Driving licence question

Ohoopee

Hi, I just got my Provisional Irish License. I also have a full American License. I was told at the License center that because I have a full American license and have had one for over 15 years, that I do not have to wait the full 6 months to take my practical driving test...all I have to do is take my 12 driving lessons. I have already taken two lessons and my driving instructor believes he can have me finished with lessons and ready to take the driving test in a couple of weeks. My question is in regards to the RSA's policy on this. According to their website:

A holder of a current full driving licence from another country (jurisdiction) for more than six months is exempt from this requirement, provided you forward a current original driving licence and a letter of entitlement from the relevant licensing authority in that country

My question in this regard is...do they keep my American license or do they send it back? I would like to keep my American driving license...I write history books which requires me to travel back to the States for research purposes months at a time.....my regular residence is in Ireland but I keep a car in America and keep an insurance policy on it....I was just wondering if they are going to keep my license or if I will be able to get it back? Also, my driving instructor is not sure but since I have a full US driving license, will I be exempt from having to display an "N" plate? Any help would be appreciated.

challengemaster

Ohoopee wrote: »

Hi, I just got my Provisional Irish License. I also have a full American License. I was told at the License center that because I have a full American license and have had one for over 15 years, that I do not have to wait the full 6 months to take my practical driving test...all I have to do is take my 12 driving lessons. I have already taken two lessons and my driving instructor believes he can have me finished with lessons and ready to take the driving test in a couple of weeks. My question is in regards to the RSA's policy on this. According to their website:

My question in this regard is...do they keep my American license or do they send it back? I would like to keep my American driving license...I write history books which requires me to travel back to the States for research purposes months at a time.....my regular residence is in Ireland but I keep a car in America and keep an insurance policy on it....I was just wondering if they are going to keep my license or if I will be able to get it back? Also, my driving instructor is not sure but since I have a full US driving license, will I be exempt from having to display an "N" plate? Any help would be appreciated.

You should be able to keep your US licence - there's no law against holding an EU and US licence. You can't legally have multiple EU licences though.

You will have to display N plates however.

Ohoopee

It is just the way it was worded in the information on the 6 month rule on the RSA website, stated that they recommended I send my US license to them registered post, they make no mention if they will send it back. Of course I guess nothing is stopping me from going back to America and telling them I lost my license and getting a new one....but yeah that is what I am trying to figure out...that has been the most frustrating thing. I have been driving for over 15 years and I get no credit for it at all except for the six month rule excemption..the insurance companies are even worse...none want to give me a no claims discount using my American insurance, I am having to start all over like i have never set behind the wheel of a car before...I was hoping they would let me skip the N plat at least.

challengemaster

Considering the laughable driving tests in the US, it's not surprising you can't exchange your licence.

You can always pick up the phone and clarify the matter regarding your US licence with the RSA. Number is on their website.

CiniO

challengemaster wrote: »

Considering the laughable driving tests in the US, it's not surprising you can't exchange your licence.

But there should be a system allowing people who hold licence abroad to go short way.
Just do theory test, and pass driving test.
I can't see a need for driving lessons, waiting times, N plates, etc...

M5

CiniO wrote: »

But there should be a system allowing people who hold licence abroad to go short way.
Just do theory test, and pass driving test.
I can't see a need for driving lessons, waiting times, N plates, etc...

It's a little silly alright. I had to do my test in the states as well mind! Four right turns later I had passed though

challengemaster

CiniO wrote: »

But there should be a system allowing people who hold licence abroad to go short way.
Just do theory test, and pass driving test.
I can't see a need for driving lessons, waiting times, N plates, etc...

To ensure that everyone that gets awarded an Irish licence from X date has been trained to a specific level, which is the whole point of EDT. I'd argue lessons are more important for someone with the likes of a US licence, because they wouldn't be used to a lot of familiarities on Irish roads such as roundabouts.

Waiting times are waived. I see no reason to ignore N plates either. It's the persons first Irish/EU licence. They are just as likely to make mistakes as any new driver trained in Ireland, and as such other drivers need to be aware.

mickdw

Seeing that there is now a swap agreement in place between ontario and ireland, I wonder is there anything to stop someone swapping American licence for Canadian one then applying for irish one.

CiniO

challengemaster wrote: »

To ensure that everyone that gets awarded an Irish licence from X date has been trained to a specific level, which is the whole point of EDT.

