Greenfield dairy setup costs.

caseman

For 300 cow herd only fag box figures.

300 cows incalf heifers 390000
300 topless cubicles 90000
slurry storage lagoon don't know cost. 40000
parlour 24 unit second hand bare building 50000
milk tank second hand 20000
water to paddocks 10000
roads 20000

total so far 620000

how much more can ye add to this i only put this together very quick

IH784man

caseman wrote: »

For 300 cow herd only fag box figures.

300 cows incalf heifers 390000
300 topless cubicles 90000
slurry storage lagoon don't know cost. 40000
parlour 24 unit second hand bare building 50000
milk tank second hand 20000
water to paddocks 10000
roads 20000

total so far 620000

how much more can ye add to this i only put this together very quick

Dunno anything about them prices,but are you ever gonna see it back

Greengrass1

caseman wrote: »

For 300 cow herd only fag box figures.

300 cows incalf heifers 390000
300 topless cubicles 90000
slurry storage lagoon don't know cost. 40000
parlour 24 unit second hand bare building 50000
milk tank second hand 20000
water to paddocks 10000
roads 20000

total so far 620000

how much more can ye add to this i only put this together very quick

300/acre for reseeding
Fencing? 100e/ac?
Water troughs inc in your water to paddocks?

Greengrass1

IH784man wrote: »

Dunno anything about them prices,but are you ever gonna see it back

If you owned the land definitely.
Questionable if being leased

Dawggone

caseman wrote: »

For 300 cow herd only fag box figures.

300 cows incalf heifers 390000
300 topless cubicles 90000
slurry storage lagoon don't know cost. 40000
parlour 24 unit second hand bare building 50000
milk tank second hand 20000
water to paddocks 10000
roads 20000

total so far 620000

how much more can ye add to this i only put this together very quick

Land. Bought owned or leased.

IH784man

Greengrass1 wrote: »

If you owned the land definitely.
Questionable if being leased

How much milk would a cow produce a day if your milking 2 times a day?

mahoney_j

Isn't greenfield kk turning profit and sitting on a nice big balance with 330 cows ,leased land ,paid labour ,majority of farm work contracted out and also had to convert arable land to tillage ,build parlour ,lagoon and standoff pad etc

jaymla627

caseman wrote: »

For 300 cow herd only fag box figures.

300 cows incalf heifers 390000
300 topless cubicles 90000
slurry storage lagoon don't know cost. 40000
parlour 24 unit second hand bare building 50000
milk tank second hand 20000
water to paddocks 10000
roads 20000

total so far 620000

how much more can ye add to this i only put this together very quick

By the time everything's up and running you'll be alot closer to a million then 620,000 to put in a proper road network/paddock system alone on a 300 acre block would be 30 to 40 grand more then your budgeting for, your parlour/cubicle costs are way to low aswell and you've not even budgeted for calving sheds/calf houses

Greengrass1

IH784man wrote: »

How much milk would a cow produce a day if your milking 2 times a day?

Depends on cow type tbh. Jex between 5000-5500l for there lactation when they get up to 3 plus.
Hol/fr 6000l maybe? Not sure they would do much more with the distance if the walks

Greengrass1

http://www.greenfielddairy.ie/node/88

Costs and projections are in one of these.
Not sure which 9ne

caseman

Greengrass1 wrote: »

300/acre for reseeding
Fencing? 100e/ac?
Water troughs inc in your water to paddocks?

And lots of p+k ibc used for water troughs.

Dawggone wrote: »

Land. Bought owned or leased.

Shared farming.

jaymla627 wrote: »

By the time everything's up and running you'll be alot closer to a million then 620,000 to put in a proper road network/paddock system alone on a 300 acre block would be 30 to 40 grand more then your budgeting for, your parlour/cubicle costs are way to low aswell and you've not even budgeted for calving sheds/calf houses

Lots of road's on the land already
Don't think i'm to far of the the mark with parlour and cubicle costs.
sheds on the farm that would be easily converted to calving pens and calf housing.
I'd have 70 cows and their followers to bring with me.

jaymla627

caseman wrote: »

And lots of p+k ibc used for water troughs.



