Car Tax Budget 2016

e92335i

My car tax is due, €1494 for the year (3 litre 2007).
Any word on potential budget shift on the car tax?

I’d kick myself if there was some very unlikely radical change like best case Co2/Cc for pre 08 cars (mine would fall into €1200 on the Co2 system), or god forbid a reduction on the lunatic pricing on anything other than a 2008+ diesel.
Then I’d kick myself even more if they upped it again.

fancy pigeon

As always I'm expecting a hike of some sorts, be it fuel or tax

ironclaw

How long is a piece of string. No one can say for any certainty, its up to the budget day that's in it. Personally I'd say no change will come into effect on the disc cost. The cost is saturated and the market won't bear much more IMO. Tax compliance is bad at best, if they up'd the pre-2008 rates then it would be even less as those on the cusp would probably take the chance by not paying.

I could however see an alignment between the post-2008 system and the pre-2008 system. There is a strong desire to get older cars off the road and the 'gravy train' of cheap tax on the post-2008 has to come to a stop. The pre-2008 cars add a fair amount to the coffers in comparison to the post-2008 i.e. In some cases you'd need two post-2008 cars to make up the same tax income as a pre-2008 car. With that in mind and with pre-2008 cars now getting older / hard to insure i.e. Less of them on the road, the shortfall will need to be made up somewhere with the current post-2008 rates.

If anything, I can see the tax disc remaining the same but fuel getting a nice addition.

mik_da_man

The CC rate have not gone up the last few years so may be due a small hike.
I taxed mine for the year last week just in case.

I can't see it coming down anyway.

ironclaw

mik_da_man wrote: »

The CC rate have not gone up the last few years so may be due a small hike.
I taxed mine for the year last week just in case.

I can't see it coming down anyway.

Given the countries growth and inflation rates, economically it can't come down. Only way is up

kirving

The VW issue has really juse confirmed in writing what the birds in the trees already knew - "environmentally friendly", low tax cars are feck all better for the environment in real world driving than their predecessors.

Unfortunately though, I can't see any aligning of the pre/post 08 tax rates by the government, because ultimately they're not concerned about the environment one bit, and fold due to pressure from SIMI and the likes.

CiniO

e92335i wrote: »

My car tax is due, €1494 for the year (3 litre 2007).
Any word on potential budget shift on the car tax?

I’d kick myself if there was some very unlikely radical change like best case Co2/Cc for pre 08 cars (mine would fall into €1200 on the Co2 system), or god forbid a reduction on the lunatic pricing on anything other than a 2008+ diesel.
Then I’d kick myself even more if they upped it again.

Just follow when budget is being announced, and if tax hike is announced, just tax your car online there and then at old rates.
If reduction is announced, wait until it comes in force.

duffman3833

i heard fuel is gonna go up but don't think car tax is this year. I could be wrong. Wish they would just think for once that most of the country cant afford 08+ cars and are stuck paying the higher tax

_Kaiser_

I don't think they'll mess with it this year, not with an election just around the corner.

If the people of this country are indeed bought off (with their own money!) and re-elect Kenny's lot though, it won't surprise me to see a post-1916 celebrations "Spring Statement" where they announce a whole raft of new charges including the previously floated Broadcast Tax and mandatory Health Insurance (neither of which have gone away, just shelved because of the Irish Water debacle)

bmstuff

mik_da_man wrote: »

The CC rate have not gone up the last few years so may be due a small hike.
I taxed mine for the year last week just in case.

I can't see it coming down anyway.

Of course it has gone up, 2 increases at least.
I am at 1809 euros now, went up last year or 2 years ago
That would really really upset me if it was going to go further up again
Not like our wages went up every year...

bigroad

At this stage of the game a lot of people can afford 08+ cars and next year even more.
They must be loosing out on these by now compared to the old system.
The difference will have to be made up in some way.

mik_da_man

bmstuff wrote: »

Of course it has gone up, 2 increases at least.
I am at 1809 euros now, went up last year or 2 years ago
That would really really upset me if it was going to go further up again
Not like our wages went up every year...

Rates have been the same since at least 2013, mine is 1809 too and hasn't risen since I've had the car.

mik_da_man

mik_da_man wrote: »

Rates have been the same since at least 2013, mine is 1809 too and hasn't risen since I've had the car.

Yeah, 2011 was 1,566 , 2012 was 1,683.
2013 was 1,809 and is still the same

Atlantic Dawn

Won't be going down, that's for sure, if it was me I would tax is as early as you can to get it at current rate.