IMO EDT should be there to teach new drivers basics like handling a vehicle, how to change gears properly, how to take appropriate position on the road, observation, braking, accelerating, making progress, etc...
That's what generally people should learn on EDT.
I even think that no one should be allowed on the road without instructor before finishing EDT. Driving permit should let you drive with fully licenced driver only after finishing EDT and approval from instructor that he is happy to let such person drive not in double-control vehicle.
But returning to the subject if person already hold a licence from other country and possibly drove for years, all those skills like vehicle handling, position on the road, gears, observation, etc were learnt long time ago so hardly a need for instructor to teach them.
What is needed for foreign drivers is proper training on theory of rules of the road and proper theory test, and obviously driving test to verify if person understands and obeys those rules. I don't really see a need for driving with instructor to learn it.

I'd argue lessons are more important for someone with the likes of a US licence, because they wouldn't be used to a lot of familiarities on Irish roads such as roundabouts.

Well differences in traffic law is significent even between EU countries, and somehow EU licence holders don't need to pass any test - even though I think they should at least theory test.
In my experience (as person who learnt to drive in Poland and moved to Ireland) traffic laws are actually completely different and it's not easy to drive safely without knowing the local laws properly.

challengemaster

CiniO wrote: »

IMO EDT should be there to teach new drivers basics like handling a vehicle, how to change gears properly, how to take appropriate position on the road, observation, braking, accelerating, making progress, etc...
That's what generally people should learn on EDT.

But returning to the subject if person already hold a licence from other country and possibly drove for years, all those skills like vehicle handling, position on the road, gears, observation, etc were learnt long time ago so hardly a need for instructor to teach them.

Only 6% of cars bought every year in the US are manuals, and that number is decreasing. The majority of US drivers have absolutely no clue how to drive a manual, or have any idea about using gears properly. Gearing and handling a vehicle are intertwined - so anyone new to learning a manual gearbox, should rightly re-learn how to handle a vehicle. Position on the road will be different also with the LHD/RHD thing.

Ohoopee

Well since this is being discussed...I thought I would offer my two cents sense I am going through this at the moment. My way of thinking is this....the driving test in Ireland is known for being hard to pass. I have quit a few friends right now who are native Irish who have failed the test multiple times and yet still drive around every day alone with their Learners. Who cares if as an American we have never driven a Manuel much? If anybody with a full license in another country is able to come over here and pass the driving test without driving lessons, why not give them the license. If they do not display the abilities that a driving instructor will teach them then I am sure they will not pass the test anyway, so if they are able to do it without driving lessons, why force them to take them?

I think the N plate is dumb to begin with...what comfort is it going to be to know that the person is a Novice driver after they have already plowed into your car? Based on what I have read, and I am no expert, the N plate comes with no restrictions other than you can not sponsor a learner driver. Is it really that important to know that the person in front of you at a stop light has only had their full license for only 2 years or less? That is just how I feel personally. I personally don't believe that a person could come straight from America and pass a driving test here in Ireland without having at least a couple of driving lessons...but if they can...why not give them the chance and give them a license if they succeed? Their driving experience in America should still count for something I believe.

challengemaster

Ohoopee wrote: »

I think the N plate is dumb to begin with...what comfort is it going to be to know that the person is a Novice driver after they have already plowed into your car? Based on what I have read, and I am no expert, the N plate comes with no restrictions other than you can not sponsor a learner driver.

It's the same point as the L plate - the driver is a novice and is likely to make mistakes, so it's just alerting other drivers to this. You wouldn't pull right up to the bumper of an L plate driver in traffic on a hill, not if you like your front bumper anyway. If you know someone is a novice you will give them more space on the road, be a bit more understanding if they do something stupid or if they're slow to make manoeuvres.

And you obviously haven't read enough.

As part of the new measures, N-plate drivers will be banned for six months if they rack up seven penalty points, rather than the 12 for fully-qualified drivers. The application of penalty points for offences is also more draconian for N-plate drivers. Those caught speeding, using a mobile phone or not wearing a seatbelt will face double the penalty points incurred by regular motorists for such offences. N-plate drivers will also have a lower permitted blood alcohol limit – 20mg instead of 50mg for fully licenced drivers.

bisounours

Speaking as someone who has a full American and French licence, I was and still am slightly apprehensive driving in Ireland. I booked in for lessons (instructor thought I was a bit mad) and drove around with him until I felt I had a better control of driving on this side of the road, changing gears with my left hand, and adjusting my spatial awareness from my new "seat" in the car. After 3 lessons (6hours) he gave me his blessing but advising to keep my left turns tighter and right turns wider. I would be all for extra lessons for anyone coming from driving on the other side of the road. Then again, I'm probably just a crap driver and many out there may be able to swap very easily!

