cattle handling

imabitthick

im putting in a new yard in an outside farm, cattle crush and all.
loked at some stuff at the plowing match, jourdain system looked nice but maybe a bit light, i usually finish heifers, so bigish cattle and a lot on limousins.
Anyone have any experience of cattle master crushes or head gates. all help appreciated.
looking forward to upgrading from needing palletes here and there.

Thanks.

Mad4simmental

I looked at all the crush lads at the ploughing to and went with Gibiny for a head gate and scoop. It looked the strongest and the release system looked the best if you had an animal pushing or pulling while trying to release.

Miname

I'm looking at putting one of these in, should save serious time. The penning is every bit as important as the crush itself imo.

Muckit

Some job alright

Muckit

I don't like the look of those rachet spikes though..... wild one go to jump and bye bye. He should have another bar over it.

Miname

Muckit wrote: »

I don't like the look of those rachet spikes though..... wild one go to jump and bye bye. He should have another bar over it.

Not really possible as the gates are all individual and another bar would defeat the purpose by making you having to pull and pull a pin at each division. You could I suppose build a section out at each gate end but would it really be worth it?

patsy_mccabe

Mad4simmental wrote: »

I looked at all the crush lads at the ploughing to and went with Gibiny for a head gate and scoop. It looked the strongest and the release system looked the best if you had an animal pushing or pulling while trying to release.

I bought a Gibney 12' calf creep gate recently. Very well made and heavy. You wouldn't lift it on your own.

Farrell

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I bought a Gibney 12' calf creep gate recently. Very well made and heavy. You wouldn't lift it on your own.

If that's the field gate, say it at the ploughing, great job

patsy_mccabe

Farrell wrote: »

If that's the field gate, say it at the ploughing, great job

Ya, that's the one.

Zr105

Muckit wrote: »

I don't like the look of those rachet spikes though..... wild one go to jump and bye bye. He should have another bar over it.

I'd kind of agree! I don't see why no one over here is doing like the Americans do on the forcing gates, rather than just a plate over the top they have a hinged bar that sticks out a tiny bit past the end of the gate that jams against the side of the tub if cattle push back, hard to explain but if you you look up circular forcing tubs most of the American ones have them.

I looked at most of the ones at the ploughing too, thought the Ritchie stock cube set up to be a very well done compact unit!

patsy_mccabe

Muckit wrote: »

I don't like the look of those rachet spikes though..... wild one go to jump and bye bye. He should have another bar over it.

Gibney had a type of forcing pen at the ploughing too. Basically, half way down the sheeting they had the 3 side cut of a square about 2" x 2" and they pushed it out a little. The spring loaded latch on the gate just slipped into it then. No way the cattle could get caught on it. Very simple but effective.

imabitthick

that round pen is very similar to what im thinking off. Getting a quote from barrett in galway today so well see.
anyone got a cattle master crush or head gate.
any thought on nugent crushes.

i looked at the ritchie one as well. just thought it a bit light,
thanks.

Muckit

imabitthick wrote: »

that round pen is very similar to what im thinking off. Getting a quote from barrett in galway today so well see.
anyone got a cattle master crush or head gate.
any thought on nugent crushes.

i looked at the ritchie one as well. just thought it a bit light,
thanks.

Is Barrett doing circular pens? Re cattle master they are great quality but mad expensive as l priced them about two years ago. Can't remember exactly price now but remember thinking I'd have 2-3 headgates for the price of one.

oldsmokey

imabitthick wrote: »

that round pen is very similar to what im thinking off. Getting a quote from barrett in galway today so well see.
anyone got a cattle master crush or head gate.
any thought on nugent crushes.

i looked at the ritchie one as well. just thought it a bit light,
thanks.

Morris headgate is a nice bit of kit, and quietish too - can work it from behind the animal

imabitthick

barrett will make anything and mad for business. we'll see what he comes back with,
anyone any experience of nugent stuff.

MfMan

Have a head gate, good and strongly built, and needs to be. Wondering now how I managed without it.

imabitthick

is that a semi or full auto setup

imabitthick

any thoughts on a sculling gate, the scissors type of the semi automatic type?

MfMan

Bump a bit.

