The best 6x9 car speakers, reasonably priced?

joujoujou

2nd hand speakers I had, just died. So have to dump them and buy a set of new ones.

I'm thinking of a set of Infinity Ref 9603iX, any better I can get for the price?

140 notes is the max I can spend on them. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

JohnBoy26

Will they be amped or will they be run off the head unit?

joujoujou

Head unit only. DEH-X3500UI, 4x50W (claimed).

And no subwoofer in a foreseeable future.

JohnBoy26

joujoujou wrote: »

Head unit only. DEH-X3500UI, 4x50W (claimed).

And no subwoofer in a foreseeable future.

4 x 50 is the max value. Those pioneers usually put out 22w rms so I'd aim for something close to that. The speakers you linked are 100 watt RMS so they will be underpowered by just powering them from the head unit alone.

Something like these will work better. The have much lower RMS power and a high sensitivity which will closer match the power of the head unit.

http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/jvc-cs-j6930

http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/speakers/alpine-sxe-6925s-6-x-9-15-x-23cm-coaxial-2-way-speaker

joujoujou

Actually, sensitivity of those Infinities is even higher (93dB/W/m vs 92dB/W/m so roughly 26%) and having bad habit to listen to heavy metal VERY loud (yes, I am deaf) makes me unsure what exactly would I choose not to be killed quickly again.

Obviously I've not enough knowledge in the whole thing, so maybe I'm wrong (and would be grateful for explanation), especially the ones you linked to are even more reasonable in terms of pricing.

JohnBoy26

joujoujou wrote: »

Actually, sensitivity of those Infinities is even higher (93dB/W/m vs 92dB/W/m so roughly 26%) and having bad habit to listen to heavy metal VERY loud (yes, I am deaf) makes me unsure what exactly would I choose not to be killed quickly again.

Obviously I've not enough knowledge in the whole thing, so maybe I'm wrong (and would be grateful for explanation), especially the ones you linked to are even more reasonable in terms of pricing.

The wattage is much higher though which will make the most difference. As for not wanting the speakers to be killed again, an underpowered speakers is more likely to be killed early rather than one that is overpowered.

The higher powered speakers you linked will sound lower on head unit power than the ones I linked. You will have to push you're head unit more to get any sort of decent volume out of them and as they will not be getting enough power they are likely to distort.

The infinities will only sound better if they are amped. This is where speakers like this come into their own.

many people falsely think that by replacing factory speakers with bigger higher power ones that they will automatically get better sound. A lot of times people are left disappointed with the results though as the factory speakers are optimized for head unit power and the replacement speakers need much more power to work efficiently.

joujoujou

Thank you. Now I'm (hopefully) less stupid than I was before.

JVCs you linked to will be purchased shortly after the payday.

MobileAudio

I would forget all about power handling and think more about how the speaker will sound and you can be sure the Infinity speaker set will sound far better then the JVC's and are a much better spec also, but they would be as they are more expensive.



The theory of damaging a speaker by driving it with too little power is myth. What damages a speaker is driving it with an amplifier beyond an amplifiers clean operating range ( driving an amp to clip ).

Think about it, if powering speakers with too little power damaged them, every time you turn your volume down low on your car head unit your speakers would blow......and we all know that is not the case.

JohnBoy26

MobileAudio wrote: »

I would forget all about power handling and think more about how the speaker will sound and you can be sure the Infinity speaker set will sound far better then the JVC's and are a much better spec also, but they would be as they are more expensive.



The theory of damaging a speaker by driving it with too little power is myth. What damages a speaker is driving it with an amplifier beyond an amplifiers clean operating range ( driving an amp to clip ).

Think about it, if powering speakers with too little power damaged them, every time you turn your volume down low on your car head unit your speakers would blow......and we all know that is not the case.

The infinities will only sound better if they are getting enough of power, which won't be from a regular head unit. I've been there done that with big speakers. They sound rubbish on head unit power.

Those infinities are a better speaker than those jvc's but they won't sound better than the jvc's running on 22 watts. They would need 60 or more watts in order to get the best out of them. Running on 22 watts they will be seriously underpowered and won't be loud, nor will the sound have any great bass or depth to it.

bmstuff

Driving speakers with too little power at higher volume will damage them. Too little power will make them work harder than they should at higher volume.

MobileAudio wrote: »

I would forget all about power
handling and think more about how the speaker will sound and you can be sure the Infinity speaker set will sound far better then the JVC's and are a much better spec also, but they would be as they are more expensive.



