Bike Cameras and Reporting Incidents

onmebike

I got a camera for the bike recently (as a present) and though I initially wasn't going to use it, I thought what the heck and I might as well have it on board for any dodgy incidents.

One thing that I'm mulling over is whether to use its footage for 'minor' infringements. For example, today on the way home I was passed by about 4 cars and a truck in one particular bus lane. The truck was the only one that really bothered me as it was a little close for comfort. Not perilously close, but closer than I'd want. In the last week I had 2 incidents where people (cars) were quite aggressive while passing me in a bus lane and unfortunately the camera let me down on both occasions (battery and lens obscured due to rain).

Does anybody have any experience of contacting the Gardaí with footage for this kind of thing? Can I just drop them the video file and say 'there you go' and they'll go off and knock on a few doors and advise people not to use bus lanes?

On one hand, I think that if lots of cyclists and drivers started doing this and Gardaí acted on it, driving behaviour might improve. On the other hand, it doesn't affect me for the most part so perhaps I should keep myself to myself.

What do you think?

Beasty

If you bother yourself reporting what are essentially daily incidents you will probably either very quickly give up on the idea, or wind the Gardaí up in a way that may do you no favours. Either way I suspect it's not going to materially influence driver behaviour.

onmebike

Beasty wrote: »

If you bother yourself reporting what are essentially daily incidents you will probably either very quickly give up on the idea, or wind the Gardaí up in a way that may do you no favours. Either way I suspect it's not going to materially influence driver behaviour.

Just because they're daily incidents doesn't make it OK though. The passive acceptance of it probably contributes to it. If people were much more reluctant to do it because of a greater risk of being caught, the number of aggressive passes would hopefully also reduce.

I do wonder how interested the Gardaí would be though.

SomeFool

onmebike wrote: »

I do wonder how interested the Gardaí would be though.

I have often thought it would be interesting if there was a way of reporting the footage to insurance companies, people are far more likely to take notice of a letter from their insurer than a call from trafficwatch.

roverrules

I'd open a YouTube account, pick a catchy username, I dunno something like bikedub. Post them up there and just go with the flow.

Might even give cycledub a few ideas on video quality, editing etc. You never know.

Kaisr Sose

My view on it is that if there is an incident the footage may be invaluable for Garda and insurance Co. In the UK I believe it has been used quite a lot — especially where there was rear and front facing footage. Having a camera should not change how you cycle though (ie not baiting drivers to get footage) and not putting videos on YouTube!!

I am getting a camera as I am sick of being treated as second class road user by impatient and discourteous motorists who think their journey is more important than mine!

I know it won't change motorist behaviour (more Policing and enforcement of laws is all that will do that) but at least there will be a record of how a moment of impatience, carelessness or whatever by a motorist can result in the loss of more than their no claims bonus!

Stay classy and be careful out there!

timmy_mallet

I've been commuting for a week and have lost track of the amount of dangerous driver behaviour I've encountered. As Beasty said, it'll more than likely be fruitless reporting everything dodgy, unless you're injured.

I've slowed down and looked in a few windows, for those that have stopped at lights or junctions after cutting me off, driving close etc etc, but they don't even know what they've done wrong, and even if you say it, you're more likely to frustrate and annoy than "re-educate".

NiallBoo

timmy_mallet wrote: »

they don't even know what they've done wrong, and even if you say it, you're more likely to frustrate and annoy than "re-educate".

I couldn't agree more. People are rarely trying to actually endanger you, most of the time they're just terrible at being aware of their surroundings.

Your second part is even more true - if you just piss people off (like cycledub), they'll get defensive and won't listen to whatever truth there is in what you're saying.

It's tempting to say strict enforcement is the answer but it's likely to annoy people so much that it wouldn't help (It also won't happen because it's political suicide).

You need to give people positive incentive to be more considerate...but how?

sconhome

Camera or no camera we should all get this emblazoned on the back of your cycle wear, it might make drivers thing twice



of course in mandatory high viz yellow background and fluorescent text

timmy_mallet

NiallBoo wrote: »

I couldn't agree more. People are rarely trying to actually endanger you, most of the time they're just terrible at being aware of their surroundings.

Your second part is even more true - if you just piss people off (like cycledub), they'll get defensive and won't listen to whatever truth there is in what you're saying.

It's tempting to say strict enforcement is the answer but it's likely to annoy people so much that it wouldn't help (It also won't happen because it's political suicide).

You need to give people positive incentive to be more considerate...but how?

Yep, there are a lot of people that find driving a real chore and it takes them a lot of effort and concentration... adding cyclists into the mix really messes with their thought process, I've seen it with the mother-in-law (to quote her; "God, that wind could blow a cyclist in front of a poor motorist"[!!!]).