Am thinking of erecting a new main crush with better penning and gates. Also thinking of putting up a smaller crush on out land. Would a portable crush (e.g. link below) be sufficient for the main crush, or would it be too shaky and unstable? Would kill 2 birds at once if it would fit in both places.

http://www.odonnellengineering.ie/portable.html

larthehar

oldsmokey wrote: »

Morris headgate is a nice bit of kit, and quietish too - can work it from behind the animal

How much are the Morris gates roughly?

barnaman

over a grand

patsy_mccabe

Fine forcing pen built from blocks;

Grueller

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Fine forcing pen built from blocks;

Not worth two stockings of sh1te. I had one here that had to be pulled down to make way for a new building and I am delighted to be rid of it. For a finish it had more steel straps on it holding blocks together than plaster. Blocks have no place in any handling facility in my experience. I had block walls everywhere when I took over the home place and I am slowly getting rid of them.

Edited to say the design is fine but the materials are wrong.

Bullocks

Grueller wrote: »

Not worth two stockings of sh1te. I had one here that had to be pulled down to make way for a new building and I am delighted to be rid of it. For a finish it had more steel straps on it holding blocks together than plaster. Blocks have no place in any handling facility in my experience. I had block walls everywhere when I took over the home place and I am slowly getting rid of them.

Edited to say the design is fine but the materials are wrong.

Ah it must be your wild cattle hopping off them haha .

You're probably right in fairness though , I think a bit of steel is nearly as cheap and quicker done aswell

Bass Reeves

He has Fr heifers in the shed on cubicles, so it will either be them or Fr cows going into it. Block wall will be grand with them type of cattle. Mind you with these type of cattle you would hardly need that type of forcing pen. Some how I think he is contract rearing dairy heifers. Not sue if he ever intends to make money at it.

Tileman

I think he is milking also. I looked at another of his videos and he was liking and the electricity cut out in the middle of milking. He is a very neat farmer. I’ll give him that.

Cavanjack

He made some investment in fairness to him for a shed to hold a few heifers. Watch his videos and think they are for his own heifers.

patsy_mccabe

His videos on the full shed are worth watching. That build was as much about extra slurry storage, handling at an outfarm as it was about carrying extra stock.

Hagimalone

Grueller wrote:

Not worth two stockings of sh1te. I had one here that had to be pulled down to make way for a new building and I am delighted to be rid of it. For a finish it had more steel straps on it holding blocks together than plaster. Blocks have no place in any handling facility in my experience. I had block walls everywhere when I took over the home place and I am slowly getting rid of them.

What materials would you recommend. In process of designing crush. Is bars both sides your preferred option? I was thinking of using crash barrier on one side. I thought if both sides had bars it's hard to dose them as they have too much room, cattle being able to swing head either side.

K.G.

On the subject of handling cattle what way do ye work yer crush.its just that in ireland everyone seems to like folling up the crush with a fill line carrying out procedures and then letting them off. I prefer using the crush gate and have one man carrying out procedures one animal at 5he time.i have all my doses hanging available over the head so there is no lugging around.the other man is loading the crush.the two men are busy all the time and they are not waiting for each other as happens with filling the line.most
Dont seem to do that around here but in other countries that s how they do it

Grueller

Hagimalone wrote: »

What materials would you recommend. In process of designing crush. Is bars both sides your preferred option? I was thinking of using crash barrier on one side. I thought if both sides had bars it's hard to dose them as they have too much room, cattle being able to swing head either side.

Mass concrete wall one side and bars on the other would be my ideal. Bars both sides allow the cattle to get their heads out the far side as you said and its a pain.

Grueller

K.G. wrote: »

On the subject of handling cattle what way do ye work yer crush.its just that in ireland everyone seems to like folling up the crush with a fill line carrying out procedures and then letting them off. I prefer using the crush gate and have one man carrying out procedures one animal at 5he time.i have all my doses hanging available over the head so there is no lugging around.the other man is loading the crush.the two men are busy all the time and they are not waiting for each other as happens with filling the line.most
Dont seem to do that around here but in other countries that s how they do it

I am almost always on my own dosing cattle so find that the quickest way for me is to fill the crush and then dose. I have a good dog that actually goes into the pen and fills the chute leaving me to work away out there.

Bullocks

K.G. wrote: »

On the subject of handling cattle what way do ye work yer crush.its just that in ireland everyone seems to like folling up the crush with a fill line carrying out procedures and then letting them off. I prefer using the crush gate and have one man carrying out procedures one animal at 5he time.i have all my doses hanging available over the head so there is no lugging around.the other man is loading the crush.the two men are busy all the time and they are not waiting for each other as happens with filling the line.most
Dont seem to do that around here but in other countries that s how they do it

I usually pack the crush and dose away.
I'd love one of the chutes you'd see on you tube that they can slide a gate across, trap one animal in the front and get at her from any angle. I'd like the pulley for lifting a back leg that would help getting a calf sucking aswell without getting a kick

K.G.