Eric Cartman

mik_da_man wrote: »

Rates have been the same since at least 2013, mine is 1809 too and hasn't risen since I've had the car.

theres some very timid rumours that suggest that could be moved to 2k , but I really hope it'll just be left alone, its already a struggle to justify it to myself.

Alanstrainor

I hadn't even considered that pre-08 tax would change at all... surely that's not a huge concern for them? 1080 is too much as is

Eric Cartman

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I hadn't even considered that pre-08 tax would change at all... surely that's not a huge concern for them? 1080 is too much as is

anything to sell more new cars and give people the "were back baby" feeling. Id be expecting some sort of grant or something to encourage more building or doing up the gaff too.

Truckermal

I only taxed mine the other day for 3 months for a eye watering 422 quid and 30 Euro of petrol lasts nearly a fortnight. .

Voodoomelon

Same boat, my €1809 is up at the end of the month. Definitely doing it this week, no way it's coming down.

e92335i

CiniO wrote: »

Just follow when budget is being announced, and if tax hike is announced, just tax your car online there and then at old rates.
If reduction is announced, wait until it comes in force.

How quickly do any changes come into effect? Next day or something like that?

CiniO

e92335i wrote: »

How quickly do any changes come into effect? Next day or something like that?

I think that was the case with last motortax rates change in 2013 budget.
Once budget was announced, price hike was effective from next working day.
But that still leaves whole evening to tax it at old rates online.

Titzon Toast

I hate the fact that it's so expensive to tax big engined cars in this country.
My pal in Kent has 5 litre M5 for the weekends only, he pays £110 every six months and still complains!

Supergurrier

Titzon Toast wrote: »

I hate the fact that it's so expensive to tax big engined cars in this country.
My pal in Kent has 5 litre M5 for the weekends only, he pays £110 every six months and still complains!

Says it all really

bear1

I have never been able to figure out why we have such extortionate rates, is there any sort of logic to it? Besides shafting the living ****e out of anyone who'd rather have a 3.0 than a 1.2 TDI.

delahuntv

Titzon Toast wrote: »

I hate the fact that it's so expensive to tax big engined cars in this country.
My pal in Kent has 5 litre M5 for the weekends only, he pays £110 every six months and still complains!

And he pays quite a bit more for fuel - and traffic in south east uk make a friday on the m50 seem easy

bazz26

I always thought the increased motor tax rates announced in the budget come into force from Jan 1st? I remember people racing to tax their car before Dec 31st to get the old pre budget rates.

CiniO

bazz26 wrote: »

I always thought the increased motor tax rates announced in the budget come into force from Jan 1st? I remember people racing to tax their car before Dec 31st to get the old pre budget rates.

That wasn't the case last time when rates changed in December 2012 announcement of budget 2013.
New rates came in force next day.

bazz26

That may have been because it was a December budget rather than the traditional October one.

bazz26

CiniO wrote: »

That wasn't the case last time when rates changed in December 2012 announcement of budget 2013.
New rates came in force next day.

Actually taken from here:

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/budget_2013.html#motortaxes

Motor Tax
Motor Tax rates across all categories apart from electric cars will increase with effect from 1 January 2013. There is a revised structure for vehicles taxed on the basis of CO2 emissions. Increases are being applied to motor tax rates for all other categories of vehicle also. There is a higher rate of increase in motor tax for cars taxed on the basis of CO2.

BMJD

bear1 wrote: »

I have never been able to figure out why we have such extortionate rates, is there any sort of logic to it? Besides shafting the living ****e out of anyone who'd rather have a 3.0 than a 1.2 TDI.

The logic is that you aren't allowed have nice things!

Cee-Jay-Cee

bear1 wrote: »

I have never been able to figure out why we have such extortionate rates, is there any sort of logic to it? Besides shafting the living ****e out of anyone who'd rather have a 3.0 than a 1.2 TDI.

Because there is actually no one in government with the remotest shred of intelligence that could implement a fair system.

I have a 2005 car and pay €710 a year. I would have no problem if the people with brand new 2.0L cars had to pay the same amount rather than ridiculous sub €200 tax figures!

Leave petrol/diesel costs alone and increase the tax on cars of people who can afford it, ie those able to buy new cars!

Marty McFly

I Fecking hate paying it.


Mine is due the end of the month hate knowing I will have paid out 4500 on tax in 3 years.