For those drivers, they are genuinely worried about hitting cyclists and the damage they could cause and would prefer them off the road, or high-viz'ed, wearing body-armour, whatever.

I've found the best way is just to (non-aggressively and without emotion) talk about the facts/dangers of cycling (and cycle lanes), it's almost like an instant recognition that cyclists aren't there to annoy you and could easily be seriously injured.

But as you say, how do you get that message across to all road users, no clue?

onmebike

I phoned Garda traffic to enquire about it. The person that I was speaking with took what I was saying on board and is passing my details onto a Garda to call me and discuss it. I'll see what they have to say about it.

WAPAIC

I often thought it would be an interesting idea to get every cyclist in Ireland to report every single incident such as a dangerous pass to the Gardai for one day. I'd imagine there would be hundreds of reports for the Gardai to follow up which would be an interesting talking point at least.

My experience of reporting one or two incidents over the years is that trafficwatch is the way forward. I reported an incident to TW a year ago and have received six calls from six different Gardai so far. It was my word against his so didn't go any further but the Gardai said the complaint would be on his record (and presumably mine?) and if there was multiple complaints it might eventually add up to something. All very vague but I'm not sure what else they could do really. If I had footage, he'd probably be arrested for attempted manslaughter:)

Mec-a-nic

I've a camera but would only report the most dangerous infringements. A car drove the wrong way down a road at me to save going around an interchange on the N7 and this was reported to Traffic Watch (yaaah - doing my part!). However, there has been no action because the Garda assigned is nowhere near me, and their crazy 10-day shift pattern makes it very difficult to line up my travel with when they are in the office at the start or end of their shift so I can give evidence in person - it's a friggin', frustrating joke.

Kaisr Sose

NiallBoo wrote: »

It's tempting to say strict enforcement is the answer but it's likely to annoy people so much that it wouldn't help (It also won't happen because it's political suicide).

You need to give people positive incentive to be more considerate...but how?

I certainly hope you are wrong in that!

Why should enforcing the Road Traffic Act (to make the roads safe for all users, reduce the burden and cost on the state caused by emergency services call out/A&E staff, higher insurance premiums due to increased claims. Etc etc) be political suicide? It seems to me to be the opposite!

Why should there be any more positive incentives or carrot offered to people to simply know and obey the rules of the road, pay attention while using them and be respectful of all other road users, particularally the more vulnerable ones. The incentive or carrot should be a policy of rigorous enforcement of all breaches!

Anything less is just going to lead to more and more carnage on the roads! A red light now means keep going or speed up for many road users. Is this what we want to be tolerated so politicians can give lollipops to kids without fear of somebody tackling them because they were issued with a fixed penalty notice for careless driving or worse?

Wishbone Ash

NiallBoo wrote: »

....It's tempting to say strict enforcement is the answer but it's likely to annoy people so much that it wouldn't help (It also won't happen because it's political suicide).

You need to give people positive incentive to be more considerate...but how?

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

I certainly hope you are wrong in that!......

......The incentive or carrot should be a policy of rigorous enforcement of all breaches!...

I'd agree with NiallBoo's assertion that it's unlikely to happen. Although most people like to describe themselves as 'law abiding citizens', very few actually are (and I include myself in that). If the Gardai were to enforce every law, it would probably backfire on them by causing resentment among the public and result in a lack of co-operation in other areas where the Gardai are looking for assistance from the public.

There would also be a huge political fallout and it would be the hot topic in any general election debate. There's already resentment from most people who are caught on various more serious infringements. Imagine the uproar if the Gardai were to concentrate their efforts on all the illegal parking around churches on a Sunday morning.

dermabrasion

If some one (Garda) develops and app that sends in footage of infractions to say Trafficwatch in a format that stands-up legally. They decide if it is worth pursuing with a fixed penalty notice. This might be a nice little earner for the exchequer. I expect there are legal issues that I am unaware off. But, I am sick of observing drivers and cyclist breaking the ROTR.
As a nation, we don't challenge people for rule breaking. Probably because you likely will be told to f...k-off or worse. I rode my bike into Central Park NYC on a pedestrian path. I was immediately told "excuse me sir, you cannot ride on this path' by a senior lady. I got off.

odyssey06

A single unmarked garda car with tons of cameras could drive around Dublin \ major cities, would be like shooting fish in a barrel... random locations each day... that would change behaviour.

randomname2005

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Imagine the uproar if the Gardai were to concentrate their efforts on all the illegal parking around churches on a Sunday morning.

Or the praise because people who need to push buggies or wheel chairs would be able to go close to churches without wondering if they will be able to squeeze between the car parked on the path and the wall, or if they have to go onto the road to go past it. (/rant)