Shared farming.



Lots of road's on the land already
Don't think i'm to far of the the mark with parlour and cubicle costs.
sheds on the farm that would be easily converted to calving pens and calf housing.
I'd have 70 cows and their followers to bring with me.

Re building I assume your planning on doing building work yourself, 300 a cubicle space plus feeding area would just about cover concrete mats barriers maybe....
Can you tell us the price of a meter of concrete by any chance in you area

mf240

If your sending a million and a half litres a year 100 grand repayments are 6.6 cents per litre.

Not a daunting when you look at it like that.

But if you had 3/400 acres of land youd probaly make a living out of drystock and take it handy.

caseman

jaymla627 wrote: »

Re building I assume your planning on doing building work yourself, 300 a cubicle space plus feeding area would just about cover concrete mats barriers maybe....
Can you tell us the price of a meter of concrete by any chance in you area

I'd be doing building work myself 20 years in construction.

stretch film

jaymla627 wrote: »

Re building I assume your planning on doing building work yourself, 300 a cubicle space plus feeding area would just about cover concrete mats barriers maybe....
Can you tell us the price of a meter of concrete by any chance in you area

75€ / meter3 was a figure I heard last week

blue5000

OP don't forget interest.

keep going

Interesting post , how are the costs of setup being shared, what is the long term outlook for ownership of the land , who will own the cows, when you say doing alot of the building work yourself, cant see you doing any building work in a 300 cow set up

cute geoge

If ye went to the trouble of reading up about greenfields in killkenny , i think it cost 1.2 millon to setup for 300 cows , i cant see you doing it that much cheaper as there setup was barebones
So roughly an interest bill of 60k per annum on top of repayments
I think you might need your head examined if you went ahead with such a daft idea

Greengrass1

cute geoge wrote: »

If ye went to the trouble of reading up about greenfields in killkenny , i think it cost 1.2 millon to setup for 300 cows , i cant see you doing it that much cheaper as there setup was barebones
So roughly an interest bill of 60k per annum on top of repayments
I think you might need your head examined if you went ahead with such a daft idea

Op says he has 70 cows plus followers aswell as a s/h parlour and tank

jaymla627

cute geoge wrote: »

If ye went to the trouble of reading up about greenfields in killkenny , i think it cost 1.2 millon to setup for 300 cows , i cant see you doing it that much cheaper as there setup was barebones
So roughly an interest bill of 60k per annum on top of repayments
I think you might need your head examined if you went ahead with such a daft idea

Given that irish banks don't place any value on stock, won't allow them to be used as collateral would imagen they would do alot of head scratching when looking at a application where the op wants nearly 400 k to buy cows alone....

blue5000

jaymla627 wrote: »

Given that irish banks don't place any value on stock, won't allow them to be used as collateral would imagen they would do alot of head scratching when looking at a application where the op wants nearly 400 k to buy cows alone....

Is this true?

caseman

keep going wrote: »

Interesting post , how are the costs of setup being shared, what is the long term outlook for ownership of the land , who will own the cows, when you say doing alot of the building work yourself, cant see you doing any building work in a 300 cow set up

No talk of who will pay for what yet.
But i think he'd be putting in topless cublices and lagoon and roads and water.
I'd be putting in parlour and cows.
i'd own cows
He'd own the land, don't think i'll ever be in a position to buy 300 acres
All work would need to be done before cow's on site.

cute geoge wrote: »

If ye went to the trouble of reading up about greenfields in killkenny , i think it cost 1.2 millon to setup for 300 cows , i cant see you doing it that much cheaper as there setup was barebones
So roughly an interest bill of 60k per annum on top of repayments
I think you might need your head examined if you went ahead with such a daft idea

Probably do need to get my head examined to even think about taking on so much work.
Greenfield was set up by our state dose that answer the question about costs.

jaymla627 wrote: »

Given that irish banks don't place any value on stock, won't allow them to be used as collateral would imagen they would do alot of head scratching when looking at a application where the op wants nearly 400 k to buy cows alone....

