criminal record wiped clean

lightmilk

Does anyone know if this legislation to get certain crinmal records wiped clean is coming trough

GerardKeating

lightmilk wrote: »

Does anyone know if this legislation to get certain crinmal records wiped clean is coming trough

Doubt if it will happened before the next election...

MDwyer

surely this is only for under 18s or something...

L1011

MDwyer wrote: »

surely this is only for under 18s or something...

If brought in as proposed*, no. From memory it'll be certain convictions over 7 years - not sexual offences and some other exclusions mainly to do with re-offending. My brain isn't up to actually parsing the Bill currently but for anyone who is awake: http://www.oireachtas.ie/documents/bills28/bills/2012/3412/b34112s.pdf

There is existing legislation for under 18s.


*its important to note that this isn't legislation and could change hugely - or never happen.

VisibleGorilla

L1011 wrote: »

If brought in as proposed*, no. From memory it'll be certain convictions over 7 years - not sexual offences and some other exclusions mainly to do with re-offending. My brain isn't up to actually parsing the Bill currently but for anyone who is awake: http://www.oireachtas.ie/documents/bills28/bills/2012/3412/b34112s.pdf

If you look at the rate of re-offending you'll see sexual offenses have an extremely low rate of recidivism, so I doubt that is why they are excluded.

The IPRT recommendations on the bill bring it in line with the UK.

Currently Ireland is the only EU country without any legislation in this area.

NUTLEY BOY

The first time that I ever saw anything like this was the UK Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 - yes, 1974 !

Here is a link to the original act if you are interested http://www.bailii.org/uk/legis/num_act/1974/ukpga_19740053_en.html

Basically, the 1974 act provided that certain offences would be deemed to have been "spent" after a certain period following conviction. In other words when a conviction became spent the offender would be entitled to answer in the negative in relation to that conviction having ever been incurred.

Some types of offences or sentences of certain levels of severity would not come within the act. There are lots of caveats and limitations.

VisibleGorilla

Compare the current UK system with the propose Spent Convictions here and you'll see the Irish system is extremely restrictive to the point of rendering the legislation useless.

Compare it to other EU nations and you'll see it's a farce.

L1011

VisibleGorilla wrote: »

If you look at the rate of re-offending you'll see sexual offenses have an extremely low rate of recidivism, so I doubt that is why they are excluded.

Two statements - sexual offences, re-offending. Should probably have used a semi-colon.

Victor

Do note that there is this: http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=13475

MDwyer

what type of offences would manage to get through i wonder? like surely only stuff like fine convictions and that?

carzony

I feel we also need legislation enacted to 'wipe clean' people's records in regards to court appearances that were unsuccesful. Keeping a record of that and even allowing it to show up when vetted is very unfair especially when your talking about the less serious offences.

MDwyer

carzony wrote: »

I feel we also need legislation enacted to 'wipe clean' people's records in regards to court appearances that were unsuccesful. Keeping a record of that and even allowing it to show up when vetted is very unfair especially when your talking about the less serious offences.

i would agree with this

carzony

MDwyer wrote: »

i would agree with this

Hopefully legislation will be introduced in the coming years. Does anyone know if such a thing is even on the cards?

I was shocked to discover that actual convictions could not be mentioned in vetting yet court appearances could :eek: How stupid is that.

MDwyer

hold on so if a person requires garda vetting their actual convictions arent listed only say mdwyer appeared on a charge of x?

god if you were brough in the wrong over something it could ruin you so even after getting off like

carzony

MDwyer wrote: »

hold on so if a person requires garda vetting their actual convictions arent listed only say mdwyer appeared on a charge of x?

god if you were brough in the wrong over something it could ruin you so even after getting off like

Lets say a guy was brought to court over a rape allegation and the verdict came back as not guilty it would still show up as in court over rape wether innocent or not..

Kinda makes a mockery of the innocent verdict really.

FortySeven

As a reformed criminal I think the rehabilitation of offenders is paramount and the idea that convictions must be disclosed is tantamount to ensuring criminals trying to reform are unemployable when required to disclose convictions.

I myself was stuck in a situation where my conviction could never be regarded as spent under the ROA 1974 because my prison sentence was over 3 years. This meant I was legally obliged to declare I had spent years in prison to potential employers for the rest of my life. All it meant ws I had to lie, therefore break the law to gain employment.

The ROA was changed in 2012 to relax these measures and my disclosure of offences was lifted after 7 years of not collecting any convictions. This is a big step on the road to turning your life around, this idea that you can put your past behind you is part and parcel of the rehabilitation of criminals. Seems a shame that Ireland is hellbent on introducing such a draconian piece of legislation that excludes anyone who has been sentenced to 12 months or more in prison from convictions ever being spent.

carzony

FortySeven wrote: »

As a reformed criminal I think the rehabilitation of offenders is paramount and the idea that convictions must be disclosed is tantamount to ensuring criminals trying to reform are unemployable when required to disclose convictions.

I myself was stuck in a situation where my conviction could never be regarded as spent under the ROA 1974 because my prison sentence was over 3 years. This meant I was legally obliged to declare I had spent years in prison to potential employers for the rest of my life. All it meant ws I had to lie, therefore break the law to gain employment.

The ROA was changed in 2012 to relax these measures and my disclosure of offences was lifted after 7 years of not collecting any convictions. This is a big step on the road to turning your life around, this idea that you can put your past behind you is part and parcel of the rehabilitation of criminals. Seems a shame that Ireland is hellbent on introducing such a draconian piece of legislation that excludes anyone who has been sentenced to 12 months or more in prison from convictions ever being spent.

The government really seems to believe in making people with convictions suffer as much as possible I'm sure it's hard trying to move on in life. Crazy to think that any criminal court case a person may be involved in is basically branding them for life no matter the result.