New low-cost Dart expansion plan suggested by NTA

monument

From the NTA:

https://www.nationaltransport.ie/news/lower-cost-re-design-of-dart-underground-project-proposed/

The National Transport Authority has carried out a review of the key transport infrastructure projects that were proposed to support the growth of the Greater Dublin Region. The Authority has now recommended to the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport that the DART Underground project be re-examined in order to deliver the required rail connectivity in the capital city with a lower cost technical solution.

DART Underground is a rail link proposal, predominately underground, from the Northern Line just north of Connolly Station, to Inchicore on the Kildare Line, and with stations proposed at Docklands, Pearse, St. Stephen’s Green, Christchurch, Heuston and Inchicore. The project received planning consent in 2011, which became operative in March 2014 following judicial review proceedings taken by a number of third parties.

The estimated cost of the currently designed DART Underground Project is €3 billion and the cost of the currently envisaged DART Expansion Programme is €4 billion. The DART Expansion Programme comprises DART Underground, as outlined above, plus:

Electrification of the Northern Line to Drogheda;
Electrification of the Cork Line from Heuston to Hazelhatch and completion of 4 tracking from Park West to Inchicore;
Electrification of the Sligo Line from Connolly to Maynooth, together with removal of level crossings and re-signalling; and
Expansion of fleet and depot facilities.
The DART Expansion Programme remains a key project in the delivery of an integrated rail transport network for the Dublin region. The overall DART Expansion Programme has been assessed as a positive project from an economic perspective. While the DART Underground Project has received planning approval from An Bord Pleanála, the business case for that project, prepared by Iarnród Éireann, indicates that its development alone under the current railway order is not economically justified.

Given the very significant cost of the DART Expansion Programme, and recognising that a lower cost alternative for the tunnel element is possible, it is intended that the CPO for the DART Underground Project is not activated and that a new Railway Order is sought for a lower cost revised scheme.
The Authority has recommended the following:

That the compulsory acquisition powers of the approved railway order for the DART Underground Project are not activated – i.e. the “notices to treat” are not issued;

That the DART Underground Project is redesigned to provide a lower cost technical solution for the project, whilst retaining the required rail connectivity;
That a new railway order is sought for the revised, lower cost DART Underground Project, together with any remaining elements of the overall DART Expansion Programme which have not already been approved under separate approval processes;

That the design and planning work of the revised DART Underground Project is advanced in order to be available for commencement of construction after 2020; and

That the non-tunnelled elements of the DART Expansion Programme be progressed in line with available funding.
The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport has indicated that the forthcoming Capital Investment Plan will make provision for advancing this expansion programme.

Carawaystick

It's some can kicking to have the DU planned to happen not after this election but after the next one too....

cgcsb

They actually seriously done a cost benefit of analysis of the tunneled section alone and found it uneconomic. Well I'm sorry now but that's just daft, obviously a DART line from Heuston to Clontarf road with turnaround facility is uneconomic, mother of jaysus.

hmmm

What's the "Lower cost alternative" that they talk about?

cgcsb

hmmm wrote: »

What's the "Lower cost alternative" that they talk about?

lol

ClovenHoof

cgcsb wrote: »

lol

Jesus Wept.

thomasj

The business plan from the NTA linked earlier in the thread contain plans (if the dart expansion plan goes ahead for

Will contain the following services

- Drogheda Inchicore (DART)
- Balbriggan Hazelhatch (DART)
- Clongriffin Hazelhatch (DART)

- Dundalk GCD (Commuter)*
Dundalk trains will no longer stop at portmarnock or howth junction

- Howth Howth Junction (DART shuttle)


- Maynooth Bray (DART)
- Maynooth Greystones (DART)
- Maynooth GCD (Commuter)
- Longford GCD (Commuter)
- M3 Parkway Clonsilla (Commuter shuttle)

- Newbridge Heuston* (Commuter)
- Portlaoise Heuston* (Commuter)
* both these services will no longer stop between Heuston and Hazelhatch

Both intercity and ESE services will not change from these plans

Banjoxed

thomasj wrote: »

The business plan from the NTA linked earlier in the thread contain plans (if the dart expansion plan goes ahead for

Will contain the following services

- Drogheda Inchicore (DART)
- Balbriggan Hazelhatch (DART)
- Clongriffin Hazelhatch (DART)

- Dundalk GCD (Commuter)*
Dundalk trains will no longer stop at portmarnock or howth junction

- Howth Howth Junction (DART shuttle)


- Maynooth Bray (DART)
- Maynooth Greystones (DART)
- Maynooth GCD (Commuter)
- Longford GCD (Commuter)
- M3 Parkway Clonsilla (Commuter shuttle)

- Newbridge Heuston* (Commuter)
- Portlaoise Heuston* (Commuter)
* both these services will no longer stop between Heuston and Hazelhatch

Both intercity and ESE services will not change from these plans

So basically, another bloody brochure that will never be implemented either in full or on any reasonable timescale.