This is the main problem raising the money needed.

blue5000 wrote: »

Is this true?

They will only finance stock over 12 months.

mf240 wrote: »

If your sending a million and a half litres a year 100 grand repayments are 6.6 cents per litre.

Not a daunting when you look at it like that.

But if you had 3/400 acres of land youd probaly make a living out of drystock and take it handy.

He'd still have a few hundred acres to pass the time i'd only be using one corner of it.

jaymla627

blue5000 wrote: »

Is this true?

In the case of ulster bank it is, was basically laughed at on the phone when I tried to get the point across of my stock value when trying to arrange a loan last year, apparently 80 cows, 25 incalf heifers and 40 heifer calves built from scratch in three years didn't offset the fact that my account wasn't preforming and generating surplus cash, the prick on the phone dealing with us didn't seem to grasp the fact over a 120000 euros worth of stock had been built up from noting...
Further to this a 20 unit parlour, 110 cubicles, 100 acres reseeded, and 2km of roadways was done nearly all from cash flow, it's a myth that banks are actively supporting farmers the problem in my situation was I wouldn't put up land for what was a minor loan to cover us over last spring, it isn't talked about alot but a serious amount of expanding farmers have a good proportion of the farm up as collateral and have rolled the dice that milk is going to stay rosy

keep going

jaymla627 wrote: »

In the case of ulster bank it is, was basically laughed at on the phone when I tried to get the point across of my stock value when trying to arrange a loan last year, apparently 80 cows, 25 incalf heifers and 40 heifer calves built from scratch in three years didn't offset the fact that my account wasn't preforming and generating surplus cash, the prick on the phone dealing with us didn't seem to grasp the fact over a 120000 euros worth of stock had been built up from noting...
Further to this a 20 unit parlour, 110 cubicles, 100 acres reseeded, and 2km of roadways was done nearly all from cash flow, it's a myth that banks are actively supporting farmers the problem in my situation was I wouldn't put up land for what was a minor loan to cover us over last spring, it isn't talked about alot but a serious amount of expanding farmers have a good proportion of the farm up as collateral and have rolled the dice that milk is going to stay rosy

in my case while it was noted that we had done a lot of work and built up infrastructure but the way its looked at was that it was a risk element gone out of the equation but if I hadn't being up building cash and had a working wife in gov job and a couple of more outside income streams that's what they really want is cash generation.

Timmaay

On the KK greenfield setup costs:


http://www.greenfielddairy.ie/files/image/2011%20GF%20open%20day%20booklet.pdf

The 326k on the winter housing/slurry seems quite steep, for 300cows thats working out over a grand/cow. As is the milking parlour 228k is 7.6k per unit.

RightTurnClyde

Timmaay wrote: »

On the KK greenfield setup costs:


http://www.greenfielddairy.ie/files/image/2011%20GF%20open%20day%20booklet.pdf

The 326k on the winter housing/slurry seems quite steep, for 300cows thats working out over a grand/cow. As is the milking parlour 228k is 7.6k per unit.

Lol. They spent €25k on the office and ony 4k on feeding equipment !

Timmaay

Agreed, 5/6k would have got them a full pig feeder and augers installed, throw in 1/2 a 12inch land drain pipe as mangers if they have none now!

jfh

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Lol. They spent €25k on the office and ony 4k on feeding equipment !