CiniO

bazz26 wrote: »

Actually taken from here:

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/budget_2013.html#motortaxes

Motor Tax
Motor Tax rates across all categories apart from electric cars will increase with effect from 1 January 2013. There is a revised structure for vehicles taxed on the basis of CO2 emissions. Increases are being applied to motor tax rates for all other categories of vehicle also. There is a higher rate of increase in motor tax for cars taxed on the basis of CO2.

Hmmm, I definitely remembered in came in force straight away.
Looked at it more through now.
Budget was announced on December 5th 2012.
If your tax was expired for December (f.e. expired 30th November or earlier) you could still pay it at old rates if paid by the end of December.
But if your tax was valid until end of Decmber, and due from 1st January 2013, even if you paid it on 6th December just a day after budget announcement, it would already be calculated at increased rates.

Have a look here from post #438
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056824688&page=30

MuppetCheck

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

Because there is actually no one in government with the remotest shred of intelligence that could implement a fair system.

I have a 2005 car and pay €710 a year. I would have no problem if the people with brand new 2.0L cars had to pay the same amount rather than ridiculous sub €200 tax figures!

Leave petrol/diesel costs alone and increase the tax on cars of people who can afford it, ie those able to buy new cars!

What about the VRT paid by people who bought the new cars? Thats another tax. Why should people with newer cars have the rates increased hugely? The knock on would put the motor trade on the brink again as values collapse. That's not a fair system in the same way the current one isn't a fair system. That's simply the old "let someone else pay" line as it suits you to have a reduction. It's not as if the motor tax rates were an unknown when the car was bought. It was a conscious decision afterall. And I would imagine there are plenty of high earners running older metal and vice versa, meaning reductions there effectively let them off on tax.

It's funny when people complain about high tax rates on their cars post-purchase. The rates are a joke but there are other options if people can't afford it after all. Higher tax cars tend to be cheaper to buy but people want it all their own way. Never going to happen like that.

The best systems would be a pay as you go one on fuel. Pay for what you use makes the most sense. It would significantly increase my tax spend as I do more than average miles but despite this I can see it as the fairest system as opposed to protecting my own interests.

mik_da_man

Nothing leaked about it, hopefully no increase anyway

drunkmonkey

mik_da_man wrote: »

Nothing leaked about it, hopefully no increase anyway

You'd have to wonder is it worth paying anymore, surely none of us would rack up €1500/€2000 in fines a year.
Nothing can really happen you besides some fines, time for a boycott anyone?

Toyotafanboi

drunkmonkey wrote: »

You'd have to wonder is it worth paying anymore, surely none of us would rack up €1500/€2000 in fines a year.
Nothing can really happen you besides some fines, time for a boycott anyone?

I done that for a good while when I was a broke student. I don't know if it's still the same now, but it was a €60 fine and no points, so using the old 3 months on, 3 months off method on a 2.0d car if you got caught less than once a month, you could be saving €400 a year. I only got stopped once ever and commuted daily on the motorway.

Toyotafanboi

In a counter arguement, i hope they don't bring the CC rates in line with the Co2 rates (I know that will never happen). My old 1.8 petrol emits 199g/km and is €636 on the CC system, it'd be €1200 on the Co2 system :pac:

kirving

Same here actually, I'd pay more on a CO2 assessment of my car.

I believe the higher output per km is a result of it being a FlexiFuel engine though, which has to be tuned to accommodate a very wide range of fuel. On Bioethanol, it's actually carbon neutral though.

Recognising this, E85 was taxed less than petrol, and the cars even had a VRT rebate as far as I know. But that wouldn't last for long, FF did a complete u-turn removed the cost incentive - and subsequently the environmental benefit too in search of more revenue from fuel.

http://www.theaa.ie/blog/so-long-ethanol/

Voodoomelon

drunkmonkey wrote: »

You'd have to wonder is it worth paying anymore, surely none of us would rack up €1500/€2000 in fines a year.
Nothing can really happen you besides some fines, time for a boycott anyone?

Before the off the road declarations came in, you could be stopped and fined 39 times a year and it would still be cheaper than paying the top CO2 rate of €2350.

Atlantic Dawn

mik_da_man wrote: »

Nothing leaked about it, hopefully no increase anyway

I remember 1 year there was nothing in the main speech but it was slipped in.

bear1

MuppetCheck wrote: »

What about the VRT paid by people who bought the new cars? Thats another tax. Why should people with newer cars have the rates increased hugely? The knock on would put the motor trade on the brink again as values collapse. That's not a fair system in the same way the current one isn't a fair system. That's simply the old "let someone else pay" line as it suits you to have a reduction. It's not as if the motor tax rates were an unknown when the car was bought. It was a conscious decision afterall. And I would imagine there are plenty of high earners running older metal and vice versa, meaning reductions there effectively let them off on tax.

