Billy Walsh quits ** SEE MOD WARNING #643 BEFORE POSTING

Joe_ Public

In an ideal world the relationship between stakeholders - in this case IABA, HP unit and Sports Council - would be symbiotic and mutually enriching. Obviously this isn't and has never been the case. The ISC employs a HP facilitator, a guy who theoretically exists to act as a buffer between the sides, smoothing out any rough edges. Think a new guy came in after London, cant think of his name, but the reality is he's probably seen inside the Stadium as Billy Walsh's man and any attempted input from the ISC only exacerbates already existing tensions. For all the guidelines and rules in place, the ISC's role is complex and has to be strategically played. I'm not so certain these veiled threats about funding will cut much ice at the top end of the association. Could be wrong but just a guess!

Birdie Num Num

hinault wrote: »

Perhaps it is.

However, it is clear that the public cannot rely upon the IABA in relation it's bona fides concerning employment contracts. That much is crystal clear.

The IABA are derelict in their responsibilities for employment contracts, what other areas are they also derelict in?

Public money should be with held from IABA until trust and transparency can be re-established.

You perhaps know more about the situation than I do. I know nothing about it as I have not been involved and only those that are involved do know. A point that I omitted in my original post is that there have been far more serious issues when it comes to the use of public money (and not just in sport). How vocal was the ISC regarding funding to soccer when John Delaney "borrowed" €5 million from Sepp Blatter for example? Soccer's Core Grant funding dwarfs that given to Amateur Boxing. Clearly something is not right and needs to be fixed but to cut funding to an organisation is cutting funding to the boxers themselves. The ISC haven't sounded professional either in the little I have heard from them. BTW I have no allegiance to boxing.

Also, if the ISC do cut funding and Irish Boxing goes into decline are we to blame the exit of Billy Walsh or the lack of funding?

Ctrl Alt Delete

pac_man wrote: »

Just because it doesn't hit the pockets of the boxers directly, doesn't necessarily mean it won't affect them.

No more or less than the situation and governance issues with IABA however.

In fact, because ISC where fairly explicit in saying the funding cut would be regarding the IABA administration and not the athletes themselves, if the funding cut did affect the athletes then it's proof of mis-management of the IABA in itself.

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

How vocal was the ISC regarding funding to soccer when John Delaney "borrowed" €5 million from Sepp Blatter for example? Soccer's Core Grant funding dwarfs that given to Amateur Boxing.

Very bad example for two reasons. First, FAI were brought in front of the Public Accounts Committee over it (with no issues found) and secondly, it was a financial "loan" in effect (regardless of terms and conditions attached by FIFA) so it wasn't the FAI giving away €5 million.

Deise Vu

My tuppence worth:

Unless The IABA come out an explain what couldn't be agreed it will be seen that they drove out a good man for petty grievances.

All the boxers I heard or read interviewed (Bernard Dunne, Paddy Barnes,Phil Sutcliffe) paid tribute to Billy Walsh and then basically said 'move on'. We have been down this road before when Gary Keegan left.

People who say of course Paddy Barnes would be less than gutted about Billy leaving because he had issues with him are making the perfect argument NOT to let one man have total say over team selection.

Selecting a boxing team is absolutely not the same as Joe Schmidt or Martin O'Neill selecting their team. If they have a useless prop or goalkeeper foisted on them it fatally undermines the entire team. Boxers fight individually. If they go to the Olympics on their own or with a dose of incompetent team-mates it wouldn't effect their chances one bit.

Billy Walsh's nephew is on the HP team. He is there on merit. I think it helps Billy that Dean's selection was ratified independently. No?

Watching Kieran Mulvey on the TV last night representing the ISC I was first of all gobsmacked at how a small elite circle can land all the plum quangos in this country. Secondly, for a fella who is trotted out to solve every conflict under the sun (didn't he even get involved in the Cork hurlers strike?) I thought his approach and language were incendiary. Some mediator, I wanted to punch his smug puss myself.

TLDR: 1. IABA come out and explain yourselves.2. Life goes on, someone else will take up the reins. 3. Kieran, get down off your high horse, it's the taxpayers money not yours.

Birdie Num Num

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

Very bad example for two reasons. First, FAI were brought in front of the Public Accounts Committee over it (with no issues found) and secondly, it was a financial "loan" in effect (regardless of terms and conditions attached by FIFA) so it wasn't the FAI giving away €5 million.

And what issues have been found and made public in terms of the IABA and Billy Walsh?

Ctrl Alt Delete

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

And what issues have been found and made public in terms of the IABA and Billy Walsh?