How did a farm office cost 25k?
Like to see the breakdown on that 😀

Sam Kade

jfh wrote: »

How did a farm office cost 25k?
Like to see the breakdown on that 😀

Enda Kenny's office hardly cost that :rolleyes:

Timmaay

staying on the kilkenny Greenfield, anyone read up in the ifj about them not getting the full milk topup, due to not having enough shares in GII. 2bh sounds like a right own goal for Glanbia...

awaywithyou

25000 for an office supposed to cost 5000.....

what the fcuk?

were the lads from irish water involved in that....?

frazzledhome

Timmaay wrote: »

staying on the kilkenny Greenfield, anyone read up in the ifj about them not getting the full milk topup, due to not having enough shares in GII. 2bh sounds like a right own goal for Glanbia...

Very simple, a Ltd Company cannot be a share holder in Glanbia co op.

RightTurnClyde

frazzledhome wrote: »

Very simple, a Ltd Company cannot be a share holder in Glanbia co op.

Frazz, how does that work. Does the director have to own the shares and the ltd company gets the support price, or are all company suppliers excluded from supports?

frazzledhome

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Frazz, how does that work. Does the director have to own the shares and the ltd company gets the support price, or are all company suppliers excluded from supports?

They must be held by an individual and that person can be operating in a company. It's meant to stop large companies who could be competitors buying up blocks of shares.

kowtow

I wonder can a limited partnership hold them -

frazzledhome

kowtow wrote: »

I wonder can a limited partnership hold them -

No, same applies

caseman

Timmaay wrote: »

On the KK greenfield setup costs:


http://www.greenfielddairy.ie/files/image/2011%20GF%20open%20day%20booklet.pdf

The 326k on the winter housing/slurry seems quite steep, for 300cows thats working out over a grand/cow. As is the milking parlour 228k is 7.6k per unit.

Their very high costs.
But a green setup would take alot of money to get going.
The only way i think i could get the money is sell my own place,and i think the neighbours would send for the men in white coats if i done that.

kevthegaff

What about putting in s/h 16 unit parlour, 50% paddocks roadways etc with room for expansion and begin with say 100+ cows, work the lease of % profits

Timmaay

Agreed with Kev, no need to hit full production immediately. On what the neighbours think about selling up, fookem, if it makes economic sense and you dont see much of a viable future there go for it, the main thing to check out is the tax consquences of selling.

Definitely worth trying to meetup with some of the KK boys if your serious about all this, I'm sure they could clarify some of them costs.

Panch18

Timmaay wrote: »

Agreed with Kev, no need to hit full production immediately. On what the neighbours think about selling up, fookem, if it makes economic sense and you dont see much of a viable future there go for it, the main thing to check out is the tax consquences of selling.

Definitely worth trying to meetup with some of the KK boys if your serious about all this, I'm sure they could clarify some of them costs.

It sounds like pure madness to me to sell an existing block of land to fund the set up of a dairy on a rented block of land

Better of burning the money

Brown Podzol

caseman wrote: »

Their very high costs.
But a green setup would take alot of money to get going.
The only way i think i could get the money is sell my own place,and i think the neighbours would send for the men in white coats if i done that.

Lease your own place, tax free income, will give the banks comfort.Lease new place you start from scratch tax wise . Stock relief and capital allowances and tax won't bother you for a while. Coming with stock and expertise with a bit of luck, hard work and the right deal you could end up with a 300 acre farm after 15 years.

IH784man

Could you not use your own home farm and add on to that

caseman

kevthegaff wrote: »

What about putting in s/h 16 unit parlour, 50% paddocks roadways etc with room for expansion and begin with say 100+ cows, work the lease of % profits

I was thinking of going this route aswell.
The farm could handle 150 cows without spending any money on roads and water,put parlour in place and b+b the cows for the winter.

When the land owner could see a return he might be more confident to spend money on infrastructure.

Panch18 wrote: »

It sounds like pure madness to me to sell an existing block of land to fund the set up of a dairy on a rented block of land

Better of burning the money

It would be economic madness,don't think i'll go burning it either.

IH784man wrote: »

Could you not use your own home farm and add on to that

Keep looking over the ditch till i'm grey in the hair and their looking back at me wondering.
Might have to