Still, it's nice filler for lazy journalists.

thomasj

hmmm wrote: »

What's the "Lower cost alternative" that they talk about?

They are looking at ways to cut the cost of the tunneling. Examples they gave included the tunnel going direct from Heuston to pearse, the tunnel only go to Heuston as opposed to inchicore or cut back stations (the example they gave only had Stephens green)

Banjoxed

Carawaystick wrote: »

It's some can kicking to have the DU planned to happen not after this election but after the next one too....

Ten years lead time is code for Never. Another cabinet will want to get the crayons and flipcharts out and play the Two Marys Gambit.

Big props to Mary Harney and Mary O'Rourke for giving the Two Marys Gambit to public life as a classic misdirection tactic. The Civil Service love the do nothing option and this dresses it up better than any other tactic.

carlmango11

cgcsb wrote: »

lol

Really? Doesn't this leave the capacity issues at Connolly? Which (I thought) was one of the main points holding rail expansion back?

the dark phantom

The Irish Way always wins out in the end.

cgcsb

carlmango11 wrote: »

Really? Doesn't this leave the capacity issues at Connolly? Which (I thought) was one of the main points holding rail expansion back?

It defeats the purpose entirely and simply replicates the same job that the 145 bus and red luas already do. No relief for the loop line or Connolly.

The money would be better spent closing Bachelors walk to cars to improve bus journey times.

Tarabuses

I'm afraid those in charge of transport planning are clueless.

LXFlyer

Tarabuses wrote: »

I'm afraid those in charge of transport planning are clueless.

I am not sure that the planners are clueless.


It's the politicians who make the final decision that don't understand what is required.

Van.Bosch

lxflyer wrote: »

I am not sure that the planners are clueless.


It's the politicians who make the final decision that don't understand what is required.

I agree, if you read the reports put forward by the NTA they are very detailed and appear as if they cover all options. They clearly believed in DU, MN etc and presented these ideas to the minister. The department then rejected DU and said make it cheaper, so i dont think the issue is that the planners are clueless its just that they arent in power.

Idbatterim

ok guys, so the spin is, that DU was planned in a different time, i.e. when we were booming, I am not sure what they reckon us having the quickest growing economy in Europe at present is, although granted, growth isn't at boom levels. It will be interesting to see, if something fit for purpose can be provided, that is at a significant saving to the current DU plans that we know. 3 billion is a colossal figure for politicians to get their head around in this country, as simply if built, it will be the biggest infrastructure project in the history of the state and I would imagine that will be the case for god knows how long into the future...

As a taxpayer, if they can build something fit for purpose, for 1-1.5 billion less, I am all for it...

cgcsb

Idbatterim, there is no scope for penny pinching on this one I'm afraid. The 'alternatives' in the NTA slide show are just lines on a map they aren't a serious practical alternative.

loyatemu

why exactly can't we sell bonds to the ECB (as part of their €1T+ quantitative easing program) to fund DU and other infrastructural improvements? Isn't that the point of QE?

cgcsb

I'd imagine it's more politics than money. You have opposition from rural Ireland and opposition from bar stool transport planners in the Irish Times/Indo(same thing) and you have opposition from the taxi industry and the likes of O'Carrolls gift shop.

loyatemu

cgcsb wrote: »

I'd imagine it's more politics than money. You have opposition from rural Ireland and opposition from bar stool transport planners in the Irish Times/Indo(same thing) and you have opposition from the taxi industry and the likes of O'Carrolls gift shop.

considering the project has been on the cards for years and has planning permission, the time for opposition has passed. Serious bottle job from the govt.

cgcsb

it's politics though. I'd be impressed if we got metro north in spite of the callers to Joe Duffy

Idbatterim

it's politics though. I'd be impressed if we got metro north in spite of the callers to Joe Duffy

I can only imagine! if they get us MN and get DU going in a few years Ill be happy, I think to give the go ahead, in an election year, for 2 big projects is possibly politically too much for them. Get one in, at under the 2 billion mark and once re-election is secured, to hell with being popular, you don't have to worry about that again, for another 5 years...