None thus far but that's nothing to do with your example or the fact that the ISC have governance concerns about the IABA

gordongekko

walshb wrote: »

Stop skirting around the issue. It's ONE man's employmenet issues, and you are trying to make out that the IABA are incapable of running the organisation full stop. Holy god..

The bolded bit is pure nonsense. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.

Where is the evidence that the IABA are inept/bent/corrupt/incapable and out of touch with reality? The Walsh saga aside, where is there any shred to imply or suggest this? Did I miss something? Have there been other workers up in arms about how bad it is to work for the IABA?

They supposedly renegned on an agreement, and that then turns into: public cannot rely upon the IABA in relation it's bona fides concerning employment contracts

The main problem seems to be the ridiculous over the top sensationalism attached to this.

You are clearly trolling now.

Its been pointed out to you that its going on since at least 2012 and its come to a head now

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/irish-amateur-boxing-association-heavily-criticised-in-official-olympic-review-1.1326512

Birdie Num Num

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

None thus far but that's nothing to do with your example or the fact that the ISC have governance concerns about the IABA

I am not getting into a tit for tat conversation here but my example was based on two sporting organisations FAI and IABA who receive Core Grant Funding from the ISC to their respective sports. Surely that example would have sparked some initial governance concerns from the ISC about the FAI. Mulvey's talk on TV last night was an attempt to pander to the public and taint the IABA when the public doesn't know black from white about the whole affair.

price690

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

I am not getting into a tit for tat conversation here but my example was based on two sporting organisations FAI and IABA who receive Core Grant Funding from the ISC to their respective sports. Surely that example would have sparked some initial governance concerns from the ISC about the FAI. Mulvey's talk on TV last night was an attempt to pander to the public and taint the IABA when the public doesn't know black from white about the whole affair.

So basically you are saying that because one inept organisation (FAI) wasn't tackled hard, then other even more inept organisation (IABA) should be left to its own devices.

Good old Ireland.

The FAI (as bad it is) is a fair few notches above the IABA when it comes to having even the most basic structures in place. Like having a PR person.

The bottom line here is that its an absolute joke that the "CEO" of this backward organisation Fergal Carruth has still not surfaced to address any question as to what his problem was.

When they thrashed out the deal with the ISC earlier (that was never even put to the board) he didn't even have the balls at that stage to speak up over his concerns regarding Walshes reappointment. Rather he carried on with the facade that it was business as usual, and is prepared to wait out the storm under whatever rock he crawled back under.

And before anyone slams me for being personal, all the man has to do is speak out and put the issue to bed. Have a bit of conviction for jaysus sake. There might even be a vocal minority who believe Walsh is replaceable, Carruth should have the balls to come out and say it. Its so small time.

walshb

gordongekko wrote: »

You are clearly trolling now.

Its been pointed out to you that its going on since at least 2012 and its come to a head now

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/irish-amateur-boxing-association-heavily-criticised-in-official-olympic-review-1.1326512

It is against the charter to throw out that accusation. If my post or posts are an issue to you then use the report post function.

gordongekko

walshb wrote: »

It is against the charter to throw out that accusation. If my post or posts are an issue to you then use the report post function.

Would you like to deal with the article instead of deflecting away from the topic like you have been doing all day?

walshb

gordongekko wrote: »

Would you like to deal with the article instead of deflecting away from the topic like you have been doing all day?

If you retract your accusation I will consider your request.

Tiriel

We are trying to keep moderation light here to enable conversation, I don't think that being heavy handed is of any value in this situation.

Having said that, don't make this discussion personal between you and another poster. Use the report post function if you believe someone has crossed the line and we will deal with it as we see fit.

Consider this a request to everyone, instead of any action on individuals. Now draw a line and let the discussion continue.

walshb

Jeez, Mulvey's pulling no punches as he accuses the IABA of, wait for it....Gross Disrespect......That's a new one.

c montgomery

walshb wrote: »

Jeez, Mulvey's pulling no punches as he accuses the IABA of, wait for it....Gross Disrespect......That's a new one.

Truth hurts does it?

walshb

c montgomery wrote: »

Truth hurts does it?

Why would that hurt me?

To be honest, I've never heard such fooking nonsense.

c montgomery

walshb wrote: »

Why would that hurt me?

To be honest, I've never heard such fooking nonsense.

Negotiate a deal, shake hands on it only to completely disregard said deal and offer no reason why. Pretty disrespectful if you ask me.

efb

walshb wrote: »

Jeez, Mulvey's pulling no punches as he accuses the IABA of, wait for it....Gross Disrespect......That's a new one.