It's funny when people complain about high tax rates on their cars post-purchase. The rates are a joke but there are other options if people can't afford it after all. Higher tax cars tend to be cheaper to buy but people want it all their own way. Never going to happen like that.

The best systems would be a pay as you go one on fuel. Pay for what you use makes the most sense. It would significantly increase my tax spend as I do more than average miles but despite this I can see it as the fairest system as opposed to protecting my own interests.

This is what I'd prefer too. You may end up paying more but if you are then able to drive whatever sized car you want without being choked to the hills with tax then I'd be all for it and it would be worth it.

Chris_Heilong

Most of us in Ireland are already paying more than 52% of our wages as income tax(including PRSI and Universal Social Charge), that is sickening enough even before we start paying motor tax, motor tax on fuel is the only system I would approve of, it will hurt a few yes but would be a step in the right direction.

R.O.R

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

Most of us in Ireland are already paying more than 52% of our wages as income tax(including PRSI and Universal Social Charge), that is sickening enough even before we start paying motor tax, motor tax on fuel is the only system I would approve of, it will hurt a few yes but would be a step in the right direction.

You do realise that over 60% of the price of a Litre of fuel is already tax, so those who drive further (and therefore use more fuel) are already funding those who don't drive that much?

Road tax is more or less an elective tax - you can choose a car that fits how much road tax you are willing to pay to the Government. There's no such option on fuel unfortunately.

Chris_Heilong

R.O.R wrote: »

You do realise that over 60% of the price of a Litre of fuel is already tax, so those who drive further (and therefore use more fuel) are already funding those who don't drive that much?

Road tax is more or less an elective tax - you can choose a car that fits how much road tax you are willing to pay to the Government. There's no such option on fuel unfortunately.

Yeah, I do realise that and moral of the story is the government is getting too much tax but adding to the price of fuel will help promote a fairer system and seems the only way to remove the current broken 2 tier system.

CiniO

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

Most of us in Ireland are already paying more than 52% of our wages as income tax(including PRSI and Universal Social Charge), that is sickening enough .

Oh come on.
Average salary is probably in region of 35k (and that's only average - so doens't tell us much). Median is even lower, so that means that most don't even exceed threshold for higher income tax range.
And those who do exceed the threshold, in majority exceed is only by small bit, so only this small bit is taxed at 51%.

It's only vast minority of workers who acutally pay 51% on most of their income.

R.O.R

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

Yeah, I do realise that and moral of the story is the government is getting too much tax but adding to the price of fuel will help promote a fairer system and seems the only way to remove the current broken 2 tier system.

Why is it a broken system? It's 2 tier as a line had to be drawn in the sand somewhere.

If you don't want to pay a high amount of Road Tax, don't. If you need a car to get around, then buy one with cheap tax. Might not be what you want to drive, but if you want to drive something with a large petrol engine then you're going to have to pay for the privilege.

Chris_Heilong

Noonan is just on now saying he is reducing the USC.

Cupra280

Just announced, only tax increase in this Budget is the 50 cent rise on a pack of twenty cigarettes.

Chris_Heilong

R.O.R wrote: »

Why is it a broken system? It's 2 tier as a line had to be drawn in the sand somewhere.

If you don't want to pay a high amount of Road Tax, don't. If you need a car to get around, then buy one with cheap tax. Might not be what you want to drive, but if you want to drive something with a large petrol engine then you're going to have to pay for the privilege.

Even the government knows its broken as they are not getting enough of a yeld from post 2008 cars as they need, everyone knows that, it was a stupid system dreamt up by the green party without any foresight about how it would effect tax take in the future. You seem happy with the current system I take it?

traco

bear1 wrote: »

This is what I'd prefer too. You may end up paying more but if you are then able to drive whatever sized car you want without being choked to the hills with tax then I'd be all for it and it would be worth it.

The problem with that is that it makes sense and is the correct way to do it;
use more = pay more,
pollute more = pay more,
ticks every box in a completely fair and unbiased manner.

Now the problem from my limited knowledge with the above methid is that it would impact how inflation is calculated as fuel and transport make up a significant amount (over 30%) of the inflation basket and they don't want that to be going mad.

So logic and fairness has nothing to with it - its all about massaging fugures to make them look nice.