51st State

Minderbinder

In the hypothetical event that the people of Ireland were given the chance to become the 51st state of the USA, would you vote in favour or against?

What conditions would you want (if any) if you voted in favour?

kneemos

Guns in Aldi.

thattequilagirl

Minderbinder wrote: »

In the hypothetical event that the people of Ireland were given the chance to become the 51st state of the USA, would you vote in favour or against?

What conditions would you want (if any) if you voted in favour?

Against.

Europe is a much better place than the States.

Annasopra

No thanks

Berlin not Boston

Pink Fairy

That we get to have Samuel Jackson as our state governor and he has to wear Rory McIlroy's cast off golf gear

Wibbs

Against, there are enough young wans with mid atlantic accents out there already.

thattequilagirl wrote: »

Europe is a much better place than the States.

Depends which part of Europe we're speaking about. Greece is a very different country and culture to Switzerland for example. America has some great points in its favour, but yeah generally speaking I would prefer Europe.

LeinsterDub

I can't see one positive of joining the US and once you're in that's it. There is no means to exit the union.

Bubbaclaus

Jesus wept

kneemos

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Jesus wept

Couldn't blame the guy.Look what they did to him.

maudgonner

We'd have to keep our own chocolate. American chocolate is rubbish.

(And yes, I know ours is going the same way - that makes me a sad panda )

Fr_Dougal

Trump for President. Let's make Ireland great again.

Wibbs

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Berlin not Boston

This bit I don't agree with. The average Irish man or woman has far more in common with a Bostonian than they would with a Berliner. I don't want to be another province of Germany either. Oh wait…

One eyed Jack

Minderbinder wrote: »

In the hypothetical event that the people of Ireland were given the chance to become the 51st state of the USA, would you vote in favour or against?

What conditions would you want (if any) if you voted in favour?

I'd be in favour of it. I'm rather tired of the ECHR's over-reaching lately. I'd sooner live under the Federal government system in the States than Europe's half-arsed attempt at unification.

namloc1980

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I'd be in favour of it. I'm rather tired of the ECHR's over-reaching lately. I'd sooner live under the Federal government system in the States than Europe's half-arsed attempt at unification.

So why don't you go there to live?

RobertKK

US companies are fleeing to Ireland with their tax inversions to become Irish.
Americans companies would be against it :pac:

We would be the number 1 terrorist target in Europe if we were part of the USA.

We have our independence, I don't think many would want to give it up so easily, we wouldn't like our fellow Irish men and women being sent to wars as we have seen in Iraq and elsewhere with American citizens.

It is easy for Irish people once they are law abiding to enter the USA, we have strong blood links to the country and the USA is even mentioned in the 1916 proclamation of Independence.
I think it is very beneficial for both Ireland and the USA for Ireland to remain independent. We are very close allies, but we should be looking to Europe to make the Union we are in stronger - just look at terrorism, we should have a European central intelligence agency rather than individual countries looking after their own security especially with terrorism now a real problem in Europe.

We don't need to become the 51st state, our place is in Europe and we need the 28 member states of the European Union to work closely together for the benefit of all Europeans.

DanielODonnell

I don't look favourably on the American people, they are all Scotch-Irish and English lovers apart from a small band of people around Philadelphia and Boston.

My name is URL

DanielODonnell wrote: »

I don't look favourably on the American people, they are all Scotch-Irish and English lovers apart from a small band of people around Philadelphia and Boston.

I'm an Irish scotch lover. Close enough

One eyed Jack

namloc1980 wrote: »

So why don't you go there to live?

Because I have obligations and responsibilities here?

I like living in Ireland. I just don't like other European countries being able to put pressure on Ireland to get in line with European social idealism.

RobertKK

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I'd be in favour of it. I'm rather tired of the ECHR's over-reaching lately. I'd sooner live under the Federal government system in the States than Europe's half-arsed attempt at unification.

I would support a federal European Union, it would be better than what we now have. Look at the response to the migrant crisis, some European Union countries closing borders as other say you are all welcome, no common approach on serious issues.

I know a lot are against a federal Europe, but I think it would be better for all of us if we did have it as we share mostly the values across Europe, but at the top in Europe it lacks decisiveness.

The USA wins on this account, but loses with it's two party system.

Minderbinder

thattequilagirl wrote: »

Against.

Europe is a much better place than the States.