The theory of damaging a speaker by driving it with too little power is myth. What damages a speaker is driving it with an amplifier beyond an amplifiers clean operating range ( driving an amp to clip ).

Think about it, if powering speakers with too little power damaged them, every time you turn your volume down low on your car head unit your speakers would blow......and we all know that is not the case.

MobileAudio

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

The infinities will only sound better if they are getting enough of power, which won't be from a regular head unit. I've been there done that with big speakers. They sound rubbish on head unit power.

Those infinities are a better speaker than those jvc's but they won't sound better than the jvc's running on 22 watts. They would need 60 or more watts in order to get the best out of them. Running on 22 watts they will be seriously underpowered and won't be loud, nor will the sound have any great bass or depth to it.

bmstuff wrote: »

Driving speakers with too little power at higher volume will damage them. Too little power will make them work harder than they should at higher volume.

Ok lads.

So as an example what exactly is damaging a 100 Watt RMS speaker when you power it with 20 watts RMS from a head unit.

JohnBoy26

MobileAudio wrote: »

Ok lads.

So as an example what exactly is damaging a 100 Watt RMS speaker when you power it with 20 watts RMS from a head unit.

Bmstuff has already covered that above.

MobileAudio

Well be better not turn our volume down any more so.

bmstuff

MobileAudio wrote: »

Well be better not turn our volume down any more so.

Nobody said that
Higher volume will generate distortion as you drive the amp/radio into clipping, as a result the speakers will try to reproduce a larger range of frequencies such as low frequencies, and if this goes outside their range (typically mids/tweeters), they will get damaged.

MobileAudio

That was the point I was making a few posts above, that it isn't lack of power but a clipped signal that damages speakers.

The whole "too little power damages speakers" is misleading.

Just think the OP will be far better off with the Infinity speakers if willing to spend the extra. They will sound better even off the head unit.

JohnBoy26

MobileAudio wrote: »

That was the point I was making a few posts above, that it isn't lack of power but a clipped signal that damages speakers.

This is explained above by another poster

MobileAudio wrote: »

The whole "too little power damages speakers" is misleading.

It isn't.

MobileAudio wrote: »

Just think the OP will be far better off with the Infinity speakers if willing to spend the extra. They will sound better even off the head unit.

That's you're opinion and you're entitled to it. I wouldn't be of the same opinion though. I think those infinities are a waste of money when they aren't going to be getting sufficient power to drive them properly. The head unit won't drive them properly.

That's why I asked the op if they were going to use an amp or not. The JVC's will run much better than the infinities off head unit power, they will be louder and they will sound better.

MobileAudio

I thought that was me :-)

Turn your head unit up full whack with any speaker and they will blow, 10 watts or 1000 watts, it's not the speakers fault if it gets abused.

bmstuff

Anyway this is not the right approach. You dont choose speakers because they have more power than the headunit can provide per channel and say they would sound better because they can handle more. Any speaker in the market would have more power than any oem headunit, which.would provide 20 wrms in very best scenario.

Your 100 wrms could actually very well sound even worse than your oem ones. This has been seen many times where people bought a good set of speakers only to report they sound awful after installation.

Fact is any decent speaker should be properly amped within its specs and crossover point to get the best of them. Throwing speakers in there cause they are better than oem on paper is not a win win situation.

MobileAudio wrote: »

That was the point I was making a few posts above, that it isn't lack of power but a clipped signal that damages speakers.

The whole "too little power damages speakers" is misleading.

Just think the OP will be far better off with the Infinity speakers if willing to spend the extra. They will sound better even off the head unit.

MobileAudio

bmstuff wrote: »

Anyway this is not the right approach. You dont choose speakers because they have more power than the headunit can provide per channel and say they would sound better because they can handle more. Any speaker in the market would have more power than any oem headunit, which.would provide 20 wrms in very best scenario.

I never said people should choose speakers with more power handling, I am trying to explain that too little power does NOT destroy speakers and the RMS figure of the speaker has nothing to do with the distortion you will hear when your amplifier clips. It doesn't matter if the speaker is 20 watts rms or 100 watts rms, they will both distort at the point where the amplifier starts to clip badly. This distortion has nothing whatsoever to with with the power rating of the speaker. Unless of course you are seriously over amping a speaker but that's another issue all together.

bmstuff wrote: »

Your 100 wrms could actually very well sound even worse than your oem ones. This has been seen many times where people bought a good set of speakers only to report they sound awful after installation.