Bullocks wrote: »

I usually pack the crush and dose away.
I'd love one of the chutes you'd see on you tube that they can slide a gate across, trap one animal in the front and get at her from any angle. I'd like the pulley for lifting a back leg that would help getting a calf sucking aswell without getting a kick

Have a lidl electric winch over the crush for lifting cows legs.i have a gate for the first section of crush by the front so i can open it out of the way for paring or in case an animal goes down.i also have a air line to operate a bucket plant there off the milking machine for cows after calving for biestings as it is near calving house.i have a couple of backing gates on crush which really helps us to load the crush

Bullocks

K.G. wrote: »

Have a lidl electric winch over the crush for lifting cows legs.i have a gate for the first section of crush by the front so i can open it out of the way for paring or in case an animal goes down.i also have a air line to operate a bucket plant there off the milking machine for cows after calving for biestings as it is near calving house.i have a couple of backing gates on crush which really helps us to load the crush

We have a backing gate here aswell , very hand alright . Actually have a bucket plant from when we were milking but the rubber is well perished since it was used last !
I hung a funneling gate at the back of the crush a couple of years ago and its easily the most useful gate on the farm

tanko

Bullocks wrote: »

I usually pack the crush and dose away.
I'd love one of the chutes you'd see on you tube that they can slide a gate across, trap one animal in the front and get at her from any angle. I'd like the pulley for lifting a back leg that would help getting a calf sucking aswell without getting a kick

If you keep an eye on donedeal etc you often see second hand crushes with side openings that could be put at the front of your crush, some have hoists for lifting feet also.
I find tying the cows back leg with a rope to the crush post behind her stops them from kicking the calf and you.

Mac Taylor

tanko wrote: »

If you keep an eye on donedeal etc you often see second hand crushes with side openings that could be put at the front of your crush, some have hoists for lifting feet also.
I find tying the cows back leg with a rope to the crush post behind her stops them from kicking the calf and you.

If you tie a cow across her midrif, up from her elder..... you knock the power out of the kick, all they can do is really jump. An old vet showed this to my father years ago. Use it all the time if I have to tatch a calf on or tube a cow.

Albert Johnson

Mac Taylor wrote: »

If you tie a cow across her midrif, up from her elder..... you knock the power out of the kick, all they can do is really jump. An old vet showed this to my father years ago. Use it all the time if I have to tatch a calf on or tube a cow.

+1 on this, I find tying a foot to something usually only agitates them more as they tend to fight the rope. By tying the rope around them across the back and in front of the elder you can totally incapacitate them without causing a struggle. It's the safest and easiest way in my experience, once the rope is tight they can lift a foot but have no power to kick.

Mac Taylor

Albert Johnson wrote: »

+1 on this, I find tying a foot to something usually only agitates them more as they tend to fight the rope. By tying the rope around them across the back and in front of the elder you can totally incapacitate them without causing a struggle. It's the safest and easiest way in my experience, once the rope is tight they can lift a foot but have no power to kick.

You have a much better way with words than me:D:D

Albert Johnson

Mac Taylor wrote: »

You have a much better way with words than me:D:D

I feel bad for stealing your thunder, either way knowing that particular rope trick is a great advantage when dealing with sucklers.

Jb1989

Albert Johnson wrote: »

I feel bad for stealing your thunder, either way knowing that particular rope trick is a great advantage when dealing with sucklers.

Have a wee 2 or 3 inch stick to jam along back bone under rope if extra tightness is required

Donegalforever

Mac Taylor wrote: »

If you tie a cow across her midrif, up from her elder..... you knock the power out of the kick, all they can do is really jump. An old vet showed this to my father years ago. Use it all the time if I have to tatch a calf on or tube a cow.

Don't depend on that ...
Some years ago I had (a normally very quiet cow) with mastitis and I tied her tight as you described and then went to work on her.
She lifted her leg and buried in my leg causing my leg to be blue and green for 6 weeks - never mind the considerable pain.

Mac Taylor

Donegalforever wrote: »

Don't depend on that ...
Some years ago I had (a normally very quiet cow) with mastitis and I tied her tight as you described and then went to work on her.
She lifted her leg and buried in my leg causing my leg to be blue and green for 6 weeks - never mind the considerable pain.

