they have no shortage of buyers.

Regarding the treasure of the Vatican, I do wonder what people think should be done with such art? The likely buyers would be oligarchs who would like the Pieta to go with the Premiership club. This art is part of the cultural inheritance of humanity as a whole and at least where they are they can be seen by visitors to Rome. Should they have been accumulated in the first place..probably not, but you can't rewrite history.

uck51js9zml2yt

They could sell what they have and give it to the poor. Is it right to hoard riches in vaults. Sayings its of historical value while hiding it away in vaults is a bit of a contradiction.

alma73

Amia Delightful Waltz wrote: »

They could sell what they have and give it to the poor. Is it right to hoard riches in vaults. Sayings its of historical value while hiding it away in vaults is a bit of a contradiction.

There is no "they". There is nobody that owns the fictional hoard in a vault that does not exist. If you go there you will see that anything of value is on display in the museam, which you pay to enter and which is used works of charity.

Even if the Pope could sell something he would have to break a treaty with Italy which does not allow the sale of art or treasures from the vatican.

What is of most value in the Vatican is its library. And that collection won't be sold.

The Vatican belongs to Catholics, not to any Pope or Cardinal. So they cant sell anything.

lazybones32

Cabaal wrote: »

The sell of alot of the valuable's and give to the poor?

Amia Delightful Waltz wrote: »

They could sell what they have and give it to the poor. Is it right to hoard riches in vaults. Sayings its of historical value while hiding it away in vaults is a bit of a contradiction.

Well then, lead by example and stop advising others to do what you aren't willing to do yourself. Or is that a bit too contradictory/hypocritical to ask?

lazybones32

Danye wrote: »

Flicking through the channels and I've come across "Word Network" and there is a guy / preacher asking people to ring up and donate ($1,000) money to sow a seed and this will be returned to them tenfold.

Yeah......There is a verse in Scripture that says God will repay a person tenfold for everything good they do or offer Him. These drives are usually accompanied by 'testimonies' from Joe in Arizona, or Matt in Colorado that as soon as they sowed their seed, the money started flowing in. It wouldn't surprise me if some stations/broadcast companies actually hire certain evangelists to raise the funds necessary to keep the channel on the air and pay the wages <cough>.

Danye wrote: »

This isn't the first time I've seen such programmes. How are these TV Networks, who claim to be Christian, allowed air these programmes?

And it won't be the last time you see them! I've no problem with a station asking for help to keep the station on the air. Advertising revenue isn't plentiful, so they rely on donations. However, promising a 1000% return on investment (and often setting a minimum 'seed' price) is more like a pyramid scheme. It must be technically legal under US Law because if it wasn't, you can be sure there's some lawyer who'd have taken them to the cleaners by now.

uck51js9zml2yt

lazybones32 wrote: »

Well then, lead by example and stop advising others to do what you aren't willing to do yourself. Or is that a bit too contradictory/hypocritical to ask?

You don't know what I do or don't do!
I have a biblical injunction to provide for my family.
I don't have an excess of valuable treasures sitting in musems or vaults. I also don't proscribe yo the prosperity "gospel".
The fastest way to get rich is to start a TV show.the proliferation of such channels supports the idea. ..I knew I was doing it wrong;)

Berserker

Benny_Cake wrote: »

I don't think that these guys should be lumped in with evangelical Christians. Lots of evangelical Christians do great things, including in this country.

I would agree with you on this. I have attended more than my fair share of Evangelical services in this country and I have only come across one church where reference was made to the area of prosperity. I sensed a note of caution from the worship leader when he started speaking about it, to be fair. The vast majority of Evangelical Christians here are wonderful, generous people.

The prosperity gospel is big, big business in the States and I have a strong disliking for it and the manner in which the televangelists sell their product on cable television. Mike Murdock is the worst I have come across by some distance.

antiskeptic

Danye wrote: »

How are these TV Networks, who claim to be Christian, allowed air these programmes?

They pay the subscription required to the company who hosts them. Shareholders have to be fed and for a company with satellite time to flog, this is as good as any other way.

solodeogloria

Berserker wrote: »

I would agree with you on this. I have attended more than my fair share of Evangelical services in this country and I have only come across one church where reference was made to the area of prosperity. I sensed a note of caution from the worship leader when he started speaking about it, to be fair. The vast majority of Evangelical Christians here are wonderful, generous people.

The prosperity gospel is big, big business in the States and I have a strong disliking for it and the manner in which the televangelists sell their product on cable television. Mike Murdock is the worst I have come across by some distance.

Good evening!

Sadly prosperity teaching is ravaging the church in Africa. In many large cities in Europe and in America it is also ravaging the church.

The solution is presenting what the Bible teaches about wealth and our future hope and inheritance that is secured in the death and resurrection of Jesus. The blessings we do receive in this life in Jesus also need to be fleshed out. A new spirit, a new family by adoption, forgiveness, salvation, rescue, a direct relationship with the Father, the Holy Spirit dwelling within us. The blessings are vast and many. Most are immaterial. The Bible's teaching on suffering for the Christian needs to be clearly taught and preached. 1 Peter for example presents the paradigm of suffering now for future glory. Hebrews 11 gives us examples of faith through adversity. Nothing says that we are guaranteed to be free from suffering, sadness, poverty, illness and death in this life. These things will come and we need to preach to ourselves daily through the reading of God's Word.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

looksee

Solodeogloria, what you are discussing is spiritual, the problem is very specifically earthly cynicism and greed. Those preachers have no interest in the death and resurrection of Jesus, only in the inflation of their personal bank accounts.

solodeogloria

looksee wrote: »

Solodeogloria, what you are discussing is spiritual, the problem is very specifically earthly cynicism and greed. Those preachers have no interest in the death and resurrection of Jesus, only in the inflation of their personal bank accounts.

Good evening!

I'm referring to equipping congregations to not fall for prosperity teaching rather than stopping dodgy pastors. The latter will always exist. There were false teachers around at the time of the Apostles. The question is how to avoid them and stick to the true Gospel.

That comes by discernment.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

looksee

But your solution is a bit like saying 'I have a solution to crime, everyone should be honest and deal fairly with each other'. It is arguably a solution but not one that is likely to have any effect on the criminals.

Its easy enough to give a spiritual/theological solution to dealing with corrupt preachers, but how would you propose to 'equip the congregation' to not fall for this kind of scam preaching? They have a room full of brainwashed people (or a lot of people they have rounded up for a bit of entertainment and a free feed) shouting hallelujah at every bit of spurious nonsense that the preacher shouts at them. The money comes from the people sitting in their lonely apartments and trailers with only the image of hope and prosperity that the preacher puts across.

The points you are making about bible teaching are pretty complex (I do not pretend to understand them, but they are not aimed at me ), if you were to stand in front of the same audience that the preachers are rousing up, offering your solution, do you think you would get the hallelujahs and contributions that they are achieving?

uck51js9zml2yt

The problem is that they say , you give to me, God will give to you and if you don't receive the blessing its your fault for either not giving enough or not having enough faith.
They don't take responsibility for what's happened.
They just bleed the people dry.

alma73

I have no problem giving to religious groups. However prosperity Gospel is not Christian teaching. Christ did not come to make us materially rich.

mcmoustache

alma73 wrote: »

I have no problem giving to religious groups. However prosperity Gospel is not Christian teaching. Christ did not come to make us materially rich.

But what if being materially rich allows them to reach a wider audience?