It's pretty damning

efb

The behaviour from the IABA since the reveal of this debacle is far from professional and pretty disrespectful tbf

Birdie Num Num

price690 wrote: »

So basically you are saying that because one inept organisation (FAI) wasn't tackled hard, then other even more inept organisation (IABA) should be left to its own devices.

Good old Ireland.

The FAI (as bad it is) is a fair few notches above the IABA when it comes to having even the most basic structures in place. Like having a PR person.

The bottom line here is that its an absolute joke that the "CEO" of this backward organisation Fergal Carruth has still not surfaced to address any question as to what his problem was.

When they thrashed out the deal with the ISC earlier (that was never even put to the board) he didn't even have the balls at that stage to speak up over his concerns regarding Walshes reappointment. Rather he carried on with the facade that it was business as usual, and is prepared to wait out the storm under whatever rock he crawled back under.

And before anyone slams me for being personal, all the man has to do is speak out and put the issue to bed. Have a bit of conviction for jaysus sake. There might even be a vocal minority who believe Walsh is replaceable, Carruth should have the balls to come out and say it. Its so small time.

:roll eyes: I am not even going to respond to this other than say I am not even going to respond.

price690

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

:roll eyes: I am not even going to respond to this other than say I am not even going to respond.

fantastic response from yourself

slow

John Treacy on the radio just now. IABA will be funded from month to month if it engages with the ISC. He didn't say what would happen if they continue to ignore the ISC.

Ctrl Alt Delete

slow wrote: »

John Treacy on the radio just now. IABA will be funded from month to month if it engages with the ISC. He didn't say what would happen if they continue to ignore the ISC.

At the end of the day ISC are not obligated to give them a penny and as a taxpayer who had pride in my country and our Irish boxers the IABA don't deserve a penny

When a minister for sport wades into the fray you know the IABA aren't going to come off the better for it

walshb

slow wrote: »

John Treacy on the radio just now. IABA will be funded from month to month if it engages with the ISC. He didn't say what would happen if they continue to ignore the ISC.

I wonder what he means exactly about the IABA engaging with ISC? Does he mean that they simply need to be in contact, or does he mean the IABA need to take the ISCs commands?

walshb

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

At the end of the day ISC are not obligated to give them a penny and as a taxpayer who had pride in my country and our Irish boxers the IABA don't deserve a penny

When a minister for sport wades into the fray you know the IABA aren't going to come off the better for it

Do you only think like this now, or did the IABA never deserve a penny?

Joe_ Public

Sorry can't post a link but a bit of a change of tune from Kenneth this evening in the Independent from what he said yesterday. A couple of very pertinent points in his interview: firstly that Zaur is not the ideal candidate for the director job and think he's right to point out that Billy, in contrast to a lot of what's been said and reported over the past few days, was on the floor a lot too and is an excellent coach in his own right.

And one eye-catching statement:

"Billy wasn't contracted after Rio and they had the power to pat him on the back and say 'take care'."

marienbad

walshb wrote: »

Do you only think like this now, or did the IABA never deserve a penny?

No person or organisation 'deserves' public monies , there are always ,rightfully, conditions attached .

flutered

Birdie Num Num wrote: »

You perhaps know more about the situation than I do. I know nothing about it as I have not been involved and only those that are involved do know. A point that I omitted in my original post is that there have been far more serious issues when it comes to the use of public money (and not just in sport). How vocal was the ISC regarding funding to soccer when John Delaney "borrowed" €5 million from Sepp Blatter for example? Soccer's Core Grant funding dwarfs that given to Amateur Boxing. Clearly something is not right and needs to be fixed but to cut funding to an organisation is cutting funding to the boxers themselves. The ISC haven't sounded professional either in the little I have heard from them. BTW I have no allegiance to boxing.

Also, if the ISC do cut funding and Irish Boxing goes into decline are we to blame the exit of Billy Walsh or the lack of funding?

no only the power hungry egotistic heads in irish boxing, its only this year that things started to growl

Ctrl Alt Delete

walshb wrote: »

Do you only think like this now, or did the IABA never deserve a penny?

All NGBs don't "deserve" a thing. They all have to fight their own corner for funding from the ISC.

Any organisation with governance issues most definitely should be bottom of the list in terms of funding , if even on the list in the first place.

walshb

marienbad wrote: »

No person or organisation 'deserves' public monies , there are always ,rightfully, conditions attached .

Of course. Nobody suggested otherwise. But the IABA have been receiving monies for several years. I am assuming that it was deserved. I asked the poster if he felt that it was never deserved.