In what way? I know politically we are closer to Europe but for most people going to another European nation (apart from the UK) to live and work is not credible. For normal people Europe doesn't really offer us any opportunities. Europe is slow, lazy, dreary and old and is kind of dragging us down with it. That's just the feeling I get. The States is obviously a bit whacky and has some problems but the optimism there is really refreshing and contagious. It's an exciting place to be.

Ireland is a brilliant country but I just feel we're going in the wrong direction with Europe. I'm not saying USA is the only alternative but I just thought it was interesting to find out peoples' opinions.

jam_mac_jam

Minderbinder wrote: »

In what way? I know politically we are closer to Europe but for most people going to another European nation (apart from the UK) to live and work is not credible. For normal people Europe doesn't really offer us any opportunities. Europe is slow, lazy, dreary and old and is kind of dragging us down with it. That's just the feeling I get. The States is obviously a bit whacky and has some problems but the optimism there is really refreshing and contagious. It's an exciting place to be.

Ireland is a brilliant country but I just feel we're going in the wrong direction with Europe. I'm not saying USA is the only alternative but I just thought it was interesting to find out peoples' opinions.

How is Europe better then the US? Health care, access to education, gun control, social welfare, art, history, music, public holidays, maternity benefits, quality of life, public transport, less war, lower crime rate, better wealth distribution, police that don't shoot you.

Harry Palmr

Ireland could be the next Delaware! Full of dodgy company laws and tax evaders.

jam_mac_jam

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

How is Europe better then the US? Health care, access to education, gun control, social welfare, art, history, music, public holidays, maternity benefits, quality of life, public transport, less war, lower crime rate, better wealth distribution, police that don't shoot you.

Or your little dog too

One eyed Jack

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

How is Europe better then the US? Health care, access to education, gun control, social welfare, art, history, music, public holidays, maternity benefits, quality of life, public transport, less war, lower crime rate, better wealth distribution, police that don't shoot you.

They have all those things in the US too, including police that don't shoot you!

Paramite Pie

If Ireland (ROI) were a US state, we'd in number 25th in terms of Population. Thats crazy. I didn't realize half their states had less than 4.5 million.

But think of the problems;

Military Conscription
lack of Proportional Representation
a strong Left-Right polarization
over 21 drinking age
expensive medical care
no dole to fall back on
Triple the Banking Charges we already pay
Paid by check (at least I was in 2010)

And lastly, we'd be the new Florida for retirees with all the Irish American Elders settling here. Good for the economy but could price houses even further out of our reach. Older people, older ideas and more conservative votes.

One eyed Jack

Paramite Pie wrote: »

If Ireland (ROI) were a US state, we'd in number 25th in terms of Population. Thats crazy. I didn't realize half their states had less than 4.5 million.

But think of the problems;

Military Conscription
lack of Proportional Representation
a strong Left-Right polarization
over 21 drinking age
expensive medical care
no dole to fall back on
Triple the Banking Charges we already pay
Paid by check (at least I was in 2010)

And lastly, we'd be the new Florida for retirees with all the Irish American Elders settling here. Good for the economy but could price houses even further out of our reach. Older people, older ideas and more conservative votes.

What you've listed there is possibly every reason why some people might want to live in a 51st State, or even 25th if you will. I wouldn't live in Florida though, the climate in Georgia would be more to my liking I think...

The Backwards Man

Why would we want to become a part of another nation three thousand miles away?

Let some of their states join us if they want.

jam_mac_jam

One eyed Jack wrote: »

They have all those things in the US too, including police that don't shoot you!

No they have no legal maternity leave or benefits. One of the only developed countries in the world. I wasn't making the point that the things I listed don't exist but that they are hugely below European standards and norms and the reasonsurrounding why we would not be better off as part of US

Caoimhgh1n

I would move within 24 hours. I wouldn't be able to stand it.

Iwasfrozen

I'd be in favor, Ireland is going too far down the big government path for my liking.

jam_mac_jam

Caoimhgh1n wrote: »

I would move within 24 hours. I wouldn't be able to stand it.

Me too. I love ireland and Europe and am glad to live here.

Iwasfrozen

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

Me too. I love ireland and Europe and am glad to live here.

Umm, you'd still live in both Ireland and Europe.

Caoimhgh1n

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Umm, you'd still live in both Ireland and Europe.

It wouldn't be Ireland though.