This is more then likely because these people change their speakers for a better one and are surprised that they still distort when they turn their head unit up to the same volume where it starts clipping ( comment immediately above )

That or bad installation technique.

bmstuff wrote: »

Fact is any decent speaker should be properly amped within its specs and crossover point to get the best of them. Throwing speakers in there cause they are better than oem on paper is not a win win situation.

Ideally yes but it doesn't mean a better speaker should not be installed just because you are not amping them and.... Keep in mind you may decide to fit an amplifier at a later stage.

In 25 years I have never changed a speaker for a better quality one and heard a retrograde step in sound, if people are they are buying iffy gear or installing it poorly, simple as that.

colm_mcm

off topic mobile audio - but 25 years on earth or 25 years installing audio professionally?

MobileAudio

Installing stuff for myself and professionally.

I'm just trying to explain that the too little power thing is a bit misleading and will turn people off putting something better in their cars because they will be worried they will damage their new speakers off head unit power, which if they do will be the the operators fault and not the speakers.

That and the fact that a better speaker will sound better. I'm not talking about being louder, that will depend on it's efficiency and other factors.

Imagine you are listening to four speakers on a display running off a headunit only.

Number 2,3 and 4 get progressively better ( Known OBVIOUS difference in sound quality between each speaker )

There is no way you will not hear the difference when you switch from one to the other, even off 22 watts rms from a headunit.

mik_da_man

Just to add my personal expierence.

One of my 6*9's blew in my car.
I had a voucher for Halfords so went in and picked up a set of vibe slick with 140 RMS, best 6*9 they had, and they sounded poor.

I asked in this forum and I was advised to pick a lower RMS pair as I didn't have an amp.

So I returned them and ordered a set of pioneer ones with 80 watt RMS and they sounded much better.

MobileAudio

One word explains that.

Vibe

JohnBoy26

MobileAudio wrote: »

One word explains that.

Vibe

It will be the same with any 140 watt RMS speaker, regardless of brand , when running off very little power.

JohnBoy26

MobileAudio wrote: »

Installing stuff for myself and professionally.

I'm just trying to explain that the too little power thing is a bit misleading and will turn people off putting something better in their cars because they will be worried they will damage their new speakers off head unit power, which if they do will be the the operators fault and not the speakers.

That and the fact that a better speaker will sound better. I'm not talking about being louder, that will depend on it's efficiency and other factors.

Imagine you are listening to four speakers on a display running off a headunit only.

Number 2,3 and 4 get progressively better ( Known OBVIOUS difference in sound quality between each speaker )

There is no way you will not hear the difference when you switch from one to the other, even off 22 watts rms from a headunit.

We'll the op has already stated that they listen to loud heavy metal so other factors like RMS is very relevant. None of those higher power speakers are designed to run off a regular head unit. Why do you think that many of these speakers have a min RMS requirement, usually 70 watt or above?

They are designed for being powered by an external amp. I don't know how you can come to the conclusion that higher power speakers will sound better on such low power. You will have to turn the volume up very far to get anything out of them and even then they won't sound great.

A lower powered speaker is much better in this situation. They will be louder and they will sound better because they are running much closer to their optimal operational power compared to a higher powered speaker in the same situation.

MobileAudio

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

We'll the op has already stated that they listen to loud heavy metal so other factors like RMS is very relevant. None of those higher power speakers are designed to run off a regular head unit. Why do you think that many of these speakers have a min RMS requirement, usually 70 watt or above?

Which car speakers have a minimum RMS ? I'm curious

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

They are designed for being powered by an external amp. I don't know how you can come to the conclusion that higher power speakers will sound better on such low power. You will have to turn the volume up very far to get anything out of them and even then they won't sound great.

The majority of car speakers are powered from a head unit so for manufacturers to make them specifically for amplified applications would be, well daft. Yes some will have higher power handling to accept amplification of different values but in general they will have enough efficiency to run from head unit power.

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

A lower powered speaker is much better in this situation. They will be louder and they will sound better because they are running much closer to their optimal operational power compared to a higher powered speaker in the same situation.

Power handling has nothing to do with how loud a speaker will sound, the power being applied and the speakers efficiency will determine that.

As for the sound better argument it doesn't add up. A 100 watt RMS high quality speaker with say a really smooth sounding silk dome 1" tweeter is going to sound a lot nicer than a 40 watt RMS speaker with a plastic harsh sounding 20mm tweeter when both powered from a head unit..NO ?

bmstuff

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

It will be the same with any 140 watt RMS speaker, regardless of brand , when running off very little power.

Yeah agreed, but Vibe speakers is really pushing it. Amped or not, they would still sound awful. That was MobileAudio point in this previous post of his.