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Can the Gardai issue a summons for PSNI?

  • 14-03-2016 8:32pm
    #1
    Mackas_view
    Closed Accounts Posts: 298 ✭✭


    Was stopped for Speeding this morning in NI. The officer had no gun but based my speeding from his cars speed. He took my details (ROI) and asked me a few questions which he then asked me to sign. He said the Gardai will serve me a summons to appear in a NI court for the speeding charge. Any information is greatly appreciated


Comments

  • #2
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


  • #3
    Mackas_view
    Closed Accounts Posts: 298 ✭✭Mackas_view


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    Nope. Gardai won't be doing the PSNIs dirty work.

    You 100% sure of that?


  • #4
    BlueLass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 148 ✭✭BlueLass


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    Nope. Gardai won't be doing the PSNIs dirty work.

    If NI drivers can be summoned to court then why not other way round?? I'm assuming they may be served by post or registered post if gardai not used.


  • #5
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


  • #6
    GM228
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    The PSNI can in theory issue a summons by registered post.

    Under NI law (The Road Traffic Fixed Penalties (Enforcement of Fines) Regulations (Northern Ireland) SR 1997/344) they can only send a summons by "ordinary post", and can only be issued by a Civil Servant in the Dept of Justive (NI) or the PSNI. The Gardaí can not legally do it.


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  • #7
    matt-dublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭matt-dublin


    Don't think he can summons u for speeding anyway, he would have to ticket and have supporting evidence to show you were speeding if you decide to challange


  • #8
    Mackas_view
    Closed Accounts Posts: 298 ✭✭Mackas_view


    matt-dublin wrote: »
    Don't think he can summons u for speeding anyway, he would have to ticket and have supporting evidence to show you were speeding if you decide to challange



    He said his evidence was the speed he had to use to catch up with me although I said that I believed distance was a factor because he had to pull out from a side road and then pursue me.


  • #9
    NUTLEY BOY
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,345 ✭✭✭NUTLEY BOY


    Mackas_view wrote: »
    He said his evidence was the speed he had to use to catch up with me although I said that I believed distance was a factor because he had to pull out from a side road and then pursue me.

    Is the speedometer in the constable's car a lawfully calibrated device that is evidentially admissible as proof of your alleged speed ? I doubt it. If not, it may be a spoof to give you a fright for future reference.

    I don't know if they use averaging in N.I. i.e. your distance travelled between two fixed points, a known distance, apart divided by time. The constable does not seem to have threatened that measure of speed.

    BTW, what exactly did he ask you to sign ? Were you cautioned before you signed whatever it was ?


  • #10
    Mackas_view
    Closed Accounts Posts: 298 ✭✭Mackas_view


    NUTLEY BOY wrote: »
    Is the speedometer in the constable's car a lawfully calibrated device that is evidentially admissible as proof of your alleged speed ? I doubt it. If not, it may be a spoof to give you a fright for future reference.

    I don't know if they use averaging in N.I. i.e. your distance travelled between two fixed points, a known distance, apart divided by time. The constable does not seem to have threatened that measure of speed.

    BTW, what exactly did he ask you to sign ? Were you cautioned before you signed whatever it was ?

    Yes he asked me a few questions like where I was going, why I was going there how far away it was and he wrote down those questions and my answers then asked me to sign it.

    Yes he said he was cautioning me and gave me the speel on anything you do say may be given in evidence.


  • #11
    NUTLEY BOY
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,345 ✭✭✭NUTLEY BOY


    My attention has been drawn to this website that might give some more useful background on speed detection methods and UK law.

    Link 1 - (a general guide on speeding offences) http://www.motordefenceteam.co.uk/offence-guide/speeding.htm

    Link 2 - ( a guide on speed detection devices) http://www.motordefenceteam.co.uk/speed-cameras-guns.htm#calib

    Under link 2 see the bit about calibrated speedometers. According to this a constable can use his vehicle's speedometer evidentially providing it is a specially calibrated one and he follows other requirements.

    I don't know if this applies to N.I.

    If you get no more replies here, consider closing the thread and posting in the motoring forum as there might be some helpful ideas there too.


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  • #12
    esforum
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,420 ✭✭✭esforum


    theres an eu directive concerning this, fines can now follow most EU drivers home and be enforced however we did not sign up for the initiative and neither did the UK.

    Sadly while that allows foreign drivers to do what they like here, it does not give us the same freedom as many countries have a pay on the spot law for foreign drivers.

    In regards PSNI and Gardai, theres agreements in place for serving in the others jurisdiction but I have no knowledge of it ever happening or if it did, what the outcome was.


  • #13
    GM228
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    esforum wrote: »
    theres an eu directive concerning this, fines can now follow most EU drivers home and be enforced however we did not sign up for the initiative and neither did the UK.

    It's the EU Cross-Border Enforcement Directive 2015/413, we don't have an option to sign up or not to this directive, (we were able to opt out of the previous directive as it incorrectly came under justice/police co-operation rather than transport), this one comes under transport and we now must implement laws to enforce it, however Ireland and the UK (and also Denmark) have a deadline of 6th May 2017 to implement the directive.
    esforum wrote: »
    In regards PSNI and Gardai, theres agreements in place for serving in the others jurisdiction but I have no knowledge of it ever happening or if it did, what the outcome was.

    The Patten agreement provides for officer exchange (there were 4 week block trials involving 80 odd officers from each jurisdiction, and only once to date has an exchange taken place for 18 months involving a Garda Superintendent working for the PSNI), but there are no agreements for issuing of summons between jurisdictions.


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