I hear you, the joys of dealing with animals. Fortunately, I’ve had no issue to date (probably jinked it now), I always try to be carefully around them but things happen.

Mac Taylor

Albert Johnson wrote: »

I feel bad for stealing your thunder, either way knowing that particular rope trick is a great advantage when dealing with sucklers.

I just couldn’t explain it properly.

Albert Johnson

Donegalforever wrote: »

Don't depend on that ...
Some years ago I had (a normally very quiet cow) with mastitis and I tied her tight as you described and then went to work on her.
She lifted her leg and buried in my leg causing my leg to be blue and green for 6 weeks - never mind the considerable pain.

That's unfortunate but I've used the above method with great success to date. Granted with some more spirited stock you may need to tighten the rope more than with others. I find using a narrower rope gives extra "bite" along with putting the knot at the elder and pulling up across the crush bar to allow for extra leverage.

I've used this method with great success (thus far) to milk out cow's, squeeze wild weanlings and the like. Getting a hay maker of a kick is never welcome but it's especially frustrating when you thought you were safe. I gave a dealer friend a hand to squeeze a bunch of bulls over the Xmas. There was about 30 to be done including a few right wild hoor's, we were getting on grand and were down to the last handful when I caught the tail of a big soft CHx lump. Before I could put up the tail he burst me across the thigh with a shot, it was my own fault but of all the one's there he was the last one you'd expect. It's all an ongoing learning experience really.

Sami23

Going to be starting putting up a new crush here shortly and just wondering would a 3 or 4 bar crush be the way to go.
Can anyone give me some pro's and con's for both please.
Always had a 3 bar up to now myself but a feckin weanling gave me a kick out through the bars the last day I was injecting them with Ivomec so just got me wondering.

Parishlad

Sami23 wrote: »

Going to be starting putting up a new crush here shortly and just wondering would a 3 or 4 bar crush be the way to go.
Can anyone give me some pro's and con's for both please.
Always had a 3 bar up to now myself but a feckin weanling gave me a kick out through the bars the last day I was injecting them with Ivomec so just got me wondering.

I'd definitely go four bar if you are handling small/medium sized cattle. Have four bars here to handle calves, weanlings etc.

No guarantee they won't find a way through to give you a kick though!

Sami23

Parishlad wrote: »

I'd definitely go four bar if you are handling small/medium sized cattle. Have four bars here to handle calves, weanlings etc.

No guarantee they won't find a way through to give you a kick though!

Would you also have a step/catwalk along side the 4 bar crush

Parishlad

Sami23 wrote: »

Would you also have a step/catwalk along side the 4 bar crush

I don't have one,but I did plan on putting one in but never got around to it. I manage away without it but it would be handy alright and would save having to stand on the lower bar at times when you need to reach in the odd time. However, it could be an issue having a step if an animal was to ever go down in the crush.
I thought about designing and fitting a kind of metal step of sorts that would hang off the lower bar and could be removed or folded up out of the way if needed. But I only ever got as far as thinking about it!
I can also slide out all the bars of the crush if I ever had a problem with an animal that has gone down.
Also, make sure you think about which way you like to work - left to right or right to left!

Bass Reeves

Sami23 wrote: »

Would you also have a step/catwalk along side the 4 bar crush

3 bar crush is grand if putting in a side step. Ideally any crush should be build along a mass concrete wall. There is an agreement for access on both sides at head gate for access to both side of an animal but my own choice is for it along a wall. The step is 15" high. As crush is indoor this was done by building it with blocks a 9" and 6"soap gave the desired height. Center was filled with stone and a 3-4" concrete footings area is on top of stone.

The bars are at 15"centers and this gives an overall crush height of 5'. The step allows good working height over cattle and give some protection against kicks. Best protection is injection animals during dosing on far side of body. It also give good height if using a scales

Limestone Cowboy

Sami23 wrote: »

Going to be starting putting up a new crush here shortly and just wondering would a 3 or 4 bar crush be the way to go.
Can anyone give me some pro's and con's for both please.
Always had a 3 bar up to now myself but a feckin weanling gave me a kick out through the bars the last day I was injecting them with Ivomec so just got me wondering.

If you're going to putting calves though it at any stage definitely need 4 rails. I'd agree with bass about a wall on far side of the crush too.