Ohoopee

No, I had not read that about the N plate but none of that worries me...I have driven in the US for over 15 years, never once had a crash, or even a speeding citation...the closest thing I have had to a citation was a fine one time when I lived in a city in America because I forgot to move my car to the other side of the street on the morning the street sweeper came through...and that only happened once. I don't mind having to take tests to prove my driving ability...not one bit. But this whole experience has just left me feeling like the 15 years of driving experience that I do have count for nothing, the insurance companies sure don't care, and with the exception of the six month rule exemption, the RSA doesn't really seem to care about my previous experience either...it is just very frustrating to have driving experience and to be treated like you are a 15 year old kid who has never set behind a steering wheel before. That is why I was kind of hoping they would exempt me from the N plates...not because the N plates are such a big deal, more like for the principle of the thing.

wonski

bisounours wrote: »

Speaking as someone who has a full American and French licence, I was and still am slightly apprehensive driving in Ireland. I booked in for lessons (instructor thought I was a bit mad) and drove around with him until I felt I had a better control of driving on this side of the road, changing gears with my left hand, and adjusting my spatial awareness from my new "seat" in the car. After 3 lessons (6hours) he gave me his blessing but advising to keep my left turns tighter and right turns wider. I would be all for extra lessons for anyone coming from driving on the other side of the road. Then again, I'm probably just a crap driver and many out there may be able to swap very easily!

It's always good to get some training if you are not 100% certain of your skills.

Most drivers I know who came from lhd to rhd needed only a bit of driving to get used to it. You just need to be a bit more careful when you start and change your habits and positioning on junctions and roundabouts.

And keep to the left:D

cantdecide

mickdw wrote: »

Seeing that there is now a swap agreement in place between ontario and ireland, I wonder is there anything to stop someone swapping American licence for Canadian one then applying for irish one.

The NDLS will always use the foreign letter of entitlement to determine where the driver earned those entitlements originally. If it originated in the US, it would not be exchanged. We now exchange with Manitoba.

US licences are not exchangeable because there are different laws in each US state and although I have sympathy for people who have to go through the full regime, there are also a lot of people with non exchangeable foreign licences that come from places with entirely different cultures and attitudes to road use. Unless exchange agreements exist, it would be unfair to partially forgive some countries some of the hurdles because we're closer in culture IMO.

Ohoopee

Just thought I would update just in case someone is looking for this information later. I just got off the phone with the RSA. Yes it is indeed true, if you hold a valid driving license from another country like the United States for instance, you can become exempt from the six month rule. You do need to send them your original foreign license plus a letter of entitlement. I have been assured by the RSA agent that they will return your foreign license to you which was my big concern. You do still need to take the 12 driving lessons but once they are done, you are free to book and take your driving test...once they exempt you that is....this is not a given thing like the lady at the Licensing office made it out to be...you do need to send a letter of entitlement from your foreign country as well as your original foreign license to them to get exempted.

I forgot to ask about the N plate but it is not a pressing concern right now to me which the other one was so I'll try to find out about that later.

Hello itsmeAdele

Ohoopee wrote: »

Just thought I would update just in case someone is looking for this information later. I just got off the phone with the RSA. Yes it is indeed true, if you hold a valid driving license from another country like the United States for instance, you can become exempt from the six month rule. You do need to send them your original foreign license plus a letter of entitlement. I have been assured by the RSA agent that they will return your foreign license to you which was my big concern. You do still need to take the 12 driving lessons but once they are done, you are free to book and take your driving test...once they exempt you that is....this is not a given thing like the lady at the Licensing office made it out to be...you do need to send a letter of entitlement from your foreign country as well as your original foreign license to them to get exempted.

I forgot to ask about the N plate but it is not a pressing concern right now to me which the other one was so I'll try to find out about that later.

In a similar situation at the moment and was wondering if you were considered a novice driver and had to use n-plates in the end? I've looked at the legislation and it mentions 'first full driving licence by a licensing authority' but doesn't specifically mention Irish licensing authority. I don't mind the n-plates as much as I mind other limitations, such as not being able to rent a car for 2 years, etc. Thanks!