One eyed Jack

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

No they have no legal maternity leave or benefits. One of the only developed countries in the world. I wasn't making the point that the things I listed don't exist but that they are hugely below European standards and norms and the reasonsurrounding why we would not be better off as part of US

They don't call it maternity leave, they call it family and medical leave at federal level, and each state is allowed legislate for additional benefits -

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_and_Medical_Leave_Act_of_1993

I'm obviously on the other side of the coin to you though in terms of your social and economic outlook, but there are many ways in which I think the benefits of being a State in the US would by far and above outweigh the negatives. I'm not denying there are of course negatives, but the negatives I see of attempts at closer European integration are moving more and more towards disabling us from governing ourselves.

Insect Overlord

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

No thanks

Berlin not Boston

First we take Manhattan. Then we take Berlin.

Iwasfrozen

Caoimhgh1n wrote: »

It wouldn't be Ireland though.

Would you say the same about greater European integration?

Minderbinder

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

How is Europe better then the US? Health care, access to education, gun control, social welfare, art, history, music, public holidays, maternity benefits, quality of life, public transport, less war, lower crime rate, better wealth distribution, police that don't shoot you.

Do you not think that as a nation we are too comfortable in terms of being able to rely on free stuff so we don't really have to think too much or work hard? The US has the best healthcare in the world but people here are just mortified at the though of paying for a good service. They also have many of the best Universities and they have an education system that teaches people to think, rather than ours which teaches people to remember.

I've been to the US a few times and never saw a gun or felt threatened. People there are so nice, friendly and positive in my experience.

The US have an ongoing history of military action abroad but on US soil has there been anything since the civil war?

Public transport I'm not that sure about because normally I rent a car but the subway in New York is very straightforward.

Better wealth distribution is an interesting one. I think that's where we're culturally different to the States. Their philosophy is if you try your best you get your rewards. Ours is if you try your best you get slightly more than someone who doesn't. Personally I think we're given too much for nothing and it might do us some good if we weren't so comfortable.

jam_mac_jam

Minderbinder wrote: »

Do you not think that as a nation we are too comfortable in terms of being able to rely on free stuff so we don't really have to think too much or work hard? The US has the best healthcare in the world but people here are just mortified at the though of paying for a good service. They also have many of the best Universities and they have an education system that teaches people to think, rather than ours which teaches people to remember.

I've been to the US a few times and never saw a gun or felt threatened. People there are so nice, friendly and positive in my experience.

The US have an ongoing history of military action abroad but on US soil has there been anything since the civil war?

Public transport I'm not that sure about because normally I rent a car but the subway in New York is very straightforward.

Better wealth distribution is an interesting one. I think that's where we're culturally different to the States. Their philosophy is if you try your best you get your rewards. Ours is if you try your best you get slightly more than someone who doesn't. Personally I think we're given too much for nothing and it might do us some good if we weren't so comfortable.

There are huge areas of reform needed in Europe and I don't agree with everything that happens here but I much prefer the system here. I think a lot of people in Ireland have tried their best and have been rewarded for it and have a lot more then others. Which is how it should be.

I am glad we are culturally different from the state and look after the vulnerable (maybe too much but that's an argument for another day) then one who blames people for their poverty. As my cultural ideas and priorities match that of Europe I would prefer the ideas of Europe then the US.

At least you have a chance here with access to education for all if you are from a bad background.

I don't really see how they have the best health system in the world. Plenty of countries have a much better life expectancy. The WHO lists France as the best. I don't really see how the US is that much better, I think that's a bit of myth by those in the US that doesn't want to offer it to all.

You might have felt safe in the US but that does not change the fact they have a huge crime problem in comparison with here.

No, they don't have wars on their own soil but many many wars that they fight in and waste their money on. I would rather live in a non interventionist country where I know my son is unlikely to ever have to fight.

Donald Trump

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Trump for President. Let's make Ireland great again.

Woo-hoo. I like the cut of your jib mister

My only dilemma would be which wall to build first? The one to keep the Nordies out or the one to keep the Mexicans Cork people in!

OneArt

No way in f*ck do I want to be American.

I love having an Irish passport, but I'd renounce my citizenship instantly if that happened. I'd sooner use my British then, or better yet, apply for a German one.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I'd be in favor, Ireland is going too far down the big government path for my liking.

So is the USA.

metaoblivia

I opened this thread thinking it was about Puerto Rico. :P

diomed

We didn't all pack in to the GPO to win the right to eat Oreo cookies.

Pink Fairy

diomed wrote: »

We didn't all pack in to the GPO to win the right to eat Oreo cookies.

Yeah, bratwurst and wienerschintzel all around!!!

Permabear

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